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View Poll Results: What is the 3rd entity inside of the destroyers remains?

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16. You may not vote on this poll
  • The Destroyer

    8 50.00%
  • Rene

    1 6.25%
  • Riful

    0 0%
  • Teresa

    6 37.50%
  • Other(please post)

    1 6.25%
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Thread: Who(or what) is the 3rd being inside the remains of the Destroyer?

  1. #1
    Registered User 下級員 / Kakyuuin / Jr. Member Alisia's Avatar
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    Claymore Who(or what) is the 3rd being inside the remains of the Destroyer?

    (I merged Mei's thread into this one)

    "Back in chapter 109. Galatea mentions that Priscilla is being contained by Clare and "something else".

    So i pose the question to you who or what is that "something else"?

    The destroyer, i think is the obvious answer. As it sucked both Clare and Priscilla into it. Problem is the destroyer was something of mindless entity and, if Clare is working together with something in order to hold Priscilla in check, it's hard to believe that thing would be capable of that. Especially since that action seems to indicate willpower and purpose, two things the destroyer seemed to lack.

    Rene (Warrior #6) has been missing for a while so she seems like should could have got sucked in. But i don't know how she could be of use to Clare in holding down Priscilla.

    Riful is almost certainly dead but she was in the area at the time. And it's not unthinkable that a little piece of her got sucked into that vortex.

    Teresa It may sound crazy but Clare has a piece of Teresa in her(literally). If there was anything left of her consciousness, it would show up in this situation i think.

    Plus you know how much the author likes his twin goddesses Teresa and Clare imagery. When that weird egg thing finally cracks open it would be right up his alley to do a rebirth of Teresa & Clare as the twin goddesses thing.

    So who or what do you think it is?"

    -Jammin

    ------------------------------------------------------------------


    An Awakening...or Another Things??


    But according to you, why yagi did not give a true form from the merger of the awakened body with the mass of claire yoki?

    Is it possible that we are dealing with a new generation of awakened? Do you believe that we will never see a well defined form of the mass of yoki + claire?
    Last edited by HegemonKhan; March 27, 2011 at 06:42 PM.

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    Registered User 英雄メンバー / Eiyuu Menbaa / Hero Member HegemonKhan's Avatar
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    Re: An Awakening...or Another Things??

    Actually, I somewhat recently found a tiny line in the manga (if interested I can find/provide the source), and there's some supporting evidence+my theory (if interested I can find/provide the source and give my theory with it), all of which, says/points to something to/of this effect:

    Clare is the Destroyer's real-true body

    (which would mean, if Clare dies, then the Destroyer dies too)
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    Who(or what) is the 3rd being inside the remains of the Destroyer?

    Back in chapter 109. Galatea mentions that Priscilla is being contained by Clare and "something else".

    So i pose the question to you who or what is that "something else"?

    -----------------------------------

    The destroyer, i think is the obvious answer. As it sucked both Clare and Priscilla into it. Problem is the destroyer was something of mindless entity and, if Clare is working together with something in order to hold Priscilla in check, it's hard to believe that thing would be capable of that. Especially since that action seems to indicate willpower and purpose, two things the destroyer seemed to lack.

    Rene (Warrior #6) has been missing for a while so she seems like should could have got sucked in. But i don't know how she could be of use to Clare in holding down Priscilla.

    Riful is almost certainly dead but she was in the area at the time. And it's not unthinkable that a little piece of her got sucked into that vortex.

    Teresa It may sound crazy but Clare has a piece of Teresa in her(literally). If there was anything left of her consciousness, it would show up in this situation i think.

    Plus you know how much the author likes his twin goddesses Teresa and Clare imagery. When that weird egg thing finally cracks open it would be right up his alley to do a rebirth of Teresa & Clare as the twin goddesses thing.

    So who or what do you think it is?
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    Registered User 英雄メンバー / Eiyuu Menbaa / Hero Member HegemonKhan's Avatar
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    Re: Who(or what) is the 3rd being inside the remains of the Destroyer?

    Well, first the Destroyer is it's own ("beast"-mindless) entity (of destruction).

    The source is back at maybe ch 70-80 ish (but be warned my memory is hazy on this. However, I can provide the exact source if needed)

    this is my understanding:

    Rubel finally told Rafaela the "information about/on Luciela" that he had been using as blackmail to get to her be his personal powerful rank 1 "asset", and finally having whatever Rubel had told her, Rafela immediately went after Luciela (presumably this happened AFTER she+Renee secretly spied on the Pieta Battle, and Rafaela simply followed Isley+Priscilla+Raki to Luciela).

    My theory is that the information that Rubel had and told Rafaela, was what Rafaela tried to do to Luciela after Rafaela had hug-crushed Luciela to death.

    We don't know if what Rubel told Rafaela would have actually "revived" Luciela back to life as a non-AO sacrificing her own life force, or if it would have created a being even more powerful than the Destroyer, lol, as unfortunately/fortunately, Rafaela messed it up. She only half-merged with Luciela's dead body, whatever the process was trying to achieve, it was incompleted and failed by Rafaela.

    This incomplete and failed half-merging, never revived the dead Luciela (there is NO Luciela inside the Destroyer, Luciela is still dead... forever dead. However, her Awakened feline form seems to be the form used for the Hellcats and Infected Hosts, but there's NO conscious/soul/spirit of Luciela. She's gone permanently).

    However, this failed/incomplete half-merging... created a new (a possibly failed/incomplete) entity inside of Rafaela's head/mind, the Destroyer.

    ------------------------------------------------------------

    with that said, we have in chronolgical order:

    Rafaela
    ``V
    Rafaela hug-crushes Luciela to death/dead
    ``V
    Rafaela subconsciously tries whatever Rubel had told her, pouring her Yoki/Life force into Luciela's corpse, but something goes horribly wrong, and it fails, incompleted at a half-merging
    ``V
    Rafaela is half-merged Luciela's corpse, and a new entity (the Destroyer) is somehow created within Rafaela's head/mind
    ``V
    Rafaela+Destroyer
    ``V
    Rafaela+Destroyer + (briefly and not fully) Renee (a quick "mind dive" by Renee, lol)
    ``V
    Rafaela+Destroyer+Clare (+ maybe Teresa)
    ``V
    Destroyer (+ maybe Teresa*) and (separated/free from the Destroyer) Rafaela+Clare (+ maybe Teresa)
    ``V
    Destroyer+Clare (+ maybe Teresa and Rafaela)
    ``V
    Destroyer+Priscilla+Clare (+ maybe Teresa and Rafaela)

    *The Destroyer's Awakened shell/exoskeleton body/form is that of the Twin Goddesses of Love, which directly correlates to Teresa's mind, and we got further support with what Priscilla comments with upon seeing the Destroyer in the TGoL body/form: "So, that is the form/body that you wished for in the end?" (We know that Priscilla is talking about Teresa in regards to this, as Priscilla never acknowledges/recognizes Clare as herself, lol, thus it is strongly implied that the Destroyer has at least a piece of Teresa's conscious in it, which resulted in it taking on the TGoL form/body when it Awakened)

    ..... so, we now get to your thread, your question, and poll question:

    Renee is either killed by Riful or ... free, doing who knows what.... lol. (the last we see of Renee is running away/fleeing from Riful+Dauf, right before the Destroyer emerges/Awakens)

    Riful's dead

    so here's what I think:

    currently the Destroyer is made up of:

    the "blob of 3" (Clare, Priscilla, and Destroyer) - duh

    and possibly at least a part of Teresa's conscious (or whatever) was with the Destroyer, before Clare re-merged with it and then "blobbed" with Priscilla, lol. If Clare has Rafaela in her mind, than poor Rafaela is "re-united" somewhat with the Destroyer as well, lol. But, this possible point about Teresa being in the Destroyer is moot, as Clare is back "merged" with the Destroyer anyways.

    if Teresa's conscious (or at least a part of it) was inside the Destroyer, it could explain why the Destroyer strangely used its small tentacles to lift up Clare's remaining upper body (which was just "consumed" by the Destroyer's huge black soul tentacles) and how Clare was able to "merge"/control the Destroyer...

    or maybe it's not Clare who's controlling the Destroyer (using it to protect the Claymores from Priscilla and to attack Priscilla) ... but Teresa herself (Clare could very well still be unconscious, having nothing to do with any of this...) ...... (wow, I think I might be onto something here... EUREKA!!!!)

    about Galatea's comment:

    Galatea is refering to Priscilla. the "blob of 3"; Clare, Destroyer, and the 3rd entity unknown entity to Galatea: Priscilla.

    Riful told Galatea about the "one horned demon" along with Clare+Jean in the Witches Maw, but Galatea has seemed to completely forgot this, and/or can't connect that this "thing" inside of the "blob of 3", is that "one horned demon" (Priscilla), hehe.
    Last edited by HegemonKhan; March 27, 2011 at 06:31 PM.

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    MH's Best Reviewer 有名人 / Yuumeijin / Celebrity Jammin's Avatar
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    Re: Who(or what) is the 3rd being inside the remains of the Destroyer?

    Hmmm to be 100% honest HegemonKhan i'm having a hard time getting my head around your theory.

    Do you mind stating it more concisely if you can, that might help me understand a bit better. Like a basic point summery or something like that.

    --------------------------

    The only thing i feel certain of in this situation is that Galatea detects yoki so whatever is in there holding the One-Horned demon in check is something giving off distinct yoki for her to sense(and now that i think about that, it rules Riful out because Galatea would have recognized her Yoki).

    So whatever the third being is it can't be anything with Yoki Galatea would recognize, or she would have said so.

    Which, as i see it, would lend credence to the idea that it would be...........
    • The Destroyer, if it possesses any kind of consciousness.(which i actually kind of doubt, but maybe your theory will change that if i can manage to understand it)
    • The aspect of Teresa that resides in Clare, if any such thing exists.(Galatea never knew Teresa)
    • An aspect of the original Priscilla, left over from when she awakened.(Galatea never knew Priscilla either)
    All of those beings would most probably have the strength to help Clare contain the one horned demon.

    The snagging point i see with the destroyer is that, as i understand the situation, Luciela ceased to be when Rafaela merged with her and created "the single nameless consciousness". Which met with Clare and took on the form Clare gave her, Rafaela. And when Clare defeated her she awarded Clare everything her mind possessed(memories, emotions, etc), in order to help Clare understand some unnamed "mistake", after that the being was "extinguished".

    Which is how the destroyer came to be, it's just a lump of raw power with no mind or will of it's own. Basically the freed power of all the Yoma elements of the Abysal one Luciela and Rafaela packed into the form Rafaela wished for and released all at once with nothing to guide it but the instinctual desire to destroy. Hence the title "Destroyer".

    So if the destroyer is actively helping Clare contain Priscilla. Why?

    --------------

    The reason i feel Teresa is a possibility, though admittedly a remote one, is that Priscilla pursued Clare seeking a "faint scent". And when she came face to face with Clare somehow didn't feel satisfied.

    If Priscilla was instinctively homing in on Teresa the whole time instead of Clare, that would explain why the scent was faint and why she didn't feel like she'd found what she was seeking. Then inside that mass of Yoki, that faint piece of Teresa could take on a new form and would certainly enforce Teresa's greatest desire to protect and help Clare.

    And could possibly give Priscilla what she has been seeking, whatever that may be.
    Last edited by Jammin; March 27, 2011 at 09:31 PM.
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    Re: Who(or what) is the 3rd being inside the remains of the Destroyer?

    It could be Rene. We haven't seen or heard from her since her escape from Riful and Dauf. Both Riful and Dauf are most certainly dead, so if it's not Rene, it can only be what's left of Rafaela as the Destroyer.
    My vote would go to Rene at this point. I think she could be Clare's remaining link to humanity if she indeed defeats Pris. I know Clare doesn't know Rene, but she did go after her in Riful's lair even though she was an unknown.

    However, the arguement about it's being Teresa sounds plausible, but not probable. It's almost too easy and I don't think this is a normal plot twist since it is so easy to guess at.

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    Registered User 英雄メンバー / Eiyuu Menbaa / Hero Member HegemonKhan's Avatar
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    Re: Who(or what) is the 3rd being inside the remains of the Destroyer?

    I'm going to try to be "concise" as I can:

    1. the third entity that Galatea was commenting about is Priscilla.

    Clare+Destroyer+Priscilla = 3 entities of the "blob"

    2. the "4th entity" (if there was/is one), I'd say/agree with is Teresa as well.

    Clare's still unconscious, Teresa is doing everything with the Destroyer: "merging with Clare", protecting Claymore's friends from Priscilla, attacking Priscilla, and now sealing Priscilla within the Destroyer as the "3rd entity of the blob of 3".

    3. "The snagging point i see with the destroyer is that, as i understand the situation, Luciela ceased to be when Rafaela merged with her and created "the single nameless consciousness". " - Jammin

    Luciela died when Rafaela hug-crushed her to death

    "the single nameless consciousness" = "the Destroyer"

    -----------------------------

    my understanding/theorizing of the "Destroyer Incident/Event":

    4. Renee "stirs" the Destroyer within Rafaela's head/mind.

    5. the Destroyer uses its Yoki Control Ability to "mind merge/bond" to Clare's mind and also to compel Clare to go to it, instead of rushing back outside of the castle to save Cynthia+Yuma from Riful+Dauf

    6. the Destroyer than uses its "itachi-like genjutsu" Illusion using its Yoki Manipulation Ability (just like how Raftela caused Miria to see Hilda instead of the TAT), and causes Clare to see Rafaela in a forest instead of seeing the Awakening/growing/"hatching" Destroyer from the R+L half-merged bodies inside the forest castle, lol. I theorize this, based on that Rubel and Jean are missing from the scene of "itachi-like genjutsu" Illusion that the Destroyer "casted" on Clare.

    7. the Destroyer is too powerful for Rafaela (and Clare too), and so when Clare is "mind merged or bonded" with the Destroyer, using much of her power, Rafaela's mind breaks through the Destroyer's control and screams at Clare's mind, "You Fool! You've made a big mistake!", why'd you listen to Rubel and come here?! Now the Destroyer is using you to Awaken, it's going to be free and take control over this body (half-merged bodies of R+L) and our minds if we stay here! And when/if that happens, than we both die! If you and Renee hadn't come here, the Destroyer and I would have rotted away to death! But now... what ahve you done, Clare?! You unleashed the Destroyer upon the world, you FOOL! you F'ed up big time! you made a big mistake!

    8. Clare you have to kill "Rafaela", it's really the Destroyer, Awakening the half-merged bodies hanging from a chain inside of this castle, your not out in the forest and that's not me!, again I'm half-merged with Luciela's corpse and hanging by the chain hanging from the castle ceiling! Kill "Rafaela", kill the Destroyer, slice up our bodies (R+L) before the Destroyer Awakens too much, grows to big, grows to powerful, our bodies are already turning into massive tentacles and its growing larger! Hurry, unleash your Yoki and use your Quicksword! Slice up our bodies before its too late! Slice up "Rafaela", hurry Clare!

    don't you dare ask me to explain Clare getting decapitated by "Rafaela" and not dying even when the manga directly states that getting killed in the illusion would be the same in the real world, Clare got decapitated in the Illusion, so she should be decapitated and dead "in the real world" too, but she isn't... I'm completely baffled... argh!

    at the same time, Teresa's "consciousness/soul/spirit/essence/entity" tranfers itself from Clare into the Destroyer, however it doesn't have control over the Destroyer yet, but it does manifest it's will over the Destroyer, causing the Destroyer's Awakened form to be that of the Twin Goddesses of Love ("What Teresa wanted her form to be in the end", according to Priscilla).

    9. Clare unleashes her Yoki, and uses the Quick Sword on "Rafaela", trying to slice up R+L half-merged bodies before its too late... but it is too late, as the Destroyer is already growing into the towering Twin Goddess of Love form (breaking/destroying the forest castle to pieces as it grows gigantic in size).

    10. Rafaela again screams at Clare, telling Clare to break the "mind merge/bond" with the Destroyer, otherwise her mind (and body) will be consumed by it, and killed/dead.

    11. Clare breaks away mentally (Rafaela uses the last of her power and transfers herself, her "mind/soul/spirit/essence/entity" into poor Clare's head, and Clare is seen "birthing" out/free from the Destroyer, possibly indeed in a "renewed/revitalized" body... does she still have Irene's arm, and what about the scars and the "implantation site"?

    12. Rafaela speaks using Clare's vocal cords/mouth talking about Alicia+Beth who are fighting against Riful at this very moment, being able to now sense them or their yoki with Clare's body, (which Clare knows almost nothing about them, proving its Rafaela speaking... or at least the memories/thoughts of Rafaela are "speaking" using Clare's vocal cords/mouth).

    13. When the Destroyer's huge black soul tentacle consumes Clare's lower body, inside the Destroyer, Teresa recognizes Clare, takes over the Destroyer, and stops the Destroyer from killing Clare. Instead, Teresa has the Destroyer use it's small tentacles to lift up Clare's remaining upper body, and bring it back to its body, maybe to Regenerate back Clare's lower body or to save/keep Clare alive at least. Teresa than has the Destroyer protect Clare's friends when Priscilla tries to attack them. Teresa than has the Destroyer attack Priscilla (instead of attacking/consuming all life/living things in the forest). Teresa manages to get the Destroyer to envelop and hold Priscilla apart of its mass, sealing Priscilla in the "blob of 3 (or 4)".

    ----------------------------------------------------

    14. Priscilla is/was seeking to eliminate the only threat to her rule over the island: Teresa of the Faint Smile, which is unfortunately, poor Clare.
    Last edited by HegemonKhan; March 28, 2011 at 12:21 AM.

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    Registered User 下級員 / Kakyuuin / Jr. Member colonywars's Avatar
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    Re: Who(or what) is the 3rd being inside the remains of the Destroyer?

    Hello

    I voted other, so I will explain My self in posting a thread.

    Clare is already in side of the blob, Priscilla also, Destroyer has in flashback consciousness of Rafaela, but after awaking It was turned into mindless weapon of destruction. I rather do not think, that Teresa consciousness is present, except Her Yoki scent, which comes from Clare. Riful was dead, so Her conscious presence is also questionable. And Renee is missing in action who knows where. But She won't be useful a lot to lock in Priscilla. So there must be merged something, someone else in side.

    And to idea that Clare is Destroyer Body, She then must took control over whole "blob thing". So maybe this all above was blended together and after awaking it will be one hell of a killing organic machine?

    Have a nice day
    Last edited by colonywars; March 30, 2011 at 01:53 PM.

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    Re: Who(or what) is the 3rd being inside the remains of the Destroyer?

    @HegemonKhan
    Sorry but I think i'm actually more confused about what your saying now.

    What do those numbers you put before your points indicate? Are they a time-line or just indicating separate points that lead to a conclusion? Either way what is your conclusion about what the 3rd entity is(The first 2 clearly being Clare and the one-horned demon, aka Priscilla)?

    I can't figure out if your saying that you think the Destroyer as an independent being or Teresa controlling the destroyer.

    -------------

    Some sub-points i will bring up that i noticed in your post by the way are....

    *) I'm pretty sure Rafaela didn't "crush" her sister or do anything as simple as physical harm. It seemed like she used the training the organization gave her to hold her sisters consciousness while she awakened(like Alicia and Beth) to take her sisters mind into herself and sort-of merge with her; resulting in that fused body that Riful had. Crushing wouldn't have created that thing.

    *) "the single nameless consciousness" was what remained of Rafaela who was reconstructed using Clare's memories. That's what the being Clare talked to called herself in chapter 92 said anyway. The Destroyer was something that was released only after Clare destroyed that entity. In what the pseudo-Rafaela called her body's "true awakening", which according her would have extinguished all semblance of her remaining humanity anyway.

    *) What happened with Clare being lured to the remains of Luciela and Rafaela was probably something similar to what the organizations #10 Rafutera used to defeat Mira. Sensory control by Yoki Synchronization. Rafultera could use it to manipulate the senses and Galatea(as well as that male awakened being in the north) could use it to manipulate their opponents physically motions.

    ----------------------

    Here I'll do a basic point summery of my Teresa theory to show you what i meant by point summery.

    Spoiler: My Teresa is the 3rd being theory show

    ----

    Maybe it's just because it's late and i'm tired but this whole return of Teresa thing is beginning to seem downright plausible to me. I wonder if i'm just convincing myself that one of my favorite characters is going to make a comeback out of sheer willpower, or if there might actually be something to it.

    In fact this whole "Teresa and Clare rebirth theory" is fitting together a lot better than i would have thought possible before i started typing it out.

    Anybody see any gaping holes in my logic that my love for Teresa might be causing me not to notice?
    Last edited by Jammin; March 29, 2011 at 12:10 AM.
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    Registered User 英雄メンバー / Eiyuu Menbaa / Hero Member HegemonKhan's Avatar
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    Re: Who(or what) is the 3rd being inside the remains of the Destroyer?

    I often make things even more confusing when I try to explain, clarify, or simplify... sorry!

    #'s 1-3 and 14 are just to separate the things I'm answering.

    #'s 4-13 are indeed chronological ordering

    the 3rd entity is priscilla (which is who Galatea is referencing, she's NOT referencing some other entity! the manga's use of Galatea's comments is to inform us, that indeed Priscilla has been sealed inside of the "blob", along with Clare+Destroyer, that those wings sticking out of the "blob" are indeed Priscilla's, if we couldn't tell, lol)

    the "blob of 3" entities:

    E1=Destroyer, E2=Clare, and E3=Priscilla. But E4 (maybe what you mean by the 3rd Entity in your OP/Poll question), I too agree with, that it is probably Teresa.

    in terms of the entities, temporarily or "permanently", (of the Destroyer):

    E1=Rafaela, E2=Destroyer, E3=Renee, E4=Clare, E5=Teresa (theoretical), and E6=Priscilla

    the Destroyer IS it's own ("beast"/mindLESS) entity (of destruction). it is NOT Rafaela's mind/conscious/subconscious NOR dead Luciela's, lol. it has it's own consciousness/it is its own inidividual entity, but it is not an intelligence/sentient entity (as it only "desires" destruction, it's "NON-thinking")

    if, my theory is right that Teresa transfered herself from Clare to the Destroyer, than once Teresa realized/became aware that the Destroyer was about to kill Clare, she-Teresa took over the Destroyer.

    -----------------------------------------------------

    does this answer your questions/make sense, or are you now even more confused?


    "*) I'm pretty sure Rafaela didn't "crush" her sister or do anything as simple as physical harm. It seemed like she used the training the organization gave her to hold her sisters consciousness while she awakened(like Alicia and Beth) to take her sisters mind into herself and sort-of merge with her; resulting in that fused body that Riful had. Crushing wouldn't have created that thing." -Jammin

    this is wrong, in my (I believe) well-supported understanding.

    Rafaela DID "KILL/FATALLY-hug-crush" Luciela DEAD! (as can be seen by Luciela's reaction, ~"Rafaela, what are you doing, you're hurting me!", and the limp hand of Luciela, signifying she's dead, killed by Rafaela's "hug-crushing" Luciela's body fatally)

    And confirmed by Riful, as she explains what happens AFTER Rafaela had "hug-crushed" Luciela DEAD. (I can provide the source, it's easy to miss as it skips a few chapters forward from the chapter where Rafaela kills Luciela, but Riful is the one who confirms and explains what happened which resulted in Rafaela being half-merged to Luciela's dead body/corpse)
    Last edited by HegemonKhan; March 29, 2011 at 01:13 AM. Reason: Automerged Doublepost

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  20. #11
    MH's Best Reviewer 有名人 / Yuumeijin / Celebrity Jammin's Avatar
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    Re: Who(or what) is the 3rd being inside the remains of the Destroyer?

    Ok i think i finally understand.

    What threw me off was that you are basing your idea on 4 entity's instead of 3. The reason i went with 3 in the poll because when Galatea took a peek at what's inside the Destroyers remains what she sensed was the Yoki of 3 distinct entities inside it.

    Clare+something else suppressing the one-horned demon(aka Priscilla)

    So those are the 3 i'm interested in. The first 2 are pretty clearly Clare and Priscilla and you believe the other is Teresa in control of the Destroyer.

    ------------------

    As for Luciela's death i reread it i still don't see any crushing going on. I'd be interested to see the section about Riful. I don't remember Riful ever mentioning the method Rafaela used to kill her sister at all.

    Basically the way i see the scene.
    • Rafaela embraces her sister hugs her tight and then you see her Yoki begin to build up.
    • A burst of energy that seems to indicate a tremendous release of Yoki begins to happen.
    • Luciela beings to realize what's going on and is not at all happy.
    • There is a loud sound, the energy stops, and Luciela goes limp.
    The next time we see either of them they are fused as one being. Not sure how a hug would have managed that or given birth to a monster like the destroyer.

    Plus, Luciela may have been in human form but she was still an abysal one. Even in a weakened state, squeezing her like a grape does not seem like it would have much effect unless Rafaela had torn her entirely in half.
    Last edited by Jammin; March 29, 2011 at 09:44 AM.
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  22. #12
    Registered User 英雄メンバー / Eiyuu Menbaa / Hero Member HegemonKhan's Avatar
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    Re: Who(or what) is the 3rd being inside the remains of the Destroyer?

    here's the source of Riful's comments about it:

    ch 82 pages 8-9 and 24-31

    specifically ch 82 page 27

    and here's Rubel's comment about having "information on/about Luciela" saying nothing about this information, merely being Luciela's location (as if Rafaela could find.. Luciela.. on her own... pffft. So, I firmly believe in my theory that this "information on/about Luciela" is directly whatever Rafaela tried to do to dead Luciela, according to Riful):

    a small suggestion of it: ch 64 page 22

    (ch 64 pages 26-35 has the Rafaela killing Luciela scene)

    ch 64 page 21 says (Rubel says/offers/bribes/blackmails) merely information on Abysaal One Luciela, not saying anything about the information being on/about Luciela's location.

    -----------------------------

    here's my theory-understanding of what Riful says:

    Rubel finally tells Rafaela how to save/"De-Awaken" her beloved older sister Luciela from the AO that she is now, back into her old self, a Claymore or a human even.

    Rubel tells Rafaela that she must first kill Luciela, as in killing Luciela, she kills the Yoma inside of Luciela too, that which has made Luciela into an AO due to Luciela's Awakening.

    Now that Luciela is dead and no longer under control of the Yoma (as it was killed along with Luciela's death), no longer an AO anymore, now Rafaela is to use a "forbidden jutsu" technique that Rubel told/taught her about (the "information that he had on/about Luciela") on the dead Luciela.

    the reason this is a "forbbiden jutsu" technique, is because it requires sacrfice of the user of it. the user sacrifices their own life, by pouring in their Life Force/Yoki into the dead corpse, to give it life back, but at the cost of their own life. This happens by the user's body merging with the dead corpse to revive it back to life, but the user is killed in the process.

    Now Rafaela cares ONLY about her beloved older sister Luciela, just like Clare with Teresa and Miria with Hilda and Ophelia with her brother and Priscilla with her papa and etc, so Rafaela will gladly do this "forbidden jutsu", will gladly sacrifice her life, if it means she can rectify her mistake that caused Luciela to Awaken and become the 3rd AO, in the first place, Rafaela, will gladly sacrifice her life to make things right and to save her sister, THIS TIME, as she failed to do so the first time when they were doing the disasterous Soul Link attempt. Saving her beloved older sister Luciela, is the ONLY thing Rafaela cares about. Rafaela was willing and indeed did so, killing her own Claymores down as Rubel ordered her, just to get Rubel's blackmail of information on how to save Luciela, earning Rafaela the gossiped title of "The Assassin of the Organization (or rather of Rubel, lol)". The other Claymores mean nothing to her, compared to her beloved older sister Luciela, Rafaela was willing to "sell her soul to the devil" and did so, to Rubel, hehe

    (and thus, I DO think Rafaela cut down Irene without hesitation. Irene is a weak inisgnificant rank 2 comapred to rank 1 Rafaela, who cares so deeply for her sister Luciela, Rafaela wouldn't hesitate to chop Irene down if it meant saving her sister Luciela, from being an AO forever, and she didn't hesitate towards all the other unknown Claymores she had already assassinated for Rubel, so why would she not do the same to Irene, why would Rafaela spare her life?)

    Now, I personally, question whether Rubel actually was telling Rafaela how to "Save/De-Awaken" Luciela... I personally think Rubel was actually telling Rafaela how to create a Super AO, that would be even more powerful than Priscilla... except Rafaela again, F'ed up, failing at doing so, and the process was incompleted, "ONLY" creating the "MERE" Destroyer instead.

    The Destroyer is merely the "incomplete and failed" result... something much more powerful was suppose to have been created.... but Rafaela F'ed it up...

    ------------

    regardless, as you can see, I think Rafaela must have been uber uber powerful, just to be able to do whatever it was that Riful described her doing.

    not to mention that Rafaela was powerful enough to do the Soul Link as well, only failing due to its added req of "yoki synchronization".

    also, not to mention, Rafaela able to briefly override the Destroyer, and tell Clare what to do to save herself.

    and lastly, having the power to "Mind Transfer" her mind into Clare's head, saving herself before she was consumed by the Destroyer, aong with Clare, who was able to escape (along with rAfaela inside of Clare's head).

    Rafaela has done some "god-like" Yoki Abilities that are so "Alien" and "unheard of" in regards to the rest of the manga and Claymores/Awakeneds! That Rafaela has to be uber uber uber powerful! Maybe not at Teresa's and Priscilla's level, but close... though *maybe* Rafaela could actually be more powerful than even Teresa as well.... *maybe*... hehe

    not to mention that Rubel said Rafaela was at least as powerful as Luciela was.

    while we don't know how much strength Rafaela had/needed to hug-crush AO Luciela to death, as we don't know how weak/vulnerable Luciela was in her humanoid form not to mention that she was also nearly out/exhausted of yoki, it's possible that Rafaela has the same level of brute strength as seen in Teresa (ripping AO Rosemary's Awakened arm off with NO YR!), Miata (tearing apart NYs with her bare hands and nearly pulling over Agatha's giant pod Awakened body, even as her wrists were tearing apart/her hands ripping off!), Awakened Priscilla (slap-smack-decapitating AO Alicia's Awakened head off of her neck!), and now Deneve (stopping an aB with her bare outstretched hand!).
    Last edited by HegemonKhan; March 29, 2011 at 12:18 PM.

  23. #13
    Registered User 上級員 / Jyoukuuin / Sr. Member
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    Re: Who(or what) is the 3rd being inside the remains of the Destroyer?

    I believe it is a part of Teresa. Hell, she might even regenerate when the cocoon gets broken.

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    Registered User 英雄メンバー / Eiyuu Menbaa / Hero Member HegemonKhan's Avatar
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    Re: Who(or what) is the 3rd being inside the remains of the Destroyer?

    could you provide your reasons for believing it is Teresa, what are the things that you feel suggest it is Teresa ?

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    Registered User 下級員 / Kakyuuin / Jr. Member jamie95403's Avatar
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    Re: Who(or what) is the 3rd being inside the remains of the Destroyer?

    I appreciates everyone's speculations. I think any of them can be possible. But what if there's not a third entity?

    Galatea says "They are both in here." Nowhere does she specifically enumerate three entities. After mentioning a "one-horned winged monster," Galatea goes on to mention Clare, then goes on to saying something other than Clare is binding Priscilla's movement. "Something" isn't necessarily a third entity. "Something" could be duct tape for all we know (just kidding :-)

    I tried to translate the passage in question (Gernot translation):

    クレアとそして別の何かが共にその動きを封じている
    Clare, and something else, are together sealing its movements

    But another possibility is my poor translation:

    The motion is sealed with something other than Clare

    Galatea goes on to warn that to release Clare might mean releasing Priscilla---Galatea does not mention a third entity. Given the dangers of Priscilla, surely Galatea would be concerned about releasing an unknown third entity. But she shows no such concern.

    In a way, I hope I'm mistaken. It would be assumedly more fun if there was a third entity. But whatever is binding Priscilla, let us all hope for a big surprise!
    All possibilities are on the table...

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