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Thread: Gantz is not using teleportation.

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    Registered User 英雄メンバー / Eiyuu Menbaa / Hero Member Amnesiac's Avatar
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    Gantz is not using teleportation.

    Quote Originally Posted by Gantz556 View Post
    Everytime that people are "teleported", they are actually being made with new copies. If my guess is correct, we have already seen hundreds of Kei Kurono throughout the manga!

    We might find out in the upcoming chapters if my crazy theory is correct.
    Your theory has already been proved wrong countless times through the manga.


    Chapter 4: while the yakuza guy's torso is outside, his legs run in the room:
    Spoiler show

    If the Yakuza appearing outside was a copy, then the legs inside the room would have no torso and head to control them into running.

    More examples...

    Chapter 5: brainless Katou speaking:
    Spoiler show


    Again chapter 5: with his head outside already, Kurono feels out the room in search for his suit and gun:
    Spoiler show


    On a more recent instance, chapter 295: american guy speaks even though his brain is already in the room:
    Spoiler show



    As I said, there are countless examples. Just look at the beginning and end of every mission.

  2. #2
    Registered User 有名人 / Yuumeijin / Celebrity warbandit66's Avatar
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    Re: Gantz 295 Discussion/296 Prediction Thread

    Well the only way technically the only way to teleport somebody is to completely destroy them and simply rebuild them particle by particle so Gantz556 may be right.
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    Registered User 上級員 / Jyoukuuin / Sr. Member Emmanra's Avatar
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    Re: Gantz 295 Discussion/296 Prediction Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by Gantz556 View Post
    I predict that the 100 points menu will be accessible for the last time. Nishi might start wearing Oka's suit for Katastrophe.


    warbandit666 did simplify what I was saying:

    Gantz is reconstrucing bodies particle by particle. Its effect will appear like teleportation, but it is not teleportation.

    Well that doesnt explain the continuity of people talk when there head are being transferred. I can see this reconstruction working if it were like beem me up scott and all mass is destroyed at once and then rebuilt. I really dont care both theories sound good. All I know Kei's badass to have survived latest mission
    Be content with what you have and not what you are.

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    Registered User 英雄メンバー / Eiyuu Menbaa / Hero Member Amnesiac's Avatar
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    Re: Gantz 295 Discussion/296 Prediction Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by Gantz556 View Post
    You did not understand my hypothesis. You should play videogames to understand what I have observed.

    Your examples are actually proofs of my hypothesis. Thanks for helping me.

    I have already noticed what you have just noticed. When someone is being "transferred", it takes a time lag for body parts to appear. It is similar to a videogame when the saved data is being loaded or loading.

    Here is how my theory really works:
    As your body is being "loaded" or "loading", you are not being teleported. Your data is only being loaded with a new copy of your body.

    Let us use your example:
    Spoiler show

    As Kei Kuruno is being "transfered", Gantz is actually copying his body piece by piece. It is like reconstruction of new matter and destruction of old body.

    Kei Kurono is conscious while his old data is being deleted, and being overwritten with a new saved data.

    Conclusion:
    It is not same as teleportation, because teleportation assumes that you are moving the same particle across space-time. What Gantz doing is not moving the same particles, but creating new particles, based upon his memory bank.

    Gantz is reconstructing a body cell by cell. How he does it? That is really what interests me.

    If it is really teleportation, the transfer must be instant without time lags/time delay. That is why I came up with my speculation/guess.

    Gantz is not teleporting, but constantly making copies of players and weapons. I am 100% confident with my hypothesis, because Katastrophe might prove it.
    I do enough gaming. You're the one who needs to brush up your cognitive abilities.

    I agree gantz is rebuilding the body, but it's not new matter. Matter can't be created nor destroyed. Gantz moves the gantzer particle by particle, rebuilding him in the new location.

    There's no lag, I don't know where you've got that from. There's clearly a connection between the two parts in the transfer, the character appears on one side synchronous with the disappearing on the other side.


    Somehow, you've completely missed the point of the examples I gave, they don't support a copy theory at all.

    Example: Katou is being transferred outside from the room.

    According to your theory, the Katou in the room is being "destroyed" and a new Katou is being created outside. But we can clearly see, when the top of Katou's head has already been transferred, the Katou in the room can still talk, according to your theory that Katou couldn't talk because his brain has already been destroyed.


    Sweet zombie jesus, I can't believe I had to explain such a simple reasoning.
    Last edited by Amnesiac; April 01, 2009 at 12:03 PM.

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    Re: Gantz 295 Discussion/296 Prediction Thread

    @Gantz556 and Amnesiac: I don't think either are you are completely right, nor are you both completely wrong. Both of you have brought up good points and arguments and I think the real answer is probably a mixture of both your opinions.
    Either that or it's just one of those things that will never be explained in Gantz.

    (Another thing I doubt will be explained is where the aliens that have been "Y-Gunned" will go {They should shoot another gantzer just for the sake of us getting a sneak peek! } )

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    Registered User 上級員 / Jyoukuuin / Sr. Member Chaoswind's Avatar
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    Re: Gantz 295 Discussion/296 Prediction Thread

    That is why we can't really say

    "I know how transfer works" because it breaks a lot of physics rules, we can't really explain it with our own rules, unless gantz is manipulating time/space continue, that kind of transportation should be impossible, unless we say something like: During the transfer the link between the body parts is never broken, because... Oku wants to -_-

    Don't try to understand something that was never meant to be understood, Oku probably thinks that transportation looks cooler than a "Beam me Spot(sp)" so until he gets out of his way to explain it, all theories are plain nonsense.
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    Registered User 英雄メンバー / Eiyuu Menbaa / Hero Member kaliayev's Avatar
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    Re: Gantz 295 Discussion/296 Prediction Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by Gantz556 View Post
    You did not understand my hypothesis. You should play videogames to understand what I have observed.

    Your examples are actually proofs of my hypothesis. Thanks for helping me.

    I have already noticed what you have just noticed. When someone is being "transferred", it takes a time lag for body parts to appear. It is similar to a videogame when the saved data is being loaded or loading.

    Here is how my theory really works:
    As your body is being "loaded" or "loading", you are not being teleported. Your data is only being loaded with a new copy of your body.

    Let us use your example:
    Spoiler show

    As Kei Kuruno is being "transfered", Gantz is actually copying his body piece by piece. It is like reconstruction of new matter and destruction of old body.

    Kei Kurono is conscious while his old data is being deleted, and being overwritten with a new saved data.

    Conclusion:
    It is not same as teleportation, because teleportation assumes that you are moving the same particle across space-time. What Gantz doing is not moving the same particles, but creating new particles, based upon his memory bank.

    Gantz is reconstructing a body cell by cell. How he does it? That is really what interests me.

    If it is really teleportation, the transfer must be instant without time lags/time delay. That is why I came up with my speculation/guess.

    Gantz is not teleporting, but constantly making copies of players and weapons. I am 100% confident with my hypothesis, because Katastrophe might prove it.
    Sigh, sometimes, people evoke a deep desire within me to gouge out my eyes. Your "theory" only holds with people who are injured (keep in mind that injuries don't have to be clearly illustrated), and similar transfer theories have been expressed in far better terms, and with fewer holes, elsewhere.

    @amnesiac
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    Registered User 中級員 / Chuukyuuin / Member Renan's Avatar
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    Re: Gantz 295 Discussion/296 Prediction Thread

    Gantz is like a fax machine! ...Not really.

    I guess it's like...he takes a copy of the person before the person dies 100% which can possibly explain why there is a second person sometimes (Kishimoto). I believe Gantz can indeed teleport, but when the dead first appear in the Gantz room they're copies of the people who died recently, after every mission with the aliens Gantz uses his magic to teleport the Gantzers back into the Gantz room healing their wounds somehow.
    My grandmother always told me that the best way to end the day was with a long shower. A long shower that is so hot your flesh will slowly burn off and you chance of survival is very small...I don't see her a lot.

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    Registered User 中級員 / Chuukyuuin / Member Renan's Avatar
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    Re: Gantz is not using teleportation.

    In a way I think he is. I think Gantz teleports the Gantzers after every mission and only makes a copy of them before they die. I don't think Gantz needs to make new copies. I think Gantz has some time of power that heals all wounds that the Gantzers have, explaining why they get lost limbs back when they die.
    My grandmother always told me that the best way to end the day was with a long shower. A long shower that is so hot your flesh will slowly burn off and you chance of survival is very small...I don't see her a lot.

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    Registered User 下級員 / Kakyuuin / Jr. Member teh100pointer's Avatar
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    Re: Gantz 295 Discussion/296 Prediction Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by Renan View Post
    Gantz is like a fax machine! ...Not really.

    I guess it's like...he takes a copy of the person before the person dies 100% which can possibly explain why there is a second person sometimes (Kishimoto).
    Nishi said the same.
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    Registered User 英雄メンバー / Eiyuu Menbaa / Hero Member georgemarvin's Avatar
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    Re: Gantz 295 Discussion/296 Prediction Thread

    Quote Quote:
    That is why we can't really say

    "I know how transfer works" because it breaks a lot of physics rules, we can't really explain it with our own rules, unless gantz is manipulating time/space continue, that kind of transportation should be impossible, unless we say something like: During the transfer the link between the body parts is never broken, because... Oku wants to -_-

    Don't try to understand something that was never meant to be understood, Oku probably thinks that transportation looks cooler than a "Beam me Spot(sp)" so until he gets out of his way to explain it, all theories are plain nonsense.
    Actually, it's kind of difficult to argue that a technology violates the laws of physics when a less advanced form of the exact same scientific principle has been in commercial use for years.

    Using Rapid Prototyping by the SLS laser production process doesn't violate ANY physics rules. The Gantz laser seems to just be a little more advanced version of the machine that is in use today. Artists, designers and small manufacturers use SLS laser 3-D printing to build real world sculptures, prototypes and even limited production products for retail sale from information stored on a computer's hard drive.

    http://www.xpress3d.com/SLS.aspx

    http://www.3dsystems.com/appsolution..._CaseStudy.pdf

    http://www.bathsheba.com/sculpt/proc...x.html#3dprint

    It creates a perfect copy of a computer-generated model stored in memory, layer by layer, using a laser to fuse together microscopic particles.

    It can be used to make an exact copy of an original object that has been reverse engineered, too, but only if the original object is expendable; in order to make a perfect copy by reverse engineering, the original would be destroyed as the 3-D scanner would disassemble it one microscopic layer at a time and store the data for use by the SLS assembly laser.

    It is entirely feasible that at some time in the future, SLS laser RP manufactuing tech will be able to do something akin to teleportation by reverse engineering an object, storing each layer's data in a computer, and re-assembling it one microscopic layer at a time at another location simultaneously. You could be reverse engineered to death, stored as a digital copy, and a fresh copy of you could be created on the other side of the world, simultaneously. If you proceeded to break your neck as you stepped off the deck, no problem; the last saved copy of you would still be in the database. The computer could just reverse engineer the broken copy of you out of existence and make another fully functional copy. We're only about 30 to 50 years behind Gantz' rapid transport technology right now.

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    Registered User 初心者/ Shoshinsha / Beginner Chloe Unprettier's Avatar
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    Re: Gantz 295 Discussion/296 Prediction Thread

    How the copy escapes from their perception, that I wonder.

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    Registered User 初心者/ Shoshinsha / Beginner abtesk's Avatar
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    Re: Gantz 295 Discussion/296 Prediction Thread

    well, nice ... while waiting to activate my account george kinda already wrote what i wanted to say.
    anyways. hi. i'm new. have been following most gantz related threads for some time, but never felt motivated enough to join the "confusion", but reading about physics related stuff kinda got be heated up.

    now ... enough of an introduction and straight to the NIEDERMACHUNG.
    most of you guys probably already know that oku never really thought about the technical stuff, since on some or another layer all the great "teleportation"stuff might not be possible at all.
    if gantz would erase the copies and reasamble them somewhere else on the spot, for the new copies to actually be capable of interacting with the old one, gantz would have to continously transport back and forth all the bodily fluits responsible for the interaction creating the body, mind, reaction-pattern, etc etc ... and that on a microsopic scope, considering both the cellular structure and overall compostion of the matter forming the body.
    so all in all, either gantz opens up a gateway between the start and end point of the transport, or it's actually not possible, because the people still live and are conscious DURING the transport.
    and considering the many really possible ways of how to "store" a body (be it either in the form of data on a harddrive or whatever) the person being transported would have to be killed on the spot. that should be the only way anyway.
    (i also can point out a moral reason to that: a copy ain't a transported person. it's a copy, and as such, two people with the same base-reaction-pattern would exist. .... i don't know if that's a bad thing, but has anybody seen the movie prestige? ... wolverine immediately kills his copy ;-) )
    my theory is:
    based on my very limited knowledge of ... i can't remember the correct term, so i will have to explain it :-P
    if you send light through a grid, the light will be distorted and its "path of flight" will be manipulated resulting in a specific pattern, corresponding to the form of the grid.
    now, in modern biology it is possible to send light trough a protein and get that pattern, analyse it and thus reconstructing the form of the protein in a graphic program.
    if the light would be strong enough, my guess is, one could send it through a humans body, get the pattern, and than reconstruct that human body on a digital level exactly copying the molecualar/atomic structure.
    and in my believe, that light would have to be so strong, it would probably evaporate the body being scaned ;-)
    sounds kinda like the little laser in gantz?
    but there is no smoke or such indicating the destructing of the body.
    so it is as much a flawed theory as any other.

    some guy talked about an actual transport, taking layer by layer of "body-stuffs" and reasembling them in the desired location.
    that's actually the best explanation so far.
    explains why there is no trace of any remains after the supposed "destruction" of the body. plus it's the simplest arround, i guess. occam's razor. simple and effective.
    space-time manipulation would be as simple ... but ...meeeeh. sounds fishy, and if gantz could just make wormholes out of nothing, then why care about taking humans to kill aliens ... just frickin destroy every muthaf***a out there.

    and here comes the standard "pliiiis axcuse me bad language guys. me not so gud in talking englisch!!!"
    i'm pretty confidant in me having made some harsh violations against the english language ... even so maybe just in this sentence ... whatever.

    please don't be too mean to me. i really am a nice guy ... sorta ... but who is in here, considering we all love people being sliced open by ugly alienthings?
    Last edited by abtesk; April 01, 2009 at 05:19 PM.

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    Re: Gantz is not using teleportation.

    If what you say is true, then how can you explain when Katou is in a Gantz mission his brother go out looking for him, that because he can't find him in that periode of time, and that is the opposite of what you said.
    if gantz makes a copies of them, that mean Gantz takes care about what could happen to thier real life, and from all mission Gantz care about no one(innocent are involved).

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    Re: Gantz 295 Discussion/296 Prediction Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by Gantz556 View Post
    Unlocking a 100 pts weapon does not mean that you are the only owner of it. Once you get the 100 pts weapon, you have the responsibility of making sure that it stays with your hands.

    For example, Kei Kurono is responsible for making sure that he has brought his Gantz suit with him. There are two events when Kurono has not brought his Gantz suit during a mission.
    ...... I'm pretty sure I understood that much, what was the point of explaining that? I don't understand your point, please explain further.




    Kurono and Nishi, have been transfered back with the H-gun they picked up and held onto when their transfer started, a weapon which neither own. A fact which I did not think was possible until this weeks chapter. It could turn out that in fact, it was always like this, bringing back whatever item you hold onto as the transfer starts. Like for example when the new mission started after Kei was killed the vamps held onto the old man and Rekia and were brought along inside the room.

    The problem arises when you go back to the Oska mission. Kato had the H-gun after defeating the boss but did not have it with him when he was back in th room.

    http://read.mangashare.com/Gantz/cha...9/page003.html (oskan mission katou)
    http://read.mangashare.com/Gantz/cha...9/page012.html (transfered back no weapon)

    A possible scenario is that, It could turn out that in the Oska mission, the Kato that defeated the boss and was transfered back, was from a different save point. Hence not having the H-gun he was holding on to after defeating the boss. This is runs into its on problem because , if the Kato that was brought back in the transfer was a from a different point, then he would be asking what happened to the boss, etc, etc.

    Just like how Kurono asked what happened after defeating the bird boss and was transfered back to the room. Since Kato did not do that, he must of known that it was him that defeated Nuri, effectively ruling that possibility out.

    So we're back to square one, the two options as I see it is

    1) You can bring back any weapon item or persons you're holding onto when the transfer starts.
    2) Gantz is messed up and made a mistake during the transfer.

    I like the first option but since that has not happened before(with H gun), I'm going to stick with option two.



    Edit: Welcome to MH, abtesk.

    Last edited by Charlie; April 01, 2009 at 06:13 PM.


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