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Thread: Medaka Box by NISHIO Ishin and AKATSUKI Akira

  1. #766
    MH's Most High Quality Poster 英雄メンバー / Eiyuu Menbaa / Hero Member earthforge's Avatar
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    Re: Medaka Box by NISHIO Ishin and AKATSUKI Akira

    Quote Originally Posted by Franckie View Post
    Nisio introduced plotlines in random intervals that were ultimately pointless (e.g. Ajimu's seal was pointless),
    Ajimu's seal was a result of a misjudgement regarding Kumagawa. It also made her a side character for this arc, with her obvious inability to do certain things.

    Quote Quote:
    spoke of topics in need of resolution but did nothing to address them (e.g. what do Zenkichi and Medaka see in each other again?),
    Zenkichi loves Medaka because "she is, for lack of a better word, perfect" (kudos if you get the reference.) She is magnificent in all things - even in failure. Or at least that's what he sees.

    Medaka thinks she loves Zenkichi (I hesitate to say that she does) because he has reached out to her when she has done the same. He is now "magnificent" to her.

    Quote Quote:
    spent a year over pointless build-up (e.g. just the prospect of having to confront Ajimu unnerved just about everybody),
    So? They reiterated how the prospect of a direct confrontation would be disastrous, as Ajimu has thousands of skills. That is, confronting Ajimu over the Flask Plan. If they subverted the roles as her characters early on, she could wipe them out and replace them until she got her goal. It was only when she had decided the game was finished that Medaka could confront Ajimu, because Ajimu was done.

    And overall, Medaka Box is a giant satire. I hardly understand it sometimes - maybe it's me, or maybe its the "bad writing". I don't care to make a judgement. I'm just enjoying the series itself. I save elaborate analysis and criticisms for series with well-defined tropes (like AoNoEx, or DGM, or Claymore.) This is just one of those "write and let write" stories.

    Quote Quote:
    The reason why I would care is because I'm a writer, hence why I stated that in my previous post.
    I'm a writer myself. To that point, the goal of a story changes depending on what you want to show or what you want the characters to show. It can be something as blatant as "good will always triumph", "friends will save you", or the typical metaphors for human existence. In MB, it is a giant author criticism, satire, and light parody of manga, wrapped haphazardly in the package of a typical shounen story. It isn't about the story as much as the puns.

    Quote Quote:
    Another aspect of his writing style I find surprising is his handling of female characters. It's not often you see females with a a strong role in the plot and varying designs. (I actually use Medaka Box as a reference as I do for countless other series for research.)
    True, but at the same time, Nisio handles his main characters haphazardly. Especially Medaka. One could say that making Medaka fall for Zenkichi is a way for her to become unthreatening and lose her strength. Take Kikaijima, she lost a lot of badass following her defeat by Medaka (this was one part of MB I wasn't fond of, because I am too jaded to believe that someone would ever care to save people suffering from misfortune - especially since saying you care is not the same as actually helping.) She was briefly revealed to still have her badass nature, but in a way, she had been portrayed to have become less strong with the advent of her feminine behavior (through her sisterly connection to Medaka, and affection to Kumagawa.)

    Quote Quote:
    No, because it's funny and it stays consistent with what the manga has been doing since day one.
    And that's what MB never ever does. It dances like a manic hamster from genre to genre, pun to pun. It's not effortless though, and we notice that.

    Quote Quote:
    That doesn't mean readers will agree with Nisio's assertions. Medaka converted Oudo? More like terrified into submission. Medaka converted Kumagawa? The other Minus did the bulk of the work for her, and even then her shrugging off Bookmaker involves her lack of empathy. Medaka converted Ajimu? By saying a couple of nice things to her. The audience will draw their own conclusions and there will be cases where the suspension of disbelief is arguably violated, such as the case with Ajimu.
    That's... Medaka. That is her character. She is a giant plot ball, the penultimate extreme example of a character that is perfect.

    Quote Quote:
    So when you read a series that cycles through hundreds of chapters with 0 plot progress, what do say?
    Again, the plot is the melange of wrapping around the puns and satire, which is unique in being indirect. This often means it brings in a crapload of details that culminate in one, tiny pun.

    Quote Quote:
    When you read countless chapters where you cannot understand what characters are saying, what do you say?
    I google it!

    "Dictionary, you're the only one who understands me..."

    Quote Quote:
    When you read a buttload worth of chapters that have nothing to do with the main plot, what do you say?
    "Man, my classmate enjoys reading this?"
    Avatar © Chelsea Gordon, author of Not Quite Normal.

  2. #767
    MH Senpai 英雄メンバー / Eiyuu Menbaa / Hero Member Atobe the king's Avatar
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    Re: Medaka Box by NISHIO Ishin and AKATSUKI Akira

    Quote Quote:
    And overall, Medaka Box is a giant satire. I hardly understand it sometimes - maybe it's me, or maybe its the "bad writing". I don't care to make a judgement. I'm just enjoying the series itself. I save elaborate analysis and criticisms for series with well-defined tropes (like AoNoEx, or DGM, or Claymore.) This is just one of those "write and let write" stories.
    This is how i feel, i had actually stopped keeping up with the manga at one point...read the kumagawa vs medaka fight and realized I'm missing a really great joke here, glad i got back into it.

    Quote Quote:
    Again, the plot is the melange of wrapping around the puns and satire, which is unique in being indirect. This often means it brings in a crapload of details that culminate in one, tiny pun.
    If people aren't getting this by now...idk. When mangas do some of things this does and does it intentionally its somehow accepted...but when this manga does it as a source of humor it flies over peoples heads. I dont think Nisio is some super godlike awesome writer....but imo the point of the series last arc was to poke fun at actual bad writing, down to the asspull of deus ex machina that ended the arc lol.

    Spoiler show
    Last edited by Atobe the king; March 31, 2012 at 10:13 PM.
    When's Prince of Tennis Smash Hit 4

  3. #768
    Registered User 英雄メンバー / Eiyuu Menbaa / Hero Member sabret00the's Avatar
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    Re: Medaka Box by NISHIO Ishin and AKATSUKI Akira

    I'll be honest and say that I've actually found this manga to be largely terrible since it decided to swap the genre of battle for romance and that's not to say that I don't like and/or haven't enjoyed a good few romance mangas but that was a change full of so much BS that I was disappointing and while there were some amusing parts, the manga's stock fell considerably. However I persisted and with each passing week, the manga with the unholiest amount of text continued to slide forth into BS-ism and the quality continued to wane. But that was OK because it was ending soon. And I persisted because I just wanted to say that I finished it.

    So WTF is this BS about a new arc? Let it die already. The manga has gone to shit. Everything is at it's natural conclusion. The manga was about an extraordinary girl in an extraordinary world and her struggles to make everyone and build friendships. My favourite sub-plot of the whole manga was the one of the ordinary guy in an extraordinary world who done everything in his power to support his even more extraordinary childhood friend/unrequited love. I actually don't have a gripe with the fact that Medaka who was unable to feel emotions throughout the whole manga suddenly not only fell for Zen but also kissed, that's fine is that's the finale but WTF is this? This seems to be pretty much exactly what's happening in Bakuman; drag it out till the anime starts.
    *Have you taken a look at Onepunch-Man? You should consider it, it's a great manga!

  4. #769
    Registered User 中級員 / Chuukyuuin / Member SaphG1's Avatar
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    Re: Medaka Box by NISHIO Ishin and AKATSUKI Akira

    I think it's already been proven that things Ajimu said did not equate to being the truth about the series, but rather a satire on it. Yet here you are taking her literally yet again in her declaration that the series would turn from battle-manga to love comedy and letting that become the factor by which you now judge every aspect of the series. I guess it just goes to show how easily fans can be won or lost based upon their own perceptions rather then the content the mangaka provides.


    There have only been about 13 chapters since Ajimu made the 'supposed' declaration that the series was changing genre's. That's 13 chapters out of 140, which is less then 10% of the entire series. The only thing that has more or less changed in those thirteen chapters is that a small break was taken from the constant physical clashes between characters. There have still been battle aspects and competition amongst the characters they just haven't focused on superpowers for what could be considered an paltry amount of time compared to the length of the series. The idea that Medaka box suddenly went downhill in 13 measly chapters due to the fact that is wasn't having a powers fight every chapter only shows to me that some fans can only ever accept single minded concepts. that's a wasteful sort of thinking; Its like reading a novel only for the fight or romance scenes. You'll never get the depth of the work when you purposely omit the rest of the content.
    Last edited by SaphG1; April 02, 2012 at 03:19 PM. Reason: it's Ajimu..not Ajemu...silly me

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  6. #770
    Registered User 英雄メンバー / Eiyuu Menbaa / Hero Member sabret00the's Avatar
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    Re: Medaka Box by NISHIO Ishin and AKATSUKI Akira

    I think you want the manga to be something it's not. The author has narrated the manga through characters for 140 chapters and because you feel you had an emotional connection with the author, all of a sudden you're more right? The fact of the matter is, there are no more enemies, Medaka is no longer president. The flask plan was completed and Medaka actually got in touch with her emotions. That's a conclusion irrespective of any narration and/or declaration. Anything beyond this point is stretching it out for the sake of stretching it out.
    *Have you taken a look at Onepunch-Man? You should consider it, it's a great manga!

  7. #771
    Scanlator 英雄メンバー / Eiyuu Menbaa / Hero Member [Cross]'s Avatar
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    Re: Medaka Box by NISHIO Ishin and AKATSUKI Akira

    Quote Originally Posted by sabret00the View Post
    I think you want the manga to be something it's not. The author has narrated the manga through characters for 140 chapters and because you feel you had an emotional connection with the author, all of a sudden you're more right? The fact of the matter is, there are no more enemies, Medaka is no longer president. The flask plan was completed and Medaka actually got in touch with her emotions. That's a conclusion irrespective of any narration and/or declaration. Anything beyond this point is stretching it out for the sake of stretching it out.
    Incorrect. You sir need to pay closer attention to this manga. Here are some points that will completely shatter your argument that there's nothing left:

    - Shiranui family: Hanten, Hasode and even the Chairman! We don't have any closure on any of them! Hasode? What's her ability do exactly, and what's she really going to do about all of this? Hanten's purpose hasn't even been specified, nor have we gotten any backstory on this guy.
    - Medaka mentioned something a while back about having 7 suitors. 7 suitors? Why was such a detail even given out, why was a number even specified? This is a point that will lead to Zenkichi fighting them all off for to keep Medaka to himself, because something like this would obviously get in the way of their love!
    - Medaka got in touch with her emotions, but where is this going to take her? What path is she going to walk?

    See? It's not completely over. You're saying that we want this manga to be something it isn't?
    You're just looking at the surface, completely oblivious of the possibilities.
    Last edited by [Cross]; April 02, 2012 at 08:29 PM.

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  9. #772
    Registered User 英雄メンバー / Eiyuu Menbaa / Hero Member Galactic Tomahawk's Avatar
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    Re: Medaka Box by NISHIO Ishin and AKATSUKI Akira

    I'm just gonna wait and see what Nisio does, I could really see it going either way.

  10. #773
    Registered User 中級員 / Chuukyuuin / Member SaphG1's Avatar
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    Re: Medaka Box by NISHIO Ishin and AKATSUKI Akira

    Quote Originally Posted by [Cross] View Post
    Incorrect. You sir need to pay closer attention to this manga. Here are some points that will completely shatter your argument that there's nothing left:

    - Shiranui family: Hanten, Hasode and even the Chairman! We don't have any closure on any of them! Hasode? What's her ability do exactly, and what's she really going to do about all of this? Hanten's purpose hasn't even been specified, nor have we gotten any backstory on this guy.
    - Medaka mentioned something a while back about having 7 suitors. 7 suitors? Why was such a detail even given out, why was a number even specified? This is a point that will lead to Zenkichi fighting them all off for to keep Medaka to himself, because something like this would obviously get in the way of their love!
    - Medaka got in touch with her emotions, but where is this going to take her? What path is she going to walk?

    See? It's not completely over. You're saying that we want this manga to be something it isn't?
    You're just looking at the surface, completely oblivious of the possibilities.
    do not forget Ajimu mentioned that Medaka killed her 'other father' and this was somehow linked to our dark hero.

    Also the flask plan i not yet complete its just not going to be impeded by Medaka and company, that doesn't mean that everyone else will agree with this turn of events.

    @Sabret00the

    Emotional connection, not really. It's called reading, and I enjoy doing it quite often, I have quite a collection and it doesn't contain cliches like harry potter and twilight. In order to enjoy something you really need to take it in its entirety or you are doing yourself a disservice. Using terms like 'emotional connection' as an accusation only show that you like ninety percent of Americans have almost no real experience in reading comprehension. When can't comprehend what you are reading abstractly and intuitively then even manga is an art form that will be lost on you. I'm not trying to insult you but its the truth.

  11. #774
    MH's Best Reviewer 有名人 / Yuumeijin / Celebrity Jammin's Avatar
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    Re: Medaka Box by NISHIO Ishin and AKATSUKI Akira

    I've never been true Medaka Box fan, the series often came across as too "messy" and often failed to really get me feeling connected to the characters, but I gotta say I'm pretty interested now because for better or worse the last few chapters have been...unique.

    I'm not going to try and defend the writing, which sure seems pretty terrible to me whether it was meant as satirical or not. Yet, for some reason I can't comprehend I am enjoying it quite a bit. As weird as I find it to be, I'm probably more interested in this series now than I ever was before.

    So I guess that means I'm a fan of all this, even if everything about this last arc has seemed incredibly bizarre to me.
    Jammin's Recommended Reading
    The Gamer [Esp. for Everybody]
    I Don't Want This Kind of Hero [Esp. for Superhero/Comedy fans]
    Girls of the Wild's [Esp. for Romance/Martial Arts fans.]
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  12. #775
    MH Senpai 英雄メンバー / Eiyuu Menbaa / Hero Member Atobe the king's Avatar
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    Re: Medaka Box by NISHIO Ishin and AKATSUKI Akira

    If not for Mbox, i would have dropped every manga i was reading, it even made the current state of Air gear tolerable lol. And people really do need to look beyond the surface...the shounen genre doesnt have to be single layered...
    When's Prince of Tennis Smash Hit 4

  13. #776
    Registered User 中級員 / Chuukyuuin / Member SaphG1's Avatar
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    Re: Medaka Box by NISHIO Ishin and AKATSUKI Akira

    Quote Originally Posted by Atobe the king View Post
    If not for Mbox, i would have dropped every manga i was reading, it even made the current state of Air gear tolerable lol. And people really do need to look beyond the surface...the shounen genre doesnt have to be single layered...
    I know what you mean at least partly, after reading today's Naruto chapter and frankly the last few weeks of Code breaker(it happens a lot but I'm exampling today) I once again got to use my new favorite manga based catch phrase "It's All fiction."

    It's hard not to enjoy a running satire that is prepetuated endlessly by the very people it makes fun of. Sometimes I think other Shounen Mangaka should read Medaka as well, if not just to see how goddamn ridiculous they get.
    Last edited by SaphG1; April 10, 2012 at 05:25 PM.

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  15. #777
    MH Senpai 英雄メンバー / Eiyuu Menbaa / Hero Member Atobe the king's Avatar
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    Re: Medaka Box by NISHIO Ishin and AKATSUKI Akira

    Lol, i should start using that. I love parodies and satire etc it sort of exposes how seriously (and too seriously) people take fiction....its why i loved star driver so much since it really wasn't meant to be taken seriously and was poking fun at so many genres haha.

    I've heard good things about the anime so far but i'm waiting a bit before i watch it...it'll be so interesting seeing the slice of life portion before the battle manga switch and then the parody/satirical switch.
    When's Prince of Tennis Smash Hit 4

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    Registered User 英雄メンバー / Eiyuu Menbaa / Hero Member masgrande's Avatar
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    Re: Medaka Box by NISHIO Ishin and AKATSUKI Akira

    Chapter 141 is out and it looks like we will finally learned more about Medaka's family but I found it weird that she didn't mention Zenkichi, also I like her new haircut.
    please click on them to help them grow.

  17. #779
    Registered User 上級員 / Jyoukuuin / Sr. Member
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    Re: Medaka Box by NISHIO Ishin and AKATSUKI Akira

    Oooh, the new story arc has begun...I would have preferred however, a straightman to point out that an arc based around a small fact we learned about Medaka early on, is initiated by the sudden appearance of a new character who decides to appear just as said small fact had just been brought up in discussion. Also, was it necessary to WORF Effect the Cooking Duo?

  18. #780
    Negative Syndicate
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    Re: Medaka Box by NISHIO Ishin and AKATSUKI Akira

    After reading chapter 141:
    Spoiler show


    I begin to question that this series should even called "Medaka Box" from now on.

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