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Ikkaku. Strength and experience all the way!!
Renji. Long range and versatility will win this matchup!!
Master vs Student. Third seat vs Lieutenant. Squad 11 vs Squad 6. Dragon vs...Baboon...snake...thing...
The only two non-captains with a bankai (except Ichigo) face off!! No holds barred, each throwing everything they've got at each other. It was said that the next time they fought it would be to the death. Well, based on what we've seen so far, who would win?
My money's on Ikkaku still. It'd be a close battle but ultimately Renji'll lose. I just don't think his bankai's strong enough yet. Neither is Ikkaku's but I think he makes up for it with his brute strength. He'll slice his way through Renji's attacks and take him down.
This is a really hard one. For one thing renji believed ikkaku to be qualified to lead a squad(perhaps there is more to him than just bankai???). Also, ikkaku was a seate officer long before renji was even a shinigami. Not to mention ikkaku before renji became a VC ikkaku was a thrid seat while renji was the 6th.
On the other hand, SS arc would suggest renji was stronger than ikkaku. Renji also has better range and seems to be at least a little more balance than ikkaku with his overall shinigami abilities(bad at kido is better than none at all).
Ikkaku would appear to have the more destructive bankai but renji would seem to have a more durable one. Not to mention renji's bankai would seem much more durable than ikkaku's.
This is a really hard one, I will take a little time to decide....
I agree with kkck, this is a difficult one. :P
I think Ikkaku might take this, as Renji thinks highly of him and seems to really respect his strength. Also Ikkakus performance against the Arrancars that attacked Karakura town was better (from what I can remember).
Ikkaku's arrancar opponents seem to be cock diesel dudes....they were steroid lovin punks, full of physical power. he was able to combat them so i think ikkaku might blitz renji in terms of strength and swordmanship but renji has advantage in terms of knowlege of a little kido and that blast Zabimaru does in bankai form. maybe renji will win if he keeps a distance and blasts Ikkaku.....
To be fair, Renji was under a 20% limit seal at the time since he was a lieutenant, while Ikkaku wasn't affected by it at all since he was only a third seat. Still, by Renji's own admittance, the battle may not even have leaned toward his favor if he had never had the limit placed on him. On the other hand, Ikkaku barely won his battle.Quote:
So overall, it's pretty hard to draw any real conclusions from their fights here. That said, ignoring the factor of respect that Renji has for Ikkaku, I still think Ikkaku'll win because he and his Bankai are more adept at the direct, head-to-head combat style that both he and Renji use. Like I said though, it'll be damn close.
^Renji does not rely on close combat though. He has actually shown he mostly fights at a range with zabimaru. Not to mention his bankai is even more efficient at ranged combat considering it does not retract like his shikai does.
......I saw that ......Madam.............but thanks anyway. It was funny how you did that in the same sentence where you complimented my observational skills. lol
Back to the discussion, I just remembered how Ikkaku's Bankai was cracked by that arrancar guy's armor. I was thinking it would just plow through Renji's weapon but now I'm not so sure...Plus Renji's got a lot more moves to choose from and even if they didn't hurt Ikkaku that much, they might still force him into a corner for Zabimaru's physical attacks. I might have to rethink my call on this....
....nah, screw it. Ikkaku still wins.
*edit* By the way, from what I heard from you guys, I was expecting more of a spread in the polls. Ikkaku's just kicking ass. Nobody even voted for the double knockout yet...I guess everybody just thought that Ikkaku would edge out Renji in the end. Interesting.
Last edited by Tonguen_yomom; May 26, 2009 at 04:17 PM. Reason: Meh...felt like it.
COme on people is NOT hard at all
We have Ikkaku:
Has been a Third seat for who knows how much, and has already refused several VC promotions (to other divisions).
We only saw him going Bankai vs a Gillian Arrancar, and I know he didn't win in a second, but you should Always keep this facts in mind.
As stated By Byakuya the more damaged you are, the harder is to keep Bankai, MUCH LESS activate it, and Ikkaku did JUST that, he was more beat than any of the others that fought, and still managed to activate his Bankai OUT of a BROKEN Zanpakto.
Second, Of all the Gillians in that fight it can be argued that Ikkaku fought the strongest one, Shawlong was obviously faster, but power wise Volcanica owned them all, (Del Toro was a cow).
Ikkaku is not on par with captains YET, but the only thing he lacks is speed (his Bankai can cut through Hierro like a hot knife through butter), besides we didn't see any kind of special attack (moving the blades around like that can't be called a Bankai special attack).
On the other hand we Have Renji... HIS BANKAI SUCKS
A cero like beam, WITH LESS power and you can obviously see when is coming >_>
His Reiatsu is not enough to maintain Bankai form for a long time, in short, in both defensive and offensive Renji fails at both... Ikakku gets Offensive easily and kind of fails at defensive...
Ikkaku Bankai + Shumpo = WIN
^Why would renji's bankai suck lol? He can control and reform it in many ways and he has range ikkaku can only dream off. Range combat and powerful kido blasts could work wonders against ikkaku IMO.
I also doubt ikkaku only lacks speed to be comparable to captains. He also lacks the huge reiatsu. Considering what was said in SS arc, it stands to reason renji has in a worst case scenario at least as much as ikkaku. Ikkaku's bankai also seems to be incomplete considering he does not use it much and barely cares for it.
I told you, you are not supposed to pull a Bankai out of your ass when you are beaten and Broken.
Lets see Renji Ranged attacks:
His Lame Cero like Beam, with SUCKS for obvious reasons
His own Bankai, baboon chain crap
Ikkaku Ranged attacks:
none that we know off
Close range attacks:
Because is long as hell, is not exactly the most useful thing in close ranged fights.
Besides His Cero beam and the Reform he can do once... what else can he do?
Ikkaku can probably cut his way through Renji's Bankai easily (SLICE AND DICE), and Ikkaku only used his Bankai when he was beat as hell, so there are BIG chances that wasn't everything Ikkaku Bankai could do.
Last edited by Chaoswind; May 28, 2009 at 07:45 PM.
Why would the beam suck, and why can he do it only once?
The Beam sucks, because is WORSE than a Cero.
Is not as powerful as one (suggestive), and takes longer to charge (VERY REAL)... not to mention you can see it coming because the energy MUST pass all the Baboon links all the way to the mouth (VERY REAL).
If the links are broken Renji can reform the Bankai again, but he states he can only do it once... not because is the limits of his bankai, but the limit of his reiatsu.
I believe we didn't see even Half of what Ikkaku's bankai can do (really we didn't even saw the final attack) on the other hand we have seen all the "tricks" renji can pull and they all are pretty unimpressive.
Like I said 3 times with this one, Bankai is not something you are supposed to do when you are beaten as hell... and Ikkaku did just that, so he earns respect points for it.
Last edited by Chaoswind; May 28, 2009 at 08:02 PM.
Why would the beam be worse than a cero and why would you imply cero is a bad technique(most powerful full hollow technique and ulquiorras and grimmjows reaction to ichigo's and shinji's cero suggest it is the mark of true hollow powers)? If anything the power of cero depends on the person.
cero is a powerful technique, but as yammy points out, is slow and can be "easily" dodged... that is why renji sucks... his attack takes longer to charge and as thus is easier to dodge it
if you play RPG's you should be aware that absurdly powerful never beats an fast character (with good power), unless you are extremely lucky
nevertheless I am going off topic... I believe Ikkaku can kick Renji's ass any day of the week, and it seems most think like me... IF renji was truly a versatile fighter then the answer would be more obscure, BUT since he isn't... Ikkaku wins
Last edited by Chaoswind; May 28, 2009 at 08:32 PM.