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Translations: Bleach 595 (2)
Ichigo & Hitsugaya
Byakuya & Zaraki
I got the idea for this match up when I was rewatching ep142 when Byakuya and Zaraki came to the Real world to get Hitsugaya's group back and they said they've been ordered to take them back by force if necessary.
I just thought what would happen if ichigo and Hitsugaya refused and all hell broke loose in that room. Obviously the whole apartment building would explode but then the fight that ensues will be mouthwatering. who would win? How would they pair up to fight? Post your thoughts.
EDIT: It's also a case of the kids overpowered with potential against the two staple powerhouses (in storyline terms I'm ignoring Yama, Shunsui and Uki)
Last edited by Mifune_Taichou; August 22, 2009 at 09:43 AM.
wow, this is prolly one of the most, if no the most interesting match-up weve had here. as to who would win...hmmmm
when it usually comes down to two on two, i vote for the team that compliments one another better, and i think byakuya and kenpachi are that team. the ultimate brawler and the ultimate ranged attacker.
this is assuming ichigonator wont pop up in the fight tho.also, hitsu has good defense, good enough to block byakuya's attacks, but not enough for zaraki's attacks, especially kendo.
the strategy i think would be best for them is, in mmo terms, have zaraki hold aggro on the other two and have byakuya nuke'em. hell, just use gokei on all three of them (big ball of death used on zommari), and watch zaraki walk out, complaining about how short and unfun that fight was
I'll have to also very closely give it to Byakuya and Zaraki.
Ironically, even though Ichigo technically "beat" both of them that doesnt quite count because they werent going all out and I think both of them are stronger than him now. I wasnt planning to involve ichigonator in this match up so I think the fight would go something like this:
I think Ichigo would lose either way and I think if Hitsugaya keeps his distance he can beat or at least trap kenpachi. If Ichigo somehow beats byakuya then they win but I dont see that Happening. if Byakya beats ichigo he will at least be severely weakened and then it just depends on who has more left in the tank-him or Hitsugaya. If however Hitsugaya fights Byakuya when both are at full strenght I dont think Hitsugaya can win. Since I also doubt ichigo can beat zaraki....
As you said Byakuya's bankai can attack both simoultaneously so its really good like that but if Ichigo can stall them enough Hitsugaya can try Using Hyoten Hyokaso and if it connects its KO but I dont see that happening.
Assuming no Ichigonator:
Byakuya and Kenpachi take it in a semi-close victory. Kenpachi with kendo and no eyepatch could overpower both Ichigo and Hitsu in my opinion. Because of how Kubo made ice in Bleach, I think that Hitsu's ice would be easily broken by Kenpachi, as he has such superior levels of reiatsu. And of course, Kenpachi vs. Ichigo... Ichigo would probably need vizard mask and bankai just to draw blood on Kenpachi. Byakuya vs. Hitsu is a decent matchup, both larger scale bankais, not sure if Hitsu can freeze kageyoshi, and if he can, if kageyoshi can break out of the ice, but I don't see Hitsugaya being able to overcome senkei or shukei of Byakuya. Plus, Byakuya has massive speed on his side, whilst HItsugaya has shown us feats of only zanjutsu, and nothing else (never used hand-hand, shunpo, nor kidou yet so far). Byakuya has both speed and kidou on his side. Basically, I see Byakuya beating Hitsugaya, and then Kenpachi beating Ichigo, or in best case scenario for Ichigo, Ichigo is stalemating against Kenpachi, while Byakuya beats Hitsugaya, byakuya joins Kenpachi, and Ichigo gets double teamed and defeated.
If counting Ichigonator.... well, isn't it obvious who would win?
IDK, this one is very hard IMO. I do not think there even is a definitely stronger side... IMO if this two sides fought 100 times each side would win 50....
Byakuya has a ranged zampakuto which can adapt itself to literally any situation. He can also use it in melee combat and drastically increase his own attack power. He also has a proven mastery over kido which makes him even more versatile. All in all, byakuya is one of the most well rounded fighters in bleach which makes him extremely versatile and dangerous.
Kempachi is an outright brawler. He does not have mastery over any shinigami fighting art except probably kendo. Even then, he makes up for it with absurd amounts of reiatsu. He is not to be taken lightly.
Hitsugaya is the prodigy with one of the strongest zampakuto to date. His zampakuto can literally control the heavens and throw chunks of it at the opponent. We have also seen captain class shinigami(gin) having a little trouble with his shikai when using his true power. His bankai can even corner a espada when using it's true power. The catch is that he can't truly control it at that state so he might get his partner caught up in his attack. hitsugaya also seems to have more than decent in every shinigami art including swordsmanship, shunpo and kido. All in all, hitsugaya is very well rounded.
Ichigo is a wild card IMO. His power level seems to randomly vary from random points in the manga which makes him extremely hard to compare against captains. I am inclined to believe that even now he is not really above them though given what we have seen. Ichigo has mastery mostly over shunpo and swordsmanship mostly with a complete lack of control over his reiatsu and kido abilities. He has his bankai and mask which exponentially increase those very aspects though. He also has getsuga tenshou which to some extent could make up for kido and ranged attacks.
I would think this one is mostly a tie....
This is a pretty clever topic, Mifune_Taichou. The outcome would be rather obvious however. Basically this is two taichou level shinigami vs. one taichou and one pathetic substitute shinigami. Poor Shiro-chan, he's got a pretty big handicap! He would be much better off with Madarame on his team instead, but then again, Ikkaku would probably take his captain's side.
There is one way I would see Ken-chan and Byakuya losing though. I could picture Kenpachi, two minutes into the match, resting the dull side of his katana on his shoulder and saying "This is boring, how about the three of you just come at me all at once instead!" Then Byakuya, being the snobby and proud aristocrat that he is, would probably accept his challenge and begin to redirect Senbonzakura over to attack Kenpachi. Then it would be on! From what we've seen, Ken and Byakuya aren't on the best of terms anyway. Remember the seen where they almost got into a fight before Gin tied Ken up and dragged him away?
But yh I both agree with Kkck in the way that when Ichigo brings his absolute A game then the fight is on and its impossible to call a winner, but considering how rarely Ichigo manages to fight on that level(once an arc lol) I would have to agree with you that poor shiro chan is stuck with a dud partner. Essentially to even it out Byakuya and Zaraki would have to kidnap Ichigo's sisters or something.
anyways, in my first post i didn want to make it sound like ken and byakuya would have it easy, but ichi is unpredictable and hitsu is undeveloped. however, if both ichi and hitsu tapped into their true potential, well then, totally different story.
Interesting matchup to say the least... Hard to say who would win, since everything would depend on too many factors, none the least of which depends on how well the teamwork between the pairs is. Ichigo has the advantage of knowing most (Though not all) of Kenpachi and Byakuya's moveset, but by all means knows nothing of Hitsugaya's, and the same for him in the cases of Kenpachi and Hitsugaya too, which in the case of Hitsugaya could hurt their teamwork as well. The captains by all means probably know most if not all about each other though, so there's certainly not a lack of information there... all really comes down to the teamwork...
Main issue though is that Kenpachi does not play nice, so that's going to hurt that side, and Ichigo's power fluctuates so wildly it's next to impossible to tell where he places on the power scale now, because though he's 'beaten' these captains before, events afterwards heavily suggest that he is, for some reason, weaker than them despite learning how to use his mask (Ignoring, obviously, Ichinator who made it even more out of whack), so who knows how effective he's going to be... Hurts both sides really.
In the end though I'd have to doubt, given that this is Bleach, that it will come down to teamwork anyway (Though there is a beacon of hope with recent events that this will stop being the case). Hence matchups would also define this too.
Theoretically either Hitsugaya or Ichigo would do well against Kenpachi if they could keep the fight ranged, similar to what Hitsugaya did against Harribel. Ichigo however likes up close and personal clashes, so this is going to seriously hurt him. In turn Byakuya is certainly one of the more potent captains in terms of his abilities, and in the case in which he fights Hitsugaya it'd ultimately come down to if Hitsugaya can freeze and immobilize his bankai or not, which is up for grabs. Theoretically, given what Ichigo did in canon though, he'd be good for this fight, but the problem is he's slowed down severely since then (As there's NOTHING that explains the crap that has happened since then but that), so that's going to be a massive issue.
It's going to be a close one that depends on a lot of factors. I'd have to assume though, given this is really a rather important plot issue that Hitsugaya and Ichigo would win in this situations. Because otherwise Hitsugaya is dragged back to Soul Society and reprimanded, and Ichigo is on Yamamoto's Naughty list for sure and really, where does it go from there? On the other hand, if they do win Ichigo goes to Soul Society with a considerable amount of actually competent backup (Sad to say), and things look brighter on that end, and Kenpachi and Byakuya can STILL have a big damn heroes moment and say the equivalent of 'Told you you'd get killed, now sit still so I can finish this guy up and drag your ass back'. And we all know that'd be awesome.
Edit: Hell, that route Hitsugaya could fight and destroy an espada that isn't in the top three, and the Rabid Haters would be considerably less butthurt, and the blind fans would be considerably less delusional.
Granted this is cheating going for the plot implications of the fight, but this was the particular scenario suggested. Any other situation in which this particular scenario takes place would be considerably harder to tell simply because there's too many variables to consider.
Last edited by Random101; August 22, 2009 at 08:21 PM.
^^ wow good analysis. I think if Ichigo and Hitsugaya won Yamamoto would probably send soi Fon and Komamura to finish them off and bring them back to prison. Then we'll can have a new arc where yamamoto says "Execute Hitsugaya Toushirou". Oh wait..... lol
I think to a massive extent it comes down to if Hitsugaya uses Hyoten Hyokaso, can Byakuya block for his team with Senbonsakura? He can if hes in the first stage I think but if Hitsugaya uses it after Byakuya's gone senkei(assuming those two are fighting each other) byakuya could be in trouble.
I think if Ichi+Hitsu want to win they need Hitsu to fight kenpachi and freeze him to put him out of commissison (i mean Sennen Hyoru or Hyoten Hyokaso not average ice attack) and then even if Ichigo loses to byakuya(which is likely) Hitsugaya can keep fighting.
If Ichigo fights kenpachi he'll make the mistake of coming close to him, his bankai will bounce off(eyepatch off mode) Zaraki will do kendo and Bleach will need a new protagonist. Man You kind of have to pity Hitsu here every which way because he's either stuck with a tard partner against two of the most badass characters in bleach or Ichigonator comes out, rapes them and then rapes him.
EDIT: ^not necessarily in that order