Jiraiya and Itachi vs. Pain

[SilentBob777]

So, we have Jiraiya and Itachi fighting against Pain (the original six paths). They can use all the techniques we've seen. Jiraiya doesn't have Sage Mode activated before the fight, but he can use it. They know Pain's abilities, but don't know his secret (the bodies are dead, where is Nagato hiding etc.), they figure it out in the fight, since Jiraiya met all the bodies before, but don't know it from the beginning. Pain knows their techniques, except SM and MS. They fight at the same place where Naruto vs. Pain was, the destroyed Konoha, but they all have 100% chakra, meaning something else destroyed the village, not Pain. Who wins?

Also, if it seems too one-sided, I might change a few things.

[Prince Sasuke]

Pain would be dealing with two of the Greatest shinobi in 'Naruto'. I believe Itachi and Jiraiya could buy themselfs enough time to figure out Pain's seceret,and could win. It wouldn't be easy, but they can do it. Pain only has one great Body and thats God Realm, the others are pretty weak especially when there jutsu is revealed.

[niblack89]

They wont need to figure out any thing the two of them together are shinobi god. Pain wont stand a chance Jiraiya himself took out 3 pain bodies. I'm sure they will figure something out quickly and finish him off

[Musashi_Keiji]

IIRC Pain himself said that if Jiraya were to have known his secret from the beginning he/they would not have won. Even without that knowledge Jiraya managed to kill 3 pain's first.

Itachi is just pwnage as well. The 2 of them teamed up vs Pain is over kill for pain.

[dflynchimp]

IIRC Pain himself said that if Jiraya were to have known his secret from the beginning he/they would not have won. Even without that knowledge Jiraya managed to kill 3 pain's first.

Itachi is just pwnage as well. The 2 of them teamed up vs Pain is over kill for pain.

Ding Ding Ding!!! And we have a winner! This is Pain's own admission of Jiraiya's power.

Versus Itachi I don't see any one of Pain's bodies (other than god and possibly hunger) withstanding amaterasu. Same goes for all the summons.

Would also be interesting to see if Tsukuyomi can take out the majority if not all of the Pains, or render them helpless while Jiraiya picks them off.

[SuperSaiyaMan]

Tsukuyomi won't do didly squat to any of the Pain bodies. Most of their combined techniques can be overwhelmed and absorb by Hungry Ghost.

And God Pain, Demon Pain, and Hell Pain are the deciding factor. Is Itachi durable enough to take a Shirna Tensei that can break the bones of a 100 meter toad after sending it flying to the next zip code?

[dflynchimp]

Tsukuyomi won't do didly squat to any of the Pain bodies. Most of their combined techniques can be overwhelmed and absorb by Hungry Ghost.

And God Pain, Demon Pain, and Hell Pain are the deciding factor. Is Itachi durable enough to take a Shirna Tensei that can break the bones of a 100 meter toad after sending it flying to the next zip code?

Why wouldn't Tsukuyomi work? Jiraiya's battle with Pain showed that genjutsu clearly works on the bodies, and Tsukuyomi is more of an instant effect type than the frog song.

Also, did we miss the part where Hungry Pain got curbstomped by Naruto with Sage Tech taijutsu? Both Itachi and Jiraiya are formidable taijutsu artists and if they chose to double team either Hell path or Hungry path first it should be bo trouble for them.

If you must ask, I think Itachi's M. Sharingan techs are just as hax as Pain's jutsus, and even without Jiraiya I'd bet on the two fighting to a stand still, assuming Itachi's disease wasn't a factor. Susanoo is a defense just as ethereal/unearthly as Shinra Tensei is on offense, so at best the two cancels each other out.

In any case, the proof is all there. Pain is susceptible to genjutsu, and Itachi is all time badass in that department. A point of his finger and he wouldn't even have to use Tsukuyomi.

[insid3rkill3r]

itachi and Jiraiya would w/o a doubt win,,, its true that Jiraiya had the frogs with him when he fought Nagato but he now has Itachi,, probably the strongest ninja to have appeared in generations,,, if jiraiya was able to figure out Pain's secret,,, then im sure Itachi would help to make it even faster,,, we know how smart he is,,, besides,,,, Tsukuyomi could be a fatal jutsu for Pain,,,, Pain was shown to not have anything special against Genjutsu,,, and Tsukuyomi is quite unique,,,, it takes effect with sight,,,, not only the bodies in front or near by like the frog song,,, which means Tsukuyomi could affect Nagato himself since its his eyesight that is shared between the bodies,,,, which would mean all the bodies would be out of control for the time being,,,,, and he has Amaterasu and Susano still,,,, Amaterasu would have no effect against the fatty but im sure a genius like Itachi and Jiraiya would soon find a strat after knowing what kind of power the body has,,,, and having Susano as a ultimate protection,,,,

We aint talking about normal shinobis,,, we talking about a man who is among the most talented in the shinobi world and 1 who is praised a genius like no other who is most-likely the strongest with the exception of maybe Pain and Madara,,,

[SuperSaiyaMan]

Why wouldn't Tsukuyomi work? Jiraiya's battle with Pain showed that genjutsu clearly works on the bodies, and Tsukuyomi is more of an instant effect type than the frog song.

The simple matter is that the Frog Song is a auditory genjutsu, thus it could affect the Realms. Any other type of genjutsu would have been completely ineffective against them.

Also, did we miss the part where Hungry Pain got curbstomped by Naruto with Sage Tech taijutsu? Both Itachi and Jiraiya are formidable taijutsu artists and if they chose to double team either Hell path or Hungry path first it should be bo trouble for them.

Since if the Pains are working together, Hungry Ghost won't be in danger. Jiraiya and Itachi will have to deal with dozens of boss sized summons, missiles and laser blasts shot by demon realm, and the Shinra Tensei and Bansho Ten'nin. Not only that, we have Human Realm able to yank the souls out of people's bodies and has shown monstrous taijutsu abilities.

If you must ask, I think Itachi's M. Sharingan techs are just as hax as Pain's jutsus, and even without Jiraiya I'd bet on the two fighting to a stand still, assuming Itachi's disease wasn't a factor. Susanoo is a defense just as ethereal/unearthly as Shinra Tensei is on offense, so at best the two cancels each other out.

Susano'o is a double edged sword. It drains life faster than anything and takes a while to set up. All God Realm has to do is use a Bansho Ten'nin to throw Itachi into Hungry Ghost's grasp and drain him.

In any case, the proof is all there. Pain is susceptible to genjutsu, and Itachi is all time badass in that department. A point of his finger and he wouldn't even have to use Tsukuyomi.

Again. Only auditory (you know, HEARING) genjutsu affects Pains since it'd be transferred back to Nagato. Uepherall and Tsukuyomi aren't going to do anything against the Pains.

[thornofcarrion]

Itachi and Jiraya will win. They both have too much to offer, some real powerful jutsus in Narutoverse. If we list down what they have to offer, Ama, Sasuno, Sage techniques, Summoning etc. then even someone like Pain will not be able to win. Itachi and Jiraya have defense as well offense. Moreover, they have quite sufficient tools to counter Pain's attacks, e.g., Pain's summoning can be matched with Jiraya's summoning. Even, ST can be blocked with Sasuno and so on.

[KnuckleheadedNinja]

Jiraiya and Itachi will clearly win. I don't there is a ninja that can possibly defeat those two if they are partner.

The only one that can possibly defeat them is Rikudo Sennin. But he was no ninja, he was god.

[dflynchimp]

The simple matter is that the Frog Song is a auditory genjutsu, thus it could affect the Realms. Any other type of genjutsu would have been completely ineffective against them.

Since if the Pains are working together, Hungry Ghost won't be in danger. Jiraiya and Itachi will have to deal with dozens of boss sized summons, missiles and laser blasts shot by demon realm, and the Shinra Tensei and Bansho Ten'nin. Not only that, we have Human Realm able to yank the souls out of people's bodies and has shown monstrous taijutsu abilities.

Susano'o is a double edged sword. It drains life faster than anything and takes a while to set up. All God Realm has to do is use a Bansho Ten'nin to throw Itachi into Hungry Ghost's grasp and drain him.

Again. Only auditory (you know, HEARING) genjutsu affects Pains since it'd be transferred back to Nagato. Uepherall and Tsukuyomi aren't going to do anything against the Pains.

I hate to be arguing this, but your logic is based on several fallacies.

Where is there any shown evidence that only auditory genjutsu can effect pain? The rinnegan might grant access to all five elements plus massive chakras and unique jutsus, but so far the Sharingan has been identified as the eye to use when discussing potent genjutsu.

You assume the Rinnegan to be an absolute counter to genjutsu when none of its related jutsus has demonstrated this ability.

Teamwork. You are assuming that battle plays out completely in the favor for Pain who makes all the right tactical decisions, aka teaming up on Itachi and Jiraiya. This is like playing chess with yourself with the initial intent of having white win even if both sides were equally matched in game pieces or arsenal to begin with.

Maybe Pain can get his shit together and come up with a winning strategy, I'm certainly not ruling out that possibility, but it's just as likely, more so in my opinion, that Itachi and Jiraiya can identify Pain's individual abilities and formulate a perfect way to divide and conquer.

If you want Fat Pain to use his absorption ability you will have to put him up in battle, which inevitably would expose him to the combat. If you wished to protect him from close ranged combat you would have to have other pain's between him and the adversary, all of which are vulnerable to ninjutsu not to mention Amaterasu.

The Shinra Tensei > Amaterasu/Susano is a moot point argument since the possibility of them having a matchup within the manga is no longer valid. I admit that I shouldn't assume that Susanoo or Amaterasu can beat ST, but it is equally unreliable for you to count on a vise versa situation, so neither of us should rely on arguing that point. The same would go for Fat Pain's ability to absorb Amaterasu or Susanoo, or Bansho Tenin's pulling Itachi out of Susanoo.

However, all of these arguments are assuming we are pitting jutsus against each other, head to head. As there are six pain bodies Hungry pain could not possible cover for all of them, which means Itachi can selectively hit an unprotected body with Amaterasu, and the more Hungry Pain tries to put himself in front of ninjutsu the more he will be setting himself in place for either Itachi or Jiraiya's taijutsu, which so far in the series have proven to be some of the best.

I also don't really see any of the Pain's possessing anything other than above average speed, while Itachi at the very least can claim mastery in that department. His first meeting with Kakashi showed how many jutsus he can put out at once.

Pain's one failsafe, the Shinra Tensei, can either be used repeatedly, or once for a nuke effect. If Naruto was able to get past the five second gap, you can bet Itachi and Jiraiya teaming up together can aswell. And if Pain decided to nuke the duo, then we're taking things back to the unwinnable argument of whether ST>Susanoo.

[ninjabot]

Where is there any shown evidence that only auditory genjutsu can effect pain? The rinnegan might grant access to all five elements plus massive chakras and unique jutsus, but so far the Sharingan has been identified as the eye to use when discussing potent genjutsu.

I can't begin to count the number of times this was claimed in several threads before this. And each time it was supported with zero evidence backing it. I'd say "Good Catch", but it's not like it was a hard fact to recognize, lol.

But I agree with your post for the most part. My one addition to it would be the inability for Pein to rely on AoE jutsu within close confines for fear of injuring his own bodies. I.E., having his enemies in the middle of his other bodies, and then firing Asura Realm's missiles at the both of them while they're so close.

[Lightsnake]

You realize that each of Pain's bodies minus 1 are rather, y'know, durable and all.

And he can always revive them later if there's a problem. Pain is criminally underrated on this forum.

[hakuthehedgehog]

You know guys, you are forgeting something: Even if Jiraya and Itachi pwned all pain's bodies, there's no guarantee that they whould be able to go to Nagato and kill, unless they knew his secret, which whould mean he could fight all out from the start and know all Jiraya's techniques.