Sasuke and power-ups....are they free gifts or not???

[kingplaya(minato)]

For some time now, people have been talking about sasuke getting free power-ups from kishi so i just thought it would be nice to start a thread about whether.... 1. It is truly free gifts? 2. Would it spread to other characters like naruto and his age mates? 3. If it is truly free gifts, then is it a good development or not? As 4 me, i think they are free power-ups and i want Kishi 2 get some 4 naruto(when he comes out from his slumber that is...) So now lets hear your views...

[Essence]

I really wouldn't call it a free gift, random yes but not a free powerup. we already knew sasuke how to summon plus he excell at what he knows so it kind of make since he can summon a hawk especially since its a symbol of his group. now i really do feel kishi should also give naruto a new technique because not giving him one also would be totally unfair, hopefully kishi gives naruto several.

[insid3rkill3r]

What power ups are we talking about? MS aka Amaterasu / Tsukuyomi and Susano right?


Ill just start by saying this,,,, in the history of the Uchiha clan,,,only a VERY few number of members were able to get the MS,,, it is it said that it requires specific circumstances,,,, but obviously,,as Itachi himself stated,,,, u need to have the potential to awake it,, which only ppl like Madara,,Itachi,Sasuke and Kakashi can,,,,, because they among the top league.

That said it might require a special even to activate it but that can actually only be to speed up the process,,,

Sasuke activated the Sharingan when he was younger when Itachi wiped out the clan,, which seemed to have triggered it,,, but the Sharingan can also awaken when u get older and get stronger with experience,, it doesnt only need to be triggered by some kind of distress which could mean that Sasuke would have awaken his MS with time,,, just like Kakashi did.

Itachi did not give Sasuke the abilitie to use MS,,,, but the revelation speeded up the process to awake Sasuke's MS,,, which he would have awaken sooner or later (I believe...).

So now,,, are Sasuke's techniques his or Itachi's ??? Translations says that Itachi transfered his Doujutsu while others say he simply transfered a protection (The Fail-Safe)... I dont think we can have a 100% accurate answer on that but from what we have seen in the manga.. in the latest chapters...

http://www.onemanga.com/Naruto/467/09/

Madara says that Sasuke awoke Susano,,,, and thus meaning that its indeed Sasuke's jutsu,,, not Itachi's..


In chapter 477

http://www.onemanga.com/Naruto/477/09/

Danzo comments on how Sasuke is indeed's Itachi's brother,, thus meaning that since they are brothers and pretty much a copy of each other,, this could explain ressemblance in their abilities,

An other thing,,, Susano doesnt seem to have the shield and the sword,, which could mean its not Itachi's but since he isnt fully formed yet we cant be sure of that,,,,,

So with all that Said,,, i wouldnt say free gifts since its because he is a genius that he was able to awake the MS,,,,and to awake Susano as well which Madara claims to be something really rare among ppl who can get the MS which is already something extremely rare.... its no random stuff of "gifts"

As for the Hawk summon,,, its a surprise yes, but if he has it,,, its because he trained and made it happen,, or whatever he did to achieve it,,, he had to do something,,, just like Naruto did with the frogs....

its a surprise but not a gift....


The only gift Sasuke was given was to be born among the Uchiha to have a Sharingan,,, but thats like saiyng Naruto was gifted with an insane amount of chakra,,, thats also saying Raikage receive a gift by having bikuu level chakra too,,,, every characters were given "gifts" to make their abilities unique.... otherwise every ninja would be doing the same jutsus,,,,,

Id say it like Sasuke has the potential to have MS,,, Itachi had the potential,, Minato had the potential to have his flash technique,,, Naruto had the potention to achieve sage mode and so on....

U get my point.

[kingplaya(minato)]

The gifts i'm talking about are his supernatural speed in using the MS techs, if itachi has had the MS for close to 10 years and couldn't manipulate amaterasu then why would sasuke who had just used it in 1 fight before then(against killerbee) be able to do it. And we all know itachi is more of a genius than sasuke(at age 13 he was head of an ANBU squad and sasuke was just chunnin level at that time) So kishi to me is just giving sasuke free power-ups....and like essence said naruto should better be given more power-ups...

[Prince Sasuke]

When it comes to the sharingan, Sasuke eys has been stated more then once to have more potential then Itachis'. It shouldn't be a surprise that Sasuke Sharingan will surpass Itachis' in every way.
Free gifts? I would say no. Just cause some abilites are learn off screen dosen't mean its free.

[juUnior]

I will just answer the question for the sake of it:

Are sasuke's power-ups free gifts or not?

From the end of fight with Itachi - yes. I also like the idea of calling them "random" rather than "free", hehe xd

I voted for "free gifts" - if it wasn't for Itachi, Sasuke wouldn't have MS, thus he would have only Sharingan. Someone can say that he's Uchiha so he has one; yes, that's true, but MS can only be activated in certain circumastances - if it wsn't for the "help" of Itachi, Sasuke wouldn't have MS. The rest is, like in the poll says second option: "They are perfectly normal" - after receiving free gift from Itachi it's only natural, that Sasuke can use MS techniques and such, so I find it normal. But the lastest chapter with that hawk thingy yet again burdened my point of view. I can't shake the feeling it was done so Sasuke would have the ability to fly as it was with CS2 "flying" wings ^^'

So in short: MS was a free gift from Itachi, no matter how I look at it. If it wasn't for Itachi, Sasuke wouldn't obtain MS, even if he would kill Naruto - therre are requirements which should be met and from what we saw, Sasuke knew almost nothing even thought he read some stuff.
After acquiring MS: doujutsu techniques are just a normal consequence of this.

btw. "Hebi" Sasuke, of course, is excluded from my rant - he learnt all the stuff he knows, starting with shunshin and ending with variations of Chidori.

[kisame123]

Sasuke is a jutsu specialist, according DB3, he has a 5 in ninjustu. He's trained under Orochimaru, so he knows a lot of jutsu and can create his own as well. He was creating his own jutsu before the series even began! He learned Katon Goukakyuu justu from his father when he was eight (only the handseals). However, he taught himself or created the Katon Housenka and Katon Ryuuka Jutsu's without any help.

Please read the following below, I've already posted this before and I'm going to post it again.

Just a heads up to those who aren't expecting another jutsu from Sasuke. He's trained under Orochimaru's tutelage, the renowned justu specialist and can create jutsu of his own if needed.

Please read this Sai-Sasuke encounter:
http://www.onemanga.com/Naruto/300/15/
"Orochimaru... did you forget about how you said you were going to teach me a new jutsu this afternoon...?" - Sasuke

-so far we've only seen Sasuke use Chidori variants which not even Orochimaru knew he had:
http://www.onemanga.com/Naruto/343/15/
"This chakra composition is... But I've never seen this kind of shape manipulation before." - Orochimaru

• That implies that he's made jutsu's on his own,
• and learned jutsu from Orochimaru separately (probably non-elemental)

don't be surprised if he shows us new jutsu's later on. Orochimaru taught him jutsu's which were most likely non-elemental. The elemental chidori jutsu's he has, for example, the Chidori sword or senbon are jutsu he's developed himself since Orochimaru did not even know about them and was surprised. Sasuke could theoretically have even learned hundreds of jutsu's from Orochimaru. I've already given the example above of him asking Orochimaru to teach him a new jutsu on that specific day, implying he could have possibly been taught jutsu's every week or even everyday. I wouldn't even be surprised if he has learned Edo Tensei from Orochimaru, since he talks about reviving his clan a lot.

I'm actually eager to see his fights and jutsu's. I'm hoping he's made his own version of Raiton armor, he wouldn't even need the sharingan to copy the Raikage's move since he is an excellent Raiton user. He's already shown that he can use Raiton throughout his body to soften the impact of blows prevent fatal wounds, during the fight against Killerbee (Kirabi). Not to mention that he can channel the Chidor Nagashi throughout his body as a defensive move. Furthermore, I wonder if he can summon the Triple Rashomon Demon Gates Orochimaru used to shield himself against four-tailed Naruto?

Nonetheless, time and time again, the manga has questioned Sasuke's abilities and whether they are because of his bloodline. However, Sasuke immediately proves that he's skilled. For example, Deidara ridicules him, stating that he was only able to kill Orochimaru because he's an Uchiha.
http://www.onemanga.com/Naruto/357/07/
take a look at what happened after that:
http://www.onemanga.com/Naruto/357/08/

Let's not forget Zetsu's famous quote, "an expert with a pebble can still beat a novice with a shuriken." This was after Sasuke broke out of Itachi's Tsukiyomi, it was impressive. Now if you want to talk about ridiculous power-ups (some I consider to be forced from the author, in other words "free), I suggest you take a look at Sage Mode Naruto! Unlike the Mangekyou, which like anyother good power-up, debilitates the user (eats away at chakra and eyesight), Sage Mode takes external and renewable natural energy and enhances nearly all of Naruto's stats! He has super strength enough to toss a Rhino summon, speed enhancement, hax punches with extended range meaning you don't even have to connect with the target, enhanced genjutsu, enhanced ninjutsu, can throw Rasengans and expand them before impact, and has now even become a powerful sensor type! That's just ridiculous and let's not forget that he's mastered it in a week or less, something his master couldn't even do in fifty years! Let's also take time to remember the Kyuubi which gives him near-limitless chakra and he can even add some of that chakra to his Sage Mode!

[MegaX]

As to why Naruto isn't getting them, I think it's because it sets up this contrast. Naruto has to work to gain his power but Sasuke easily attains all of his. It'll all pay off when Naruto defeats him.

[kisame123]

As to why Naruto isn't getting them, I think it's because it sets up this contrast. Naruto has to work to gain his power but Sasuke easily attains all of his. It'll all pay off when Naruto defeats him.

Not really, Naruto never paid attention during school and opted to skip his classes.
Take a look at him dipping class here:
http://www.onemanga.com/Naruto/154/07/
Here he is being scolded for that:
http://www.onemanga.com/Naruto/154/08/

He had trouble "concentrating", which explains why he has such a hard time learning things. Whereas Sasuke actually stayed in school, did his homework, and had good grades, which means he learned the material! Take a look here if you don't believe me:
http://www.onemanga.com/Naruto/223/05/

Even after being taught a jutsu by his father, he ended up disappointing him by failing to produce an adaquete Katon Goukakyuu Jutsu. His father even remarked that he wasn't like Itachi. Sasuke then trains night and day for a week to master the technique, you can see for yourself here:
http://www.onemanga.com/Naruto/223/09/

He's also done the same thing with kunai practice. Sasuke wasn't a true genius like Itachi or Kakashi who both graduated from the academy early. He graduated at the same time as Naruto and the Konoha 12. People like to call him a "genius", I just think he's a very hard-working person who has a clear goal. When it comes to ninjutsu, he's incredibly creative. He actually thought of the idea of manipulating Amaterasu into different shapes and forms.

Naruto and other "hard-working" people like Rock Lee may cry because things are difficult for them. Yet, it doesn't change the fact that people like Sasuke and Neji work very hard and train for their powers. Things were just easier for Sasuke because he worked hard consistently whereas Naruto lagged behind all these years and he's feeling the consequences for that now.

[kingplaya(minato)]

I think most of u are not getting my point, i'm very aware of the fact that sasuke can learn justus very quickly but ever since the itachi fight i'm not sure he has had the time to train so my problem is that during each fight he does something that would normally require atleast a week's training in one second!....if he trains there would be no doubt in my mind that he is capable of achieving these feats and more but he just hasn't done that.....as 4 naruto's learning of sage mode, he actually TRAINED(thats the key word) 4 it and don't 4get that he used his clones to speed up the process...

[kkck]

Sasuke has had 3 powerups so far:

CS

Oro's jutsu

MS

He already lost oro and CS and MS wasn't a surprise at all, we all knew he was going to get it the moment it was introduced. I doubt anyone was actually naive enough to even consider the possibility of sasuke not getting it. CS was meant to keep sasuke in check and bring him to orochimaru and oro seemed mostly accidental lol. MS wasn't free since sasuke was basically born with it, it is his right to have it; it isn't something which can be compared to steroids. CS was forced on him and it was a miracle he survived the whole thing. I don't find sasuke's powerups so bad as people make them out to be, there are plenty other things which I dislike more lol.

[kisame123]

I think most of u are not getting my point, i'm very aware of the fact that sasuke can learn justus very quickly but ever since the itachi fight i'm not sure he has had the time to train so my problem is that during each fight he does something that would normally require atleast a week's training in one second!....if he trains there would be no doubt in my mind that he is capable of achieving these feats and more but he just hasn't done that.....as 4 naruto's learning of sage mode, he actually TRAINED(thats the key word) 4 it and don't 4get that he used his clones to speed up the process...

It's not that simple for an Uchiha, let alone an Uchiha who has awakened the Mangekyou. The Sharingan has always been something that you awaken under heightened emotional or stressful conditions. In other words, the Sharingan is only something you can awaken in battle. This is why the Uchiha are a powerful and awesome clan, they can only attain greater heights by risking their lives, throwing themselves into battle.

As for the Mangekyou, you cannot set aside time to train for the Mangekyou Sharingan. As I have said, like anyother good and realistic power-up, it debilitates the user:

• It drains too much chakra (which again is perfectly normal for powerful attacks)
• The more you use it, the more your eyesight weakens and deteriorates until you finally become blind

You cannot and definitely should NOT use the Mangekyou for training purposes. You can only use it in combat under extreme circumstances and so far, Sasuke has battled a Bijuu and the five greatest shinobi in the five great nations, the Kages. Besides, Madara is forcing him to do these things because he considers this to simply be a training exercise. The Yondaime Mizukage, under the influence of Madara, created the ninja academy program in which Genin were supposed to slaughter each other to pass.

You can understand why Madara puts Sasuke under life-threatening training exercises, it's probably the best method to awaken his powers. Madara isn't the only one, Danzou has trained "Root" using the same method of playing off ninja's against each other. Furthermore, even Jiraiya forced Naruto to draw out the power of the Kyuubi to summon Gamabunta by pushing him off a cliff!

[M3J]

I say they are perfectly normal. Had it been Itachi's gifts to Sasuke, I think Itachi's Mangekyou Sharingan would show, not Sasuke's, every time Sasuke used any of the techniques. I think he just made it so Amaterasu is used on Madara if a Sharingan is seen. I assume you're thinking about Mangekyou Sharingan though.

[kingplaya(minato)]

Come on!...i'm i the only 1 who voted free gifts here, where the hell are the others!<joke>.....i'm fine with him having the MS but the speed at which he's learning things is not normal EVEN 4 sasuke, the putting of amaterasu around susano was overkill cuz he had just found out he had/awokened susano then how the hell could he put amaterasu around it the next second?...if u say he awakens things in battle then getting susano is fine with me but the things he's doing with it are free 'gifts'(just like sasuke just getting the sharingan and the next second he can do genjustu with it and the next day he gets the 3 pointed sharingan, it just doesn't make sense!) i havn't even spoken about the hawk summon yet but we'll come to that P.S. Kakashi trains his mangekyo sharingan to be better so why can't sasuke???...

[kkck]

Come on!...i'm i the only 1 who voted free gifts here, where the hell are the others!<joke>.....i'm fine with him having the MS but the speed at which he's learning things is not normal EVEN 4 sasuke, the putting of amaterasu around susano was overkill cuz he had just found out he had/awokened susano then how the hell could he put amaterasu around it the next second?...if u say he awakens things in battle then getting susano is fine with me but the things he's doing with it are free 'gifts'(just like sasuke just getting the sharingan and the next second he can do genjustu with it and the next day he gets the 3 pointed sharingan, it just doesn't make sense!) i havn't even spoken about the hawk summon yet but we'll come to that P.S. Kakashi trains his mangekyo sharingan to be better so why can't sasuke???...

Sasuke was not capable of using sharingan genjutsu outright, he only did that after the timeskip which took place 3 years after sasuke first got the sharingan(about a decade if you consider the memories he suppressed). It was also implied between sasuke getting the sharingan when he fought haku and VOTE there was a spam of around 0.5-1 year. You could say he developed it very fast but that is only because he has his own innate talent. I guess sasuke could be comparable to those real life weirdos who get PHDs by the time they are 17(he is 16 and he is above even elite jonnin).