Part I vs Part II

[jimm120]

The only thing I haven't liked about Part II were:

1 - Naruto/Sakura being so ehh with the whole Sasuke situation. the guy flat out shows you how he isn't what he was and yet there is still this whole one sided view about Sasuke.

2 - Too much Sasuke. I was alright with it when he was fighting Itachi and Madara had him in that cave (after the fight), but after that, its just felt like a spam-r-us on Sasuke and his super add-ons.

3 - No Naruto development during the timeskip. Really, it sucked. Sasuke becomes near godlike during the timeskip yet Naruto only becomes a little better. Which goes back to point #2, in which no only was there this huge difference in timeskip power up, but then it goes on to show Sasuke master things in seconds.

4 - Naruto learning things too quickly. Sorry, its like it was decided that Naruto needed something and they gave some 10 chapters inbetween for him to master soem uber attack, which for Sasuke, it was tons of fights and what-not.


Still like the story but Part 1 owned. It had such great character development. From beginning to end.

Part 2's story development has been a drag. No development during the 2 1/2 years. Naruto/Sakura whiny. Naruto into a love-fest. Sasuke just hate and not listen to reason, which was shown to be his strength in part 1.


Just two things...but it turns out to be pretty big



_____________________________________________

Ok, just read the whole thread.

Ok, it seems a lot of people also mentioned some of the things I said.

Just the whole "chase after Sasuke" plot really sucked, especially when Sasuke kept doing things which weren't the smartest decision. So, dumb decisions and Naruto/Sakura sitll after his arse just doesn't feel right...and all this since the beginning of part 2.

And to add insult to injury, then they made Naruto a full blown wuss. Its about love. That is all he said. No realistic answers. I know Kishi was building up the answer to this last Sasuke encounter/the final sasuke encounter, but man, that is the whole of Part 2.

That is what I didn't like of Part 2.

And I don't feel it is "darker". I wish it was darker. This whole danzo situation could have made the manga much darker, but look what happened in less than 1 arc. This isn't darker, this is more of a less comical, more spamming of attacks, and less character progression. that doesn't mean darker.

[soulbane_zp]

I started with part II, than after the rescue Gaara arc, I read part I before continuing.

I must say I like part I better. Part II isn't that bad, but Naruto is way too much obsessed with Sasuke, it kills the story a bit for me. Than Kishi went into the whole Uchiha this Uchiha that, and copy-paste the night of the massacre over and over again. That only made part II even worse. But now, when Naruto is back to his old self (more or less), I'm starting to enjoy this manga again.

I guess when we see the parts as a whole, when part II is wrapped up and finished, both parts will be on the same scale of quality.

[kisame123]

I started with part II, than after the rescue Gaara arc, I read part I before continuing.
I must say I like part I better. Part II isn't that bad, but Naruto is way too much obsessed with Sasuke, it kills the story a bit for me. Than Kishi went into the whole Uchiha this Uchiha that, and copy-paste the night of the massacre over and over again. That only made part II even worse. But now, when Naruto is back to his old self (more or less), I'm starting to enjoy this manga again.

the irony is that even with Naruto back in focus, the story is failing to generate interest. the chapters of late have been pretty boring, discussion threads barely generate forty pages, with this week's spoiler discussion not even hitting twenty. the Sasuke-bashing in the Sasuke-driven chapters generated three times that amount. again, the irony in this is that all the members that constantly trolled the thread bashing Sasuke, who kept on begging for Naruto's appearance have all but disappeared and are nowhere to be seen. all is not lost, I thought the most recent chapter with Yami Naruto and Killerbee was pretty good. it could have been better, but I'm pleased. I also think that Naruto will catch a lot more interest again as the war starts and will probably outsell the other manga.

however, I found it interesting to see people have orgasms over Bee training Naruto. although I specifically stated that it is just an excuse to take Naruto out of the war and focus, people couldn't stop dreaming about this. nonetheless, I'm going to laugh so hard the day when Sasuke enters the war and demonstrates his power, fights the Edo Tensei Akatsuki members and reaps their souls out, and kills Kabuto. I'm going to laugh after seeing everyone die from shock at pure action Sasuke displays, while Naruto trains with Killerbee and writes a few rap songs.

[soulbane_zp]

however, I found it interesting to see people have orgasms over Bee training Naruto. although I specifically stated that it is just an excuse to take Naruto out of the war and focus, people couldn't stop dreaming about this. nonetheless, I'm going to laugh so hard the day when Sasuke enters the war and demonstrates his power, fights the Edo Tensei Akatsuki members and reaps their souls out, and kills Kabuto. I'm going to laugh after seeing everyone die from shock at pure action Sasuke displays, while Naruto trains with Killerbee and writes a few rap songs.

I really hope that doesn't happen and I doubt it will. Sasuke got a lot of focus because it was necessary. Kishi needed to develop his MS abilities and the only way to do that was via fights. It's only logical, since MS damages your eyes and shortens your lifespan (Susano'o), so one can't train for those techniques, they unlock in combat during high emotional states. That's why Sasuke got those fights, and it lasted only one arc, it wasn't that bad. But Kishi went overboard with the whole Uchiha thing (Itachi and Sasuke issue), that was when I started to loose interest, he stretched it a lot. I mean besides Kishi giving Naruto this unhealthy obsession over Sasuke, which seems Kishi dropped it in these last chapters (with Naruto having a burden taken off his shoulders, yadda yadda yadda... so long as Naruto doesn't think about Sasuke all the time and has reached a decision of how to deal with him I'm fine with it).

Kishi might show us one more fight that will involve Sasuke, just to show what EMS can do, before his showdown with Naruto. There isn't any other reason than that for Sasuke to fight. Sasuke's story was told (very detailed too), I think Kishi is done with him. I really do hope so at least, otherwise I will really start doubting about who Kishi sees as the main character of this manga. So far Kishi is delivering, I hope he continues with that.

[kisame123]

I really hope that doesn't happen and I doubt it will. Sasuke got a lot of focus because it was necessary. Kishi needed to develop his MS abilities and the only way to do that was via fights. It's only logical, since MS damages your eyes and shortens your lifespan (Susano'o), so one can't train for those techniques, they unlock in combat during high emotional states. That's why Sasuke got those fights, and it lasted only one arc, it wasn't that bad. But Kishi went overboard with the whole Uchiha thing (Itachi and Sasuke issue), that was when I started to loose interest, he stretched it a lot. I mean besides Kishi giving Naruto this unhealthy obsession over Sasuke, which seems Kishi dropped it in these last chapters (with Naruto having a burden taken off his shoulders, yadda yadda yadda... so long as Naruto doesn't think about Sasuke all the time and has reached a decision of how to deal with him I'm fine with it).

Kishi might show us one more fight that will involve Sasuke, just to show what EMS can do, before his showdown with Naruto. There isn't any other reason than that for Sasuke to fight. Sasuke's story was told (very detailed too), I think Kishi is done with him. I really do hope so at least, otherwise I will really start doubting about who Kishi sees as the main character of this manga. So far Kishi is delivering, I hope he continues with that.

I'm not sure that this will be the right place to talk about this issue, but since there doesn't seem to be any trouble, I guess it's fine. anyways, the Uchiha issue was absolutely necessary, while the fight with Killerbee was not. the Uchiha issue has been there since day one, it isn't something new. Sasuke clearly let everyone know that he wanted to kill "a certain man", I don't think anyone believes that Sasuke would never fight Itachi. second, Itachi had already told Sasuke that there is a third person with the Mangekyou and this isn't something that was ignored by the readers. we even suspected Kakashi being that third person, but it was confirmed to be Madara who coincidently was one of the statues at the Valley of the End. Sasuke and Kakashi even hinted that the Valley of the End has some special meaning. finally, since day one, we knew that Sasuke wanted revenge and his ideology was one that encourage hatred. this directly conflicted with the "will of fire" we had gotten so used to in Part I. Naruto would become stronger protecting those he loved, while on the other hand, Sasuke's strength was driven by hatred. clearly these two conflicting ideologies were going to crash into each other. to make that a reality by "crashing" Sasuke into Naruto, Kishimoto revealed the truth behind the massacre as a catalyst and basically an anti-epiphany for Sasuke. Sasuke, since the beginning, has been raised to become Naruto's archnemesis. it's a twist of fate, the worst irony that Naruto's best friend, the one who ironically inspired Naruto to protect his loved ones, would become his worst enemy. do you see how I was able to tie all of these things together?

nonetheless, the Uchiha thing isn't new, it's always been there. even in the revered Zabuza arc which everybody seems to like, the main fight between Kakashi and Zabuza involved the Sharingan and with each new fight, more abilities were introduced. Sasuke awoke his Sharingan at that time against Haku. interestingly enough, Sasuke was the reason why Naruto snapped, introducing the Kyuubi. there are two major powers in the story, the only things that matter, Kyuubi and Sharingan and it's been like this since Part I. the only problem is that now Kishimoto has been writing sloppy, doing things without purpose. what was the point of Sasuke vs. Killerbee? couldn't Sasuke have done all the power awakenings with his fight against the Kages? was the fight simply to introduce a "perfect jinchuuriki" and couldn't Kishimoto have done that against Kisame (before the clone switch)? there are a ton of other problems, some going way back to the beginning. the Sand arc was pointless when you look at it from the perspective of Naruto, what did he accomplish, what new power did he demonstrate? he didn't even fight the main bad guy (Sasori) and waisted time in a pointless chase with Deidara. not to mention that the arc was so damn boring and then comes the Retrieve Sasuke arc. exactly what was the purpose of that arc? Kishimoto made a lousy effort to introduce emotion into Sai, which Sasuke was successfully able to do in a second through the Sharingan, lol. what has changed about Sai, he could feel emotion? what is his purpose, other than being a boring zombie in Team 7? the problem isn't the Uchiha, ironically that is the life support of the manga, the only thing that it is generating interest, suspense, and is driving the plot. nonetheless, I find the recent chapter an improvement and I am even willing to wait ten chapters for Naruto to defeat Yami Naruto (who kind of sucks).

anyways, now that Naruto is conveniently out of the picture, Sasuke will come in. Kishimoto has etched in stone now that Kabuto will be annihilated by Sasuke, by bringing back Itachi through Edo Tensei. Kabuto will obviously use Itachi against Sasuke, which would also ensure that the other revived members will fight Sasuke. what happens next if Sasuke has to win? obviously Sasuke will defeat everybody there and kill Kabuto and he is probably the only person suited for this job since he will have "reaping" abilities to nullify Edo Tensei and kill Kabuto who can regenerate.

[MegaX]

Actually, Madara has said that Sasuke needs to recover from whatever the process of attaining EMS entails. So he's out of the war for the immediate future also.

I bet he and Naruto will join the fighting at roughly the same time. Maybe Sasuke a little earlier, so that Naruto can have a Big Damn Heroes moment.

[ashher]

the recent chaps should only be boring if one is interested in nothing but fights.....naruto chaps recently has been awesome when it comes to character development. B's development as well as kabuto,kisame and madara are all being very interesting in recent times aside from naruto's development.

[soulbane_zp]

I'm not sure that this will be the right place to talk about this issue, but since there doesn't seem to be any trouble, I guess it's fine. anyways, the Uchiha issue was absolutely necessary, while the fight with Killerbee was not. the Uchiha issue has been there since day one, it isn't something new. Sasuke clearly let everyone know that he wanted to kill "a certain man", I don't think anyone believes that Sasuke would never fight Itachi. second, Itachi had already told Sasuke that there is a third person with the Mangekyou and this isn't something that was ignored by the readers. we even suspected Kakashi being that third person, but it was confirmed to be Madara who coincidently was one of the statues at the Valley of the End. Sasuke and Kakashi even hinted that the Valley of the End has some special meaning. finally, since day one, we knew that Sasuke wanted revenge and his ideology was one that encourage hatred. this directly conflicted with the "will of fire" we had gotten so used to in Part I. Naruto would become stronger protecting those he loved, while on the other hand, Sasuke's strength was driven by hatred. clearly these two conflicting ideologies were going to crash into each other. to make that a reality by "crashing" Sasuke into Naruto, Kishimoto revealed the truth behind the massacre as a catalyst and basically an anti-epiphany for Sasuke. Sasuke, since the beginning, has been raised to become Naruto's archnemesis. it's a twist of fate, the worst irony that Naruto's best friend, the one who ironically inspired Naruto to protect his loved ones, would become his worst enemy. do you see how I was able to tie all of these things together?

nonetheless, the Uchiha thing isn't new, it's always been there. even in the revered Zabuza arc which everybody seems to like, the main fight between Kakashi and Zabuza involved the Sharingan and with each new fight, more abilities were introduced. Sasuke awoke his Sharingan at that time against Haku. interestingly enough, Sasuke was the reason why Naruto snapped, introducing the Kyuubi. there are two major powers in the story, the only things that matter, Kyuubi and Sharingan and it's been like this since Part I. the only problem is that now Kishimoto has been writing sloppy, doing things without purpose. what was the point of Sasuke vs. Killerbee? couldn't Sasuke have done all the power awakenings with his fight against the Kages? was the fight simply to introduce a "perfect jinchuuriki" and couldn't Kishimoto have done that against Kisame (before the clone switch)? there are a ton of other problems, some going way back to the beginning. the Sand arc was pointless when you look at it from the perspective of Naruto, what did he accomplish, what new power did he demonstrate? he didn't even fight the main bad guy (Sasori) and waisted time in a pointless chase with Deidara. not to mention that the arc was so damn boring and then comes the Retrieve Sasuke arc. exactly what was the purpose of that arc? Kishimoto made a lousy effort to introduce emotion into Sai, which Sasuke was successfully able to do in a second through the Sharingan, lol. what has changed about Sai, he could feel emotion? what is his purpose, other than being a boring zombie in Team 7? the problem isn't the Uchiha, ironically that is the life support of the manga, the only thing that it is generating interest, suspense, and is driving the plot. nonetheless, I find the recent chapter an improvement and I am even willing to wait ten chapters for Naruto to defeat Yami Naruto (who kind of sucks).

anyways, now that Naruto is conveniently out of the picture, Sasuke will come in. Kishimoto has etched in stone now that Kabuto will be annihilated by Sasuke, by bringing back Itachi through Edo Tensei. Kabuto will obviously use Itachi against Sasuke, which would also ensure that the other revived members will fight Sasuke. what happens next if Sasuke has to win? obviously Sasuke will defeat everybody there and kill Kabuto and he is probably the only person suited for this job since he will have "reaping" abilities to nullify Edo Tensei and kill Kabuto who can regenerate.

I never said that the Uchiha story wasn't important, only that Kishi went overboard with it. He shoved Uchiha down our throats whenever he could. There are 2 conflicting sides, Uchihas and Senjus. Uchiha's isn't the only clan in that conflict, but Kishi told the story from their point of view only, which leaves me unsatisfied and annoyed a bit. We know everything there is to know about them, but we have no idea of what happened with Naruto's mother, for example. We waited I don't know how much chapters, only to get 1 chapter about Naruto's father. That's ridiculous, considering how much Kishi spammed about the Uchiha's and that massacre scene. Kishi only recently started to bother to show some depth to the character of Naruto, which sparked my interest again. Part I was about Naruto mostly, his growth and struggles, that's why I enjoyed it a lot more than part II where we have a history of one clan repeated all over and over again, while having "revenge" starting to take over the plot. Someones revenge doesn't sound too much interesting to me as someones struggle to go from nothing to Hokage. And whenever Naruto is in the focus, there is light comedy in the manga, which I also prefer more than the angst Sasuke brings. I never gave a rats a** about Sasuke and his revenge and him getting it.

And I wouldn't be so sure about Kabuto and Sasuke either. Kabuto has a long history with Naruto, and I wouldn't be surprised if Kishi made Kabuto vs Naruto the last battle in this manga.

[soulbane_zp]

this isn't a conflict between two clans, it's a conflict between what was a clan and the entire village. the Senju clan was probably just added in to draw more parallels between Naruto and Sasuke, yet Naruto probably isn't a Senju due to the lack of references. the conflict of this story is between the Kyuubi and the Uchiha. as you can see here, Naruto mentions the two opposing forces, "we won't be Uchiha, jinchuurikis, or anything." it has been this way since Valley of the End and will continue to be the main driving force of the story. the history of the Uchiha clan has been reverberated since the earliest chapters in Part I, along with Sasuke's revenge. his revenge was mentioned within the same breath as Naruto's dream of becoming Hokage. where were you in Part I, where were the complaints about the Uchiha clan, "too much" Sharingan, I hate Sasuke, when did you complain about this in Part I? it doesn't matter if you do not give a damn about a certain character, whether you like it or not, that character has been there since the beginning, along with his stated goals. in fact, if I were Kishimoto, I wouldn't have given this manga the title "Naruto" since there seems to be another main character that is essential to the story. as for Naruto's familial ties and history, what is there to talk about? he is the son of Yondaime, who although isn't being mentioned much right now, had plenty of show time in Kakashi Gaiden and had a lot of speculation and hype in Konoha. Part I, at most, spent a lot of time drawing parallels between Naruto and Yondaime and now the same thing is being done in Part II, but to a greater degree to show Naruto's strength. there is essentially no difference between Part I and Part II, except that it is now confirmed that Yondaime is his father and is even used as a meter stick for Naruto's growth, both of which were not in Part I. as for Kushina, why are you questioning her relevance? Kishimoto already stated in an interview that he will reveal a bit more on her. just wait a bit, give it some time, Kushina will be revealed soon enough. the fact that she is being revealed so late in the story probably hints towards her having a very important role.

to be honest, I think this thread is a place where a bunch of members just take out their frustration over their tardism and how their favorite character is lacking according to their own standards. it is just a place to blame everything on Sasuke. people can say a lot of crap and garbage about Sasuke ruining the story or that the story is going downhill (which it is NOT), yet these recent chapters prove that Sasuke makes the story interesting. where are all the trolls, the character bashing, what happened, did they all disappear? even I find the recent chapter to be interesting and yet, none of those members who had nothing better to do in their spare time except bash characters are MIA (Missing in Action). it is simply because this manga generates a lot of tardism, obsession over characters and when something doesn't go their way or a character doesn't kneel and bow down to their favorite character (Naruto), the story is going "downhill". the story hasn't gone "down hill", as a matter of fact, it's gotten a hell of a lot more interesting than it has ever been before. the best indicator of how a manga is doing, is the amount of volumes it sells, not your opinions. the manga sales greatly increased Sasuke vs. Itachi arc. no one cares about Sai, Rookie 11, bonds, and the pathetic village known as Konoha. instead people are more interested in the Kyuubi, war, alliance, Kumogakure, the Uchiha clan, Kabuto, Edo Tensei, Akatsuki, Itachi, Madara, and what Sasuke's new doujutsu will look like! just wait a bit more until the war starts, volume sales will skyrocket close to One Piece levels, maybe even more since One Piece has basically settled down. I say this since everyone seems to rate this manga based on OP, although I do that too sometimes. this manga has a lot more potential, but it can only harness that potential by using the same points of interest I mentioned above, not boring one dimensional characters such as Sai or Rookie 11.

as for Naruto fighting Kabuto, I think that's a really bad joke. what is Naruto going to do, preach? is he going to smash a Genkidama Rasengan on Kabuto? Kabuto is going to have more regenerative capabilities that Orochimaru, he is going to keep on coming back and Naruto will not be able to kill him even if he tried. what is Naruto going to do against Edo Tensei? develop Shiki Fuujin so that it doesn't kill you, what? Kabuto already revealed his goal is Sasuke and we can tell judging by the horny look on his eye, he is serious. likewise, Kabuto revived Itachi and Nagato, both who have no relevance to Naruto. Naruto has already fought Nagato, he has already spent up his development time with him, Nagato here is simply a killing machine that will be put to sleep. Kishimoto basically made Kabuto a test subject for Sasuke's new power the moment he revived Itachi. what better way to demonstrate his power than to have him fight all five Akatsuki zombies? right now the zombies will cause mayhem for the alliance and will probably stay clear of Sasuke since Madara instructed Kabuto to do so. when the alliance attacks the hideout causing chaos, Kabuto will take his shot on Sasuke, who by then will annihilate him and his zombie army. this will be done to give Sasuke his final goal, Kabuto's jutsu, a purpose that involves capturing Naruto alive and reviving the Juubi. this will probably happen while Naruto is sitting comfortably, chilling with Killerbee!

But it is a conflict between those two. That's how Kishimoto portrayed it. Naruto doesn't have to be blood related to the Senjus for that. Naruto represents what the Senju stood for, Sasuke represents the Uchiha's. Kakashi Gaiden was all about Kakashi. We didn't saw much Minato in it. We didn't saw much about the tailed beast too. I bet Kishi can write a lot of stuff about them, and it will be far more interesting than repeating the same thing about Uchiha's and hatred (at least for me, since I'm not a Sasuke fan, which you apparently are). And I also never said that I hate Sasuke, I just don't want to read again and again about Uchiha's and their hatred, or about Sasuke's revenge, that thign is boring and uninteresting for me. Just how many times did Kishi redraw the night of the massacre? Was that really necessary? Nope. But I also never complained about it, I just read through it, waiting for something more interesting (for me at least) to come along in the story. That doesn't mean I need to like it now does it?

The best selling arc for Part II is Pain arc, not the Uchiha's brothers, if I'm not mistaken, and I'm pretty sure I'm not. And I care about the Rookies, Sai and that pathetic village of Konoha, so it's not nobody. Everybody doesn't share your opinion on things, and it seems to me that you are far more obsessed with Sasuke than I am with Naruto. For me the character of Sasuke is boring and linear, but I certainly don't hate him.

As for Kabuto I said my opinion on that. He wants to fight Naruto too, and Kabuto has history with Naruto and he is the only character that turned more bad from his interaction with Naruto. Also Kabuto is in the story for a long time now, Kishi can easily make him the final villain. I see you don't like Naruto much, well that's too bad, I have nothing more to say on that matter. I'm pretty sure that Naruto can handle Kabuto, and I see how you made your own fanfiction of Sasuke's awesomeness and Kabuto's facesmashing along with the zombies and I don't know what not , and you are saying others are obsessing over a character (lol).

[fullmoon]

I actually don't divide Naruto into parts or anything when read it, it's great as a whole.
But if I have to chose then that would be the part when team7 still had Sasuke and went on missions; the chuunin exam counted too. It was funny back there and all the characters were small, pure and cute, still their fights were interesting enough.
After that the story focuses on the Uchiha clan's tragedy which made me try to drop this manga several times --> MI, yeh I know . Not that I hate the Uchiha-focus things or Sasuke, I am a Sasuke fan (wow many ppl gonna dislike me at this point ) so I really looking forward to any of his fights. It's bcs I'm Sas fan that I hate these recent parts: He has changed too much, so Oro-like (gross, don't like this man >.<) and heartless, dark, kinda insane now. I miss the old Sasuke in chap 27, 36 too... where is he, Kishi? How could u do smt like that? T-T...
.. Sr, lets cont with the topic..
About the recent arcs, they sure are much more enjoyable with all the huge scale battles and flashy techniques but somehow it just feels more out of commercial, meet-deadlined reason and less passionate reason to me.
--> No offend to Kishi, I like his work after all, just my feeling.

---

IMNSHO
To many ppl think that Kishi was into the Uchiha clan too much, I think it's a little hasty to conclude bcs part II hasn't end yet and the main part is still on its way \O/ can't wait!!
He just want to turn Sasuke evil asap >> he did it now so I bet that from now on the story will focus on Naruto again.
Manga often stresses on smt tragedy rather than non-tragedy so maybe we weren't spammed by Minato and Senju means there's just nothing bad happen to them. Also the hero always shows up in the last minus is what Naruto kept saying in the first arc so Kishi must wanna tell Minato story in the last minus, don't u think?