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Translations: Gintama 507 (2)
My response to goral's original post...
Answer; It is often said that speculation is more dangerous than fact. It is clear from the way that the story is told that the MIB had been using 'plants' (most likeily hidden members of there own factions) to spread information among the humans. such as the nature of Yoma as 'ultimate monsters that have been around for ever' etc.
Also i always assumed that since Yoma are just parasites infesting people who were originally just human; that any knowledge the human possessed would be inherited by the yoma, which is why the Yoma believed and spouted the orgs. lies. The only knowledge a yoma starts with is the memories taken from it's first host.
Answer; We know that Miria could never give the real reason she knew about the other continent (the two Dragon kin\Askaram).
So, she went looking for other proof to get a rebellion started;
When you think about it, Miria figures too much out from just seeing the Askaram (we know she gets some help from Rubel in that regard), but to say she discovered the whole plot with just that would be far fetched.
The 'what are they made of' question is a good one with two possibilities; either
3a) She simply made up the whole thing to get the Claymores on side. It's an interesting speculation and Miria has been shown to be liberal with the truth (not mentioning and hiding the existance of the DK at the HQ).
But, I feel saying that she was believed too easily, or that the Claymores are dumb to believe her, feels wrong for the exact reason that people argue that Miria is talking rubbish.
If Miria supposedly cannot tell between one metal and another; then neither should your average Claymore. At which point it comes down to how much trust the other Claymores have in Miria.
3b) Miria really did do research. While metals cannot be told apart by simple observations, such as color, it is possible to note other things however.
Such as under what kind of stresses diffrent materials can endure.
bronze breaks when competing against iron, iron rusts, steel dosen't rust, titaium is hard but brittle, etc. Also things like burning\melting temperature.
As Given that Claymores travel across the whole cont. it would be easy to imagine that someone like Miria would be able to check not only the locations of mines throughout, but who uses them.
Anyone notice that dispite having money of their own noone uses it? (except Clare via Raki?)
Miria could have used her 'wages' to ask people to spy for her, to watch the mines.
She could have easily used her 'wages' to have a cont. blacksmith examine a retrieved Claymore (and she would not admit that given that a claymore's sword doubles as gravemarker); while I agree that Yagi has not shown one, blacksmiths must exist somewhere.
I always took it that Rubel would place himself in a specific direction, so Clare wouldn't need to know precisely where he was (just head in a general direction); 'just heading north and you find me along your path' kind of thing.
If by sunglasses you mean 'something to reduce the level of light going into ones eyes on a sunny day' (I have some dark glasses that don't even have a uv factor)?
Within our own histroy; the first true glass was actually produced in ancient egypt (long before the medievil period of histroy) and so I don't see how that type of 'sunglasses' couldn't exist in a medievil world.
In fact, producing stained glass came first; until someone perfected the production of 'clear glass' sometime later.
Anyhow, Glass (clear or not) was considered a luxary item and every expensive even in (ancient egypt), but the MIB have a lot of money, yo.
Answer; I always thought it was his 'in joke'; because nothing is what it appears to be on the Claymore cont. Claymores are not the true name given to the warriors; thus it amounts to Claymore actually meaning 'fake'.
Rubel is a 'fake' MIB. Claymores are 'fake' warriors (as in that they are really 'test subjects')
Rubel is actually saying, 'I'm a fake as well'.
Last edited by Decepticon; April 14, 2014 at 10:06 AM.
Utsune, your calculation and numbers are pretty on point as generalization for the Claymore generations and spans.
I want to comment about the huge generation difference between Teresa and Clare, 77th vs 150th. I feel that it's actually explainable as there were special circumstances and events that predated and contributed to that. Before Teresa, there was the awakening of Luciela where the organization was almost destroyed which many warriors and trainees were wiped out. In response the organization most likely than not increased their productions of new trainees to become warriors which increased the generation numbers in a short amount of years. After Teresa become a ranked warrior, there was the Rockwell Hill Massacre where Hysteria killed a hill piles of dead warriors. Thus, in turns the organization had to increase their productions of new trainee to become warriors, which in turns again increased the generation numbers in a short amount of time. Finally, the awakening of Priscilla, wiped out numbesr 1 to 4 and lost the next No.1 candidate, which would contribute to an increased in generation numbers again in short amount of time because the organization was desperately trying to create strong warriors. (They were desperate enough to bride Raphaela back into the organization.) Remember that the organization did not have the perfect formula to just create strong warrior right off the bat, so the probably rely of creating more patches of new trainee (each patch equals a generation) hoping some would have single digit power, and not every patch of new trainees was a success.
About Ophelia, she must had became a trainee and warrior after awakening of Prisiclla, because she went crazy after she saw the one horned monster Priscilla ate her brother who sacrificed himself for her. So, she probably entered the organization around the time of Clare, probably was number around her generation as well.
Other things to consider.
- The line of 47 warriors most likely always overlap. (Cassandra and Roxanne, Hysteria, Rosemary, and Teresa, the ghosts)
- Low ranking warrior rising up to high ranking do not happen very often. (As stated in Roxanne's backstory and her being the exception, and Renee commented on this as well.)
- The Mibs preferred the warriors' reign to be short so they won't find out too much.
Priscilla may not be the only one who could assimilate her Claymore sword into her body.
Alicia might be doing something similar when she awakened, as her sword disappeared when she awakened.
Last edited by God Eye Galatea; April 14, 2014 at 11:05 AM.
That is exaaaactly what I'm looking for, can't believe I overlooked it completely, much kudos GEG! XD
With that in mind, pre-#77 classes would probably be spread out over a longer time than post-#77 classes (as you've mentioned, due to the near destruction of the Org on several occasions...... I'll keep the maths out for now, lol. But it's certainly something I'd love to try put into perspective at some point.)
About the Claymore sword, not sure if it had been discussed already, but now that I think about it Hysteria kinda assimilates her sword into her body too when she awakens, although the sword doesn't exactly disappear, it's not exactly absorbed as in Priscilla's and Alicia's case. IIRC the explanation about not being able to pull out the sword is a bit wishy-washy to me, but the dialogue along the lines of "my body recognises the sword as part of me" could have been a peek into the mechanics behind this assimilation thing.
The reason to why the sword in Hysteria´s throat didn´t assimilated with her was that it wasn´t Hysteria´s sword. Remember, Miria pulled it from a fallen comrade after discarding her own for a suicide move.
Priscilla´s sword was her own, therefor capable to merge with her as I believe Yoki is the reason to why the swords are so indestructible in the first place. The warrior infuses it with it´s unique aura and allows it to be forever sharp and in prime condition... kind of like the hybrids themselves.
That Hysteria got trouble proves this theory as the two auras were too different to match each other and Hysteria´s yoki had to reject the other alien yoki in order to be free of the blade.
Kind of like carving out a tapeworm.
I suspect that Priscilla been the assimilator from the get-go and that that is her grand ability.
Note: She was trapped in the same house as a yoma, the parasitic creature that assimilates into a human and gets everything it have for more power.
She was not a hybrid when the Org came for her months later...
But she hadn´t turned to a yoma either, and the parasite keeps infecting as long there are potential hosts. Nobody but Priscilla was available during all this time yet no take-over.
I believe that Priscilla gained anti-bodies and increased resistance to the parasite by devouring the flesh of her father, which had already been infested and she slowly gained a resistance that prevented the parasite to take over completely.
Ironically, this turned her to the very embodiment of it or the "Yoma Queen" so to say.
And based on all the evidence, she has all the properties of the parasite in her awakened abilities.
She took over Cassandra like the parasite does with humans, only this one had a mind of its own.
She took over Hysteria for a short amount of time.
She forced Cassandra´s human portion to change, similar to how a yoma sheds its disguise as we seen countless times before.
Rimuto stated that the parasite was almost impossible to destroy or kill. Which we have seen with Priscilla now.
She have taken over Chronos, Cassandra and Octavia who are now slaves to her without any strength to resist the hunger... just like the human victims for the yoma.
Heck... I actually start to believe that Priscilla really did die when Claire delivered her Quicksword at her...
But the dormant parasite inside Priscilla´s head have now awakened and hijacked Priscilla´s body for its own now when Priscilla´s mind have been destroyed. Evidence. All that have come out from her mouth is just "Hungry, hungry, hungry, HUNGRY,HUNGRY!!!!!!!!!!"
Parasitic behavior there.
If we get proof that Priscilla no longer remembers Teresa in the coming chapter, then that alone is the proof needed to declare Priscilla killed off for real and that the thing we see now is nothing but a yoma parasite doing the one thing it was created for.
Eat and Survive.
This is essentially a reflection on the very first battle with the yoma from chapter one. A warrior vs the yoma... and a symbolic end to the very plague that the Organization unleashed in the beginning.
I think this is more acceptable then that Priscilla somehow survived as herself and did a ton of things that enraged the fandom here when we saw it.
But that´s just my theory...
Do you think that having pointy ears is a sign of better hybridyzation (and an indication of greater power)? Irene, Ophelia and Cassandra have them and Irene could awaken her arm, something no Claymore has done before AFAWK. I would like to see Cassandra's stats (particularly mentality or sensing, since Ophelia and Irene have these stats particularly well developed) to see whether she has something in common with Irene/Ophelia. Does anyone remember another pointy eared Claymore? It's rather rare from what I see and every pointy eared Claymore was a monster.
Ophelia, Irene... Cassandra... Deneve have slightly pointy ears, not the same range as the others but still noticeable, and she has a that starfish healing factor going on... and that´s all pointy eared characters... four people.
so that could be a thing... those with pointy ears might have some of the actual parasite inside them to bolster their powers.
I thought it was a character design thing. In Ophelia's case it makes her look less human and more like some insane faere, it gives Irene a sort of distinguished exotic quality, and Cassandra's supposed to look like a cat. The correlation with strength comes from the fact that basically everyone in this story who matters is at single-digit level.
Queenie had pointy ears too and she was N.20.. But she looked so young as if she was a new warrior. Maybe if she was given enough time she would be like Miria; jumping through ranks.