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Thread: Two types of Vaizards, or not?

  1. #1
    Scanlator 上級員 / Jyoukuuin / Sr. Member Jinoh's Avatar
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    Two types of Vaizards, or not?

    I posted this some while ago on a discussion thread on Mangashare, but while browsing this thread again, I came across this again, and thought it would be worth sharing with you.

    The differences are the eyes, the eyes of ichigo which are normally brown change to yellow as he puts his mask on, however shinji's eyes stay gray, even after putting his mask on... I don't have pics on Hiyori to confirm this... But I will get them and post them here...Hiyori pics added

    Quote Quote:






    (eventhough it's anime, i couldnt find manga pictures of an official vaizard form colored by tite kubo, and the animators cant mess up the plot of kubo, since these vaizards are crucial, if the animators did, bleach would be messed up (edited just incase))




    I really wonder what's the meaning of this eye color difference...
    Last edited by Jinoh; November 01, 2007 at 01:21 PM.

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    Registered User 英雄メンバー / Eiyuu Menbaa / Hero Member AngryChubbs's Avatar
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    Re: Two types of Vaizards, or not?

    i think that you could be onto something. i also noticed that along with that how come ichigo has to go bankai to use his mask. and the other viazards dont even think about going shikai but just put on their mask and are stronger than a bankai-ed ichigo with his mask.

    anyone else find this strange?

    edit...
    also...how come the chick can keep her mask on the side of her head and put it on and off as she pleases. im not sure...but i think shinji can do the same thing. so maybe ichigo is just at the infancy of his viazard form and he will learn to progress and get all the power thats available.

    i would guess thats when he will fight aizen and pwn him

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    Registered User 中級員 / Chuukyuuin / Member matrice's Avatar
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    Re: Two types of Vaizards, or not?

    I don't think that this color thing was intended to have any particukar meaning... In the manga you simply can't distinguish between they eye colors because they are both withe, so if Tite meant to say something with the color thing he should have put a line somewhere to catch the reader's attenction.

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    Registered User 中級員 / Chuukyuuin / Member lilkwarrior's Avatar
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    Re: Two types of Vaizards, or not?

    Quote Originally Posted by AngryChubbs View Post
    i think that you could be onto something. i also noticed that along with that how come ichigo has to go bankai to use his mask. and the other viazards dont even think about going shikai but just put on their mask and are stronger than a bankai-ed ichigo with his mask.

    anyone else find this strange?

    edit...
    also...how come the chick can keep her mask on the side of her head and put it on and off as she pleases. im not sure...but i think shinji can do the same thing. so maybe ichigo is just at the infancy of his viazard form and he will learn to progress and get all the power thats available.

    i would guess thats when he will fight aizen and pwn him
    FINALLY, someone finds it strange that other Vizard besides Ichigo doesn't have to use Bankai to use their mask and STILL stronger than Ichigo (shinji so far).

    I think Ichigo isn't in FULL control of his mask, he's basically a noob still. He doesn't know how to use cero and other Hollows powers I'm convinced the other Vizard use. I KNOW Shinji's sword doesn't have a ability to shoot cero blasts, it was his hollow powers. hanks for bringing it out the odd difference of Ichigo using his vizard form only in bankai while other vizard don't. To be honest, I don't think all the vizard have Bankai, wouldn't that mean they had to be pretty much captains before being kicked out of Soul Society. I think MAYBE that is going to be KEY plot point in the story. Before I add more here's a hunch nobody seems to reply to (the most recent one):


    "If Grimmjow's history and his companions' are indeed true, the full hollow Ichigo we've seen can be a vastorde. As I said in a previous post, it wouldn't be surprising if most (I never said all) of the few vastorde were shinigami that attempted to be Vizard and failed in their inner battles or succumbed to it? It would make sense. regular souls become hollows and are pretty powerful, one can be stronger than others and start eating other hollows and if they don't lose their sanity, become adjuchas. If they don't get severely hurt, they continue to evolve. Now if say a shinigami were to become a hollow, not necessarily eaten by another hollow, how much powerful can they be? We know that a vizard is on par with arrancar and some ESPADA already, and we know by Ichigo's hollow that a shinigami's hollow is stronger than they are on average, yhus it can be easily concluded, that is the fastest shortcut to become a vastorde. Ichigo's full hollow form was able to regenerate, so I don't think his evolution could be stopped, unless you literally cero that hollow out of existence completely. Ichigo and the other Vizard, at least Shinji are captain level in power, if they become full hollows, it's likely that ten of them could destroy all of Soul Society if they had lost their sanity and became full hollows, that would had to be Vastorde level.

    It makes perfect sense, why it is forbidden to even gain hollow powers.

    Back on topic, I don't think Tite is going to make Ichigo bad guy or do a "skywalker" thing wih Ichigo. If he DOES become full hollow, something most likely will happen to stop him completely being succumbed to it. I think Aizen KNOWS about Ichigo bing a vizard or felt his hollow reaitsu back in soul society, and he might even know of the vizard as well. Remember Aizen has studied many forbidden things in Soul Society and he had to went across Vizard history or those banned of attempting. He might not know how many there are, he may simply know they exist. Wouldn't be a twist if the crumbling treasure can force vizard like Ichigo to become full hollows (or awaken it) and then change them to Espada?"

    Vizard who are in FULL control of their Vizard forms have more control of Hollow powers and have zero or almost zero chance of their hollow part of the soul ever overwhelming their sanity and becoming Vastorde.

    Less Experienced Vaizards like Ichigo have more chance of their hollow side coming back which is What Hollow Ichigo hinted at and having a chance to take over the Shinigamis' minds becoming Vastorde. Just like Bankai having strength and cons like your bones crushing by your own pressure, hard to maintain, and etc., Vizard form has its own complications that are more serious.

    Though it's a dream and hopefully not happening, but wouldn't be just plain sjhocking if more exerienced Vizard can release to their "full hollow" counterparts? We saw what Ichigo would look like with longer hair and stuff

  5. #5
    Registered User 英雄メンバー / Eiyuu Menbaa / Hero Member _ATMA's Avatar
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    Re: Two types of Vaizards, or not?

    erm isnt part of the reason he just goes a head and uses bankai is beaucse of his insane speed when he uses it? and then ur putting the new founded hallow speed and strength ontop of so hes just putting the physical limits of his body even further >.> at least this is how i allways saw it as, why sit around in a huge slower shikai mode? when u can have a super lightening fast bankai lol


    Quote Quote:
    "If Grimmjow's history and his companions' are indeed true, the full hollow Ichigo we've seen can be a vastorde. As I said in a previous post, it wouldn't be surprising if most (I never said all) of the few vastorde were shinigami that attempted to be Vizard and failed in their inner battles or succumbed to it? It would make sense. regular souls become hollows and are pretty powerful, one can be stronger than others and start eating other hollows and if they don't lose their sanity, become adjuchas. If they don't get severely hurt, they continue to evolve. Now if say a shinigami were to become a hollow, not necessarily eaten by another hollow, how much powerful can they be? We know that a vizard is on par with arrancar and some ESPADA already, and we know by Ichigo's hollow that a shinigami's hollow is stronger than they are on average, yhus it can be easily concluded, that is the fastest shortcut to become a vastorde. Ichigo's full hollow form was able to regenerate, so I don't think his evolution could be stopped, unless you literally cero that hollow out of existence completely. Ichigo and the other Vizard, at least Shinji are captain level in power, if they become full hollows, it's likely that ten of them could destroy all of Soul Society if they had lost their sanity and became full hollows, that would had to be Vastorde level.
    maybe when a shinigami transcends hallow powers the stronger the shinigami and the more reitsu the stronger the hallow, isnt the whole reason of 1 hallow eating another to gain the reistu so maybe instead of having to eat other shinigami, hallows, humans. where all the vizard type hallow/shinigami their inner hallow eats off the shinigami's reitsu over time increasing power all the shinigami has to do is work on increaseing their stanima and reistu thus increase their hallow sides strength and power >.> maybe this a plausible theory x.x lol
    Last edited by _ATMA; November 02, 2007 at 01:04 AM. Reason: Automerged Doublepost
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    Registered User 英雄メンバー / Eiyuu Menbaa / Hero Member Neuroff's Avatar
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    Re: Two types of Vaizards, or not?

    Ichigo was using his mask with shikai during his whole mask training. Like _ATMA_ said, the reason he always goes bankai is so that he can use his full power, not because he needs to.

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    Registered User 英雄メンバー / Eiyuu Menbaa / Hero Member akatsuki27's Avatar
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    Re: Two types of Vaizards, or not?

    maybe the eyecolor thing has to do with ichigo being a normal human when he became both a hollow and a shinigami....the vaizards were already shinigami when they acquired hollow powers to become vaizards....ichigo became both at the same time

    just throwing that out there
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  8. #8
    Registered User 英雄メンバー / Eiyuu Menbaa / Hero Member AngryChubbs's Avatar
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    Re: Two types of Vaizards, or not?

    one thing i thought of is that maybe ichigo might be a special type of hollow because he became both a shinigami and a hollow at the same time. as akatsuki said, the others were shinigami first and then became viazards. maybe there is something very special about ichigo that will be revealed later on and this might be why his eyes change color.

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    Registered User 上級員 / Jyoukuuin / Sr. Member radical3113's Avatar
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    Re: Two types of Vaizards, or not?

    Quote Originally Posted by akatsuki27 View Post
    maybe the eyecolor thing has to do with ichigo being a normal human when he became both a hollow and a shinigami....the vaizards were already shinigami when they acquired hollow powers to become vaizards....ichigo became both at the same time

    just throwing that out there
    thats always bothered me, ichigo still being soul with a human body how come this dosent weaken him, although its a good reason why his why his vizard training didnt go so well, the guy is trying to be a shinigami/hollow/human.
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    Registered User 英雄メンバー / Eiyuu Menbaa / Hero Member _ATMA's Avatar
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    Re: Two types of Vaizards, or not?

    Quote Originally Posted by radical3113 View Post
    thats always bothered me, ichigo still being soul with a human body how come this dosent weaken him, although its a good reason why his why his vizard training didnt go so well, the guy is trying to be a shinigami/hollow/human.
    hehe ichigo in himself alone is entirely a whole new entity probably :P he has to find his properly balance and he doesnt really fit the any of the 3 groups at all i believe he as access to far more things then he lets on and a possiblty of going total hallow and keeping control while useing shinigami powers ;p would be a very interesting thing like when he had to fight shirosaki lol but on a whole diffrent level of control
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    Registered User 上級員 / Jyoukuuin / Sr. Member RaZe's Avatar
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    Re: Two types of Vaizards, or not?

    Quote Originally Posted by AngryChubbs View Post
    i think that you could be onto something. i also noticed that along with that how come ichigo has to go bankai to use his mask. and the other viazards dont even think about going shikai but just put on their mask and are stronger than a bankai-ed ichigo with his mask.

    anyone else find this strange?
    If you recall, the vizards fought hollow ichigo without even using their masks. It wasn't until hollow ichigo charged up a cero that the vizard he was fighting decided to pull on his mask, prior to that the only known 'power up' used was kenseis shikai.

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    Registered User 中級員 / Chuukyuuin / Member lilkwarrior's Avatar
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    Re: Two types of Vaizards, or not?

    Quote Originally Posted by Neuroff View Post
    Ichigo was using his mask with shikai during his whole mask training. Like _ATMA_ said, the reason he always goes bankai is so that he can use his full power, not because he needs to.
    LOL, I forgot all about that. Got too caught up with seeing too much of the other battles and not remembering those scenes.

    But anyway, I'm almost convinced that a Soulless Vizard (one that lost their internal Hollow battle) is surely the quickest way of becoming a vizard, if the Shinigami had considerable power to begin with. I don't think that it's probably the only way, but it surely is a powerful shortcut (not that any Shinigami wants to be a Vasto Lorde or have a chance of losing their mind of course.) of becoming one. I hope the way of becoming a Vastorde is revealed by maybe a background history of Ulquiorra, Halibel, and the other top 4 Espada.
    Last edited by lilkwarrior; November 06, 2007 at 01:50 AM.

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    Registered User 英雄メンバー / Eiyuu Menbaa / Hero Member AngryChubbs's Avatar
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    Re: Two types of Vaizards, or not?

    Quote Originally Posted by RaZe View Post
    If you recall, the vizards fought hollow ichigo without even using their masks. It wasn't until hollow ichigo charged up a cero that the vizard he was fighting decided to pull on his mask, prior to that the only known 'power up' used was kenseis shikai.
    i think when he fully transformed, it was because he was transforming into a plain hollow with no special abilities. ichigo and shirosaki were fighting in the inner world so no one was in control of the hollow and i think that it was just a brainless hollow with a lot of spiritual power. that is why they were able to fight it without using masks or any power ups. but im willing to bet that if shirosaki came out, they would have all had to go vizard because he can control the powers.

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    Registered User 初心者/ Shoshinsha / Beginner
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    Re: Two types of Vaizards, or not?

    i didnt read read all the posts but heres my question:

    why do the vaizards people can transform onto their mask while still in their physcial body while ichigo needs to be in spirit form?

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    Registered User 英雄メンバー / Eiyuu Menbaa / Hero Member _ATMA's Avatar
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    Re: Two types of Vaizards, or not?

    Quote Originally Posted by baalasherah View Post
    i didnt read read all the posts but heres my question:

    why do the vaizards people can transform onto their mask while still in their physcial body while ichigo needs to be in spirit form?
    atm its not very clear but i think the most plausible thing would have to be they're in customized gaigi
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