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they both die
We should also remember that Itachi and Jiraiya were tied for strongest rated ninja in the last databook. They both scored a 35.
I think its 35.5
If one can't understand the Itachi was clearly lying to hide his allegiances when he said what he did, then you seriously need help.
I'm sorry, but Itachi and Kisame together would defeat damn near any single shinobi with the lone exception being Pain and even then you could make an argument for Itachi and Kisame.
The only way he could have been telling the truth was if Kishi orginally wanted Jiraiya to be stronger than the two of them, or if Kisame and Itachi got THAT much stronger over 2.5 years. He was lying, it's just something that needs to be accepted.
Remember, Itachi crippled Orochimaru with ease, the man Jiraiya could never defeat. Why would he fear Jiraiya, if he felt Orochimaru, the genius of the Sannin and the murderer of the God of Shinobi was beneith him?
I would also point out that Sasuke and Itachi fight in much different ways and have different skill sets. Presuming that Itachi was telling the truth, That still doesn't necessarily mean that Sasuke couldn't do it.
This translation never implied Jiraiya was stronger: http://www.onemanga.com/Naruto/144/10/
Last edited by megadud20; June 30, 2010 at 01:23 AM.
First off I would like to point out that Itachi is nowhere near as strong as most think. His only real arsenal was his Mangekyou, and now Sasuke's is much stronger. Sasuke's normal sharingan beat out his Tsukuyomi (period) and his Katon was greater. Not to mention the great stamina difference.
Now if Current Sasuke and Jiraiya were to fight, they would both die. Sasuke can spam Suped-Up Mangekyou Jutsu forever. Or at least until he tires out. On the other hand there is no ninja that can fight Jiraiya and not be killed in the process. This has been both stated and shown.
Hmm I don't understand how SM makes someone immune to genjutsu. 1st if we look at naruto case it takes both sakura and chiyo to snap naruto out. And chiyo is probably a low s-rank shinobi. What I understand so far is there are ways to nullify genjutsu, but it depends how strong that genjutsu is. It's not like automatic immunity. It would be less effective, but it "can" still work. From sasuke and itachi fight both their genjutsu is almost impossible to notice when they are cast. The only way to fight them without getting caught is not to look from the start. Also, sasuke susano is an archer so it's a lot harder to run away from it compared to itachi from what we've seen. 2nd once you get caught by tsukuyomi it takes seconds to die. And as far as I know you can't get out of it. Genjutsu usually paralyze victims in shock, but tsukuyomi actually kills because it feels real and long. I'm not saying he will get hit, but sasuke arsenal seems a lot more deadlier than jiraiyas. However, sasuke emotion has become unstable IMO after getting MS. He no longer fight as smart as when he fought itachi. If sasuke would use his brain a little more and use his hate to drive him to win, I will give this fight to sasuke. Because at this stage he would do anything to win no matter what the consequence is.
Besides I'm benching sasuke before he gets EMS. He should be much stronger with EMS. But, since I don't have evidence I wouldn't give anything more. 57/100 probability for sasuke.
edit @gomugomu_getsuga: You're right, itachi was not as strong as he should. He was sick. But he's 10x a ninja sasuke is. His arsenal even after obtaining MS is not only hax jutsus, he efficiently use bunshin, kunai etc. 2nd tsukuyomi was suppose to be unbreakable. It was a weak explanation that "my hate overwhelmed you blah3x". But the the end it was explain itachi was a loving carring bear and he would have kill sasuke if he wanted too. So, I would argue he released sasuke from tsukuyomi just like always and the same way he did for kakashi. You are right though, sasuke has more stamina to a sick itachi as far as I know. And Oro fought with jiraiya and survived 2x. There was this cocky chuunin too that survived rasengan when they were looking for tsunade.
Last edited by hibar90; June 30, 2010 at 02:08 AM.
Furthermore, yes it IS possible to have automatic immunity to genjutsu if you have a bijuu like Killerbee. Similar to SM, the host and the bijuu are part of the same chakra network. In fact, it's looking quite easy to break genjutsu by tapping to virtually ANY outside source at this rate now that even Sasuke was able to break Itachi's TSUKOYOMI by merely tapping into his curse seal as shown here and here. It's looking like anyone special is being immune to genjutsus left and right by tapping into an outside source. Few examples include and are not limited to: people with chakra-controlling allies, anyone with a bijuu, and sage mode users. Heck, even Raikage, and Deidara can resist genjutsu and they're not even special!
I've already posted a long reply of how Jiraiya is 100% immune to Itachi's time control, so that's out of the question when Sasuke can even pull it off half as well as Itachi could (which is the only reason he was able Danzo in the end).
The only one thing that looks promising is Sasuke's bird summons, but even still, frogs beats birds anyday, IMHO. Frogs can not only wield weapons, many are known to use ninjutsu, sage mode, and possess a very potent genjutsu with no known counter. We don't know how many birds Sasuke can have out at once or how many variations he can summon, while he know for sure Jiraiya can have several out at once with the help of the sage elder frogs. Sasuke would be wise (and quite lucky) to use the bird to flee the battle.
Jiraiya has this battle won for sure.
Last edited by megadud20; June 30, 2010 at 03:36 AM.
Sasuke is very strong and his genjutsu are good, but his genjutsu and taijutsu is inferior to that of Itachi, his general ninjutsu surpass Itachi due to the fact that sasuke is a ninjutsu type and Itachi a genjutsu type. Sasuke his genjutsu abilities are very good but against 3 opponents backing eshoulder up its impossible to perform a genjutsu long enough to make it any effect. when ma and pa fuse with jirayji they fuse themselves with chakra spots in his shoulder which lead directly to the center of the bodies chakra control. Sage mode is continuesly kept at the max capacity through the chakra gathering of ma and pa so even if they need to stop for a time to break the genjutsu sage mode isn't canceld.
The only real dangerous jutsu sasuke has that will pose a problem for jiraiya is AM and sussano, however sussano has it costs, if sasuke keeps up sussano for long periods of time it will drain his chakra and life force at a exceptional fast rate and he knows that. Sasuke can resort to spamming AM which would put jiraiya in a dangerous situation since the fire can not be extinquished.
Sasuke using summoning is useles considering the toads jiraiya can summon being ma, pa and gamabunta and the other 2 huge frogs.
Considering everyhting I give this fight to jiraiya, based on his wide arsenal of jutsu and mastery of it, Itachi not wanting to engage a fight with him, Pain admitting that jiraiya was stronger them him but failed because of lack of knowledge (even considering it was 6 against 1).
replacement technique can be used against anyone even against the byakugan who has the greatest insight of the 3 great doujutsu. Neji failed to see that naruto used replacement jutsu in order to dig underground and beat neji, so I doubt the sharingan with inferior insight would be able to do the same.