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View Poll Results: Team A: Shunsui, Urahara, and Shinji! VS. Team B: Stark, Gin, and Tousen!

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  • Team A takes it with relative ease.

    5 35.71%
  • Team A takes it with relative difficulty.

    7 50.00%
  • Team B takes it with relative difficulty.

    1 7.14%
  • Team B takes it with relative ease.

    1 7.14%
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Thread: Shunsui, Urahara, and Shinji VS. Stark, Gin, and Tousen!

  1. #1
    Registered User 英雄メンバー / Eiyuu Menbaa / Hero Member Jackk's Avatar
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    Shunsui, Urahara, and Shinji VS. Stark, Gin, and Tousen!

    Just as the title states, it is:

    Team A: Shunsui, Urahara, and Shinji!

    VS.

    Team B: Stark, Gin, and Tousen!

    Fight Location: Some random forest in Soul Society.

    Rules:

    1. All participants have access to everything they have shown so far...with the exception of Tousen. Tousen will have access to Vaizard mask, and his Resurrección/release, but no Bankai for Tousen. (Since he was shown not using Bankai/shinigami abilities while in vaizard/Resurrección mode.)

    2. Neither Team has knowledge of the other team's abilities before the start of the fight. Nevertheless, they are free to analyze each other's abilities as the battle progresses.

    3. Also, since we don't know for sure how long Shinji can hold his Vaizard mask, (It never really shattered on him when he used it the few times that we have seen him using his mask. He seems to have excellent control over it etc.) we'll say that Shinji can have his mask for an unlimited amount of time for this fight. Additionally, Shinji can use Sakanade, his shikai, in combination with his mask... since we know that both Ichigo and Love can use Shikai + mask etc.

    Which Team wins ?!
    Last edited by Jackk; July 11, 2010 at 10:07 PM.

  2. #2
    Registered User 英雄メンバー / Eiyuu Menbaa / Hero Member El Samurai Guapo's Avatar
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    Re: Shunsui, Urahara, and Shinji VS. Stark, Gin, and Tousen!

    It would be close, but I would say team A with relative difficulty.

    Mainly because you said that team A has knowledge of team B's abilities, but not vice versa. I think this is an unfair advantage for team A because they have people like Shunsui and Shinji with hax zanpakutous, and having knowledge of what they do would even the playing fields.

    If it wasn't for that I would say team B would win, but even then it wouldn't be much of a victory since team A characters would be limited to shikai. For example, I think Starrk could take Shunsui on in a 1 on 1 match, but if Shunsui could use his bankai Starrk would probably get destroyed. Same with Shinji vs. Gin or Kaname vs. Kisuke.

    But again, according to the rules of this thread I say team A wins with relative difficulty.

  3. #3
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    Re: Shunsui, Urahara, and Shinji VS. Stark, Gin, and Tousen!

    Wait what? Team A knows of Team B's abilities?

    "Team A starts with no knowledge of Team B's abilities, and Team B starts with no Knowledge of Team A's abilities."

    Anyways, interesting matchup since all of the fighters are definitely strong.

    Shinji's shikai could potentially help his entire team by affecting all the opponents (albeit, once they realize the effects I wouldn't be surprised if they scattered so they would not be all affected).

    Urahara has a pretty good shikai, good kidou, and his inventions on his side.

    And Shunsui is all-around strong and has a very sneaky shikai.

    On the other hand, Stark has his incorporeal wolves which will be hard to defend against (if they are defendable at all, perhaps team A will just have to continually be on the run).

    Gin has his hax bankai to snipe opponents.

    I actually think Tousen would do better if he could use his bankai (makes entire enemy team blind and deaf), I mean, all Gin would have to do is touch Tousen's zanpakutou (so he can see) and then snipe out the enemies with his own bankai. But, resurreccion tousen is not exactly a pushover either. Seems like a monster of brute force.

    I think that if Team A can keep all of Team B under the effects of Shinji's sakenade and defeat them quickly while they are affected, then they have a good chance of winning. If Team B can counter sakenade (at least to the point where only one fighter is affected by sakenade), then I think that it will be a tough battle to call.
    Current Theories/Beliefs for Bleach:
    -Barragan and Halibel arn't goners yet-Confirmed
    -Ukitake has an absorb and redirect type shikai (think baby nel vs. Dardonii's cero)-Confirmed
    -The VL army/group that Aizen supposedly has doesn't exist-Pending/Waiting for confirmation on Wonderweiss
    -The Vizards have ulterior motives, by ulterior I mean they arn't just going to be goody-two-shoes and help out the SS that betrayed them just to get back at Aizen-Pending

  4. #4
    Registered User 英雄メンバー / Eiyuu Menbaa / Hero Member Jackk's Avatar
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    Re: Shunsui, Urahara, and Shinji VS. Stark, Gin, and Tousen!

    Well actually, I said that Team A does "not" have knowledge of Team B's abilities. And Team B also does "not" have knowledge of Team A's abilities, thus it is fair. Then I said that they can analyze and learn about their abilities has the battle progresses, and go from there etc. But again, neither Team has knowledge of the other team's abilities before the start of the fight.

    As for my opinion, I think "maybe" it could go either way... but not sure, I'm interested in what people think could happen.

    Urahara's analytical skills will be helpful during the battle, not to mention he is also a very skilled shinigami too, and with a very versatile shikai. Furthermore, if Urahara can use his reiatsu sealing technique on one of his opponents, then well... it's pretty much over for whoever got caught on Urahara's reiatsu sealing technique. (which is a technique that Uruhara made himself http://www.onemanga.com/Bleach/403/09/ ..... http://www.onemanga.com/Bleach/403/07/, so yes, he should be allowed to use it if he can.)

    Shunsui has a hax Shikai, and he's very strong and experienced... senior captain, actually defeated Stark with just shikai in the manga etc.

    Shinji also has a hax Shikai that could be helpful to mess with Team B's coordination, and perhaps make the job for Team A a little less difficult. Shinji also has a Vaizard mask that he can use to boost his power too.

    On the other hand, Stark, Gin, and Tousen would not be pushovers either, but I think maybe Team A could take it with relative difficulty in the end.
    Last edited by Jackk; July 12, 2010 at 05:35 PM.

  5. #5
    Registered User 英雄メンバー / Eiyuu Menbaa / Hero Member El Samurai Guapo's Avatar
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    Re: Shunsui, Urahara, and Shinji VS. Stark, Gin, and Tousen!

    Quote Originally Posted by Jackk View Post
    But again, neither Team has knowledge of the other team's abilities before the start of the fight
    Well you should have just said it that way in the first place, less confusing. Either way, it was my mistake, the fight is fair.

  6. #6
    Registered User 英雄メンバー / Eiyuu Menbaa / Hero Member Jackk's Avatar
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    Re: Shunsui, Urahara, and Shinji VS. Stark, Gin, and Tousen!

    Quote Originally Posted by El Samurai Guapo View Post
    Well you should have just said it that way in the first place, less confusing. Either way, it was my mistake, the fight is fair.
    Sorry if it was confusing. I edited the OP now... hopefully it's clearer now.

    I also added a 3rd rule... allowing Shinji to use his mask for as long as he wants ( it won't break on him), and he can use Mask + Shikai too.

    I still think Team A could take this with relative difficulty, but I'm still interested in seeing what people have to say about the fight. If they agree, or disagree.. and why they think the fight will go the way they think it will go etc.
    Last edited by Jackk; July 11, 2010 at 10:12 PM.

  7. #7
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    Re: Shunsui, Urahara, and Shinji VS. Stark, Gin, and Tousen!

    This is a good fight. Like to see the analysis of character vs. character. Shunsui could do some good damage to anyone. Getting close is the key, but once he does I think the color game is almost a definitive win for him. All the characters wear the same colors. Urahara is a good kido user but he's dealing with Gin Tousen and Starrk, all of whom are fast, perhaps the fastest is Starrk. I don't think Team B are slouches, but Shunsui and Shinji have been captains much longer than Gin or Tousen. Gin I would say is on par with Shinji though.His sword is super fast but if Ichigo can keep up with it or block it, I don't see why Shinji and his crew couldn't. Tousen's ressurecion to me wasn't special. I think he was just too overjoyed with his new abilities. I give it to team A with difficulty.

  8. #8
    Registered User 英雄メンバー / Eiyuu Menbaa / Hero Member Jackk's Avatar
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    Re: Shunsui, Urahara, and Shinji VS. Stark, Gin, and Tousen!

    Yeah, I suppose they could approach this fight in one of two ways...

    Scenario #1:

    Each one of the fighters picks an opponent to fight from the opposing team and then they go at it 1 on 1.

    Scenario #2:

    They could do: all 3 from Team A against all 3 from Team B. In other words, an all out battle... with assists and just fighting as a team... helping each other out etc.

    If we go with Scenario 1-

    I think we would probably see the following match ups:

    Shunsui Vs Stark-

    This one we have seen already, but we had interruptions. Ukitake stopping some of Stark's ceros with his Sōgyo no Kotowari Zanpakutō, which allows his to absorb and redirect energy attack from his enemies. And then Love and Rose had Stark distracted for a while, which allowed shunsui to sneak in the shadows and stab Stark, then beat him with Irooni (his Color game.)

    Would be good to see a fight between Stark and Shunsui with no interruptions. Stark's ceros and specially the wolfs (which he did not use against Shunsui in their actual fight in the manga).. should cause problems for Shunsui. Nevertheless, if Shunsui can catch Start with Irooni, the color game, then Start is done... just how it happened in the Manga.

    Urahara Vs Gin-

    Interesting match; however, seeing how Ichigo could still somehow block Gin's Zanpakutō in their fight... I don't see why Urahara couldn't do the same. Urahara is a very smart man, and I think he will see that it is better to fight Gin at close range due to Gin being more deadly from a distance with his Bankai usually. Urahara's Zanpakutō's versatility will come in handy. His bloodmist shield may help him defend himself, and he is also quite good with kido, although he probably would not want to use kido from afar due to Gin's longer reach, unless Urahara can surprise him. Then of course, if Urahara can get a hold of Gin and use his reiatsu sealing technique.... then it's over for Gin, since even Aizen admited that that would have killed him too if it hadn't been for the Hōgyoku. Still, Urahara has to be very careful because Gin's Zanpakuto is still very fast.

    Shinji Vs Tousen -

    Another interesting match, Vaizard VS. Vaizard. Shinji's sakanade may or may not be useless against Masked Tousen... some would argue that since Tousen is blind, Shinji's Sakanade will have no effect on him, BUT Sakanade's effect seems to activate with smell http://www.onemanga.com/Bleach/387/06/, so if Sakanade still works on Tousen... then Tousen would not be "seeing" things in reverse (since he's blind), but he could probably still receive damage in opposite directions, since Sakanade also reverses the place where you get hit. http://www.onemanga.com/Bleach/387/10/http://www.onemanga.com/Bleach/387/11/

    Perhaps Sakanade won't be as effective on tousen when he's blind, and I do see Tousen's Vaizard regeneration causing some trouble, but if Shinji can push Tousen to use his resurrecion/release... then I think Shinji will be able to take him because Tousen gets a lot stronger, but he's not used to his new vision while in resurreccion. Shinji will just totally screw him with sakanade then. If Shinji is smart, he would put his Mask on and just attack rapidly in various directions, which should not allow his opponent to keep up... while trying to work, in their minds, the reverse attacks from sakanade. I think that will be the key to ultimately confuse the enemy with Sakanade. Put Mask on and attack fast!

    Then, if we go with Scenario 2-

    I think it would be an interesting match as well, probably more intense and not entirely sure, but I think a "team battle" may also benefit Team A more. Particularly because of Shinji's Sakanade and Urahara's analytical skills, then Shunsui could probably sneak in the shadows and attack from behind while the opponent was busy fighting someone else etc. They must also try to keep the fight at close range due to Gin's deadly bankai.
    Last edited by Jackk; July 12, 2010 at 01:55 AM.

  9. #9
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    Re: Shunsui, Urahara, and Shinji VS. Stark, Gin, and Tousen!

    the thing that team B have is alot of speed ..starrk n Gin shoot that made

    Tousen ahhh Tousen Hollow Tousen would be the main threat as he is so damn strong it stupid...he could beat shunsui IMO

    shinji is key to defence of team A is sakanade would play well.

  10. #10
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    Re: Shunsui, Urahara, and Shinji VS. Stark, Gin, and Tousen!

    Shinji vs Gin - I'd say Shinji. Gin is deadly and has a great bankai but his aim will be messed up with sakanade, and I think a well placed cero or simply some melee beating would be deadly for Gin. Shinji is a beast, even without his mask. One point for team A.

    Shinji vs Starrk - I'd possibly go with Starrk here. He's tricky and pretty much the only guy with some serious control of his movement and ridiculous mobility and awareness. I think sakanade wont do much good if he can dodge the first few hits, as I believe he would adapt relatively fast. So that's a point for team B.

    Shinji vs Tousen - I'd go with Shinji really. Even if Sakanade doesn't work on the blind man with his mask, he doesn't have the firepower to bring Shinji down and in a straight up sword fight, he'd get himself killed. In his bug form, sakanade should work, and bug's general awareness seems somehow diminished, so even if he does have a strength advantage over shinji there, it wont do him much good. Point team A.

    Urahara vs Gin - Definitely Urahara. This is just Gin asking for a dummy gigai and Urahara blasting the bananas out of him. I'd say Urahara has slight mobility advantage (they both seem rather fast), and Urahara clearly owns him in Kido. Point for team A.

    Urahara vs Starrk - I'd give this to Urahara, even though this is easily the closest call in this entire fight IMO. Starrk can tank, has speed advantage and firepower advantage along with range. On the other hand, Urahara some really nice defensive moves, potential setup for some heavy kido blasting. Binding kidos combined with benihime's defense and another binding... I'd say if he uses his gigai well, he can take this. Team A point.

    Urahara vs Tousen - Tousen could take this, IMO. He's got great perception and speed in his masked form, and that should keep him from any potential traps for a while. I think simply going into a sword fight and regenerating any injuries, could wear Urahara down. Urahara can't take him down in one hit there considering his reg, and if he gets him with binding, transformation to the bug form should do the trick. Urahara could try gigai here, but he doesn't have the firepower to bring the ManFly here, and the guy is just too strong. Team B.

    Shunsui vs Starrk - I'd go with Starrk here. Ceros could be good enough to keep Shunsui at a distance and I can't see how he could not get him with the wolves. Shunsui would have trouble getting close and landing any games properly, which again he can lose, seeing how he wouldn't have the surprise attack advantage here. Idk, this bit goes to Starrk, IMO. Team B, point.

    Shunsui vs Gin - Pretty tough, though probably Shunsui. He has the reaction time and can get into melee, and games would just be the end of Gin. Team A.

    Shunsui vs Tousen - Shunsui, pretty confidently. He can match the speed of masked man and melee games could one hit the blind man, so his regeneration is pretty much a not go here. The bug is powerful, but no way is he landing a hit on Shunsui and the colour game would be a disaster for him. Team A gets this point too.

    6 - 3 in match ups for Team A, my ruling goes to them. Pretty straightforward.

    If they fought as a team, team A has the AoE sakanade advantage and that could very well be the breaking point. Either way, Team A.
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  11. #11
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    Re: Shunsui, Urahara, and Shinji VS. Stark, Gin, and Tousen!

    Shunsui would beat all 3 one on one. Starrk is the fastest one perhaps, but he still didn't outpace Shunsui. Without his swords working he still held his own, in shikai that didn't work against a ressureccion Starrk? Then when his swords did work it was lights out Starrk. He'd beat Tousen with ease too, Tousen is blind and shouldn't know colors. Shunsui calls irooni white and cuts him in half. Gin might be the hardest for Shunsui, but his speed I think would allow him to close that gap immediately. gin casts a big shadow with that long sword too. Shunsui hides in there with kageoni and strike the shadow Gin makes, good hit right there.

    Urahara could beat 2 out of the 3. I don't think he'd fare too well against Starrk, but the other two I'm thinking wouldn't be too much of a hassle for him.

    Shinji could beat 2 or 3 as well. I bet he could stay with Starrk and Tousen, but I donno about Gin. I would say so but it's hard to tell, Sakanade wouldn't do much to throw off Gin especially if he just swings his sword around and slices everything in it's radius.

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