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Thread: Is Mana the earl?

  1. #31
    Registered User 上級員 / Jyoukuuin / Sr. Member relory's Avatar
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    Re: Is Mana the earl?

    Thanks for clearing things up aracely! *wants to learn Japanese now*

    But I still think it's significant that the other Noah refers to Earl as Count/Earl/Master, while the 14th touches his face(uh.. mask..thing.. what the heck is that disguise anyway xD), calls him 'brother' and then tells him how he's going to kill him and take his place. Nea's got a nerve xD or he's batshit crazy.

    It could mean(apart from sibling) that he thinks/regards Earl as his equal. This is also highly possible.

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    Registered User 下級員 / Kakyuuin / Jr. Member Aracely's Avatar
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    Re: Is Mana the earl?

    My bets are on him both having nerve and being batshit crazy, but we'll see. Maybe he is sane after all.

    Absolutely, the 14th behaves in quite a different way from the others, and it must be significant. He would need to think of the Earl as an equal or something like that to think that he could replace him. Also, there seems to be something intimate about the way the 14th treats the Earl (nothing dirty! Really!). He touched the face of the Level 4 in an affectionate way when he was sending the Earl a message through it, and there was that second time too when he directly touched the Earl's face/mask/ugly mug. The Earl's flashbacks, too, also seem to indicate that they were very close. It wouldn't be all that surprising if they really were brothers, whether the Earl is Mana or not.

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    MH's Most Beautiful Member 有名人 / Yuumeijin / Celebrity Naomidee's Avatar
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    Re: Is Mana the earl?

    You know, you have a point there about them being close. Maybe that's the reason that The Fourteenth is the only Noah to refer to the Earl as his brother. Simply because they were close on a deeper level of meaning than the other Noah were, or that he simply sees The Earl as his equal.

    That would answer that question.
    Thanks for clearing that up for me. XD Sometimes, I take things too literally.
    Last edited by riki; September 03, 2010 at 03:31 PM.

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    Re: Is Mana the earl?

    I'm not sure if Mana really is the Earl or if it is a coincidence or another brother Cross forgot to talk about. But what everyone must admit is that they look a bit too similar...

  5. #35
    Registered User 上級員 / Jyoukuuin / Sr. Member relory's Avatar
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    Re: Is Mana the earl?

    yeah... and didn't Cross "promise the 14th he'd watch over Mana until the 14th returned"?
    Unless Mana is the Earl (or is alive somewhere), Cross sure is terrible at keeping his promises that IS kinda likely too though xD

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    Registered User 下級員 / Kakyuuin / Jr. Member BexXx's Avatar
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    Re: Is Mana the earl?

    I really think that mana s the Earl (signs seem ta point to that big-time) but never know what the real truth there could be . . .

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    Registered User 下級員 / Kakyuuin / Jr. Member clamche's Avatar
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    Re: Is Mana the earl?

    I don't think that Mana is the Earl. The Earl has horns under his hat and the way he talks about God and the fact that his soul produces the dark matter - all this proves that he is the devil. Besides he is 7000 years old ( Millennium ). Mana died . Humans die. Mana's soul was called back from heaven. The Earl uses human souls for creating akuma.
    We still haven't seen clear picture of Mana.
    Mana loves Allen. The Earl hates him.
    Mana and the 14th had a hellish life after the 14th's betrayal. They were always running. Cross said that. From whom were they running when all Noah except Road were killed? The angry and betrayed Earl of course.
    Mana is still appearing by Allen's side and is helping him ( when Allen's eye evolved for example ).
    Mana's last words "keep walking" sound like "keep running, keep moving" - Mana and the 14th were always running since 35 years ago. They were hunted by the Earl - the other Noah after reincarnating didn't remember a thing and don't seem to hate the 14th.
    Just because there is slight resemblance in there appearance doesn't seem the are a lot alike. Besides it's not Hoshino's style to make Mana the Earl.

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    Registered User 英雄メンバー / Eiyuu Menbaa / Hero Member ying_su's Avatar
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    Re: Is Mana the earl?

    Maybe, Mana was the Noah of Joy.


    TIMCANPY FOR THE WIN!!!

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    Registered User 上級員 / Jyoukuuin / Sr. Member relory's Avatar
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    Re: Is Mana the earl?

    Just adding another possible 'clue' that could support the "Mana = Earl" theory to the archive remember that painting that Allen recognized as Mana back in chapter 7? Doesn't it look more like the Earl than Mana when you think about it? With the pointy ears, devilish smile and.. overall creepiness? xD (actually, it looks more like a mix between Jack Skeleton and Jesus walking towards crucifixion but whatever xD) I find it kinda strange that Allen thought of Mana when he saw it, because it doesn't really look like him at all(warning: big pages):

    Spoiler show


    What if Allen subcounciously(sp?) acknowledged it as being Mana and Earl at the same time because of his Noah memories or something?

    I just remembered this page after rereading the new chapter, when Nea referred to the Earl as a 'puppet of destruction' or 'insane puppet'. Notice how Mana/Earl/Jack is chained, and looks like he's being dragged forward? IF Mana is not the Earl, I still think this picture almost proves(or at least hints) that Mana was a Noah himself..

    It COULD of course be a coincidence, but seeing as almost nothing in DGM is a coincidence, it's not easy for me to turn my back on this theory x'D But I just cannot grasp that link between Allen, Mana, Earl, 14th and Tyki I get more confused the more I think about it but I am sure Hoshino doesn't want us to find out what it is yet, this early(?) in the story :P

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    Re: Is Mana the earl?

    what i know that mana and the 14th were siblings XD

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    Registered User 下級員 / Kakyuuin / Jr. Member Aracely's Avatar
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    Re: Is Mana the earl?

    Quote Originally Posted by clamche View Post
    We still haven't seen clear picture of Mana.

    Just because there is slight resemblance in there appearance doesn't seem the are a lot alike.
    I think it's a lot more than a slight resemblance. Going by the pics from page 2 of this topic, there's a lot we can see. We haven't seen any one picture which shows Mana's face fully, but we have seen his entire face. Is there really any part of Mana and the Earl's appearance (save for their clothes) that we can point to and say isn't alike?

    Basically, we know that:
    - Mana's eyes are pale in colour, and so are the Earl's.
    - Their eyes are the same shape.
    - Mana and the Earl have the exact same hair style. It even includes having the same stray strands of hair hanging over their faces.
    - Mana and the Earl appear to have the same hair colour.
    - They have the exact same amount and distribution of facial hair.
    - They have the same face shape.
    - They have the same build.
    - They look the same age.

    I don't really think there's much room for arguing that they don't look alike or merely have a superficial resemblance. I would say that there is in fact clear evidence that they look identical.

    ...Why they look identical is a different matter entirely. Just because they look identical doesn't automatically mean that Mana has to be the Earl. There are other explanations for why that could be.

    For example, have you read Continue? It was a manga by Hoshino which she published before D.Gray-man. The Earl appeared in Continue, and in that manga, an ability of his was described: the Earl had the ability to enter and take over the bodies of other people for his own. It's possible that the Earl in D.Gray-man also has this ability. This could mean that he is not Mana at all, but has simply snatched Mana's body.This option would actually make a lot of sense - because of what we've learned about the Earl's soul being the source of the dark matter for the Akuma, who kill people and take over their bodies, is it really so strange for the Earl to also be able to do that? And if the Earl is a body-snatcher, then it explains why he has lived for so long.

    But I must confess that one main attraction I have to this theory is that it explains why the Earl looks like Mana and yet Mana's soul could be brought back as an Akuma by Allen. If the Earl and Mana really are the same person, then the scene with Mana being brought back is going to need quite some explaining.

    Quote Originally Posted by clamche View Post
    Besides it's not Hoshino's style to make Mana the Earl.
    Ah, but what makes you think that making Mana the Earl is something that Hoshino wouldn't do? I'm not saying he is the Earl, but I definitely don't think that it would be against Hoshino's style to make him that.

    Think about it. Is it Hoshino's style to try to make it look as if one person is actually two people, in order to add drama? Answer: Yes! It is, and she's done it before. That's exactly what she did with Alma and the girl whom Kanda was searching for.

    There are other hints of similarity between the Earl and Mana. They're both people who have attention-grabby personalities. They both have clown imagery. And Cross said that Mana might have amnesia. It's possible that, if the Earl and Mana are genuinely the same person somehow, the Earl had amnesia during the time he spent with Allen. So long as the Mana being made into an Akuma thing has some sort of explanation, then those things plus their identical appearances could all be hints to the audience.

    Quote Originally Posted by relory View Post
    I just remembered this page after rereading the new chapter, when Nea referred to the Earl as a 'puppet of destruction' or 'insane puppet'. Notice how Mana/Earl/Jack is chained, and looks like he's being dragged forward? IF Mana is not the Earl, I still think this picture almost proves(or at least hints) that Mana was a Noah himself..

    Maybe it could be a reference to Mana having become an Akuma? Although the Noah thing works too.

    The fact that Mana escaped with the 14th and presumably fought alongside him must mean that Mana is very strong in a fight. I'd thought that maybe he was a strong sorceror or something, but him being a Noah would work too. Although if that's the case, then maybe the Earl was lying (or omitting facts) when he told the current Noahs that they had all been killed by the 14th.
    Last edited by Aracely; September 16, 2010 at 05:46 AM.

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    MH's Most High Quality Poster 英雄メンバー / Eiyuu Menbaa / Hero Member earthforge's Avatar
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    Re: Is Mana the earl?

    I think the resemblance between the Earl and the Mana is purely for symbolic reasons.

    Think about it: Allen's mentor, Mana, is like the polar opposite of the Earl. You guys have mentioned the similarities, but note everything seems to be inverted. The Earl is an Auguste, Mana is a Whiteface Clown. The Earl is exuberant, Mana is more composed. Allen's personal hero is the exact opposite of the Earl.

    What annoys me about the idea that Mana is the Earl is that we don't have any lead into the plot element. If DGM was a story with no art, we would have never been able to think up this theory. Basically, this theory relies on facial similarities in the art itself. The art is so chaotic, I highly doubt the similarity was done intentionally. There is no foreshadowing (no "gee, Mana was gone a lot of the time when I was young though", plus the weirdness of why he would fake his own death), at least none for the last 98 chapters, and we know how Hoshino plays with the themes and plots all the time.

    I think Mana and the 14th were just very close. Perhaps Nea was already an outcast for sparing his brother when he turned. Either way, I think they were just dedicated too each other, an odd relationship between a Noah and a human. But the the Earl used that to his advantage in chasing down the two. Perhaps Mana knew a little magic, but I think he was being defended by the 14th all the time when on the run, which wore down his strength until he finally fell in battle.

    This plot twist allows for more consideration of the themes, which is what Hoshino always seems to go back to.
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  17. #43
    Registered User 上級員 / Jyoukuuin / Sr. Member relory's Avatar
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    Re: Is Mana the earl?

    I really like your theory, aracely! Earl being able to 'take over' other bodies would explain a lot ^^ Hoshino reuses a lot of ideas from her earlier work in DGM. In Zone the main character was a boy trapped in a girl's body, and in DGM it was the other way around('that woman' being trapped in Alma..?).. and Earl DID have horns, like in the one-shot (it wasn't bunny ears dammit)

    Wow, I realised I haven't even read Continue! Does anyone know where I can find it? Ever since I saw the Continue-art in the Noche artbook I've wanted to read it!

    The only other reason(aside from the Mana = Earl theory xD) why I kinda cling to the idea that Mana was involved with the Noah other than being the 14th's brother, is the fact that he has the same 'crest'(fandubbed ''Noah's Crest''?) as at least Rhode and Tyki (and it's also shown on the musician's score) on the buttons of his coat:
    LINK

    It could be that he just borrowed Nea's coat though if that's the case I'll probably laugh my ass off forever! XDIt could also be that it's some kind of crest representing the "third side", if Rhode and Tyki also are a part of it.. that could also be, but it's nagging me a little...
    Gaah, there are so many possibilities, and no matter how much we theorize, Hoshino will almost always suprise us anyway my experience, that is

    EDIT: Sorry for commenting on such a little note, but wasn't Allen the one who was referred to as a white-face, not Mana? (actually, I thought that the Earl was the bossy white-face and Allen was the clever Auguste, the Earl chasing Allen/14th who doesn't follow the Earl's rules, well, w/e xD) Although Mana kinda fits that too, he definitly resembles the stock character 'Pierrot' even more: Link
    Allen actually referred to Mana as a pierrot, didn't he? (Allen's a pierrot himself though, a sad character who acts like a clown should, light-heartly and happy when he shouldn't be ;_; ) This Coca Cola-AD featuring a Pierrot reminds me SO much of Mana the kid is Allen, totally: Youtube-Link *getting off-topic* it's just so cute x'D

    I still think there's more to this theory than.. nothing. Although Earthforge makes good points about the invertion, I simply can't agree that this is merely a coincidence. As mentioned earlier in the thread, it's not just the facial features that are similar. They're both clownish, both are 'brothers' of Nea (altough in Earl's case it could just be like a Noah-brother, not by blood :P) and both seem to care a lot about Nea, and both get... extremely emotional yet comical when they think and talk about him XD :
    (dammit, why doesn't the spoiler tag work for me anymore? D: ) So yeah. More than just a coincidence, I still stand by that belief
    Last edited by relory; September 16, 2010 at 12:56 PM. Reason: didn't want to double-post D:

  18. #44
    Registered User 下級員 / Kakyuuin / Jr. Member Aracely's Avatar
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    Re: Is Mana the earl?

    Quote Originally Posted by earthforge View Post
    I think the resemblance between the Earl and the Mana is purely for symbolic reasons.

    Basically, this theory relies on facial similarities in the art itself. The art is so chaotic, I highly doubt the similarity was done intentionally. There is no foreshadowing
    I would say the only foreshadowing that's obvious at the moment would be that there has yet to be a full face shot of Mana without his makeup on. I'd say that the fact he has yet to be shown like that shows that there is going to be plot involvement and revelations about him, whatever those might turn out to be.

    But really, I don't think that Hoshino would have made the two characters look identical unless she had a clear reason to do so. Tyki and the 14th look virtually identical, and I don't think anyone would argue that there is no reason for this other than symbolism, even though we don't yet know why they look that way.

    Hoshino's art style is definitely chaotic, but I don't think that she could have given Mana and the Earl an identical appearance by accident. She's not so incompetent that she wouldn't notice that two such important characters have the same character design.

    Quote Originally Posted by earthforge View Post
    but note everything seems to be inverted. The Earl is an Auguste, Mana is a Whiteface Clown. The Earl is exuberant, Mana is more composed. Allen's personal hero is the exact opposite of the Earl.
    Actually...Mana isn't that composed. In all the scenes of him where he's in clown make-up, he seems exuberent. Even on the day he had to bury his own dog, he was cracking jokes, pulling funny faces, and teasing Allen. And when Allen saw Mana in his dream in a later chapter, he was full of energy. It seems that he was actually a silly, theatrical, energetic type of person.



    Quote Originally Posted by earthforge View Post
    Perhaps Mana knew a little magic, but I think he was being defended by the 14th all the time when on the run, which wore down his strength until he finally fell in battle.
    That's a definite possibility. The 14th even instructed Cross to look after Mana after he was gone. On the other hand, for someone as driven as the 14th apparently was, somehow it seems a little odd that he would bring a dead weight along with him, even if it was his brother. But maybe it wasn't possible for them to split up. Or maybe they just couldn't bear to be apart.
    Last edited by Aracely; September 16, 2010 at 01:55 PM.

  19. #45
    Registered User 中級員 / Chuukyuuin / Member ANGELiki's Avatar
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    Re: Is Mana the earl?

    Quote Originally Posted by Aracely View Post
    Actually...Mana isn't that composed. In all the scenes of him where he's in clown make-up, he seems exuberent. Even on the day he had to bury his own dog, he was cracking jokes, pulling funny faces, and teasing Allen. And when Allen saw Mana in his dream in a later chapter, he was full of energy. It seems that he was actually a silly, theatrical, energetic type of person.
    Hm... Don't forget that he was dealing with a small child that was alone all the time. I'm sure he was an energetic person all right, but I think he was just trying to cheer Allen or rouse his attention...
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