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Thread: Kotoamatsukami of Shishui

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    Registered User 上級員 / Jyoukuuin / Sr. Member synapse's Avatar
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    Question Kotoamatsukami of Shishui

    I don't understand how advanced uchiha abilities were "diagnosed"...esp when it is something like Kotoamatsukami of Shishui Uchiha. If it is an MS ability and can be used only once in 10 years, how did people find out he had it in the first place???

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    Registered User 英雄メンバー / Eiyuu Menbaa / Hero Member Fox666's Avatar
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    Re: Kotoamatsukami of Shishui

    I think it would be easier to ask how he know it could only be used every 10 years since he clearly had it for less than 10 years...
    Quote Originally Posted by IChallengeYou! View Post
    TOBI IS OBITO

    did you say something about timelines?! naruto ate it NOM NOM NOM IT'S GONE.

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    Registered User 上級員 / Jyoukuuin / Sr. Member Krina29's Avatar
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    Re: Kotoamatsukami of Shishui

    I think this should be in Naruto Toshokan

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    Re: Kotoamatsukami of Shishui

    I think that it's not only his technique but has been in someone before in the uchiha clan, a predecessor.
    Look at Itachi's amaterasu = people knew that it was black flames that burnt everlasting, even though not many should have seen or maybe known about it.

    Then you have the sword that Itachi's susanoo used. It was a sword that orochimaru searched for his whole life. But at the end Itachi had it.

    So I think that this abilities have been before our time, and the info about them is/was always there for those who wanted to know.

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    Registered User 英雄メンバー / Eiyuu Menbaa / Hero Member number12michael's Avatar
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    Re: Kotoamatsukami of Shishui

    Quote Originally Posted by offensive bias View Post
    I don't understand how advanced uchiha abilities were "diagnosed"...esp when it is something like Kotoamatsukami of Shishui Uchiha. If it is an MS ability and can be used only once in 10 years, how did people find out he had it in the first place???
    he could use it as he pleased.....it is only when its being used by a non uchiha that it takes 10 years to charge.....unless the non uchiha has Senju DNA(and when they say senju do they mean Hashirama or any senjus DNA would do?)

    and i am sure that the tablet under the shrine has all the information about uchiha and there eye powers so i am sure they are all in there
    "Keep Eating Shit For The Rest Of Your Life " - 愛憎のロクサーヌ- Roxanne of Love and Hate

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    Re: Kotoamatsukami of Shishui

    Quote Originally Posted by offensive bias View Post
    I don't understand how advanced uchiha abilities were "diagnosed"...esp when it is something like Kotoamatsukami of Shishui Uchiha. If it is an MS ability and can be used only once in 10 years, how did people find out he had it in the first place???
    Danzo possessing his arm and chakra wasn't affected by a ten year limit, so logically Shisui wouldn't have been effected by it either. And presumably, there had been others in the Uchiha clan to possess Kotoamatsukami, which is why it's mechanics were known.

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    Registered User 英雄メンバー / Eiyuu Menbaa / Hero Member Murdock's Avatar
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    Re: Kotoamatsukami of Shishui

    Quote Originally Posted by number12michael View Post
    he could use it as he pleased.....it is only when its being used by a non uchiha that it takes 10 years to charge.....unless the non uchiha has Senju DNA(and when they say senju do they mean Hashirama or any senjus DNA would do?)
    and i am sure that the tablet under the shrine has all the information about uchiha and there eye powers so i am sure they are all in there
    Never stated ... Itachi suggesting you need shodai's cells implies that shisui would be affected by that time limit Itachi himself said that ... Why didn't Itachi transpalnted that eye gaining EMS (which I wouldn't state he would get since you need a family member IMO and not any MS) and getting the most powerful genjutsu ... he wanted Sasuke to have MS by killing him but it could have been done in several other ways ...

    This suggests that even Shisui was affected by that time limit

    Quote Originally Posted by Rikudou King View Post
    Danzo possessing his arm and chakra wasn't affected by a ten year limit, so logically Shisui wouldn't have been effected by it either. And presumably, there had been others in the Uchiha clan to possess Kotoamatsukami, which is why it's mechanics were known.
    He wasn't experiencing any side effects since he had hashirama cells ... however it doesn't suggest that Shisui wouldn't have been affected
    Why Tobi can't be Obito (or Rin):

    Year 0 for our purposes:
    We know that Madara and Tobi knew each other (confirmed by Kishi) and gave Madara's Rinnegan to Nagato.
    Year 5:
    J-Man trains Nagato
    Year 10:
    Obito is born.Tobi might be using Obito's eye but that is improbable since it would most likely be MS technique BUT considering how much he's been using it he would be blind by now. Itachi used it very sporadically and was blind, same Sasuke-Tobi is spamming it for 17 years and is OK?

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    Re: Kotoamatsukami of Shishui

    Quote Originally Posted by Murdock View Post
    He wasn't experiencing any side effects since he had hashirama cells ... however it doesn't suggest that Shisui wouldn't have been affected
    Except Danzo was affected by a time limit, just not a long one. And Hashirama's cells were stated for Izanagi. There's a reason Danzo purposely took Shisui's arm and shoulder, a reason for using Shisui's own chakra when we've seen that such measures aren't require. And obviously Shisui could hardly become well-known for a technique he couldn't have used more then twice his life time.

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    Registered User 英雄メンバー / Eiyuu Menbaa / Hero Member Murdock's Avatar
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    Re: Kotoamatsukami of Shishui

    Quote Originally Posted by Rikudou King View Post
    Except Danzo was affected by a time limit, just not a long one. And Hashirama's cells were stated for Izanagi. There's a reason Danzo purposely took Shisui's arm and shoulder, a reason for using Shisui's own chakra when we've seen that such measures aren't require. And obviously Shisui could hardly become well-known for a technique he couldn't have used more then twice his life time.
    shisui was experiencing time delay Itachi said he couldn't have use kotoamatsukami because it was still recovering from the last time Shisui used it ... it there was no time delay for shisui Itachi would be able to use it right away since shisui had the eye still in him after he used thus it would "charge" itself but the eye was still cooling down ... how else would Itachi know about 10 year limit if it wasn't from shisui
    Why Tobi can't be Obito (or Rin):

    Year 0 for our purposes:
    We know that Madara and Tobi knew each other (confirmed by Kishi) and gave Madara's Rinnegan to Nagato.
    Year 5:
    J-Man trains Nagato
    Year 10:
    Obito is born.Tobi might be using Obito's eye but that is improbable since it would most likely be MS technique BUT considering how much he's been using it he would be blind by now. Itachi used it very sporadically and was blind, same Sasuke-Tobi is spamming it for 17 years and is OK?

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    Re: Kotoamatsukami of Shishui

    Quote Originally Posted by Murdock View Post
    shisui was experiencing time delay Itachi said he couldn't have use kotoamatsukami because it was still recovering from the last time Shisui used it ... it there was no time delay for shisui Itachi would be able to use it right away since shisui had the eye still in him after he used thus it would "charge" itself but the eye was still cooling down ... how else would Itachi know about 10 year limit if it wasn't from shisui
    Didn't claim there was no time delay, say it was logically not as long as ten years. As mentioned, how could Shisui have become famous and notorious for Kotoamatsukami if he was basically limited to once a decade. That would be like if Minato or Itachi were limited to using their signature abilities every hundredth battle. They would hardly be as dangerous as they normally are. And it would make no sense that a non-Uchiha would be capable of using an Uchiha ability better then the Uchiha. Hashirama's cells don't explain it either, as they were specifically embedded in his arm, not his head.

    Itachi's a genius, he could have easily made a hypothesis using whatever data he had. Wouldn't be the first time a genius in this series figured something out with next to no evidence.

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    Registered User 英雄メンバー / Eiyuu Menbaa / Hero Member Murdock's Avatar
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    Re: Kotoamatsukami of Shishui

    Quote Originally Posted by Rikudou King View Post
    Didn't claim there was no time delay, say it was logically not as long as ten years. As mentioned, how could Shisui have become famous and notorious for Kotoamatsukami if he was basically limited to once a decade. That would be like if Minato or Itachi were limited to using their signature abilities every hundredth battle. They would hardly be as dangerous as they normally are. And it would make no sense that a non-Uchiha would be capable of using an Uchiha ability better then the Uchiha. Hashirama's cells don't explain it either, as they were specifically embedded in his arm, not his head.

    Itachi's a genius, he could have easily made a hypothesis using whatever data he had. Wouldn't be the first time a genius in this series figured something out with next to no evidence.
    Problem is that Hashirama's cells act as a chakra supply that explains the cooldown limit ... as Shisui didn't have it he had the timelimit, why else would Itachi state that there was 10 years timelimit unless you had hashirama's cells ... Shisui was known as Shunshin no Shisui not only for his MS ... I honeslty don't know it just doesn't make sence to mention timelimit if there was none ... I mean if that was the case Naruto should have just kept it since it was matter of chakra since he is probably the only one with similar chakra capacity to shodai
    Why Tobi can't be Obito (or Rin):

    Year 0 for our purposes:
    We know that Madara and Tobi knew each other (confirmed by Kishi) and gave Madara's Rinnegan to Nagato.
    Year 5:
    J-Man trains Nagato
    Year 10:
    Obito is born.Tobi might be using Obito's eye but that is improbable since it would most likely be MS technique BUT considering how much he's been using it he would be blind by now. Itachi used it very sporadically and was blind, same Sasuke-Tobi is spamming it for 17 years and is OK?

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    Registered User 中級員 / Chuukyuuin / Member GyoMasta's Avatar
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    Re: Kotoamatsukami of Shishui

    Uchiha Shisui didn't have that time limit snce it was his Mangekyou in his body, but Itachi isn't Shisui and Shisui's MS that Itachi had wasn't in its original body. To use it more often one would need Shisui'S or Hashirama's super cells, both of which Danzou. But since Danzou wasn't full Shisui nor Hashirama, his use of it was still limited in time, but not as long as for Itachi, as he used it in the summit and, from what Tobi said, was hesitating on whether or not to use Kotoamatsukami on Sasuke os use the Sharingan for Izanami. But Shisui shouldn't have had time trouble using that jutsu.

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    Re: Kotoamatsukami of Shishui

    Quote Originally Posted by Murdock View Post
    Problem is that Hashirama's cells act as a chakra supply that explains the cooldown limit ... as Shisui didn't have it he had the timelimit, why else would Itachi state that there was 10 years timelimit unless you had hashirama's cells ... Shisui was known as Shunshin no Shisui not only for his MS ... I honeslty don't know it just doesn't make sence to mention timelimit if there was none ... I mean if that was the case Naruto should have just kept it since it was matter of chakra since he is probably the only one with similar chakra capacity to shodai
    Hashirama's cells boost physical stamina, they don't grant more chakra. We saw this with Danzo, who had a huge drop in chakra everytime Izanagi ended and even had to take actions to preserve his chakra. And in the end when he didn't have enough chakra to maintain control, Hashirama's cells attempted to take over.

    In addition, Kotoamatsukami being Shisui's MS would have meant it wouldn't have costed him that much chakra to use. Look at Itachi, who while confirmed to have low chakra levels, is still capable of using his MS multiple times in a single battle. Or Sasuke, who uses his MS continuously without worry. So Shisui would not have been limited in his usage simply due to chakra. Aoi, Kirabi, and Kabuto all made it clear that Shisui was infamous for Kotoamatsukami.

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