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Thread: Lost in translation: Number 510

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    Translator 上級員 / Jyoukuuin / Sr. Member boyakist4649's Avatar
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    Lost in translation: Number 510

    All the text in bold are my translations, followed by my interpretations in italics. Disclaimer: If the text is not mentioned below, that means I thought the existing translation was sufficient to understand the meaning of the original text.

    Sorry - doing this half asleep this week... @_@
    I might make some corrections later. Although there were a couple notable mistranslations... (highlighted by **)

    p3
    Konan: I wasn't just sitting idly by your side all that time.
    I know exactly why your dimensional transfer failed.
    Konan: Looks like your dimensional transfer failed.
    It's not like I was sitting idly by your side all that time.

    Not much of a difference, but Konan does not say that "she knows exactly why it failed" - although she probably does know why it failed. I think the Japanese text had some subtle humility included in it.

    Konan: you have to solidify before you can absorb yourself
    and you always take longer to absorb someone or something else.
    **Konan: You always have to solidify before you can absorb yourself.
    and compared to when you absorb something else... there's a delay

    She's saying that he's a bit slower when he has to absorb himself, in comparison to when he absorbs other things.

    p5
    Konan: I prepared all of these... all six hundred billion explosive tags... to kill you! Enough for ten minutes of non-stop explosions!
    Konan: The six hundred billion explosive tags I have prepared in order to kill you...
    will continuously explode for 10 minutes!!

    Slight differences - no difference in overall meaning of text.

    p6
    Konan: No matter what happened to them, they both fought for their own ideals.
    Konan: No matter what (it may have looked like), they fought and died through their own will.
    So Konan is making a specific reference to what Nagato ended up looking like - essentially sacraficing his physical being to achieve his and Yahiko's "will".

    p7
    Konan: I won't let you ruin it!
    Konan: I will not let you get in the way!!
    Konan is intent on letting Nagato and Yahiko fulfill their intentions/will. She doesn't believe that Madara can ruin this - but rather she thinks that Madara is only an obstacle in this path.

    p11
    Madara: A technique that can only be used... by someone posessing both the powers of the Uchiha and the Senju!
    Madara: An eye technique that is only granted to those who have the powers of both the Uchiha and the Senju
    Latter translation is more literal, Madara does sound like he respects the powers of the Uchiha and the Senju more than the English translation would suggest.

    p12
    Madara: Izanagi was originally a jutsu used by the sage of the six paths to "create"
    Madara: The Izanagi is an adaptation of the Rikudou Sennin's (six paths sage) ability to "create nature"
    Madara says that Izanagi uses the same principles as the Rikudou's "万物創造" which means: 万物(nature/being) and 創造(create).

    Madara: The Uchiha and the Senju were once one and the same.
    The sage, who was the two clans and the two bloodlines in one person, used his powers to create many things.
    Madara: The Uchiha and the Senju were once one entity
    The Rikudou sennin was their (Uchiha and Senju) ancestor, and used both their bloodlines and powers to create many things


    Madara: By administring imagination, and the spiritual energy which forms the basis of "yin" power... he would create shape and form from nothingness.
    Madara: The power of the "Yin-Elemental" is based on the spiritual energy which enriches imagination... and using that he created objects from nothingness.


    Madara: By administering vitality and the physical energy which forms the basis of "yang" power... he would breath life into that form
    Madara: The power of "Yang-Elemental" is based on the physical energy which enriches life... and using that he breathed life into these objects.
    The original Japanese text was confusing enough - a basis within another basis.

    Madara: With his yin-yang elemental power, he created the nine beasts from the ten-tails chakra.
    Madara: From the ten-tails chakra he used the Onmyou Elemental (yin and yang elemental) to create each of the tailed beasts.
    Translation wasn't off - but I decided it may be a good idea to throw the Onmyou Elemental terminology out.

    Madara: a technique with the power to turn imagination into reality...
    Madara: a technique which realizes "imagination" into "life"
    Meaning that Rikudou Sennin had the ability to create life from nothingness.

    p13
    Madara: I am Uchiha Madara! The man who obtained Senju Hashirama's powers! Two of the six paths are now one being!
    **Madara: I am the Uchiha Madara that obtained the power of Senju Hashirama!
    As the second Rikudou, both are now one being!

    Two things - he still does not state "I am Uchiha Madara." He is still implicating that he is Uchiha Madara.
    and additionally, he implies that he is the second Rikudou - saying that it only took the second Rikudou incarnation to unite what was separated by the first.


    p14
    Konan: Yahiko and Nagato's will hasn't vanished from this world!
    Konan: Yahiko and Nagato... their wills won't disappear!
    First translation seems like Yahiko and Nagato's will would have eventually disappeared.

    p15
    Konan: Thank you, Nagato... your death has only renewed my hope!
    Konan: Thank you, Nagato... even in death you show me the way to hope!

    Konan: It doesn't matter if I'm scattered to the wind! I will stop y-
    Konan: I can be the flower that wilts... but I will (stop) you here...
    Konan is saying that she herself is dispensable - comparing herself to a wilting flower.

    p17
    Nagato lays at rest, the smile etched on his face a memorial to the peace he dreamed of

    Nagato smiles... as he is blanketed by the "will" towards peace...

    actual word used here is "spooled" or "wrapped" rather than "blanketed," but couldn't think of something better... sorry!
    Last edited by boyakist4649; September 19, 2010 at 01:16 AM.
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    Registered User 中級員 / Chuukyuuin / Member LanderZ's Avatar
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    Re: Lost in translation: Number 510

    I was wondering how this one would turn out, and it appears you cleared up a number of things. Kudos.

    So, Inton and Youton for Light/Dark-elements, and Onmyouton for the combo, or were the spoiler translations a little off?

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    Registered User 下級員 / Kakyuuin / Jr. Member Biassed's Avatar
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    Re: Lost in translation: Number 510

    I am still not clear on whether he referred Nagato as third Rikudo or not?
    If he did, can we assume uzumakis (probably) carry both bloodline limits?

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    Translator 上級員 / Jyoukuuin / Sr. Member boyakist4649's Avatar
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    Re: Lost in translation: Number 510

    Quote Originally Posted by LanderZ View Post
    I was wondering how this one would turn out, and it appears you cleared up a number of things. Kudos.

    So, Inton and Youton for Light/Dark-elements, and Onmyouton for the combo, or were the spoiler translations a little off?
    陰 (In or yin) and 陽 (You or yang) make 陰陽 (Onmyou) - you are correct. I subsequently added the translation above. thanks for bringing it to my attention


    Quote Originally Posted by Biassed View Post
    I am still not clear on whether he referred Nagato as third Rikudo or not?
    If he did, can we assume uzumakis (probably) carry both bloodline limits?
    Madara did refer to Nagato as the third Rikudou - no problems with the translations there - hence I didn't add in my two cents. But I guess that's what a thread is here for - to answer any other questions

    Now, can you assume Uzumaki's have both bloodlines... I don't think that would be a biased assessment, but that would be jumping a little too far (at least the bloodline limit part). There probably is a good connection - in that Naruto seems to have Rikudou characteristics in his new Kyuubi seal. As to what the connection is, and how strong of a connection, we will have to wait and see. ^^
    Last edited by boyakist4649; September 19, 2010 at 01:25 AM. Reason: Automerged Doublepost
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    Re: Lost in translation: Number 510

    One final question... Your translation seems to indicate that Madara-guy is the "second Rikudo" and Nagato is the third. Just to verify, to clear up some oddball scanlation issues, do they refer to it in any way that divides it up as "the second of the 6 paths (since Roku/Riku = 6)" and Nagato as "the third of the 6 paths", i.e. that there are 6 chosen people/paths and 3 have been labelled, or is it more of a "I am the second Rikudo Sage, and Nagato is the third Rikudo Sage, chronologically speaking"?

    The mangastream translation made me sad to think that there are 6 special people or some such, cause god knows they'll end up being Naruto, Sasuke, and Kakashi somehow....

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    Re: Lost in translation: Number 510

    Big THX boyakist-sama once again!

    So now its ccrystal clear - SF was better yet again this time with their translation <lately MS.. or Hisshou, is messing important parts ^^'> So Madara being the second Rikudou is right, as well as Nagato being the third. <in my opinion it comes down to chronology: firstly Madara acquires Hashirama's powers thus becoming "the third Rikudou", then Nagato was born/activated Rinnegan thus becoming "the third Rikudou">
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    Re: Lost in translation: Number 510

    I have been eagerly waiting for your translation this time since the chapter was very informative and the translations was confusing, it seems both sleepy fans and mangastream has done some mistakes but that doesn't take any credibility from their amazing job they do every week i have many questions and i really thank you for you top notch job since it clarified a lot of things.

    Quote Quote:
    The Izanagi is an adaptation of the Rikudou Sennin's (six paths sage) ability to "create nature"
    i particularly like this line since i thought that izanagi is the jutsu that rikodu used to realize hi imagination but did he actually used adaptation word or he said izanagi originally was rikodu jutsu as MS and SF translation seems to imply (sorry i'm a bit thick headed but i have to make sure)

    Quote Quote:
    and used both their bloodlines and powers to create many things
    now in SF translation it says that rikodu created "all" things which is a bit absurd, so it would be very informative of you if you tell me why is this comfusion between many and all since the difference in meaning is so great.

    Quote Quote:
    Two things - he still does not state "I am Uchiha Madara." He is still implicating that he is Uchiha Madara.
    and additionally, he implies that he is the second Rikudou - saying that it only took the second Rikudou incarnation to unite what was separated by the first.
    so he didn't blatantly admit that he's uchiha madara but still talks about himself in third person? that's very important actually.
    also i didn't understand the bit about combining what the first seperated but may be this would imply that tobi is still not confirmed to be madara and may go towards the direction of being rikodu's son.


    About the yin and yang elemntal >>> does he actually say that yin =spiritual energy and yang =physical energy without other components ar the yin =spiritual=+magination
    yang=physical +life???


    sorry about all the questions but i really need to understand as they 're pretty confusing lines
    also thanks for a job well done

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    Translator 上級員 / Jyoukuuin / Sr. Member boyakist4649's Avatar
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    Re: Lost in translation: Number 510

    Quote Originally Posted by LanderZ View Post
    One final question... Your translation seems to indicate that Madara-guy is the "second Rikudo" and Nagato is the third. Just to verify, to clear up some oddball scanlation issues, do they refer to it in any way that divides it up as "the second of the 6 paths (since Roku/Riku = 6)" and Nagato as "the third of the 6 paths", i.e. that there are 6 chosen people/paths and 3 have been labelled, or is it more of a "I am the second Rikudo Sage, and Nagato is the third Rikudo Sage, chronologically speaking"?

    The mangastream translation made me sad to think that there are 6 special people or some such, cause god knows they'll end up being Naruto, Sasuke, and Kakashi somehow....
    Madara implicates himself as the second Rikudou. He says that the first Rikudou Sennin purposefully divided up the Senji and Uchiha - but by the time the second Rikudou arrived (Madara), the two were back together as one being again.

    Quote Originally Posted by Naruto-4-hokage View Post

    i particularly like this line since i thought that izanagi is the jutsu that rikodu used to realize hi imagination but did he actually used adaptation word or he said izanagi originally was rikodu jutsu as MS and SF translation seems to imply (sorry i'm a bit thick headed but i have to make sure)

    About the yin and yang elemntal >>> does he actually say that yin =spiritual energy and yang =physical energy without other components ar the yin =spiritual=+magination
    yang=physical +life???
    1. He says that the Izanagi is an adaptation of the powers of Rikudou (to create things out of nothingness)

    2. To clarify: "imagination" is based on spiritual energy, which uses Yin elemental powers. "Life" uses physical energy, which uses Yang elemental powers.

    yeah, I know. Confusing.
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    Thumbs Up Re: Lost in translation: Number 510

    I am glad to know that Izanagi is an adaptation of the powers of Rikudo.
    We know Madara's Izanagi is better than Danzo's. I was trying to assure myself about the limitation of Madara's powers. I want to believe Madara won't be able to do things that (in the future) Rikudo Sage could do.
    If he can, that will be too much for me to digest.

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    Re: Lost in translation: Number 510

    In light of a mistranslation (IMHO), allow me to clarify a critical point in this week's chapter:

    Mangastream: Two of the six paths are now one being!
    Original Japanese: 二人目の六道にして 今は唯一の存在。

    Let's break it down literally to avoid further misunderstanding.
    二人目の (the second person) 六道(Rikudou)にして  今は (now) 唯一 (The only) の存在 (existance/being)

    The first sentence:
    二人目の六道にして This is meaning that "something" takes form as the Second Rikudou Sennin - in this case we are likely talking about Madara.
    The second sentence:
    今は唯一の存在 Means that: they are now one being.

    Now, let's take it into context: Madara just talked elaborately about how the original Rikudou Sennin separated himself into two parts: an "Uchiha" part and a "Senju" part. However he says that he is an "Uchiha Madara which gained the power of Senju Hashirama" thus making him in control of both Uchiha and Senju parts. Madara is saying that he is the second Rikudou, and he is the only one who has combined what the original Rikudou Sennin had separated.

    This interpretation is further supported when the author decided to make Madara refer to Nagato as the third Rikudou.

    Now does this mean there is a fourth, fifth and a sixth Rikudou? I would not think so. If "Rikudou Sennin" and "Rikudou" are two separate entities (Madara refers to himself as the second Rikudou, and Nagato as the third Rikudou - and not Rikudou Sennin), this may hold true. However, it would be VERY poor writing on the part of the authors.

    Sorry - my two cents ended up to be a couple dollars...
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    Re: Lost in translation: Number 510

    Boyakist, 六道 means ridoku which would mean six roads/paths ... so we have been getting bad translations when they say Ridoku the sage of the six paths, because 六道 actually means six paths?...

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    Re: Lost in translation: Number 510

    I'd like to thank you for your continous work for proper translations It's very good to see corrections to work scanlation crew(s) do.

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    Translator 上級員 / Jyoukuuin / Sr. Member boyakist4649's Avatar
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    Re: Lost in translation: Number 510

    Quote Originally Posted by Alterno View Post
    Boyakist, 六道 means ridoku which would mean six roads/paths ... so we have been getting bad translations when they say Ridoku the sage of the six paths, because 六道 actually means six paths?...
    Who knows... even Kishimoto and his authors probably do not know the full extent, and the true meanings behind what "Rikudou" really means.

    Just from what I know - based on Buddhist beliefs - Rikudou are the 6 different worlds that one can be reborn into if they are "lost."
    天道(ten-dou), 人間道(ningen-dou), 修羅道 (shura-dou), 畜生道 (chikushou-dou), 餓鬼道 (gaki-dou) and 地獄道 (jigoku-dou) are the 6 different paths. As you have already noticed, Kishimoto has used these as the six different bodies of Pein.

    Can this mean six different paths? It always can - meaning that since the storyline is not based on any precedence or tradition, Kishimoto and his authors can always fill in the details to conjure up a story. However this is why I stick to proper nouns in their original language. Otherwise, something like this could happen:

    Kakashi could have been called Scarecrow. Could you imagine what would have happened on these boards when we saw Kakashi get influenced by Itachi's Tsukuyomi, and found Kakashi strapped to a wooden cross - and what possible hidden meanings could be behind that?

    it would have been its own thread...
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    Re: Lost in translation: Number 510

    Thanks alot as always Boyakist, just one slight detail I'ld like to add to the six pathes:
    Rinnegan was translated with "Reincarnation eye" or "Samsara eye", name for the circle of life and reincarnation in several eastern religions including buddhism. As this is absolutely conclusive with the six paths or worlds of reincarnation you mentioned I thought it might be worth beeing mentioned here.

    Names of persons never are translated so I don't think that there ever was a chance of Kakashi ending as "Scarecrow" in english translations
    Still there have been several allusions on the meaning of his names in anime and manga. For example in the filler episode about Team 7 wanting to see Kakashi's face, Sakura observes him for a long time and then discovers that he was long gone and she only watched the back of a scarecrow wearing Kakashi's clothes. I wonder if there is a relation to the "Idiot"-crow? As far as I know, Kishimoto seems to identify a little with Kakashi. There was an interview where he answered questions as Kakashi, and a page states that Kakashi has the same house plant as Kishimoto used to have (carrying the name "Ukky"). And there is an obvious, although possibly random, relation between a scarecrow and a crow as scarecrows are used to keep crows away.
    Might be some kind of game by him. Maybe that he hopes not to look like an idiot (as the Ahō-crow appears in such situations and a scarecrow should keep it away) too often, that he never looks like an idiot or that he always feels like an idiot

    Sorry for abusing your thread to let my mind roam on irrelevant topics, happens to me too easily in the morning (10:30 am here)
    (Is there a proper english idiom to express that? The german one is "den Geist (or "die Gedanken") schweifen lassen". Word by word that would be "To let the mind(or thoughts) roam" but it doesn't sound quite right. I mean it "feels" like an idiom to me in german which would mean that a translation word by word would most likely create a wrong result.)
    Last edited by Roflkopt3r; September 20, 2010 at 03:45 AM.

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    Re: Lost in translation: Number 510

    Quote Originally Posted by boyakist-sama
    Madara just talked elaborately about how the original Rikudou Sennin separated himself into two parts: an "Uchiha" part and a "Senju" part.
    Its really like that? It isn't the other way around: that Rikudou Sennin came from Uchiha and Senju? <he was the ancestor of both clans?> He didn't separate anything me thinks.
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