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Thread: Guts and other strong/ bad ass characters

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    Registered User 英雄メンバー / Eiyuu Menbaa / Hero Member 102jayday's Avatar
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    Guts and other strong/ bad ass characters

    Okay alot of people been talking about how other characters are stronger than guts. Like sure DBZ are too powerful for anyone but the poll about that dude whos in baki the grappler is stronger than guts, i say no, guts may not be a martial artist but his a hardcore fighter who knows how to fight and thats being dirty and hang in there till you kill.

    Gut's is really strong, he took down 100 men by himself and he can fight the aspotles like we all saw the others get own by aspostles and guts is there ripping out one of their horns and using it as a weapon. Guts has that thing when you knock him down he keeps getting up and asks for more.

    Manga Berserk, Gantz, Rurouni Kenshin, Claymore<3 Fav Anime FMAB! Gundam seed, Nana, InitialD.

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    MH Senpai 英雄メンバー / Eiyuu Menbaa / Hero Member Roflkopt3r's Avatar
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    Re: Guts and other strong/ bad ass characters

    Hm... hmm.... well...

    So, first of all Guts is somewhere "near" a plausible, realistic amount of power so totally supernatural guys like Dragon Ball or people from other universers with weird rules (Bleach with it's spirit level, Naruto's chakra/ninjutsu system etc.) don't really count. Guts certainly exceeds normal human level, but not by an really extreme amount.

    The next problem would be the kind of competition how to measure it.
    In combat? Guts is a sword fighter and his expertise with swords and to be able to fight in heavy armor are what he gained because it suits his world of medieval warfare. So he wouldn't be really comparable to characters of modern scenarios who might be specialised on modern firearms -technological advantage would obviously solve for most of those- nor really with most characters who fight without any weapons, as even with martial arts skills it wouldn't be a good idea to face a guy who is able to swing such a big sword at such speed.
    Prohibiting any weapons at all would distort the competition as well, as Guts obviously focused on sword fighting since he isn't a sportsman but a warrior.

    As I didn't read many manga suiting this, the only real comparison I could make would be with the Samurai of Shigurui as they also live in world on an equal tech level and without much of supernatural elements.
    He'ld fair very well against them I'ld say... not due to skill though, but due to equipment. A massive plate harness and a huge two handed sword against unarmored fighters with their quite "weak" Katanas which have less range and couldn't block a massive two handed sword well either would easily mean victory I guess, especially since he also uses a cannon, a crossbow and small bombs.

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    Registered User 英雄メンバー / Eiyuu Menbaa / Hero Member ameya730's Avatar
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    Re: Guts and other strong/ bad ass characters

    i could think of only two people who could be considered as badass as guts

    thor from vinland saga
    kenshin from rurouni kenshin
    ogami itto of lone wolf and cub (dont know whether to include the son cause the son and father live meifumado)

    but inspite of my best efforts i could not objectively say who amongs these four would win against each other. obviously i considered guts without his berserk armor.

    i did not consider any shonen character cause like rolfkop3r said shonen belong to an entirely different category.
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]

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    Registered User 中級員 / Chuukyuuin / Member Crisis.'s Avatar
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    Re: Guts and other strong/ bad ass characters

    guts is the strongest human in berserk but idk about that outside of beserk.

    my list of who i would like to see vs guts

    musashi: musashi from vagabond would probably beat guts in a fight and his as normal as it gets in a manga.( his far better then guts when it comes to swordsmanship and would take advantage of guts right eye ,going for his blind spot. all he has to worry is about dodging guts huge sword , and if he can dodge a katana thats alot faster then what guts could ever swing his sword , i think he would be okay. ) also when he gets to fight sajiro , we will get to see how he does againts someone with a long sword.

    manji from sword of the immortal would be make a good fight

    akira inugami from wolf guy ( i want to see if guts sword would break on him, and nothing more since well it would be an unfair fight.)

    and kenshin from samurai x

    =3 those guys are normal enough from guts to fight

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    Registered User 有名人 / Yuumeijin / Celebrity llamapie's Avatar
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    Re: Guts and other strong/ bad ass characters

    Quote Originally Posted by Crisis. View Post
    guts is the strongest human in berserk but idk about that outside of beserk.

    my list of who i would like to see vs guts

    musashi: musashi from vagabond would probably beat guts in a fight and his as normal as it gets in a manga.( his far better then guts when it comes to swordsmanship and would take advantage of guts right eye ,going for his blind spot. all he has to worry is about dodging guts huge sword , and if he can dodge a katana thats alot faster then what guts could ever swing his sword , i think he would be okay. ) also when he gets to fight sajiro , we will get to see how he does againts someone with a long sword.

    manji from sword of the immortal would be make a good fight

    akira inugami from wolf guy ( i want to see if guts sword would break on him, and nothing more since well it would be an unfair fight.)

    and kenshin from samurai x

    =3 those guys are normal enough from guts to fight
    Guts actually swings his sword faster than anyone with a katana and their puny muscles could. The fight would be interesting but there is no way Guts would be beaten by someone who has no choice but to dodge. Think about it. You can't block the dragon slayer, all you can do is dodge and you will hardly have room to counter because Guts' reach is massive. He is a MASTER swordsmen, don't deny him that. He is far from a simple brute.
    Give the best manga of all time some attention!

    # of "Miura will die before Berserk is finished" comments(since Nov. 1st 2008): 100

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    Registered User 中級員 / Chuukyuuin / Member Crisis.'s Avatar
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    Re: Guts and other strong/ bad ass characters

    i doubt guts would swing his dragon slayer faster then musashis katana ( not to mention he can cut someone in half with one handle swing so he does have a lot of muscle ,and guts dragon slayer is to heavy( its to heavy for a normal person but with guts muscle it should be as fast as a normal soldiers speed ) for him to counter musashis sword swing when his in range ) and both manji and musashi are both heavily built )

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    MH Senpai 英雄メンバー / Eiyuu Menbaa / Hero Member Roflkopt3r's Avatar
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    Re: Guts and other strong/ bad ass characters

    I didn't read Vagabond yet, but a Katana has serious trouble against a full plate armor as Gutts is wearing. Putting the supernatural Berserk effect aside, he still has the muscle power of wearing a heavy plate harness. One handed weapons of the size of a Katana (approx. 1kg if I'm not mistaken) don't have a real chance of penetrating it, put aside to actually make a cut. Medieval European weapon developement was alot about how to injure a fully armored knight as far as I know, as it takes serious and often heavy weapons - war hammers (also with a piercing tip), special armor piercing swords (Estocs) and diverse piercing weapons.

    Berserk certainly does not treat the effect of armors and weapons realistically either, but a Katana looks pretty weak compared to a plate armor as it's not designed for piercing attacks at all nor has the weight or stability to damage it.
    Last edited by Roflkopt3r; November 17, 2010 at 12:50 PM.

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    Registered User 英雄メンバー / Eiyuu Menbaa / Hero Member 102jayday's Avatar
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    Re: Guts and other strong/ bad ass characters

    Guts is interesting, sure his a human and all, but he is incredibly strong. The guy kills demons every night. The queen fairy fight proves how gut's can handle a fast aerial opponent, he had few seconds to attack or dodge. The epic fight that proves how good gut's is when him and serpico first fought on the ledge of the cliff. For gut's to have everything against him and still be able to do good (it makes serpico really smart trapping him like that) That little fight was epic, i love how serpico dodges gut's attack by dropping down then grabbing a spike bomb and throws it and climbs back up to flee.

    Kenshin is awesome but would be no match for guts but it would be sort of like a guts vs serpico kind of match, i don't think many could be able to fight guts when he is serious. except dbz lol.

    The supernatural characters, i reckon gut's could own naruto (it's nothing he hasn't dealt with before. Prob beat ichigo, ichigo is fast but guts is a swordmaster, he would read him like a book.

    Manga Berserk, Gantz, Rurouni Kenshin, Claymore<3 Fav Anime FMAB! Gundam seed, Nana, InitialD.

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    Registered User 中級員 / Chuukyuuin / Member roxas_strife2's Avatar
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    Re: Guts and other strong/ bad ass characters

    Quote Originally Posted by Crisis. View Post
    i doubt guts would swing his dragon slayer faster then musashis katana ( not to mention he can cut someone in half with one handle swing so he does have a lot of muscle ,and guts dragon slayer is to heavy( its to heavy for a normal person but with guts muscle it should be as fast as a normal soldiers speed ) for him to counter musashis sword swing when his in range ) and both manji and musashi are both heavily built )
    Let's look at the fight he had with Zodd when he stood between him and Griffith. His movements far outclassed any humans, and his sword wits were sharper than even Zodd, who has wielded a sword for 300 years or more. Then look at the times he's cut through multiple soldiers just swinging with a single hand, and the times he's stopped the Dragon Slayer's momentum in an instant. I highly doubt that any swordsman could match even just late Golden Age Guts. All these swordsmen are strong, but Guts is just in a class all his own.

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    Registered User 中級員 / Chuukyuuin / Member Crisis.'s Avatar
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    Re: Guts and other strong/ bad ass characters

    read sword of the immortal and veganbond then we can get into it further.

    don't get me wrong guts epic but he doesn't do well against fast opponents, especially one thats fast and has the ability to cut a human in half with one handle swing.

    http://i55.tinypic.com/2drgwgj.jpg

    heres a picture that can help you Imagen it. the dragon slayer would be close to impossible(even tho we seen him done it before) to stop midway giving musashi the chance to step into his range and cut guts head off clean ( like how his about to do in the picture with his wabiki or however you spell that ) and im comparing guts with out the berserk armor ability

    P.S im not saying they will win against guts but they do have a high chance. i would love to see giichi or makie fight with guts
    Last edited by Crisis.; November 20, 2010 at 04:28 AM.

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    MH Senpai 英雄メンバー / Eiyuu Menbaa / Hero Member Roflkopt3r's Avatar
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    Re: Guts and other strong/ bad ass characters

    Quote Originally Posted by Crisis. View Post
    read sword of the immortal and veganbond then we can get into it further.

    don't get me wrong guts epic but he doesn't do well against fast opponents, especially one thats fast and has the ability to cut a human in half with one handle swing.

    http://i55.tinypic.com/2drgwgj.jpg

    heres a picture that can help you Imagen it. the dragon slayer would be close to impossible(even tho we seen him done it before) to stop midway giving musashi the chance to step into his range and cut guts head off clean ( like how his about to do in the picture with his wabiki or however you spell that ) and im comparing guts with out the berserk armor ability
    First of all it's incredible hard to value "speed" in a drawn anime which contains of single images. However, there were allusions that Gutt's speed is absolutely beyond human capabilities at some scenes:
    http://manga.animea.net/berserk-chapter-2-page-52.html

    Looks fast, doesn't it? He also managed to get himself into position behind that guy afterwards and to kill him.

    Against any kind of Samurai or other japanese sword fighters: No matter how skillful the fighter, with a "natural" Katana he would not be able to hit Gutts anywhere beside at his head or his unarmored arm, and Gutts will very well know so.
    It's also not like Gutts would be a random spear carrier #19515 who lets his life in battle because he didn't use the range advantage of his weapon to his advantage. Gutts, with his skill and knowledge, would definitly know that he has a range advantage and use it to it's best. Apart from that he also has a crossbow and a cannon, just in case there might be a possibility to use them at one point, and an iron hand with which he crushed quite some skulls already when it seemed like he couldn't defend himself anymore.
    He also managed to catch Serpico's quick sword with his bare hand and bend it so his hand was safe. Just as an example of how quick and skillful he is.

    Apart from this:
    -He's in a perfect age for fighting probably
    -Even so, he has incredible experience: After all he's the boy who hugged his sword at the age of six. His sword was pretty much the only constant in his life and some kind of friend to him. He's also fighting since very early childhood and never stopped doing so ever since - real fighting, not just some practice matches mostly.
    -And something which isn't very useful for a duell, but makes him even more complete as a warrior: He knows every kind of war and fighting: He can fight in any kind of armor, on horseback, knows about huge scale battles, besiegement, probably some about military tactics and acted as a leader for the raiders. Probably he can use many other weapons besides swords, such as polearms, bows and crossbows.
    Last edited by Roflkopt3r; November 20, 2010 at 04:33 AM.

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    Registered User 英雄メンバー / Eiyuu Menbaa / Hero Member 102jayday's Avatar
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    Re: Guts and other strong/ bad ass characters

    I reckon in that kind of quick draw fight gut's would not do the first attack with his sword. He would use the dragon slayer as a shield from the draw attack then shoot with his canon or arrows lol.

    Anyone wonder how dante from devil may cry would go? imo i think he would be creamed but he is so cool lol. Then again how would gut's handle a gun?? Like his armor would protect him but what about a headshot, well guts would use his sword to cover his head or something.

    It makes me think guts and dante seem alike with powers and stuff. I wonder if Guts is half human (i am bs on k) we saw his dead mother but never knew anything of guts father, he could of been on the tree or raped the woman or was a aspostle who raped that woman, but then again sheike or someone would be able to tell guts isn't normal....well they say his not normal.
    Last edited by 102jayday; November 21, 2010 at 09:09 AM.

    Manga Berserk, Gantz, Rurouni Kenshin, Claymore<3 Fav Anime FMAB! Gundam seed, Nana, InitialD.

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    Hound of Shadow 伝説メンバー / Densetsu / Legendary Member benelori's Avatar
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    Re: Guts and other strong/ bad ass characters

    I reckon Musashi could reach his level, heck maybe even Kojiro...but that's pretty much it, probably because I don't really know what manga to pick...somebody mentioned Thor from Vinland Saga...Well that could work as well, though I think Guts is pretty much more powerful then everybody mentioned before, and his swordplay doesn't really fall far under either...it's Guts for me...

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    Registered User 中級員 / Chuukyuuin / Member Forever Rain's Avatar
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    Re: Guts and other strong/ bad ass characters

    Quote Originally Posted by 102jayday View Post
    Guts is interesting, sure his a human and all, but he is incredibly strong. The guy kills demons every night. The queen fairy fight proves how gut's can handle a fast aerial opponent, he had few seconds to attack or dodge. The epic fight that proves how good gut's is when him and serpico first fought on the ledge of the cliff. For gut's to have everything against him and still be able to do good (it makes serpico really smart trapping him like that) That little fight was epic, i love how serpico dodges gut's attack by dropping down then grabbing a spike bomb and throws it and climbs back up to flee.

    Kenshin is awesome but would be no match for guts but it would be sort of like a guts vs serpico kind of match, i don't think many could be able to fight guts when he is serious. except dbz lol.

    The supernatural characters, i reckon gut's could own naruto (it's nothing he hasn't dealt with before. Prob beat ichigo, ichigo is fast but guts is a swordmaster, he would read him like a book.
    If you are talking about Kenshin from the OVA, then I would say that would be an interesting fight but from the original manga/anime, Kenshin would destroy Gutts. Remember the original Rurouni Kenshin characters wasn't restricted by human physics. Kenshin could move so fast that the human eye couldn't keep up, Kenshin could move so fast he could hit you in five spots at the same exact moment, Kenshin could swing so fast and hard he could create a vacuum in space. The only reason I'm considering that Gutts could beat him is because I'm not sure if the reverse blade could do enough damage to weaken Gutts insane stamina, but if we factor in the amount of impact the blows should do, then yeah his hits should take him out.

    If we're talking about Gutts in the Berserk Armor then that's another thing. He's not restricted by pain and wounds and his bones and body parts and spin back into place.. Berserk Armor Gutts would eventually take down Kenshin.

    I see it like this:
    Golden Age Gutts << Kenshin
    Gutts < Kenshin
    Berserk Armor Gutts > Kenshin

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    MH Senpai 英雄メンバー / Eiyuu Menbaa / Hero Member Roflkopt3r's Avatar
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    Re: Guts and other strong/ bad ass characters

    Quote Originally Posted by benelori View Post
    I reckon Musashi could reach his level, heck maybe even Kojiro...but that's pretty much it, probably because I don't really know what manga to pick...somebody mentioned Thor from Vinland Saga...Well that could work as well, though I think Guts is pretty much more powerful then everybody mentioned before, and his swordplay doesn't really fall far under either...it's Guts for me...
    Just read Vinland Saga and there's certainly nobody besides Thors who could fight nearly on par with Gatsu, not even Thorkell (though his power is ridiculous )

    As Thors only has been shown eliminating some standard guys and outsmarting (plus outpowering) Askeladd, it's really really hard to estimate his powers besides "strongest guy in Vinland Saga". Could he probably pull of something amazing like avoiding Gatsu's sword and moving into a range too close for his sword to be used well? Can't be answered imo, although I tend to say that Gatsu is stronger.
    (However, the way Thors died made him a hell of a badass character and deserves him a nice place in badass character rankings imo, though nobody could replace Gatsu on place #1 )

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