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Thread: Furigana in another language and other issues

  1. #1
    Registered User 初心者/ Shoshinsha / Beginner Elanor Pam's Avatar
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    Furigana in another language and other issues

    The manga I'm translating (Shchelkunchik) has a couple of russian and german words here and there, but these lines have furigana in a language I simply can't identify. I know german and it's not it; my friend studies russian and it doesn't seem to be that either. I've googled the katakana, but all it brings up are transcriptions and reviews of this particular chapter. I'm completely stumped. I've put the original kanji, and the corresponding furigana in parenthesis:

    Quote Quote:
    (After a quick speech about how Beethoven didn't let deafness get in the way of being awesome)
    交響曲(シンフォニー)
    - Symphony
    第5番(ママーファンク)。。。
    - Number Five (Mamaa Fank?)
    《運命》(シェルクザールス)だ!!
    - Fate!! (Schelkuzals?)
    Next are just run-of-the-mill lines I'm not confident about:

    Quote Quote:
    ああやってグレートにいったのは
    - The words I've been telling Great...
    ボクのほうじゃないかっ!!
    - Don't they also apply to me!?
    Quote Quote:
    (Two sisters talk about whether to support a friend with dangerous enemies)
    あの子危険かも。。。いいの?
    - He might bring us trouble... are you okay with that?

    (the other nods, the first goes on)

    まあ、私らも同じようなもんだけどね。。。
    - Well, we're on a similar situation..
    Quote Quote:
    ショパンが学生時代に声楽料の同級生コンスタンシア・グワトコフスカという少女に恋をし『ボクは不幸な事に自分の理想の人に会ってしまった。。。心から忠実に仕える。。。』と。。。
    - In his student days, Chopin fell in love with his classmate Constancia Gladkowska, and decided "in my greatest unhappiness I met with the person of my dreams... I devote myself to you..."
    Quote Quote:
    そうじゃ元祖操り人形(マリオネット)バージョンじゃ。。。
    - Yes, it's the original Marionette Version...
    Quote Quote:
    おーおーあいかわらずよう働く女房じゃいわい!
    - Oh, oh, a hardworking wife as always!
    Quote Quote:
    (talking about the old days of an evil demon king)
    人間は蹂躙され沈黙するしかなかった。。。
    - Humanity could but be overrun into silence...
    Quote Quote:
    (more info in a post further down)
    その絶望力。。。支配力。。。ああっ 憎くてたまらない!!
    - The power of that despair... that control... aah, I can't resist that hatred!!
    Last edited by Elanor Pam; December 19, 2010 at 07:32 AM. Reason: added context which should have been there from the start >_>;

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    Registered User 初心者/ Shoshinsha / Beginner
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    Re: Furigana in another language and other issues

    Well, Beethoven's Symphony no.5 is known as "Fate", and looking it up brings the German "Schicksalssymphonie", which fits the katakana IMO. I don't have enough familiarity with German to comment on the middle line, though I will say that katakana transliterations are often quite odd.

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    Registered User 初心者/ Shoshinsha / Beginner Elanor Pam's Avatar
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    Re: Furigana in another language and other issues

    I'll have to confess I hadn't looked much further into the german possibility - since the second line didn't correspond to what I knew of german numbers, I immediately discarded the possibility out of hand. #5 in german would be "Nummer Funf", no Fank or anything like that... either that or "funfte". My best guess is that the author transliterated it as if it were read by a german-illiterate american...

    Still, thanks a lot - I've studied german for a couple years, but didn't know diddly about the name of symphonies. I'm confident now that's the name I was looking for.

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    Translator/Moderator 英雄メンバー / Eiyuu Menbaa / Hero Member
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    Re: Furigana in another language and other issues

    It's Beethoven's symphony No. 5, and the words in () seem to be in German.

    第5番/No. 5: Nummer fünf <Why マーファン? I don't know.>
    運命交響曲: Schicksals-symphonie or Schicksalssymphonie (in German)


    ボクのほうじゃないかっ!! It was me who [ああやってグレートにいったのは].

    (XXXが)憎くてたまらない: I can't help but hate XXX. / I absolutely hate XXX. <XXX is the person who has the power.>
    Last edited by mikkih; December 18, 2010 at 10:11 PM.

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    Registered User 初心者/ Shoshinsha / Beginner Elanor Pam's Avatar
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    Re: Furigana in another language and other issues

    The problem with the German word is that, in a later chapter, a character mentions that the symphony's name sounds like another character's name - the main character, シェルクンチク = Shchel Kunchik (Russian for Nutcracker). Schicksals is missing a couple of sounds present in the furigana for fate, the シェル in fact, so I'm starting to think it's a language close to but not quite German. And yes, it is Beethoven's... I was an idiot and didn't add that. I'll edit the main post to make it clear.

    Hmm, I guess the last line does need some context... the bad guy is power tripping, talking about the power of an eldrich abomination of sorts which he wants to harness. Since he only spoke of it in glowing terms (almost like it was a lover), I thought my initial translation (which was like yours) had to be just plain wrong, so I didn't add anything else. Here's his whole speech:

    Quote Quote:
    (some other character):死や破壊しか生まない
    恐怖の遺産、魔王の血を。。。
    何に。。。使う気じゃ?
    - The legacy of dread, the Demon King's blood...
    - Brings about nothing but death and destruction...
    - What use could you possibly have for it?

    (bad guy):恐れてなどいない!- I feel no dread for it!
    尊敬しているのだ!!- No, I revere it!!
    感動している! 狂おしい程。。。- I'm in love with it! Maddeningly so!...
    その絶望力。。。支配力。。。ああっ 憎くてたまらない!! - The power of that despair... that control... aah, I can't resist that hatred!! (?)
    アレさえあれば蜜月の時代! - If only I had it, such a honeymoon it would be!
    私達の。。。 - Our...
    栄光の日々が。。。甦る!! - Glory days... would return!!

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    Re: Furigana in another language and other issues

    Quote Originally Posted by Elanor Pam View Post
    The problem with the German word is that, in a later chapter, a character mentions that the symphony's name sounds like another character's name - the main character, シェルクンチク = Shchel Kunchik (Russian for Nutcracker). Schicksals is missing a couple of sounds present in the furigana for fate, the シェル in fact, so I'm starting to think it's a language close to but not quite German. And yes, it is Beethoven's... I was an idiot and didn't add that. I'll edit the main post to make it clear.
    To me, it is rather odd if Firigana for No. 5 is in Russian.

    The ballet music for the Nutcracker was composed by Tchaikovsky who is a Russian composer. The Symphony No. 5 was composed by Beethoven, a German composer. If you find any music titles by Chopin with Furigana/Yomigana, check Polish first. Mozart:German. Bach:German.

    Quote Originally Posted by Elanor Pam View Post
    Hmm, I guess the last line does need some context... the bad guy is power tripping, talking about the power of an eldrich abomination of sorts which he wants to harness. Since he only spoke of it in glowing terms (almost like it was a lover), I thought my initial translation (which was like yours) had to be just plain wrong, so I didn't add anything else. Here's his whole speech:
    > 『ボクは不幸な事に自分の理想の人に会ってしまった。。。心から忠実に仕える。。。』と。。。 Most people would not say 幸せ or 幸福 (happiness) instead of 不幸 (sadness, sorrow). This mangaka probably likes these twisted wordings.

    I think it is your choice to translate the sentence literally or spice it up a little. Here, "hate" means "adore" or "envy." They are just having a love and hate relationship, or the Mangaka just like the obscure writing style. One way of doing it is just to translate the phrase normally but use italics: hate. The readers probably understand what it means. Your translation in the original post works fine as well.

    ........こじつけ............Nothing to do with real manga .................
    ママーファンク: Mummer Funk. TXC (a new wave Swedish band ) has an album titled Mummer. Their music has a flavor of funk.

    シェルザールス: シェル and ザウルス are characters in Final Fantasy games. Their encounter can be a fate.
    Last edited by mikkih; December 19, 2010 at 04:38 PM. Reason: just added a useless こじつけ section

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  10. #7
    Registered User 初心者/ Shoshinsha / Beginner Elanor Pam's Avatar
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    Re: Furigana in another language and other issues

    We did actually look into the Russian name for the 5th, guessing that maybe the manga was using Russian as a fantasy lingua franca of sorts (the main character has a Russian name, the bad guys branded him with a cyrillic character, etc... note that it's a fantasy world and no one treats these words as foreign), but all Russian names for Beethoven's 5th failed to match the furigana in any way, so no, definitely not Russian.

    What stumps me is that the supposedly German song name is supposed to sound like the confirmed Russian character name (and this is pointed out in-story), when in RL Schicksals doesn't sound nearly as close to Shchel Kunchik as the furigana made them out to. I'm leery of chalking it up to an authorial error, because this mangaka really knows his music history, so I want to know the options before counting my losses and sticking to the German name. The weird ママーファンク line might be the key here, and I'd like to confirm whether it's gibberish or an actual language.

    As for the second, I think envy is a great match in-context, actually. Thanks, I hadn't thought of it.

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