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View Poll Results: Best Plot-twist

Voters
149. You may not vote on this poll
  • Bleach's

    30 20.13%
  • One Piece's

    47 31.54%
  • Berserk's

    26 17.45%
  • Vinland Saga's

    18 12.08%
  • Naruto's

    28 18.79%
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Thread: Best plot-twist

  1. #16
    Registered User 有名人 / Yuumeijin / Celebrity ashher's Avatar
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    Re: Best plot-twist

    Ahh...you've gotta love wiki...one can fit in almost anything in that 'definition' starting from berserk to bleach. The thing is...lit is always more about feeling rather than grammer, or so i believe. 'twist' is something that twists what a readers feeling/perception about the work. Clues should be hidden and the 'apparent' foreshadowing should be misleading in case of twist...till its time of revelation where the reader suddenly sees the hidden clues which, if noticed earlier, would've acted as foreshadowing for the real event. another type of 'foreshadowing' associated with plot twist would be keep pointing at a certain point when something of great importance will happen, but when that point comes something happens which was unexpected by the reader. That is not foreshadowing of the actual outcome of the twist, rather its a foreshadowing of 'something of importance to happen at that point' and that something turning out to be a twist. I believe that was what meant by the wiki definition. it was not exactly defining the effect of twist when it was talking about 'foreshadow or shock'...i think it was more commenting on the way the effect is delivered. In case of 'foreshadowed twist' you expect something to happen and yet get surprised, while in case of 'shock twist' you expect nothing at that point but get a totally unexpected surprise.


    So i would rather term 'Berserk twist' a 'defining development' whereas the 'Bleach twist' would be more appropriate to term as a 'shocking development'. A twist should be suprise+retrograde effect+change in 'anticipated' course of plot. 'Eclipse' gets none of them ticked, it has great importance on plot development, but it neither surprises,nor changes the readers' perception of previous proceedings of the manga, nor it takes the plot to direction that was unforeseen. 'Aizen' at least gets the 'surprise' and 'unexpected change' correct...but retrogade build up is what is missing. Also the 'unexpected change'...though unexpected, is rather shallow.
    Last edited by ashher; January 11, 2011 at 12:37 PM. Reason: Automerged Doublepost

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  3. #17
    Rewriter 伝説メンバー / Densetsu / Legendary Member naruto-niichan's Avatar
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    Re: Best plot-twist

    Quote Originally Posted by Ustegius View Post
    Bleach one was a shock, but nothing more.

    Vinland saga's is the best. It was shocking, surprising, well executed and really had a great impact on the story and the characters. It's really in it's own league.
    I would say it's a close call. Bleach was a shock, I didn't find a more unexpected plot-twist than this one. It may be true that Kubo pulled it out of nowhere (as he's always doing) but still he did a great job with that. I never thought that it looked unnatural or forced, Kubo could have made a great story from this point.

    At last, my vote goes to Vinland because it has the same great impact on the story and was completely unexpected. It's above Bleach because I really love Askeladd's character, because it's a far better executed story than Bleach and maybe because it's more fresh in my head.

  4. #18
    Artists of MH 英雄メンバー / Eiyuu Menbaa / Hero Member shinsengumi's Avatar
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    Re: Best plot-twist

    by the way ; the real plot-twist in naruto should be this one in addition to whats written in the opening post imo ;

    Spoiler show

  5. #19
    Registered User 英雄メンバー / Eiyuu Menbaa / Hero Member predsfan's Avatar
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    Re: Best plot-twist

    I have to vote for Bleach's in this category ( or at least I think that's the one hit ). I pretty much based this on two things, I am familiar with the series and it was pretty unpredictable:
    Spoiler show


    One Piece's didn't really effect the plot (especially considering the main character already knew).
    Spoiler show


    I haven't read Berserk in such a long time I'm not even sure what's being referenced there so I couldn't vote for it.

    I haven't read enough of Vinland Saga to understand the significance of that plot twist so I also couldn't vote for it.

    I really couldn't vote for Naruto's. Honestly, I found it very cliche.
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  6. #20
    MH's Most Friendly Member 有名人 / Yuumeijin / Celebrity destiny4ever's Avatar
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    Re: Best plot-twist

    My vote was between Bleach’s and Berserk’s, but in the end I decided to vote for Bleach’s. Why? Because I wasn’t expecting
    Spoiler show
    It was a super cool plot twist and one of the reasons why the SS arc is the best, at least IMHO.
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  8. #21
    Registered User 英雄メンバー / Eiyuu Menbaa / Hero Member AlB's Avatar
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    Re: Best plot-twist

    Vinland Saga
    Spoiler show


    Naruto's and Berserker's twist were certainly "twists", that is no doubt. but, in my opinion, bleach topples them all. I mean, seriously
    Spoiler show
    Last edited by AlB; January 20, 2011 at 01:33 PM.

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  10. #22
    MH Senpai 英雄メンバー / Eiyuu Menbaa / Hero Member Roflkopt3r's Avatar
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    Re: Best plot-twist

    Quote Originally Posted by AlB View Post
    Spoiler: Vinland Saga show

    It would be useful if you would give a hint/tag what you're writing in a spoiler, how should we've known that it was Vinland Saga?

    Yes, that one is a WTF moment as well, but it undeniably was a giant plot twist too. Just see how much the story and characters have turned due to this!

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  12. #23
    Registered User 英雄メンバー / Eiyuu Menbaa / Hero Member AlB's Avatar
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    Re: Best plot-twist

    Quote Originally Posted by Roflkopt3r View Post
    It would be useful if you would give a hint/tag what you're writing in a spoiler, how should we've known that it was Vinland Saga?
    erm, point taken

    Quote Originally Posted by Roflkopt3r View Post
    Yes, that one is a WTF moment as well, but it undeniably was a giant plot twist too. Just see how much the story and characters have turned due to this!
    if we judge by long-term consequences VS and Bleach plot twists are pretty much on par, but as I already said, the actual event in Vinland Saga was somewhat expected.

  13. #24
    MH Senpai 英雄メンバー / Eiyuu Menbaa / Hero Member Roflkopt3r's Avatar
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    Re: Best plot-twist

    Quote Originally Posted by AlB View Post
    if we judge by long-term consequences VS and Bleach plot twists are pretty much on par, but as I already said, the actual event in Vinland Saga was somewhat expected.
    Wow I think 95% of readers rather said "That was so unexpected that I had to read it twice when it started as I thought I didn't see right". I thought this was very much unexpectable and not forecast at all.

  14. #25
    Registered User 英雄メンバー / Eiyuu Menbaa / Hero Member AlB's Avatar
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    Re: Best plot-twist

    Quote Originally Posted by Roflkopt3r View Post
    Wow I think 95% of readers rather said "That was so unexpected that I had to read it twice when it started as I thought I didn't see right". I thought this was very much unexpectable and not forecast at all.
    and, in contrast, 100% of Bleach readers fell off their seats when the identity of main Villain was revealed to them, when he revealed truth behind half of the events of 2 whole arcs and did what he did

    and I honestly knew who would do that in VS. did you really expect one of the other 3 to do that?
    Last edited by AlB; January 20, 2011 at 01:46 PM.

  15. #26
    MH Senpai 英雄メンバー / Eiyuu Menbaa / Hero Member Roflkopt3r's Avatar
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    Re: Best plot-twist

    Quote Originally Posted by AlB View Post
    and, in contrast, 100% of Bleach readers fell off their seats when the identity of main Villain was revealed to them, when he revealed truth behind half of the events of 2 whole arcs and did what he did

    and I honestly knew who would do that in VS. did you really expect one of the other 3 to do that?
    No I would not, for the simple reason that it was absolutely depending on the scenario as well as beeing a totally spontaneous decision by Kubo as well. Other mangaka seem to have a plan what they're doing

    It really didn't surprise me when I here finally got confirmed that this twist was not planned at all but only made afterwards in order to prolong the plot. It felt so very, very made up to me already...
    Spoiler show

    Such twists have to be executed better to be believable imo, it only annoyed me in this case.

    Also, undisputably the quality of Bleach went down drastically afterwards. The twist wasn't used well in the end, it was the upbeat to some of the worst parts of Bleach, which even many Bleach fans accept.

  16. #27
    Registered User 英雄メンバー / Eiyuu Menbaa / Hero Member AlB's Avatar
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    Re: Best plot-twist

    Quote Originally Posted by Roflkopt3r View Post
    No I would not, for the simple reason that it was absolutely depending on the scenario as well as beeing a totally spontaneous decision by Kubo as well. Other mangaka seem to have a plan what they're doing

    It really didn't surprise me when I here finally got confirmed that this twist was not planned at all but only made afterwards in order to prolong the plot. It felt so very, very made up to me already...
    Spoiler show

    Such twists have to be executed better to be believable imo, it only annoyed me in this case.

    Also, undisputably the quality of Bleach went down drastically afterwards. The twist wasn't used well in the end, it was the upbeat to some of the worst parts of Bleach, which even many Bleach fans accept.
    I agree, the quality of Bleach went down. but for me, this very twist was what made me stick to the manga in contrast, I would say that what happened in VS was waaay too premature but that's just my personal, subjective thinking, just as you claiming that the plot-twist in Bleach was cheap is your personal opinion. forced? perhaps. cheap? no waay

  17. #28
    MH Senpai 英雄メンバー / Eiyuu Menbaa / Hero Member Roflkopt3r's Avatar
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    Re: Best plot-twist

    Quote Originally Posted by AlB View Post
    I agree, the quality of Bleach went down. but for me, this very twist was what made me stick to the manga in contrast, I would say that what happened in VS was waaay too premature but that's just my personal, subjective thinking, just as you claiming that the plot-twist in Bleach was cheap is your personal opinion. forced? perhaps. cheap? no waay
    Premature in what way? I think it was an unsuspectedly elegant twist actually. Nodoy saw it coming, yet it was absolutely plausible and reasonable, even under the smoke screen of a sudden breakout of madness.
    I don't think that such a twist came too early either. At an unexpected time, perhaps, but not a bad timing at all imo.

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  19. #29
    Registered User 英雄メンバー / Eiyuu Menbaa / Hero Member AlB's Avatar
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    Re: Best plot-twist

    Quote Originally Posted by Roflkopt3r View Post
    Premature in what way?
    I think it was an unsuspectedly elegant twist actually. Nodoy saw it coming, yet it was absolutely plausible and reasonable, even under the smoke screen of a sudden breakout of madness.
    I don't think that such a twist came too early either. At an unexpected time, perhaps, but not a bad timing at all imo.
    premature story-wise. there was so much potential for
    Spoiler show
    honestly, I felt as if it was wasted. it sure was elegent, but Bleach's was blunt. it was as if the entire plot was put upside-down and yet connected many things together.

    you know Roflkopt3r, I think we'll never agree on this

  20. #30
    MH Senpai 英雄メンバー / Eiyuu Menbaa / Hero Member Roflkopt3r's Avatar
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    Re: Best plot-twist

    Ah allright, I see your point now. Obviously it's always sad to lose things which contributed so greatly to a story so far, but don't you think that it is also exiting? So many characters were ruined by appearing far longer than they should have, while such a big twist can prove worthy of such a sacrifice.

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