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Translations: Gintama 515 by kewl0210
This is madness ... No, this is MIRRRRRRRRRRRRIIIIIIIIIAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA.
I want claire back too .
I wonder how many chapters there will be before the manga is finished. I don't think we're that far from the end.
Amazing chapter! I just love the fact, that by giving the 1digit Claymores second thoughts about killing Maria gave them a personality. I hate when Mangaka introduce Characters as some Nonbrainers just so they can serve their purpose as a bridge for the storytelling. This chapter shows that through it my be hard to create every singe characters that can think on its own, it shows that it pays of.
Who would have thought that they spare Maria live and follow her in the revolt?
Last edited by terrorei; March 02, 2011 at 03:07 PM. Reason: Automerged Doublepost
Miria has always been my favorite Claymore and I'm so happy that she's alive!!!
She looked so cool in that chapter!!!
This comeback was Epic!!!
And now it's the revolution!!
This chapter has convinced me that it is impossible to universally confirm a death of a character of this series, when you haven't seen the head or brain cut from the body.
What I would like to know is if the claymore who first stabbed her (the one Miria thought as Hilda) was knowledgeable of keeping the "ephemeral, yet colossal, unknown warrior" alive.
I seem to love this manga when it explains a story through thoughts and mysterious frame gestures & quotes. I think this is what draws me in. This reminds me of how Raki or Clare explains situations in a readable manner. The mangaka is a great story teller, and the translator, molokidan, did rather well in using terms (ephemeral, yet colossal) I never used in a sentence.
Well, I probably sound like a party pooper since so many people loved the chapter, but I can't say I liked it. Or rather... I don't like the way the story is going. The chapter itself is quite powerful, but it suffers from some serious deus-ex-machina.
We will undoubtedly get yet another flashback showing us to explain how Miria was saved and how they helped her recover and what Miria told them, but... it's just off.
The chapter shows us the revolt pretty much began the moment Miria didn't kill the claymores. I can understand why most claymores would hesitate to kill her. At the very least, they'd want an explanation. But all of them? Including this kid who's self-awareness had been crushed entirely? Even if not for the kid... Statistics dictate there'd be at least one claymore too pissed at Miria (she did cut them up!), too scared of the organization, too loyal to the organization, or just too confused to think straight. And yet she lives...
Sorry, but that's stretching it too much.
Next deus is how the heck did Miria convince all of them to revolt?
Even if Rubel (Louvre?) backed up Miria's explanation (and this chapter suggests otherwise), it doesn't make sense. Not even with the live-sparing tossed into the mix. Of course, it's a manga so it doesn't have to be entirely realistic, but it's deus-ex-machina all the way.
I suspect Yagi didn't like the prospect of a battle between claymores, and the discussion of purpose, morals and such that comes with it. Maybe he didn't expect so many fans would be upset over Miria's death. Either way, he took the easy route out.
Most of the new comrades will be short-lived. Literally. Quadrupling the cast in such a haphazard way is a no-go, and with those three new abyssal corpses comming up... it's a given.
At least one of the abyssal corpses (can we call them AC? ) will... survive the rebellion. After all, the organization still needs some firepower after it's all over. I doubt it's time to switch to the main land already.
Hmm yeah I find it pretty weak that if the Mangaka had planned from the beginning for Mira to start a revolt she might have tried something a little more sophisticated than "if I attack them without killing them they will join my team".
Fair enough if the Mangaka couldn't think of anything better but it just seems with the direction of each months chapter's, that there is some stalling going on. Although I only read a the chapter once when it comes out then go a month without reading.
Most monthly series I guess should be judged in volumes as their supposed to. But I wasn't really annoyed that Miria didn't die just because of the fact her death sucked. Saying that the majority of Claymore's cast are very likable characters and deaths are only exciting when they are in really in the shit like the winter wars.
what do you think of this somehow being a super-plan by Miria/Rubel?
Rubel seemed to know that Miria was still alive, so it's possible this is his plan or at least he's in on it with Miria.
Audrey+Rachel, while they did say that they'd be enemies to the Ghosts the next time they met after being rescued/saved from being killed by Riful, could have possible not have actually meant it (just saying it to pretend to be loyal to the Org, like Miria had done), and gone back and told the Claymores that they are to side with the Ghosts, or at least not kill the Ghosts (and it might be possible that Miria+Audrey had schemed this plan together, or that Audrey was secretly "apprehensive/traitorous" about the Org as Miria was, pretending to be loyal to it)
it's possible that Miria actually set up this "double-strike" with Tabatha, unknown to the rest of the Ghosts and/or Galatea (or not, maybe she knew of Miria's plan, hehe). Tabatha would lead the Ghosts against the Lab at the same time, Miria would launch her surprise attack from within the Org HQs (using her fake death, though this would have to have been planned in advance... Audrey/Rubel as the messanger/accomplice?) leading the Org's own Claymores against the Org
and then there's whether this was Miria's plan or Rubel's plan... (as you know of my wild theory/theories of Rubel, hehe)
Moderator message by: HegemonKhanYou're welcome to give your emotional comments about (most people's beloved) Miria's return or whatever else, but please also have something substantive too, as seeing spam posts of only "Yay, Miria's back!" isn't thought provoking, engaging, nor creating discussions. so please write something also that leads to discussions, along with your emotional comments about Miria's return or whatever else.
This chapter has a lot of questions/mysteries to bring up or answer/respond about !!! grins
Last edited by HegemonKhan; March 02, 2011 at 07:14 PM.
WOAHHHHHHHH. WOAHHHHHHH. WAIT.
Anyway, back to the chapter. Things to note: Miria is back. With epic scar (if anime comes back, epic music appears at this time) Some epic revolution will go on.
Prediction: Miria + Claymore V "Abyssal Ones" - Miria ends up disadvantaged. In comes the warriors at the Northern Path. Then something will happen with Priscilla + Clare (somehow). This will take about 1 year.
I'd like to add something. I think that the organization has to be defeated here (or at least in this battle). Because apparently, they thought that the claymores are on their side. I really don't want to see them like "yeah, the Claymores joined you so what? we still have this and that...".
Miria managed to put the Org in such a bad situation. When I saw her persumed death scene, I lost my respect to her as a leader especially after leaving all the others behind just to die a meaningless death.
I'm sorry I doubted you Miria
How many warriors did Miria have to persuade to rebel? Are they the full compliment of 47 warriors?
If we minus the four of Anastasia's party, Miata and Clarice, Alicia and Beth, and Dietrich, that would leave as few as 38 warriors left to convert. But this is conjecture as the Org can easily replace any and all of them at any time.
Given that Miria and the Ghosts saved the hunting parties led by Nina (three warriors minus Clarice), Audrey (four warriors), and Dietrich (three minus Dietrich), and the three warriors in Lacroix, that would be 13 warriors at Organization HQ whose lives were saved by the Ghosts. And presumedly since those 13 were brought down by Miria, but whose lives were spared a second time, perhaps “the second time is the charm.”
That would leave at most 25 warriors left who “owed” no previous debt to Ghosts. Except that Miria spared their lives. Would that be enough to persuade them to join Miria? Dunno.
All the conjecture above, even if true, would only make the impossible merely improbable, that is the Claymore rebellion. But the 13 warriors rescued by the Ghosts may have created the critical mass to tip the balance of opinion in favor of Miria's rebellion. Maybe...
Sort of like the hundredth monkey phenomenon.
But we still need to see what happened in the critical three-month period between Miria being brought down and her reappearance.
ch 113 does say that "ALL" 47 (minus whatever the amount) were recalled to the Org HQs 3 months ago (which is when Miria had attacked), and have been there ever since, lol.
so it seems that Miria has the support of the "entire" Claymore force, hehe.
Miria has converted "100%" of the Claymores against the Org, hehe
Last edited by HegemonKhan; March 03, 2011 at 04:52 AM.
Fast on the avatar, ne? Hehehe.
Nice numbers/Computations. I'll try counting the ones shown in the manga. 8D
Sorry can't help it. As i was reading the chapter... My mind just said. "The Legend of Miria" over and over~
Last edited by cklaighe; March 02, 2011 at 08:57 PM. Reason: Automerged Doublepost
they will use the old number 1 as their weapons ( using Priscilla's arm). Why I am having a feeling that Teresa will be one of them?
I think you have to remember that the Ghosts convinced even Audrey (and, IIRC, Rachel) of their plans. We have yet to meet a Claymore who has never been suspicious of the Org (except Raftela and the Twins but they have no conscious minds). That coupled with the fact this intruder could have easily killed all them but chose to let them live, and that their leader (Audrey is now the highest ranked Claymore alive) believes her innocence doesn't leave any doubt in my mind that they'd all join together to keep her alive to at least hear what she had to say. Also, it's been seen that the lower ranked Warriors are highly impressionable, if one of their sisters told them to listen to this woman's story who spared your life (especially if that sister is your leader), they'd do it. The only people who've ever shown independent thought are the single digits, and most of them are either directly with the 7 or are their allies. And we can;t forget that many of the Claymores have at least a smidgeon of knowledge about what happened in Pieta...
With all this, I think the mangaka showed great skill as an author, I fully believe that every encounter we've had with Warriors of the Org have been built upon to come to this point - that the Warriors "loyal" to the Org would listen to Miria (the greatest leader ever forever, that's some serious foreshadowing on the author's part) and revolt against the Org.
Anyways, it seems we'll be seeing the Old Three (that's what I'm calling the three resurrected number ones) much sooner than we previously believed. Cassandra, "The Dust Eater", has been confirmed to be one of them. I can't even take a guess as to what her abilities will be. I think Teresa is a given (she is "the strongest number one in history" and Dae said he picked the three strongest) and I'm hoping for Sistina "The Divine Oracle", Roxanne "Of Love and Hate" (I'm thinking she'll be the third because of that MIB's comment about the trouble she gave them) or Lutecia "The Universal".
Out of all them though, I'm rooting for Lutecia. With a name like "The Universal", I have no doubt she's either the second or third most powerful Claymore to ever live. Maybe she's got a souped-up Yoki Manipulation ability. As for Roxanne, I'm guessing she's got some sort of Raftela like ability where she can control people's emotions. Sistina is probably like a Galatea on steroids (she is the "Divine Oracle"), though the word Oracle makes it seem like she can predict the future and Teresa is already the god of that technique.
And this manga is far from over. We have an entire continent that needs to be explored and a war that must be settled. Claymore isn't ending anytime soon.
Last edited by White Silver King; March 02, 2011 at 10:09 PM.
Well, when faced with certain death, but on awakening, found that you are not only alive, but ALL your peers have survived as well, there's reason to doubt as to whether the enemy is truly an enemy. And I get the impression that Claymores are not really that loyal to the organisation in the first place - more like afraid to go against them and face the wrath of the execution squad (which is of course, made up of other Claymores). I suppose in the midst of all the confusion, instead of just killing her, they wanted to know why - why Miria chose to let them live, why she attacked the organisation. Seeing the small warrior make the harmless strike, they made an agreement to fake her death and find the answers later. I suppose they thought that if she turned out to be an enemy, killing her would be simple when she's injured. So no harm hiding her away, wait for her to wake up and bombard her with questions. Which led to... Miria "brainwashing" them and the creation/dramatic expansion of the Mira fan-club! Yay!
In fact, that single word they all thought might be a 'why' :P Tho it is puzzling why the unnumbered twins were also swayed by Miria's actions. Maybe they had a higher degree of self-awareness? I mean, when Alicia was killed, Beth reacted instinctively and seek revenge. Maybe something similar happened here? The twins may have felt the power gap and thought they should have died. Or they may have felt it unfair to kill an enemy when she was 'blindsided' and were reluctant to kill her. One thing led to another, and a general consensus was reached to let Miria live.
Personally, i don't think any of this was planned. Miria went to the organisation with the full intention to bring it down. Tabitha decided to go North thinking that's what Miria would have done. The claymores decided to spare Miria to have their questions answered for once in their lives. Coincidentally, me reckons it all worked out quite well