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View Poll Results: Who wins?

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  • Urahara

    62 62.63%
  • Isshin

    37 37.37%
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Thread: Urahara Kisuke vs Kurosaki Isshin

  1. #46
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    Re: Urahara Kisuke vs Kurosaki Isshin

    i'm telling you that ulq believes shinigamis are weaker than hollows (which obviously is only a pride-based statement and also due to his ignorance because hollows dont get into SS parties)
    he is overrating his own strengh because mighty godzen gave it to him and fed him ,and all the espada, up with his stories about SS and how they can overthrow shinigamis ...
    finally,urahara wasnt trying to destroy half of karakura town , he used the minimum strengh he could that would beat yammy and thus ulq could easily deflect it ... were they in a desert and no one was with them , he would have smoked ulq because, clearly, he travels with his inventions in his pocket
    THE UCHIHA LOGIC:
    "brother follows hiw on path? destroy konoha " uchiha sasuke
    "the village wants you not to interfere with politics? coup-d'etat" uchiha fugaku
    "coup-d'etat on the way? obliterate entire clan" uchiha itachi
    "clan wants to make peace? destroy everyone everywhere" uchiha madara
    "10 years old crush dead?infinite tsukyumi" uchiha obito



  2. #47
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    Re: Urahara Kisuke vs Kurosaki Isshin

    Quote Originally Posted by ki0 View Post
    Even if we assume that Ulquiorra meant he would have the upper hand, isn't that same as anyone else boasting in a fight? Yoruichi didn't think she would lose either.

    If there was some truth to what Ulquiorra said it still wouldn't prove much. Ulq has R2 and they would have to protect their friends, which would mean free hits for Ulq.
    I actually think Urahara (bankai) can defeat Ulquiorra (R2). My point is "Ulquiorra knew who they were (apparently Aizen told him) but he still was not intimidated, which means Aizen didn't tell Ulquiorra that Urahara was as strong as him." Otherwise Ulquiorra would piss his pants, especially if Yoruichi (who is also strong) was by Urahara's side. Ulquiorra thought he would have the upper hand against either Urahara or Yoruichi, while the other was trying to take care of the wounded.


    Quote Originally Posted by tousendrinksbleach View Post
    i'm telling you that ulq believes shinigamis are weaker than hollows (which obviously is only a pride-based statement and also due to his ignorance because hollows dont get into SS parties)
    he is overrating his own strengh because mighty godzen gave it to him and fed him ,and all the espada, up with his stories about SS and how they can overthrow shinigamis ...
    finally,urahara wasnt trying to destroy half of karakura town , he used the minimum strengh he could that would beat yammy and thus ulq could easily deflect it ... were they in a desert and no one was with them , he would have smoked ulq because, clearly, he travels with his inventions in his pocket
    If Ulquiorra didn't know who Urahara and Yoruichi were, I would say he might be overrating his own strength but he exactly knew how powerful they were, he had this information.
    Last edited by Gran Maestro; March 11, 2011 at 11:22 AM. Reason: Automerged Doublepost

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  4. #48
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    Re: Urahara Kisuke vs Kurosaki Isshin

    Quote Originally Posted by Gran Maestro View Post
    Aizen didn't tell Ulquiorra that Urahara was as strong as him." Otherwise Ulquiorra would piss his pants, especially if Yoruichi (who is also strong) was by Urahara's side. Ulquiorra thought he would have the upper hand against either Urahara or Yoruichi, while the other was trying to take care of the wounded.
    +
    Quote Originally Posted by Gran Maestro View Post
    If Ulquiorra didn't know who Urahara and Yoruichi were, I would say he might be overrating his own strength but he exactly knew how powerful they were, he had this information.
    pick up one side then i'll answer you + i'm not telling you that this is between ulq and urahara, i'm saying this is between ulq and all shinigamis
    in his fight agaisnt ichigo he tells ichigo that no shinigami can beat a hollow <<<<<<<<<<<<<<< this is my point
    THE UCHIHA LOGIC:
    "brother follows hiw on path? destroy konoha " uchiha sasuke
    "the village wants you not to interfere with politics? coup-d'etat" uchiha fugaku
    "coup-d'etat on the way? obliterate entire clan" uchiha itachi
    "clan wants to make peace? destroy everyone everywhere" uchiha madara
    "10 years old crush dead?infinite tsukyumi" uchiha obito



  5. #49
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    Re: Urahara Kisuke vs Kurosaki Isshin

    I think you're misunderstanding the quotes if you think they don't add up.

    First quote says that if Aizen told Ulquiorra that Urahara was on his level, then Ulquiorra wouldn't have thought that he would have the upper hand, even if the other was taking care of the wounded.

    Second quote says that if he didn't know the names and approximate level, then you could argue he was overestimating himself, but considering he knew that Yammy wasn't on their level (at that time), and he knew how strong they were, that shows that Ulquiorra was never told Urahara was Aizen's equal in overall power...

    Edit: This is sorta nitpicking, but wasn't Ulquiorra's point that humans would never be the equal of hollows? He acknowledges that shinigami should imitate hollows to get stronger, but he doesn't continue the statement to say that shinigami could never beat hollows, no? Otherwise, it doesn't make sense for him to become an Arrancar.
    Last edited by UchihaHunter; March 11, 2011 at 11:51 AM.

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    Re: Urahara Kisuke vs Kurosaki Isshin

    - Let's look at what took place in that battle. Yammy was about to shoot a cero at point blank range. Yoruichi was going to sit there and take it, because Orihime was behind her. Urahara jumped in and dissipated the blast. If we replace Yammy with Ulq R2 and cero with a close range lanza, Urahara likely would of been severely damaged or one hit KO'd.

    Ulquiorra did feel he would win, but Ulq still had R2 to rely on and could make them take his most powerful attacks.
    Last edited by En Yang Ji; March 11, 2011 at 11:55 AM.

  8. #51
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    Re: Urahara Kisuke vs Kurosaki Isshin

    Quote Originally Posted by tousendrinksbleach View Post
    pick up one side then i'll answer you
    These statements aren't contradictory.

    Ulquiorra knew how powerful Urahara and Yoruichi were but this power is less than you think.

    Quote Originally Posted by tousendrinksbleach View Post
    i'm not telling you that this is between ulq and urahara, i'm saying this is between ulq and all shinigamis
    in his fight agaisnt ichigo he tells ichigo that no shinigami can beat a hollow <<<<<<<<<<<<<<< this is my point
    Are you sure Ulquiorra didn't say "How can a human defeat an arrancar like me?"

    And Ulquiorra's superior officers were all shinigami.

  9. #52
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    Re: Urahara Kisuke vs Kurosaki Isshin

    Quote Originally Posted by Gran Maestro View Post
    These statements aren't contradictory.

    Ulquiorra knew how powerful Urahara and Yoruichi were but this power is less than you think.
    say what ? you are telling me aizen was sitting on dinners with espada explaining his tactics and sharing his knowledge ? aizen is clearly a manipulative type exactly like urahara (yes urahara is too, but others know it and have faith in him )
    i'm telling you, if you take what ulq said as truth then you gotta take what he said when ichigonator poped up , what byakuya said about ichigo training 1000 years and still losing to him (if you didnt notice, byakuya was facerolled and shown mercy twice by a 3days trained ichigo and ulq saw his most powerful attack taken barehanded by ichigonator)


    you are only saying that there is a different between what kubo implies and what characters boast about because you want to use whatever you like as an argument and tell to whoever you want that there areguments are false ...


    Quote Originally Posted by Gran Maestro View Post

    Are you sure Ulquiorra didn't say "How can a human defeat an arrancar like me?"
    havent you noticed? it actually happened

    now , if it was starkk i would have taken his speech as truth (because his opinion isnt biased and he has high analitical skills ... ) but ulq follows aizen orders blindly , his background is flawed thus any logical statment he tries to make isnt 100% accurate (try to believe that you can divide by zero then you will see miraculous mathematical deduction possible)
    Last edited by tousendrinksbleach; March 11, 2011 at 12:09 PM.
    THE UCHIHA LOGIC:
    "brother follows hiw on path? destroy konoha " uchiha sasuke
    "the village wants you not to interfere with politics? coup-d'etat" uchiha fugaku
    "coup-d'etat on the way? obliterate entire clan" uchiha itachi
    "clan wants to make peace? destroy everyone everywhere" uchiha madara
    "10 years old crush dead?infinite tsukyumi" uchiha obito



  10. #53
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    Re: Urahara Kisuke vs Kurosaki Isshin

    Quote Originally Posted by tousendrinksbleach View Post
    say what ? you are telling me aizen was sitting on dinners with espada explaining his tactics and sharing his knowledge ?
    Aizen obviously informed Ulquiorra about his potential opponents in human world before the mission. How exactly do you think Ulquiorra knew who they were?

    And didn't we see Aizen and espada having a tea party?

    Quote Originally Posted by tousendrinksbleach View Post
    aizen is clearly a manipulative type exactly like urahara (yes urahara is too, but others know it and have faith in him )
    i'm telling you, if you take what ulq said as truth then you gotta take what he said when ichigonator poped up , what byakuya said about ichigo training 1000 years and still losing to him (if you didnt notice, byakuya was facerolled and shown mercy twice by a 3days trained ichigo and ulq saw his most powerful attack taken barehanded by ichigonator)


    you are only saying that there is a different between what kubo implies and what characters boast about because you want to use whatever you like as an argument and tell to whoever you want that there areguments are false ...
    I'm not specifically talking about you but whenever I quote a manga character, people say "this character is wrong for whatever reason". Usually the excuse is "some character was proven to be wrong at some point" but if we go by this logic, all statements in any manga collapse once a character makes a false statement. Manga characters may be wrong but if manga doesn't give us solid evidence to disregard a statement, if the information isn't superseded by manga itself, then any such statement is better than our opinion. This is how I see things.

    If people disregard some statements and then quote other characters to support their arguments, it creates an unfair discussion platform which is based on our individual subjective opinions about who is right and who is wrong. I had the exact same problem in Byakuya vs Yoruichi thread and I don't want to go through it again. Any statement can be claimed to be wrong provided that you have enough creativity to speculate. The more we introduce our speculations to the manga, the further we move away from the possible truth.

    I gave you the correct translation, interpret it in any way you wish but don't quote me and say I'm wrong just because you don't agree with the said manga character. Don't shoot the messenger. And don't say "Ulquiorra didn't believe shinigami could defeat him", his Aizen-sama was a shinigami. Ulquiorra actually said "To think that I would be defeated by a human who had transformed into a hollow", when did he say no shinigami could ever defeat him? Post a link, I hope you aren't pulling stuff out of thin air.

  11. #54
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    Re: Urahara Kisuke vs Kurosaki Isshin

    What does Ulquiorra statement prove about Urahara's power level?

  12. #55
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    Re: Urahara Kisuke vs Kurosaki Isshin

    Quote Originally Posted by Gran Maestro View Post
    Aizen obviously informed Ulquiorra about his potential opponents in human world before the mission. How exactly do you think Ulquiorra knew who they were?
    .

    you took the fact that he knew who urahara was and developped a manga out of it , seriously ... what does this have to do with what he knows about urahara's strengh or if he was misled by aizen or not (again i tell you, aizen isnt stupid to share his thoughts with his pawns ... look at poor tousen , even the one who followed him since he was just a vc was just played)


    as for the shinigami and human part , you are missing the point .... its like im telling you that i ll use this pistol to kill a guy and you are telling me that i'm wrong because it's actually a sniper gun....
    my point is : ulq analitical skills are not high enough to make eveything he says true : he said a human ransforming into hollow can no beat him but he even oneshoted him
    Last edited by tousendrinksbleach; March 11, 2011 at 12:38 PM.
    THE UCHIHA LOGIC:
    "brother follows hiw on path? destroy konoha " uchiha sasuke
    "the village wants you not to interfere with politics? coup-d'etat" uchiha fugaku
    "coup-d'etat on the way? obliterate entire clan" uchiha itachi
    "clan wants to make peace? destroy everyone everywhere" uchiha madara
    "10 years old crush dead?infinite tsukyumi" uchiha obito



  13. #56
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    Re: Urahara Kisuke vs Kurosaki Isshin

    wait what we now claiming Urahara is below ulq in power level ? all because of ulq bragging, an enemy bragging they stronger then lose quite easy is manga law

  14. #57
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    Re: Urahara Kisuke vs Kurosaki Isshin

    Quote Originally Posted by ki0 View Post
    What does Ulquiorra statement prove about Urahara's power level?
    It suggests that Aizen (who informed Ulquiorra about Urahara and Yoruichi) told Ulquiorra that Ulquiorra could take on either of them by himself. We can at least conclude that Aizen didn't say Urahara was as strong as himself, otherwise Ulquiorra wouldn't be so daring. This is my interpretation of course, feel free to interpret it however you wish.


    Quote Originally Posted by Hystzen View Post
    wait what we now claiming Urahara is below ulq in power level ? all because of ulq bragging, an enemy bragging they stronger then lose quite easy is manga law
    No, we're claiming Aizen didn't tell Ulquiorra that Urahara was as strong as himself. lol
    Last edited by Gran Maestro; March 11, 2011 at 12:41 PM. Reason: Automerged Doublepost

  15. #58
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    Re: Urahara Kisuke vs Kurosaki Isshin

    Quote Originally Posted by Gran Maestro View Post
    It suggests that Aizen (who informed Ulquiorra about Urahara and Yoruichi) told Ulquiorra that Ulquiorra could take on either of them by himself. We can at least conclude that Aizen didn't say Urahara was as strong as himself, otherwise Ulquiorra wouldn't be so daring. This is my interpretation of course, feel free to interpret it
    you are either having a different point from the one i think you have , or you are wrong IMO ... ofc aizen didnt tell ulq that urahara was as strong that him , so you are using this to prove that urahara is weaker than ulq?
    THE UCHIHA LOGIC:
    "brother follows hiw on path? destroy konoha " uchiha sasuke
    "the village wants you not to interfere with politics? coup-d'etat" uchiha fugaku
    "coup-d'etat on the way? obliterate entire clan" uchiha itachi
    "clan wants to make peace? destroy everyone everywhere" uchiha madara
    "10 years old crush dead?infinite tsukyumi" uchiha obito



  16. #59
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    Re: Urahara Kisuke vs Kurosaki Isshin

    Quote Originally Posted by tousendrinksbleach View Post
    you took the fact that he knew who urahara was and developped a manga out of it , seriously ... what does this have to do with what he knows about urahara's strengh or if he was misled by aizen or not (again i tell you, aizen isnt stupid to share his thoughts with his pawns ... look at poor tousen , even the one who followed him since he was just a vc was just played)
    So Ulquiorra knew who they were but he had no idea how powerful they were and he totally speculated when he said he would have the upper hand against them if they tried to protect the wounded. And Aizen told Ulquiorra that Urahara was weak for the lulz. He would have a good laugh when Urahara thrashed Ulquiorra, what else was the point?

    It's apparent that you don't understand where I'm coming from or what I'm talking about.

    Quote Originally Posted by tousendrinksbleach View Post
    my point is : ulq analitical skills are not high enough to make eveything he says true : he said a human ransforming into hollow can no beat him but he even oneshoted him
    This is exactly what I was talking about in my post. Ichigo's hollow form who surprised Ulquiorra is a good excuse to disregard everything in the manga in whatever context. IMO Ulquiorra had the second best analytical skills after Starrk among the espada. Anyway, feel free to disagree with me or manga statements, you are entitled to your opinion.


    Quote Originally Posted by tousendrinksbleach View Post
    you are either having a different point from the one i think you have , or you are wrong IMO ... ofc aizen didnt tell ulq that urahara was as strong that him , so you are using this to prove that urahara is weaker than ulq?
    URAHARA ISN'T WEAKER THAN ULQUIORRA.

    People don't read posts carefully, so I guess I have to write in capital letters for people to see. Did you read this?

    Quote Originally Posted by Gran Maestro View Post
    I actually think Urahara (bankai) can defeat Ulquiorra (R2). My point is "Ulquiorra knew who they were (apparently Aizen told him) but he still was not intimidated, which means Aizen didn't tell Ulquiorra that Urahara was as strong as him." Otherwise Ulquiorra would piss his pants, especially if Yoruichi (who is also strong) was by Urahara's side. Ulquiorra thought he would have the upper hand against either Urahara or Yoruichi, while the other was trying to take care of the wounded.
    Last edited by Gran Maestro; March 11, 2011 at 01:02 PM. Reason: Automerged Doublepost

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  18. #60
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    Re: Urahara Kisuke vs Kurosaki Isshin

    that's the ticket, urahara going bankai to beat ulq ? you are kidding ? ... benehime smokes ulq in R3 if he still could transform
    jus read your own post, it's like implying that aizen needs to go bankai to fight ulq in r2 >->
    THE UCHIHA LOGIC:
    "brother follows hiw on path? destroy konoha " uchiha sasuke
    "the village wants you not to interfere with politics? coup-d'etat" uchiha fugaku
    "coup-d'etat on the way? obliterate entire clan" uchiha itachi
    "clan wants to make peace? destroy everyone everywhere" uchiha madara
    "10 years old crush dead?infinite tsukyumi" uchiha obito



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