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View Poll Results: Who wins?

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91. You may not vote on this poll
  • Team Cueball Cubed

    51 56.04%
  • Team Krazy Kidz

    40 43.96%
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Thread: Team Cueball Cubed vs Team Krazy Kidz

  1. #46
    Registered User 中級員 / Chuukyuuin / Member Cooper's Avatar
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    Re: Team Cueball Cubed vs Team Krazy Kidz

    Really.

    Like I said, because of Wondy's childish look Ukitake wasn't expecting his attack. It was a surprise attack, not Wondy's amazing speed feat.

    And of course Shunsui wanted revenge, it's kinda obvious reaction when your friend/ally is attacked.

    Off-panel fights doesn't count, maybe Kensei had a sudden stomach problems.

    I may be highly underestimating Wonderweiss, but you are highly overestimating him.
    All Hail Lelouch!

  2. #47
    Registered User 英雄メンバー / Eiyuu Menbaa / Hero Member
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    Re: Team Cueball Cubed vs Team Krazy Kidz

    Quote Originally Posted by El Samurai Guapo View Post
    I think it's something to consider when the character in question lacks any sort of reasoning capabilities whatsoever. I don't even think I posed in that thread that involved Allon, but I agree with whoever brought up that point; Allon would indeed be prone to attacking an ally.

    It makes no difference either way, Hachi can swiftly deal with Momo in a number of ways before she can even begin to contribute to her team. Then he'll just hit WW with a bakudo 63 and...well, you know the rest.
    Again, you missed the point that despite there being opportunities for both Allon and WW to attack their allies, they never did. We know that the Gotei 13 is essentially a group under one leader, yet Komamura, Hisagi, Kenpachi, Ikkaku, etc. fought with one another. Does that mean that whenever any of these characters is in a team battle, we should say "well, they have fought against characters that they should be allied with, so we have to take that into consideration"? Regardless of what you think of their reasoning abilities, both Allon and WW seemed to have been capable of knowing friend from foe, seeing as how NEITHER ONE of them EVER attacked an ally. Freaking Grimmjaw obliterated Luppi, but I didn't see anyone talking about Grimmjaw turning on Renji. You people kill me sometimes...

    Anyway, just as swiftly as Hachi could deal with Hinamori, WW could deal with Hachi. And actually, regarding the Bakudo 63, seeing as how hollowfied Kensei was able to break out of one, I don't think it's outside the realm of reason to think that Wonderweiss could. We also don't know if he could just negate kidou, since plenty of people seem to think he negated HH, etc.

    For the record, I thought it was more shockwave dissipation than anything else, but...who knows.

  3. #48
    Registered User 中級員 / Chuukyuuin / Member Kugo Ginjo's Avatar
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    Re: Team Cueball Cubed vs Team Krazy Kidz

    Quote Originally Posted by Cooper View Post
    Like I said, because of Wondy's childish look Ukitake wasn't expecting his attack. It was a surprise attack, not Wondy's amazing speed feat.
    He was looking at WW, so it counts as a speedblitz.
    Shunsui and Ukitake were both surprised by WW speed and couldn't react.


    Quote Originally Posted by Cooper View Post
    And of course Shunsui wanted revenge, it's kinda obvious reaction when your friend/ally is attacked.
    That's how you interpreted the situation, he never said that he was gonna revenge him nor did he even stated that he was scared.

    Quote Originally Posted by Cooper View Post
    Off-panel fights doesn't count, maybe Kensei had a sudden stomach problems.
    Kensei never appeared again so he got defeated, it's all there is to it and plain denying it is giving no counter-prove nor a good reason why it doesn't count.

    Quote Originally Posted by Cooper View Post
    I may be highly underestimating Wonderweiss, but you are highly overestimating him.
    Okay.

    And you avoided the part where he was exchanging blows with Yamamoto, he even got praised by him.
    Last edited by Kugo Ginjo; March 12, 2011 at 11:14 AM.

  4. #49
    Registered User 英雄メンバー / Eiyuu Menbaa / Hero Member
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    Re: Team Cueball Cubed vs Team Krazy Kidz

    We were outright told he could negate Ceros, and though we don't know how he did it, the same scream that negated that broke apart HH, so it's kinda up in the air whether it works on much else. Kido is questionable to say the least, so I wouldn't rely on it. The problem I'd have is 63 kind of doesn't stop him from unleashing his mass of extend-able, hyper fast, flexible, hidden, stretchy arms and laying waste to ANYTHING THAT GETS TOO DAMN CLOSE.

    Which is both of them as neither has any decent ranged capabilities that I've seen.

  5. #50
    Registered User 英雄メンバー / Eiyuu Menbaa / Hero Member El Samurai Guapo's Avatar
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    Re: Team Cueball Cubed vs Team Krazy Kidz

    Quote Originally Posted by UchihaHunter View Post
    Again, you missed the point that despite there being opportunities for both Allon and WW to attack their allies, they never did. We know that the Gotei 13 is essentially a group under one leader, yet Komamura, Hisagi, Kenpachi, Ikkaku, etc. fought with one another. Does that mean that whenever any of these characters is in a team battle, we should say "well, they have fought against characters that they should be allied with, so we have to take that into consideration"? Regardless of what you think of their reasoning abilities, both Allon and WW seemed to have been capable of knowing friend from foe, seeing as how NEITHER ONE of them EVER attacked an ally. Freaking Grimmjaw obliterated Luppi, but I didn't see anyone talking about Grimmjaw turning on Renji. You people kill me sometimes...
    You're the one missing my point. I don't know why you're trying to bring up other characters co-operating in this tournament with what would be their respective enemies in the canon storyline. For the purposes of this tournament, I think it's obvious we should ignore the fact that they would obviously never join forces. My argument was about the special trait WW has that others lack: mental retardation. Allon and WW are unlikely to work together with a shinigami not because they're originally enemies, but because they're too dumb to know that in this situation they're supposed to be teamed up. It's true we never saw WW attack an ally before, but that doesn't mean he's incapable of doing so. In fact, Aizen likely only programmed him to distinguish the difference between the dudes wearing arrancar outfits and everyone else. In fact, in the case of Mashiro he didn't even attack her until she began attacking him.

    Quote Quote:
    Anyway, just as swiftly as Hachi could deal with Hinamori, WW could deal with Hachi.
    No he couldn't. WW may have speedblitzed Juushirou, but Hachi is not an overrated, sick, weak captain that hasn't accomplished a damn thing in the manga. Hachi would fodderize Juushirou just as easily as WW did. WW tried the exact same sh*t on he did on Juushirou with Urahara Kisuke and Mashiro and failed miserably. Juushirou is just overrated because he's an older captain; even Mashiro—who I don't exactly hold in high regard by vaizard standards—performed way better than him.

    Quote Quote:
    And actually, regarding the Bakudo 63, seeing as how hollowfied Kensei was able to break out of one, I don't think it's outside the realm of reason to think that Wonderweiss could.
    It is when you consider Wonderwiess has not shown any type of raw-power that would suggest he can rip out of 60+ level bakudous from a skilled caster. We know that berserk hollow shinigami possess tremendous raw power; we saw the hollow Ichigo the vaizards fought in the barrier rip out of a Bakudou #75. In any case, even if WW does start to rip out, 63 apparently stacks with 61 (which DOES completely restrain movements by the way [including this kid's arms—though he'll be bound before he releases]; effectively "freezing" the target). Or Hachi can wait until he does break out and then hit him with #99.

    Quote Quote:
    We also don't know if he could just negate kidou, since plenty of people seem to think he negated HH, etc.
    You're the one killing me here. The only thing he can apparently negate are certain ceros and Yamamoto's flames. I couldn't care about less what people think (though actually, you're the first person I've heard suggest he can negate kidou), there is clearly far from enough affirmation to go around saying he'll be negating bakudous.

    Quote Quote:
    For the record, I thought it was more shockwave dissipation than anything else, but...who knows.
    Do us a favor and stick to your first thoughts.
    Last edited by El Samurai Guapo; March 12, 2011 at 02:34 PM.

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  7. #51
    Registered User 英雄メンバー / Eiyuu Menbaa / Hero Member
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    Re: Team Cueball Cubed vs Team Krazy Kidz

    Quote Originally Posted by El Samurai Guapo View Post
    You're the one missing my point. I don't know why you're trying to bring up other characters co-operating in this tournament with what would be their respective enemies in the canon storyline. For the purposes of this tournament, I think it's obvious we should ignore the fact that they would obviously never join forces. My argument was about the special trait WW has that others lack: mental retardation. Allon and WW are unlikely to work together with a shinigami not because they're originally enemies, but because they're too dumb to know that in this situation they're supposed to be teamed up. It's true we never saw WW attack an ally before, but that doesn't mean he's incapable of doing so. In fact, Aizen likely only programmed him to distinguish the difference between the dudes wearing arrancar outfits and everyone else. In fact, in the case of Mashiro he didn't even attack her until she began attacking him.
    Urahara didn't attack WW, but he attacked Urahara. Ukitake didn't do anything to him, but he attacked him.

    You're being dense here, and I think it's on purpose. You have ZERO evidence of WW being unable to tell friend from foe, yet you bring that up as part of your argument?

    Aizen programmed him to distinguish the difference between the dudes wearing arrancar outfits and everyone else? Don't create situations merely to suit your preferences. Fura doesn't have an arrancar outfit on, but we never saw him go attack Fura. You're just bending what happened in the manga to fit your initial opinion. Stick to what is shown in the manga and you'll have more people that believe you. You'd think you guys would have figured this out already based on the Hitsugaya vs. Yammy, Rose vs. Yammy, and Love vs. WW threads, but apparently, you didn't.

    Quote Quote:
    No he couldn't. WW may have speedblitzed Juushirou, but Hachi is not an overrated, sick, weak captain that hasn't accomplished a damn thing in the manga. Hachi would fodderize Juushirou just as easily as WW did. WW tried the exact same sh*t on he did on Juushirou with Urahara Kisuke and Mashiro and failed miserably. Juushirou is just overrated because he's an older captain; even Mashiro—who I don't exactly hold in high regard by vaizard standards—performed way better than him.
    Ignoring your opinions on Ukitake, I already think Urahara has some of the best reflexes in the manga (although, didn't he take that initial Bala from WW from the front?), so that's irrelevant.

    Furthermore, are you trying to suggest that Hacchi has similar reflexes to Urahara? I think that's...difficult to prove, to say the least.

    Mashiro was already focused on fighting WW (didn't she initiate the fight between them?), so that situation is different as well.

    Quote Quote:
    It is when you consider Wonderwiess has not shown any type of raw-power that would suggest he can rip out of 60+ level bakudous from a skilled caster. We know that berserk hollow shinigami possess tremendous raw power; we saw the hollow Ichigo the vaizards fought in the barrier rip out of a Bakudou #75. In any case, even if WW does start to rip out, 63 apparently stacks with 61 (which DOES completely restrain movements by the way [including this kid's arms—though he'll be bound before he releases]; effectively "freezing" the target). Or Hachi can wait until he does break out and then hit him with #99.
    Considering he dealt damage (albeit minimal) to someone that tanked a stab from Aizen, I think we can conclude WW has got good raw power. We've never seen an arrancar break out of a Bakudou with raw power (IIRC), but considering we've seen it done by the opposite side of the hybrid, I can't imagine it being impossible for WW to do. And again, if we look at it as WW having the ability to negate HH, RJ, and Ceros, it's not odd to think he could negate kidou.

    Quote Quote:
    You're the one killing me here. The only thing he can apparently negate are certain ceros and Yamamoto's flames. I couldn't care about less what people think (though actually, you're the first person I've heard suggest he can negate kidou), there is clearly far from enough affirmation to go around saying he'll be negating bakudous.
    Again, I'm not saying it's a fact that he can negate kidou, seeing as how we have no proof. But ceros and RJ are about as opposite as one can get, no? You're going from a Menos' special ability to the special ability of a Zanpaktou. Considering Kidou uses reiatsu as well...I again don't think it's a stretch to think he could negate kidou.

    Quote Quote:
    Do us a favor and stick to your first thoughts.
    Sigh.

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  9. #52
    Registered User 中級員 / Chuukyuuin / Member Calisto's Avatar
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    Re: Team Cueball Cubed vs Team Krazy Kidz

    Wonderweiss speedblitz Hacchi and Ikkaku.

  10. #53
    Registered User 英雄メンバー / Eiyuu Menbaa / Hero Member El Samurai Guapo's Avatar
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    Re: Team Cueball Cubed vs Team Krazy Kidz

    Quote Originally Posted by UchihaHunter View Post
    Urahara didn't attack WW, but he attacked Urahara. Ukitake didn't do anything to him, but he attacked him.
    Exactly my point, Wonderwiess is totally unpredictable.

    Quote Quote:
    You're being dense here, and I think it's on purpose. You have ZERO evidence of WW being unable to tell friend from foe, yet you bring that up as part of your argument? Aizen programmed him to distinguish the difference between the dudes wearing arrancar outfits and everyone else? Don't create situations merely to suit your preferences. Fura doesn't have an arrancar outfit on, but we never saw him go attack Fura. You're just bending what happened in the manga to fit your initial opinion. Stick to what is shown in the manga and you'll have more people that believe you. You'd think you guys would have figured this out already based on the Hitsugaya vs. Yammy, Rose vs. Yammy, and Love vs. WW threads, but apparently, you didn't.
    Whatever, I'm being dense because I believe there's the possibility that a character who we know for a fact lacks any sort of reasoning capabilities may attack its partner? Fura? Wasn't that thing its pet? I'm pretty sure hollows would be included in the list of things not to aggro anyway. In fact, that's probably the very reason Wonderwiess did not attack Mashiro right off the bat; she had her mask on and WW was probably confused as to whether or not she was a hollow. Only after he witnessed her destroy his pet did he try and shoot a cero at her. Guess who else has a hollow mask that would also be throwing WW for a loop once he puts it on? Yes, Hachi.

    Quote Quote:
    Ignoring your opinions on Ukitake, I already think Urahara has some of the best reflexes in the manga (although, didn't he take that initial Bala from WW from the front?), so that's irrelevant.
    Furthermore, are you trying to suggest that Hacchi has similar reflexes to Urahara? I think that's...difficult to prove, to say the least.
    His reflexes don't need to be as good as Urahara's, it's not like WW will suddenly pop into this fight out of nowhere and try to backstab Hachi here like he did to Kisuke.

    Quote Quote:
    Mashiro was already focused on fighting WW (didn't she initiate the fight between them?), so that situation is different as well.
    Yes precisely, if WW was unable to blitz Mashiro the entire time they fought, I don't see how Hachi would be. Hachi doesn't rely on his mask as much as she does either, so he would not be totally f*cked the moment it comes of like she was. Hachi will be focused on fighting WW here obviously, he definitely won't be taken by surprise.

    Quote Quote:
    Considering he dealt damage (albeit minimal) to someone that tanked a stab from Aizen, I think we can conclude WW has got good raw power.
    I think even minimal is an exaggeration, considering he landed HUNDREDS if not THOUSANDS of punches on the old man who was totally unfazed by that attack. Yamamoto could have torn WW's arms off (the big ones that were holding him) at any moment and escaped from that attack if he actually felt threatened, but he obviously wasn't.

    Quote Quote:
    We've never seen an arrancar break out of a Bakudou with raw power (IIRC), but considering we've seen it done by the opposite side of the hybrid, I can't imagine it being impossible for WW to do.
    Problem is the arrancar have never displayed the same amount of raw power as shinigami in the midst of undergoing a hollow transformation. I've always held that shinigami -> hollow hybrids are superior anyway, as in general pure shinigami seem to be superior to pure hollows.

    Quote Quote:
    Again, I'm not saying it's a fact that he can negate kidou, seeing as how we have no proof. But ceros and RJ are about as opposite as one can get, no? You're going from a Menos' special ability to the special ability of a Zanpaktou. Considering Kidou uses reiatsu as well...I again don't think it's a stretch to think he could negate kidou.
    "You're just bending what happened in the manga to fit your initial opinion. Stick to what is shown in the manga and you'll have more people that believe you."

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  12. #54
    Registered User 初心者/ Shoshinsha / Beginner Autumn's Avatar
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    Re: Team Cueball Cubed vs Team Krazy Kidz

    WW solos via a blitz.

  13. #55
    Registered User 英雄メンバー / Eiyuu Menbaa / Hero Member Takahashi's Avatar
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    Re: Team Cueball Cubed vs Team Krazy Kidz

    Wait....

    So Krazy Kidz are going to lose because WW will attack his teammate, and Hachi is apparently immune to speedblitzes despite having no means of fighting in CQC at all?

    Am I getting this right?

    Jesus, here's a Zommari repeat.

    @Samurai

    How can you trash Ukitake for feats, yet say that Hachi will be able to handle an extremely fast opponent despite his only feat being up against a guy who just flat out didn't attack him for 10 minutes?

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  15. #56
    Registered User 英雄メンバー / Eiyuu Menbaa / Hero Member El Samurai Guapo's Avatar
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    Re: Team Cueball Cubed vs Team Krazy Kidz

    Really Takahashi? You have issues with my posts but not with any of these "WW blitzes them both" one liners?

    Quote Originally Posted by Takahashi
    How can you trash Ukitake for feats, yet say that Hachi will be able to handle an extremely fast opponent despite his only feat being up against a guy who just flat out didn't attack him for 10 minutes?
    #1 Because I don't think WW is "extremely fast," definitely not faster than respira.

    There's no way WW is so quick that Hachi won't even have enough time to put a barrier up in front of himself. I also doubt Ikkaku would allow Wonderwiess to get passed him so easily.

    How is this a Zommari repeat, Wonderwiess never even displayed the speed Zommari did. I also think Hachi's image makes people think his reaction time is slow. Just cause he's fat doesn't mean he's slow, this is bleach not the real world.

    It's funny in any of these threads where you initially claim to be on the fence, you seem to always end up arguing the opposite side of whatever I happen to choose.
    Last edited by El Samurai Guapo; March 12, 2011 at 06:38 PM.

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  17. #57
    Registered User 初心者/ Shoshinsha / Beginner Autumn's Avatar
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    Re: Team Cueball Cubed vs Team Krazy Kidz

    Quote Originally Posted by Takahashi View Post
    Wait....

    So Krazy Kidz are going to lose because WW will attack his teammate, and Hachi is apparently immune to speedblitzes despite having no means of fighting in CQC at all??

    And your basing this off of what exactly?

  18. #58
    Registered User 中級員 / Chuukyuuin / Member Kugo Ginjo's Avatar
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    Re: Team Cueball Cubed vs Team Krazy Kidz

    @El Samurai

    Ukitake nor Shunsui got any time to do anything against WW, what makes you believe that Ikkaku or Hachigen can?

    Zommari couldn't overwhelm Byakuya with his speed but WW beat Kensei, kept up with Yamamoto and blitzed Ukitake, he has better speed.


    Quote Originally Posted by Autumn View Post
    And your basing this off of what exactly?
    That's kinda hard to read...
    Last edited by Kugo Ginjo; March 12, 2011 at 06:46 PM. Reason: Automerged Doublepost

  19. #59
    Registered User 英雄メンバー / Eiyuu Menbaa / Hero Member Takahashi's Avatar
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    Re: Team Cueball Cubed vs Team Krazy Kidz

    Quote Originally Posted by El Samurai Guapo View Post
    Really Takahashi? You have issues with my posts but not with any of these "WW blitzes them both" one liners?
    WW has blitzed Ukitake, and shown in his fight with Yama that he's damn fast. Ikkaku is VC level with a slow Bankai, and no notable speed/reaction feats. Hachi's movement is slow, has no way to fight up close, and has only fought an opponent who let him chuck Kido at him constantly. I voted for Zommari to beat Hachi in the other thread too. As people just seem to think Hachi can just instantly make barriers all around him and then crush someone, despite never doing two things at once.

    Do I support the speedblitz one liners? No. But at least it has far more evidence to back it up than "Yoroichi speedblitzes Byakuya".

    You think Ikkaku could actually do anything to stop WW? He couldn't even beat sealed Po.


    Quote Originally Posted by Autumn View Post
    And your basing this off of what exactly?
    You are aware that was me talking about what other people are saying right?
    Last edited by Takahashi; March 12, 2011 at 06:58 PM. Reason: Automerged Doublepost

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  21. #60
    Registered User 初心者/ Shoshinsha / Beginner Autumn's Avatar
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    Re: Team Cueball Cubed vs Team Krazy Kidz

    Quote Originally Posted by Takahashi View Post
    You are aware that was me talking about what other people are saying right?
    Sorry about that.I though you where talking to little ole me for some reason.

    Sorry for the confusion.

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