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View Poll Results: Who wins?

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  • Kenpachi

    36 32.73%
  • Shinji

    74 67.27%
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Thread: Zaraki Kenpachi vs Hirako Shinji

  1. #1
    The Giggs MH中毒 / MH Chuudoku / MH Addicted igotthegoods's Avatar
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    Zaraki Kenpachi vs Hirako Shinji

    Kenpachi vs. Shinji



    this keeps the others ones nicely aligned
    Kenpachi

    Zaraki Kenpachi is the captain of the 11th division and the 11th holder of the title Kenpachi, a testament to his battle prowess. He is the only captain ever known to not have attained bankai. While permanently in shikai, the name of his zanpakutō is unknown. His zeal for battle, powerful physique, and reliance only his sword in combat define him. He also enjoys wearing an special eye patch to restrain his immense reiatsu to prolong the battle experience.
    this keeps the others ones nicely aligned
    Shinji

    Hirako Shinji is a recruiter and the de facto leader of the Visored, and was previously the captain of the 5th Division in the Gotei 13. Shinji is somewhat comical, adding a bit of levity to situations that are otherwise serious. Shinji's zanpakutō is named Sakanade. The blade releases a scent that inverts and reverses the enemy's visual perception. Shinji claims that it is impossible to comprehend the attack directions, as the more experienced one is, the more one relies on instinct to fight, causing one to inevitably fall prey to Sakanade.
    this keeps the others ones nicely aligned


    Cast your vote and discuss (logically) why you voted for who you voted for. Have fun, but keep it clean!

  2. #2
    Registered User 英雄メンバー / Eiyuu Menbaa / Hero Member Takahashi's Avatar
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    Re: Zaraki Kenpachi vs Hirako Shinji

    Gonna go with Shinji on this one.

    He's got a mask, he's got a hax Shikai, and he seems to be the strongest of the Vaizards, save maybe Love.

    Kenpachi has dealt with a similar ability and prevailed, but there's a difference, Tousen sucks

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  4. #3
    Registered User 英雄メンバー / Eiyuu Menbaa / Hero Member vizardichigo's Avatar
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    Re: Zaraki Kenpachi vs Hirako Shinji

    I love Ken- chan, hes definitely one of my top 3 fav characters ( Grimmjow and Aizen being the other 2 ) but i must admit Shinji has got this,...It may take a while but if Shinji goes for fatal blows and not just flesh wounds he takes it easily..
    Thank You Kubo...You have proven once and for all, that Yamamoto Genryuusai is STRONGER THAN AIZEN SOUSUKE despite what the fanboys think

  5. #4
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    Re: Zaraki Kenpachi vs Hirako Shinji

    Shinji's got the edge here, even if he's CQC primarily. Kenpachi's far better than him at CQC, but with that ability his effectiveness is crippled. Too many ways he could realistically use his shikai to throw him off in a close range fight, and worst comes to worse he can just shoot him at range with Cero.

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  7. #5
    Registered User 英雄メンバー / Eiyuu Menbaa / Hero Member Jackk's Avatar
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    Re: Zaraki Kenpachi vs Hirako Shinji

    Shinji wins this.

    I already anticipate that somebody may try to use the argument that "Kenpachi beat Tousen's Bankai that removed his senses." But here's the thing: both Tousen and Shinji have hax abilities that effect the senses;however, Shinji's ability is still going to screw Kenpachi. We know that against Tousen, Kenpachi had to act reflexively and guess Tousen's location. Heck Kenpachi even needed to let Tousen stab him (not to mention how lucky Kenpachi was...considering that Tousen was dumb enough to not go for the head--which would have actually killed Kenpachi). But things are going to be different when Kenpachi faces Sakanade because Sakanade does not remove Kenpachi's senses, it messes with them! And we all know that Kenpachi not only likes to get hit a lot, but he also acts reflexively a lot. Shinji with his HAX shikai is just a pretty bad match up for Kenpachi.

    As stated by Shinji (Kubo), the more skilled and experienced one is... the more one relies on reflex to fight, causing one to inevitably fall prey to Sakanade. It was also stated that it's pretty much impossible to process all the inversions in your mind, flip them around and counter/block the attacks in time. Heck specially if your opponent is attacking very fast from multiple angles/directions, what the heck are you going to do? There is no way that Kenpachi is going to be able to reliably counter Sakanade; Kenpachi actually has his senses here, thus he will use them. Even if Kenpachi realizes what's happening... he will not be able to keep up with everything and is bound to make a mistake in the heat of battle against sakanade. Not to mention that Shinji even has the option of shooting Kenpachi from a distance with kido blasts or ceros if he wanted to.

    Furthermore, Kenpachi is definitely slower than Shinji even without the Mask; Kenpachi has no shunpo skills, while Shinji does. Heck we've even seen Shinji outrunning both Love and Rose in the TBTP arc; Shinji is fast. Suffice to say, I definitely don't see Kenpachi beating Shikai + Mask Shinji....
    Last edited by Jackk; March 15, 2011 at 09:07 PM.


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  9. #6
    Registered User 中級員 / Chuukyuuin / Member kamakazi_1996's Avatar
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    Re: Zaraki Kenpachi vs Hirako Shinji

    its an interesting fight

    i dont think kenpachi will fall prey to sakanade that easily, kenpachi was able to take down tousen with only his sense of touch and then he was even able to predict his movements with pure instinct, he would just need to get used to sakanades effects

    shinji is the leader of the vizards and no doubt strong, if he puts on his mask he could probably speed blitz him or even fire a couple ceros at him but kenpachi doesn't go down that easily, he took a punch from yammy in his resurrection and said he got hit by a gust of wind-shinjis mask lasts around 3 minutes i think if shinji cant take him down by that time its kenpachis win
    "This is a weird feeling... You, who once asked me why I distanced myself from you, have now gone and distanced yourself from me. Should I do the questioning this time? Just now, why did you distance yourself from me?" -ichigo kurosaki

  10. #7
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    Re: Zaraki Kenpachi vs Hirako Shinji

    Kenpachi has got this in a bag. I don't see how Shinji's cuts are going to do anything to Kenpachi but piss him off. The only thing Shinji can do is hope that he makes a fatal cut, which I doubt is going to happen. If you think Shinji's little shikai move can make a fatal wound on Kenpachi, you're mistaken. He'll definitely have to do it at least twice. Kenpachi is the guy that eats swords. He loves to get hit. In fact that's mainly his strategy, and seeing as how none of Shinji's strikes have been shown to be that deadly. They may be fast, but it's useless if they hardly do damage. Considering that Kenpachi is the biggest tank next to Komamura, and could arguably be even more of one than Komamura seeing as how he faced him and Tousen at once. Speaking of facing Tousen, he not only took Tousen's shikai, which I remind you had dozens of blades STICKING inside Kenpachi, but also took his Bankai. I don't think I need to explain myself further. We all know that Tousen's bankai is just as hax if not more so than Shinji's shikai. how do you catch what you can't see, what you can't hear? Tousen's Bankai was countered, it wasn't just after a couple of hits, it was basically after one hit. Tousen could have just killed him, or could he?

    All signs point towards Ken figuring out Shinji's shikai after one strike, then the next strike Shinji tries for, Ken would probably just grab his blade and smile. From there it's all Kenpachi.

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  12. #8
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    Re: Zaraki Kenpachi vs Hirako Shinji

    Quote Originally Posted by Random101 View Post
    Shinji's got the edge here, even if he's CQC primarily. Kenpachi's far better than him at CQC, but with that ability his effectiveness is crippled. Too many ways he could realistically use his shikai to throw him off in a close range fight, and worst comes to worse he can just shoot him at range with Cero.
    A few issues I have with this...

    1. It seems you're presuming that Kenpachi won't figure out how to counter Sakanade before Shinji kills him...I don't see how this is true. Have we seen Shinji damage anything outside of a busted up one-armed Grimmjaw? Meanwhile, Kenpachi tanks two Captain's Shikai attacks, and a released Espada's attack in HM and keeps on laughing...

    2. A Cero? So his Cero is going to completely shit on Nnoitra's Cero? Again, his Cero couldn't even completely overwhelm busted up one-armed sealed Grimmjaw's Cero in the real world...it's going to shit on Nnoitra's HM Cero?


    Kenpachi wins this with relative ease. Shinji's only range attack is a Cero, which we've seen Kenpachi deflect like nothing and dodge, even in HM...which leaves him with attacking directly, which...really? Shinji hasn't shown any considerable strength or even skill in CQC. Kenpachi, on the other hand, excels in it.

    I'm not sure if you voted or not, but you're a reasonable member, so I figured I'd at least try to change your opinion if you haven't already voted.

  13. #9
    Registered User 上級員 / Jyoukuuin / Sr. Member Omiem's Avatar
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    Re: Zaraki Kenpachi vs Hirako Shinji

    Quote Originally Posted by UchihaHunter View Post
    Kenpachi wins this with relative ease. Shinji's only range attack is a Cero, which we've seen Kenpachi deflect like nothing and dodge, even in HM...which leaves him with attacking directly, which...really? Shinji hasn't shown any considerable strength or even skill in CQC. Kenpachi, on the other hand, excels in it.
    I'd say this counts as a pretty good CQC feat.

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    Registered User 上級員 / Jyoukuuin / Sr. Member
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    Re: Zaraki Kenpachi vs Hirako Shinji

    This will be a cakewalk for Shinji as soon as he goes into Shikai. Unlike Tousen's Bankai, Ken's superb reactions will actually work against him. He was able to beat Tousen's Bankai by slashing in the direction he felt Tousen's blade moving towards him.

    However, if his reactions are so finely hewn, then he will literally be incapable of reacting any other way - time and time again Shinji will attack him, and Ken's muscle memory will dictate that he reacts in the way he has in every fight he has had before, which will result in a complete miss every time. So I think Shinji is, with the exception of ranged attackers, the worst possible opponent for Ken to come up against. Ken's amazing reactions =/= being able to adapt to completely different fighting physics, rather they would prevent it.

    On top of this, Shinji isn't exactly a weakling - with his Vizard mask I would put him leagues above Nnoitra, who would have finished Ken in a few more slashes had it not been for Kendo. So despite Ken being a tank, it will only take a few slashes from Shinji to take him down. Even if Ken were able to eventually get around Shinji's Shikai, which I believe he would not, Shinji could finish him off before this happens.

    I don't know whether Shinji's Shikai can be circumvented by sensing Shinji's Reiatsu, but this doesn't matter anyway since Ken can't sense Reiatsu. So to me, there is no way Ken will be able to land a hit on Shinji, let alone defeat him - especially if Shinji isn't polite enough to explain the nature of his Shikai.

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  17. #11
    Registered User 英雄メンバー / Eiyuu Menbaa / Hero Member
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    Re: Zaraki Kenpachi vs Hirako Shinji

    Quote Originally Posted by Omiem View Post
    I'd say this counts as a pretty good CQC feat.
    I'd be impressed if not for this

    http://read.mangashare.com/Bleach/ch...8/page010.html

    Furthermore, I don't think Shinji is much of a tank either...even if he does stab Kenpachi, what's to stop Kenpachi from grabbing his arm and attacking as he did Tousen?

  18. #12
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    Re: Zaraki Kenpachi vs Hirako Shinji

    Quote Quote:
    1. It seems you're presuming that Kenpachi won't figure out how to counter Sakanade before Shinji kills him...I don't see how this is true. Have we seen Shinji damage anything outside of a busted up one-armed Grimmjaw? Meanwhile, Kenpachi tanks two Captain's Shikai attacks, and a released Espada's attack in HM and keeps on laughing...
    I hold this as True because Shinji can apparently reverse directions one at a time same as all at once, it appears to be up to him. It's how the whole thing with Hitsugaya worked.

    GRANTED, LOLILLUSION, but fundamentally that trick wouldn't have worked anyway unless he knew he could do it, so the function of the ability for that particular segment is valid.

    Quote Quote:
    A Cero? So his Cero is going to completely shit on Nnoitra's Cero? Again, his Cero couldn't even completely overwhelm busted up one-armed sealed Grimmjaw's Cero in the real world...it's going to shit on Nnoitra's HM Cero?
    Nnoitra's cero looks like this: http://www.mangafox.com/manga/bleach/v35/c308/12.html

    Adequate but nothing special for a cero.

    Shinji's is like this: http://www.mangafox.com/manga/bleach/v27/c236/12.html

    Larger scale, and he's getting some nice backlash on it. I'm not saying it'll be much more potent... but unlike in Nnoitra's case him being able to palm to knock it aside it isn't going to be viable for two reasons, the scale being much larger than his hand and because of his shikai. He's going to actually be taking that to some part of his body. A lot of those if he keeps it up. Kenpachi's got monstrous stamina yes, but even he can't keep going forever. And trying to find Shinji's going to be a bitch an a half if he reverses whatever the hell direction he wants.

  19. #13
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    Re: Zaraki Kenpachi vs Hirako Shinji

    Quote Originally Posted by Random101 View Post
    I hold this as True because Shinji can apparently reverse directions one at a time same as all at once, it appears to be up to him. It's how the whole thing with Hitsugaya worked.

    GRANTED, LOLILLUSION, but fundamentally that trick wouldn't have worked anyway unless he knew he could do it, so the function of the ability for that particular segment is valid.
    Eh, considering what Gran said in the Kensei vs. Shinji topic, I don't think the reversal of direction would really be much of an issue outside of the initial dodge in the wrong direction that makes the stab/slash deeper than it initially would have been. Again, though, considering that he's taken substantial amounts of blades before, I don't see that as an issue. Unless, of course, Shinji's Shikai + Mask attacks are going to completely (and I mean completely) shit on the Tenken + Suzumushi combo.

    Quote Quote:
    Nnoitra's cero looks like this: http://www.mangafox.com/manga/bleach/v35/c308/12.html

    Adequate but nothing special for a cero.

    Shinji's is like this: http://www.mangafox.com/manga/bleach/v27/c236/12.html

    Larger scale, and he's getting some nice backlash on it. I'm not saying it'll be much more potent... but unlike in Nnoitra's case him being able to palm to knock it aside it isn't going to be viable for two reasons, the scale being much larger than his hand and because of his shikai. He's going to actually be taking that to some part of his body. A lot of those if he keeps it up. Kenpachi's got monstrous stamina yes, but even he can't keep going forever.
    Again, it barely overpowered Grimmjaw's Cero. Are we going to argue that one-armed real world Grimmjaw's Cero is stronger than HM-still in the Espada Cero? I don't care about the size of it really, in theory, you should never be able to grab energy with your hand anyway. In addition, size of explosions, size of attacks...doesn't always mean everything. Mugetsu didn't seem like it was bigger than Soi Fon's Bankai, but I doubt it was weaker than it. (sorta apples and oranges, but you get the point)

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  21. #14
    Registered User 上級員 / Jyoukuuin / Sr. Member Omiem's Avatar
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    Re: Zaraki Kenpachi vs Hirako Shinji

    Quote Originally Posted by UchihaHunter View Post
    I'd be impressed if not for this

    http://read.mangashare.com/Bleach/ch...8/page010.html

    Furthermore, I don't think Shinji is much of a tank either...even if he does stab Kenpachi, what's to stop Kenpachi from grabbing his arm and attacking as he did Tousen?
    That could just be Kenpachi grabbing Tousen's arm after the blade touched his left shoulder. It's the only logical explanation as to how Kenpachi knew where to grab the blade.

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    Re: Zaraki Kenpachi vs Hirako Shinji

    Either way, he actually blocked the attack before it damaged him, even though he only had touch...vs. mostly dodging an attack that he could at least see coming and react to.

    Of course, there's also him mostly dodging attacks from Tousen despite having only touch.

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