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Shunsui vs. Yoruichi
this keeps the others ones nicely aligned Shunsui
Kyōraku Shunsui is the captain of the 8th Division. He is a laid back and flamboyant man, evident in his style of dress and general attitude, and he is rarely seen without a smile on his lips. He is often seen drinking sake and napping or attempting to chase after women. Despite his seemingly carefree attitude and general dislike for confrontation, as one of the oldest and most powerful captains in Soul Society, Shunsui is a fearsome opponent. His zanpakutō, Katen Kyōkotsu, is unique in that it exists as two completely separate swords. In its shikai, Katen Kyōkotsu has the power to "make kids' games real". The zanpakutō makes the rules and anyone who steps within the boundaries of its spiritual pressure is forced to play by those rules, including Shunsui himself. The games that have been shown are called Bushōgoma, Takaoni, Kageoni, and Irooni.
this keeps the others ones nicely aligned Yoruichi
Shihōin Yoruichi, former captain of the 2nd Division and former head of Omnitsukidō (Covert Ops), is intelligent, witty, and often playful. Because of her former high-ranking positions as well as being part of the noble Shihōin clan, she holds an intimate knowledge of Soul Society and its workings. Not much is known about her zanpakutō or its abilities as she is rarely even seen with it, although it is known that she has achieved bankai. Yoruichi, who holds the title of "Goddess of Flash", possesses incredible speed and is considered to be the most proficient Shunpo master in all of Soul Society. She has also mastered the advanced technique Shunkō, which combines hand-to-hand combat with kidō.
this keeps the others ones nicely aligned
Cast your vote and discuss (logically) why you voted for who you voted for. Have fun, but keep it clean!
Yoroichi's probably faster than him, although I can't imagine a senior captain isn't at least roughly Byakuya speed level. At any rate, I don't see him being speedblitzed ever. His lack of Kido use is a definite negative, but his Shikai has plenty of killing power, he has two massive swords, something an unarmed person won't want to get near. Doesn't hurt that the game has the potential to one/two shot her.
Because Shunsui's color game plays a risk reward game, that means any attack Yoroichi tries leaves her MUCH more open to being cut than someone with a blade, or weapon for that matter.
Shunko's strong, to what degree, we don't know. I like Yoroichi, but she hasn't shown enough to confidently say she could take him on.
Yeah Shunsui. While I'm fully aware I'm picking the wrong team in the other one, here lacking a blade for the game is costly, and Starrk, having among the most impressive speed feats of the bloody manga was being kept up with by Shunsui more or less, so speed isn't a huge deal. Blunt force with the color game isn't either, and fighting HtH against blades without adequate ways to block is freaking rough. Even Shunko probably isn't the necessary trump here.
Tough match up, and it's really hard to call when we factor in the mood of Shunsui's Shikai. If his shadow games are working, then I can see Shunsui making a killing blow, but Yoruichi has demonstrated impressive reflexes seeing how she was able to read Cocoon Aizen's speed. If Iro Oni is working, then the battle can go either way due to the risk factor, but Shunsui should have the slight edge because of his experience with the game. However, I can also see him losing if Yoruichi uses Utsusemi at the right time, which can misdirect Shunsui's eyes and create an opening for Yoruichi. Shunko is definitely gonna be a big factor here as well, and I highly doubt Shunsui will be able to effectively go against it head on(due to Shunko's power). So with these reasons, I'll vote for Yoruichi here, but it's still a close match regardless.
Last edited by Omiem; March 23, 2011 at 12:32 AM.
Am not even shocked about Ichigo winning any more... : /
Aaaanyways, this match should be a bit more interesting to me (notice the post).
Yoruichi is hyped up as being the Goddess (God?) of flash, and is probably the quickest (Ex)Captain in all of Soul Society.
Shunsui, however has been praised as being one of the best captains that Yamamoto has ever trained.
Both seem to take their time to get into battles, as Yoruichi tends to joke around, and Shunsui is incredibly lazy. However both can also be quite serious when the time requires.
Now (as it is quite late, and I would rather read other peoples posts and then reply) I think one of the main things that Yoruichi has going for her (her speed) is not as big an advantage against someone like Shunsui. I say this because I find it highly unlikely that he will be "speed-blitzed". This is due to him being able to fight, react, dodge, and beat someone who can do this.
Sure Yoruichi put up a valiant effort against Aizen, however he appeared to be hardly putting "his all" into that fight. He definitely didn't beat her using a KS trick as I believe he did against Shunsui (feel free to disagree with me here, but I think that it is not possible to rule out that KS could well have been used - especially as Aizen said this).
That said, although I am leaning towards Shunsui at the moment, I may wait until some more posts are out before finalizing my vote (not that it makes much of a difference - Ichigo vs Starkk anyone...?)
Allow me to reiterate what an amazing feat that is. Starrk, weighed down, could vanish completely from sight when sealed. That's how fast he is. Yoruichi when similarly weighed down had to freaking WORK to lose Byakuya. Starrk's freaking amazing in that regard.
Now wait a minute. When has Shunsui ever been able to legitimately read Starrk's Sonido speed? I don't recall Starrk using his full Sonido against Shunsui(because of Ceros), and Starrk's sword clash with Shunsui doesn't really count due to Starrk being already hindered physically and mentally.
Firstly: I think that Yoruichi made her getaway from Byakuya pretty easily, as shown by her supreme confidence in her abilities here.
And Secondly: Yoruichi states that at that point she was pretty out of shape compared to how she used to be. If we are using the Yoruichi that fought Aizen (and I am assuming that we are), then it is likely that she prepared herself for that fight a lot more rigorously, and therefore is likely to be much fitter then she was against Byakuya.
That said, Starkk's feat does at least seem more impressive to me then anything Yoruichi has shown thus far.
I don't thnk anyone said his sonido was "read". We're just acknowledging that his speed was dealt with. Shunsui wasn't getting speed blitzed and was defending pretty much blow for blow til the guns came out, ad Shunsui may not have connected with a blow without distraction, but the most Starrk got was a glancing blow on Shunsui's elbow (and this was released Starrk at that). He didn't put Shunsui down until his back was turned, so the whole cheap shot argument works both ways.
In otherwords, he was capable of, without his full strength, keeping up with the strongest Espada, dodging and counter attacking for the most part. And since Starrk's shown me speed that I consider greater than Yoruichi's I don't see why he couldn't dodge a flurry of close range blows from Yoruichi, or just counterattack.
Last edited by ninjabot; March 23, 2011 at 12:49 AM.
A physically hindered Starrk was also able to slash Shunsui.Quote:
Starrk took way more damage, which is the entire point.Quote:
Last edited by Omiem; March 23, 2011 at 12:55 AM.
Originally Posted by Omiem
Niether was Shunsui, hence, no bankai.
Originally Posted by Omiem
A Shunsui who still wasn't using his full strength either. That was Starrk at his greatest strength, his released form against Shunsui's shikai.
Originally Posted by Omiem
No, that's actually not. Unless we're making two completely different points. What I'm saying is, you can't fault one character for taking the cheap shot when the other did the exact same thing.
Last edited by ninjabot; March 23, 2011 at 12:58 AM.
Wow, this is tough. It would be close (in my mind) but I'd have to go with Shunsui. My logic being (not that Bleach battles follow any real logic) that we've already seen that Shunsui, without releasing his bankai, is an incredibly dangerous force. We know that among the active Gotei 13 captains, Yamamato (most definitely the most powerful) considered him and Ukitake among the best fighters, and his fight with Starrk helped to prove that. He's not only quite adept at the fundamentals of fighting (at least swordplay and most likely footwork) but his shikai release alone is both incredibly strong, and can easily tip any fight in his balance (even if you're fundamentally a stronger fighter, if you don't figure out how to fight within his sword's rules, you're going to lose).
That feat by Starrk kinda reminded me of when Shunsui did the same thing with Nanao chan. Even Yama-Jii commended it. Who knows just how far away that place where Shunsui and Juushiro was to where he 'dropped off' Nanao-chan? Shunsui kept up with Starrk by all means. He dodge ceros that were instantaneous. Got hit with one trying to lop off WW's head, and got back up like nothing happened. Lisa-chan knew he was playing dead, there was nothing on him but a slight burn to his clothing where he got hit, you can see here then afterwards it looks like Lisa-chan gives him more of a beating than Starrk's ceros did.
You don't remember Starrk attempting to hit Shunsui, and never succeeding, save for a graze on his elbow, and one cheap shot? I bring these instances into question because these are the instances before either was injured.