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Translations: Gintama 507 (2)
So I may be opening a can of worms here but lets see.
Is the recent bankai Ichigo weaker than any of the captains? Or does Vizard Ichigo rip apart captains like Byakuya?
I say the first fight with Byakuya was a fight of what it is to have bankai and therefore limited to bankai vs bankai. But like Ikkaku and Kenpachi, Byakuya has shown to have more in his aresenal - Cicada, kido, Gokei etc.
So lets have them do a rematch in HM - no bones cracking Ichigo, no oops so youre bankai is hyper-speed combat Byakuya. Everything is laid out on the table and no one is underestimating anyone.
Scenario 1: Bankai Ichigo - the one that cut base Ulquiorra.
Scenario 2: Vizard Ichigo - the one that overpowered Ulquiorra base and then fought Ulquiorra R1.
Location: On top of the HM
IC: Ichigo - Resolved.
- Byakuya - aint f*ckin' around either.
Last edited by Waking_Dreamer; November 17, 2010 at 06:32 PM.
if by "recent" you mean the Ichigo that fought and defeated Aizen then Byakuya gets pwned pretty damn hard lol
If Byakuya "aint f*ckin' around" as you say, he should take scenario 1 pretty easily. Scenario 2 would be a tough call because hollowfication turns bankai Ichigo into SSj Bankai Ichigo. After the fight with Grimmjow he was able to keep the mask on for quite some time as well. Still Byakuya has things like bakudou (to either bind Ichigo or block his GTs with #81 danku) and goukei. Also I assume that he wouldn't be reluctant to use senkei properly here either.
I guess I would lean slightly towards Byakuya for scenario 2 as well, though it could go either way. As a side note, I think hollow masks become most productive when used together with bankai. As we saw with Ichigo, the inner hollow and zanpakutou are linked, and so are their powers. As such, it's probably not possible to bring out the full potential of a vaizard's inner hollow (and thus their hollow mask) without a full release of shinigami powers (AKA bankai) as well. In other words, I think we've yet to see how destructive a bankai + mask really can be since we've yet to see a real captain level shinigami do it.
where this this notion come from?
because he pwned the "4TH" ESPADA?
full hollow Ichigo hasn't shown anything to put him over Yama while Yama on the other hand has shown himself to be the strongest character "besides Houg Aizen and Zangestsu Ichigo"
Last edited by BaddAzzKenpachi74; November 17, 2010 at 08:11 PM.
byakura scenario 1 ichigo 2
Full Hollow Ichigo, while potent, is a blatant moron. All it takes is cutting the horn to knock him out of it too, which doesn't seem particularly hard. It'll be rough going for some of the mid level captains, but it's not impossible. Higher level ones, particularly Yamamoto, have it way easier. That Ichinator is prone to not moving for stretches of time doesn't exactly help.
That being said, Byakuya both scenarios. He could probably take it if he keeps to base bankai and uses it wisely, with Goukei at a key moment. Ichigo's lack of a significant amount of his speed helps immensely, though he compensates by now being able to fling Getsuugas. However if Byakuya keeps moving and saves enough of the petals for defense, he's not in that bad a position.
I don't know, the ichigo that fought grimmjow and ulquiorra was using a totally different fighting style. Ichigo has getsuga versatility at this point, the cresent, wrapping it around the sword for big strikes, and just unloading those huge getsuga sprays that are as big as a cero. Byakuya would have to be very defensive against all that.
The mask will make a huge difference to. We've seen what a full on kageyoshi blast does to ichigo and it wasn't enough to stop him so the mask should provide some nice protection from even gokei.
Byakuya has his kido options and they could shut ichigo down. Everyone already knows about that though.
This is hard since they are both my fav characters. It's byakuyas vast array of options vs ichigos mask boosted power.
Scenario 1 goes to Byakuya pretty easily.
Scenario 2 would be tougher, but I'd still say Byakuya comes out on top purely because of his versatility. Hollow Ichigo has some more power, but he's far from learning any new tricks. If Byakuya is throwing out Rikojokoro's, assassin techniques, and not underestimating Ichigo, I'd bet on Byakuya.
And if Byakuya isn't fucking around, does that mean that he can use all 1000 swords of his Senkei ?(no kill you by my hand bs) then it's an easy win.
Blast spell 33: (Does it look as powerful as shikai GT?)
Binding spell 61:
Keep it to 13 swords at one time:
I actually don't remember it being that big of an explosionQuote:
Considering no one has ever dodged this Kido, and no one has ever immediately broken out of it, this is a big factor to me.Quote:
Damn I forgot about that! Byakuya takes it, no question.Quote:
Byakuya went harder on Renji than he did to Ichigo.
Well the way I see it is that all the Ichigo's of HM (minus the monster) are weaker than the Ichigo at the end of SS. Its not entirely baseless cause Aizen stated Visored Ichigo should have been far stronger than what he was displaying. Gin also said Ichigo was scarier in SS and didn't think much at all of his Visored mask boost.
My logic is that Ichigo working fully with Zangetsu (Shinigami side only) >>> Ogihci not lending full power and working against them both. This plays right into Kubo's main theme of anything Shinigami > Hollow. His power only started to fluctuate wildly after the Hollow made its presence felt. This logic explains the apparent "mess" that was going on between Byakuya/Kenpachi/Ichigo and Zommari/Nnoitra/Grimmjow. Kubo didn't mess up the powerlevels, he neglected explaining precisely what was happening to Ichigo and left it all up to the fans to work out.
The only powerlevels he messed up imo was that of VLs. He overhyped them and couldn't live up to his promises cause it meant there would be no excuse for his precious goodies to live. Even Aizen got trolled by it cause he, like us, genuinely expected the VL Espada to do the business.
So I voted Byakuya wins both scenarios. Visored Ichigo made both Grimmjow and R1 Ulquiorra look far better than they actually were. Resolve won't help him in this fight cause Byakuya already seen that and his Ban Kai. His biggest advantage in the SS fight was the element of surprise combined with Byakuya's arrogance. Both those will be absent here so he's going down.