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Thread: Naruto 544 Discussion

  1. #916
    Registered User 中級員 / Chuukyuuin / Member Lexotan's Avatar
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    Re: Naruto 544 Discussion / 545 Predictions

    Quote Originally Posted by galeno View Post
    Madara does not need to use a talisman of his own to control the ET Kages: all he need is that one that absolutely removes all their personality. If he could control the Kyuubi with his MS, what to say about the rinnegan?

    Rinnegan is an improvement over sharingan, right? So probably he'd be able to control people with it. And even if that's not the case - if that's an ability only the sharingan possesses - he still has one sharingan right? So, he still can do it all along.

    The thing is that, to cease Madara's control over them, they need to be sealed, as Yondaime already showed us. So, I bet the alliance will have to do it, in order to remove their sharingan&rinnegan.

    More importanly: Hachibi clearly stated that Naruto would die if he used tajyuu kagebunshin while in fox mode. And Shikaku's only plan to defeat the white zetsus is to make Naruto use it this way. How is this going to be solved? I expect we'll have this answer in the chapter that comes out tomorrow.

    (what's the correct romaji btw, "tajuu" or "tajyuu"?)
    If genjutsu was a efficient way to control the Pain bodies, Nagato would have done that.

    So far, the only person that has been established that can do long ranged genjutsu is Itachi, but the manga also stated he can't control too many people at once.

    Nagato was only able to control that many bodies over a greater distance due his chakra rods, which also had a distance limit.

    I don't think Genjutsu is a proper way to control a Pain body, since any Ninja would be able to break Madara's control over a body by simply breaking the genjutsu casted over them. And breaking genjutsu casted over somebody else is a fairly easy trick in the NarutoVerse.

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  3. #917
    Registered User 中級員 / Chuukyuuin / Member galeno's Avatar
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    Re: Naruto 544 Discussion / 545 Predictions

    Quote Originally Posted by Lexotan View Post
    If genjutsu was a efficient way to control the Pain bodies, Nagato would have done that.
    I think your statement is wrong. Pain bodies that nagato controlled were corpses. The ET bodies are made of living people: their bodies are alive, what the ET does is to make another soul takeover.

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  5. #918
    Registered User 中級員 / Chuukyuuin / Member Lexotan's Avatar
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    Re: Naruto 544 Discussion / 545 Predictions

    Quote Originally Posted by galeno View Post
    I think your statement is wrong. Pain bodies that nagato controlled were corpses. The ET bodies are made of living people: their bodies are alive, what the ET does is to make another soul takeover.
    Nagato could easily have taken living Ninjas and Genjutso them into a Pain body.

    If that was a better option.

  6. #919
    Registered User 中級員 / Chuukyuuin / Member galeno's Avatar
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    Re: Naruto 544 Discussion / 545 Predictions

    That was obviously not a better option, because living people can die, while corpses cant. But the living that are under ET are immortal, while the jutsu lasts.

    Quote Originally Posted by Lexotan View Post
    Nagato could easily have taken living Ninjas and Genjutso them into a Pain body.

    If that was a better option.

  7. #920
    Registered User 中級員 / Chuukyuuin / Member Lexotan's Avatar
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    Re: Naruto 544 Discussion / 545 Predictions

    Quote Originally Posted by galeno View Post
    That was obviously not a better option, because living people can die, while corpses cant. But the living that are under ET are immortal, while the jutsu lasts.
    The Pain bodies died all the time. But one of the Pains had the power to resurrect them.

    Once Naruto killed that Pain, Nagato wasn't able to bring life back to the Pains again.

    I mean, as far corpses go, since those Pains were also corpses.

    The rinnegan supposedly can cast all jutsus, so I would expect Nagato to be able to use ET too.
    But his jutsu over life and death was even more powerful than the ET, since he could bring somebody back form the dead for real. No fake bodies like ET.

    I still don't think genjutsu is a good option to control those Pains. Controlling through ET itself sounds a much better option to me.

    But I could be wrong.
    Last edited by Lexotan; June 28, 2011 at 06:51 PM.

  8. #921
    Registered User 中級員 / Chuukyuuin / Member galeno's Avatar
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    Re: Naruto 544 Discussion / 545 Predictions

    The pain bodies did not died, they were corpses. What Naraka path did was only restore the corpses that were destroyed. Or should I say: Naraka had the ability to summon the Outer Path to restore it.

    Quote Originally Posted by Lexotan View Post
    The Pain bodies died all the time. But one of the Pains had the power to resurrect them.

    Once Naruto killed that Pain, Nagato wasn't able to bring life back to the Pains again.

  9. #922
    Registered User 英雄メンバー / Eiyuu Menbaa / Hero Member bigman's Avatar
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    Re: Naruto 544 Discussion / 545 Predictions

    Why is everyone saying Sasuke is going to copy and have Raiton Armor? He isn't Kakashi, he only copied Lee's taijutsu technique and that's it. I'm sure raiton armor looks simple but if it was that simple anyone with that nature chakra would be able to do it. Just like Rasengan, Raiton Armor has no hand seals so I don't see him copying it. If it was just a normal tech with hand seals and using raiton then yeah i would accept him copying it, but its not like that.

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  11. #923
    Registered User 中級員 / Chuukyuuin / Member galeno's Avatar
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    Re: Naruto 544 Discussion / 545 Predictions

    Quote Originally Posted by Lexotan View Post
    But his jutsu over life and death was even more powerful than the ET, since he could bring somebody back form the dead for real. No fake bodies like ET.
    That's not totally right: he could only bring back people he havekilled hilmself recently. He said, for example, that he would bring Jiraya back to life it he could, but that was not the case...

  12. #924
    Registered User 中級員 / Chuukyuuin / Member CVB3's Avatar
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    Re: Naruto 544 Discussion / 545 Predictions

    If i may add my 2 cents in this dc about how Madara is controlling the new 6 paths. I think its through the sharingan, not necessarily that its a genjutsu; i think that these sharingans are Madara's own "rods". That these sharingans is Madara's way to control them like how Nagato controlled the 6 paths through his rods. The rinnegan is there for an enhanced control and the shared vision ability which also allows Madara to control them simultaneously.

    LMAO
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  13. #925
    Registered User 中級員 / Chuukyuuin / Member galeno's Avatar
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    Re: Naruto 544 Discussion / 545 Predictions

    I don't know if you mentioned it here but: isn't it Kishimoto's mistake to state that a sealed soul cant be summoned in ET? I'm asking this because: who would Orochimaru have brought back to life when he summoned Shodai and Nidaime? Who was there in the third coffin that Sandaime stopped?
    I always thought it'd be Yondaime, as unlikely it is (knowing that he was sealed in the shinigami's belly).

    If that's not it, that would be who? Uchiha Izuna (madara's brother?)? Or even Madara?
    That should be the same coffin that Kabutomaru used to win his argument with Madara right?

  14. #926
    Registered User MH中毒 / MH Chuudoku / MH Addicted Delbi's Avatar
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    Re: Naruto 544 Discussion / 545 Predictions

    Quote Originally Posted by galeno View Post
    I don't know if you mentioned it here but: isn't it Kishimoto's mistake to state that a sealed soul cant be summoned in ET? I'm asking this because: who would Orochimaru have brought back to life when he summoned Shodai and Nidaime? Who was there in the third coffin that Sandaime stopped?
    I always thought it'd be Yondaime, as unlikely it is (knowing that he was sealed in the shinigami's belly).

    If that's not it, that would be who? Uchiha Izuna (madara's brother?)? Or even Madara?
    That should be the same coffin that Kabutomaru used to win his argument with Madara right?
    It was supposed to be Yondi, but Kishi basicall reconned the manga afterwards. I can't imagine anyone else Orochimaru would of had access too aside from Minato being that he also had the remains of the first two Hokages.

    Saying that, the technique could have just failed even if Sandiame didn't stop it, or perhaps it did fail and the Old man actually failed in stopping it, but thought he did because it failed.
    "The line dividing good and evil cuts through the heart of every human being. And who is willing to destroy a piece of his own heart?” - Aleksandr Solzhenitsyn

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  16. #927
    MH Senpai 伝説メンバー / Densetsu / Legendary Member M3J's Avatar
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    Re: Naruto 544 Discussion / 545 Predictions

    Quote Originally Posted by Lemonadez View Post
    Madara didnt use ET. Its one of the Rinnegan abilities like how Nagato use the 6 Dead PAIN body. all of them are dead but they had Rinnegan (non of them had Rinnegan from the start), It make them look like alive but theyre not really alive, they have no soul. They were just puppet with real bodies.
    Tobi didn't use ET, Kabuto did. Tobi probably used something to make it impossible for Kabuto to recall them or something. He may have also "convinced" Kabuto to not fuck with the ET summons somehow, but it's more likely Tobi used measures to make Kabuto unable to control them, as Tobi did ask Kabuto for info on Edo Tensei. Plus, Tobi has the Rin'negan, so he could take the summons under his control. Tobi could have used Rin'negan's jutsu like Nagato did to give make them similar to him, one SHaringan and one Rin'negan.

    Nagato can't revive bodies dead for a while, though it may be different with Tobi. He was able to control the corpses by using chakra rods.

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  18. #928
    Registered User 有名人 / Yuumeijin / Celebrity KiSwordsman's Avatar
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    Re: Naruto 544 Discussion / 545 Predictions

    Quote Originally Posted by galeno View Post
    I don't know if you mentioned it here but: isn't it Kishimoto's mistake to state that a sealed soul cant be summoned in ET? I'm asking this because: who would Orochimaru have brought back to life when he summoned Shodai and Nidaime? Who was there in the third coffin that Sandaime stopped?
    I always thought it'd be Yondaime, as unlikely it is (knowing that he was sealed in the shinigami's belly).

    If that's not it, that would be who? Uchiha Izuna (madara's brother?)? Or even Madara?
    That should be the same coffin that Kabutomaru used to win his argument with Madara right?

    As far as I know there was no third coffin in the manga. That was just something that was added in the anime. The anime has been known to mess up stuff royally, then fix it if its brought up later.

  19. #929
    Banned MH中毒 / MH Chuudoku / MH Addicted
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    Re: Naruto 544 Discussion / 545 Predictions

    Yea, these ET summons have probably had some sort of jutsu used on them that will make sure they are loyal to Madara, and likely can't be controlled by Kabuto.

    Remember, even if the original summoner of Edo Tensei dies, the Edo Tensei summon would still be active, so Kabuto isn't actually necessary for these things to function. All Madara did was skip a step, he didn't wait for Kabuto to die before he took control of the 6 Jinchuuruki.

    ---------- Post added at 10:35 PM ---------- Previous post was at 10:23 PM ----------

    Quote Originally Posted by KiSwordsman View Post
    As far as I know there was no third coffin in the manga. That was just something that was added in the anime. The anime has been known to mess up stuff royally, then fix it if its brought up later.
    Correct, there was no third coffin shown at all in the manga.

    In the Official Shonen English release of the chapter, Orochimaru himself thought that Hiruzen managed to stop the Third. He seem to have learned the true reason later for why the Third Coffin really failed, but he definitely didn't know the true reason at the start.

    Perhaps he found out the true reason when Hiruzen used the Shiki Fuujin against him and explained it.

    The Third himself sounded unsure of how he stopped the Third Coffin example, but he did, in fact, feel as if he had somehow managed to stop it.

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  21. #930
    Registered User 英雄メンバー / Eiyuu Menbaa / Hero Member Moon Stricken's Avatar
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    Re: Naruto 544 Discussion / 545 Predictions

    I don't know why people think Madara Edo Tensei'd the Jinchuuriki, he simple revived them using the Rinnegan to create his own 6 Paths of Pain. Makes complete sense. 6 Available Jinchuuriki, 6 Paths needed and Madara possess the Rinnegan.

    Just because Madara learned of the secret behind Edo Tensei does not mean he used it. Its clear that Madara used the Jinchuuriki as the 6 Paths of Pain.
    ~Now i am become death, the destroyer of worlds~

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