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Life is diverse and life has preferences, and so inequalities will always exist, no matter how hard we try to get rid of them, as they are apart of life, do we want to get rid of life, I should hope not!
We are organisms, life forms, and "animals". That means we live under the laws of life, the laws of nature.
Life cares about one thing and one thing only: continuance or self-preservation; in other words, Life is selfish.
Life's continuance occurs through replication, which we know better as reproduction. The thing is though, life is unable to replicate perfectly, life is imperfect and makes errors and mistakes in its attempt at replicating itself, life messes up its own reproduction. A reproductive mistake occurs, creating a different genetic code, than that of its parent. Or, the reproduction process can be damaged (such as from radiation), which also creates a different genetic code, and we call this a mutation. Either this "flawed or mutant" offspring survives or it doesn't. We calll this "environmental test", Natural Selection. However, unless the "flawed or mutant" offspring is able to survive to maturity, have its own offspring, which is then able to survive to maturity and have it's own offspring, it fails. As without a Viable Offspring (able to produce a grandchild, your child is able to have a child), there's no continuance or self-preservation of that "flawed or mutant" strain of DNA. That "flawed or mutant" strain of DNA dies off. When "flawed or mutant" strains of DNA make Viable Offspring, and this continuance or self-preservation repeats generationally, it is known as "genetic modification over time", which is what we call adaptation (a small change from its parent) or evolution (a big change from its parent). Every single individual organism of our vast diversity of life is a "flawed or mutant child of a flawed or mutant parent". Yes, we all are "flawed or mutants", hehe.
At first, there was only mitosis reproduction, or flawed copying, though actually the flawed copies were extremely rare or infrequent, and also usually fatal as well. Also, mutation is actually extremely rare or infrequent too. So, life was barely evolving for a very long time, there was very little diversity of life during this very long amount of time.
However, one such mutation or flawed copy occured at some point, which created a different form of reproduction, meiosis reproduction, or more commonly sexual reproduction, sex. This was the best thing that ever happened to life, as sex attempts to make hybrids instead of copies.
Mitosis' process only has one division (one cleavage) occuring, resulting in 2 diploid (46 chromosomes) cells, which means rarely is there a mistake made.
Meiosis' process has two divisions (two cleavages) occuring, resulting in 4 haploid (23 chromosomes) cells (spermatozoa cell and ova cell), which means a significantly greater chance of there being a mistake.
Meiosis' significantly greater chance of a mistake occuring, is what caused an explosion of life diversity that we know today, in an extremely short amount of time, compared to the amount of time that passed before there was the reproduction of meiosis (sex).
"Everything is about sex"
So, that means all of our behaviors and interests, are ultimately for sex. Socializing, Physical Performance, Intelligence, and etc is about sex, about getting sex.
But remember that it's the Viable Offspring that matters, as that's our continuance or self-preservation, that's our selfishness.
Viable Offspring = The successful "mission" of producing a grandchild, your child is able to have a child.
That's the "mission" of life, and social animals are best adapted/evolved or "equipped" for this "mission"
Yes, the process is slower, but the success rate is higher.
The babies of social animals takes longer to develop, but that extended nurturing, enables the best chance of having viable offspring.
The significance of social animals is the family structure.
It's this family structure that is the guide to a successful "mission" of Viable Offspring.
But let's first have our briefing of what this "mission" of ours is and entails.
01. You have to survive to maturity (puberty, when you can reproduce, have sex)
01A. You have to survive birth
01B. You have to survive baby+child years
02. You have to impress the opposite gender into being your mating partner (or there is always rape if unable to impress)
03. You have to out-impress your competition (or there's always elimination of your competition too)
04. You have to actually be able to reproduce (be non-sterile)
05. Your mating partner has to be able to reproduce (be non-sterile)
06. Your child has to survive to maturity (puberty, when you can reproduce, have sex)
06A. Your child has to survive birth
06B. Your child has to survive baby+child years
07. Your child has to impress the opposite gender into being your mating partner (or there is always rape if unable to impress)
08. Your child to out-impress your competition (or there's always elimination of your competition too)
09. Your child has to actually be able to reproduce (be non-sterile)
10. Your child's mating partner has to be able to reproduce (be non-sterile)
The Genius of Gender Specialization
The "male" gender is designed to deal with "external threats/tasks"
1. Find, get, and bring back food for his entire family.
2. Fight off animals or other males
3. Deal with nature, the environment, natural disasters, human civilization, and/or man-made disasters
4. Able to perform physical tasks like domestic or travel related tasks, carrying and moving things
5. (Humans) Able to build a home for family (Humans are probably the only or few species where it's the male who builds the "nest", the home/house, and not the female, lol)
6. (Humans) Brain Hemispheres have fewer connections, theorizingly why males are more able to focus on a single task and do that task really well, but are less able to multi-task.
7. (Humans) Generally more mentally fit, less emotional, more rational and calm, less fearful and nervous, non-panicky, which is good for leadership/decision-making, especially in a crisis,
(sorry, some of my wolf passion/knowledge, hehe)
or when around animals, as animals can sense emotions, and will act upon them. Also, animals demand no mental weakness (as their survival is at stake), one must be mentally fit as well as physically fit. A wolf that doesn't learn to be mentally fit, is killed by its own pack or banished from the pack, as it's a "cancer" to the pack's survival. "A chain is only as strong as its weakest link". Unfortunately, most Humans don't understand this, and when a wolf pack, or more frequently a dog pack has Humans as pack members, they treat their Human pack members the same way, by their same rules. Wolves and dogs structure is nearly the exact same as our militaries. A chain or heirarchy of command, and a demand to be both physically as well as mentally fit. And you you meet these creteria, just like with our military wolves and dogs will look after their own and care for their own. Except they will "leave a member behind" if that member is too detrimental to the pack. However, at the same time, a mother wolf will stay with her weak dying cub, and die (starve) with it, instead of going with the pack to a place that has food for them when winter comes.
Actually, we see the same behavior in humans as well, a we too despise mental weakness too, those "hysterical women", emotional is stigmatized you have to be rational and calm at all times. An emotional person is a crazy or mad person. Just like animals we ruthlessly destroy the mentally weak amongst us as well, demanding mental fitness.
8. (Humans) Generally, males have good eyesight, are observant, and read body language well (which are all aspects of combat/fighting) when we're motivated to do so anyways hehe, however our social skills are generally poorer than a females'.
9. (Humans) Males are good at hunting, high calorie/protein = meat
10. Males usually have more testorone than females, which makes us more aggresive/violent, which is great when we're away from home or dealing with external threats, but not when home when there's no external threats to deal with.
11. (great apes, this includes humans) males have high standards, and societal standards, members who don't adhere to these societal standards are ruthlessly destroyed. Gorilla's will gang-murder a member that doesn't follow their society, ripping the poor gorilla to shreds, while the alpha gorilla watches horrified but not doing anything as the group "Serves their societal justice of capitol punishment", and disturbingly when paired up to a Human mob (lkicking someone on the ground, dragging them through the streets, burning them alive, raping female journalists - covering the middle east and where-ever there is mobs/strife/conflict/hatred is not a good idea!, cutting their limbs off, etc etc), it's the exact same image. exact same behavior, you can't tell gorrila from human, they're behaving exactly the same.
12. (Human) males work at a higher intensity, but that exhausts us quickly so we can't work all day, like females do. the male works really hard at a single or few tasks, and then they rest and don't work for the rest of the day, lol. females constantly complain of males being lazy as we don't work all day like they do. Males often complain that females don't work "hard", even though they work all day long.
13. males devout their bodies to muscles and physical activity, as the females provide the pregnancy and suckling.
The "female" gender is designed to deal with "internal threats/tasks"
1. (Human) females are very adapt at socializing. This helps with "domestic affairs". This is especially important, as females can control males with their socializing skills. Females are "adept" at "keeping the peace and harmony" at home and in the community and family. Females who don't ahve good social skills, become the victims of demestic violence. A female with great social skills can calm down the most enraged and angry male into a docile meek male.
2. (Human) due to females' socializing, they excel at sharing and building up a great knowledge base. they learn herbs and plants really well, being good at gathering in prehistoric times, when we were hunter-gatherers.
3. (Human) from #2, this leads to females knowing well what to do when someone gets sick, what to give them and stuff like that. "mother knows best", drink that chicken soup, etc etc etc.
4. (Human) females generally live longer, providing more stability.
5. (Human) females work at a lower intensity, but that enables them to work all day, whereas males work really hard at a single task, and then they rest and don't work for the rest of the day, lol. females constantly complain of males being lazy as we don't work all day like they do. Males often complain that females don't work "hard", even though they work all day long.
6. Females are more comforting, caring, and supportive, whereas males are more aloof and not as helpful.
7. females can devout their bodies to pregnancy and suckling, as the males provide the physical activity from their muscles
let's look at why this specialization of the genders is so ingenius
imagine trying to hunt with a 9 month pregnant belly and being "full of milk"! not only does it drastically hurt your hunting performance, but instead of just your life at risk, now there's your life and the baby's life at risk.
imagine trying to be pregnant and trying to give birth when you got all that muscle and non-stretchy leanness, how does your stomach expand for the growing baby when you got rock hard abs? etc etc.
obviously life isn't able to have a body that can do both tasks that are specialized between the male and female genders. that's why having a "female" gender and a "male" gender is really so ingenius, if you think about it.
Desired qualities in a mate:
both male's and female's preferences are actually based upon the child, as remember it's all about the viable offspring.
Female's preferences in her male mate:
fitness = healthiness = fit/healthy genes = fit/healthy baby/child = less likely to die during childbirth nor before puberty, able to hunt - get/provide food.
strength = healthiness = strong healthy baby/child = less likely to die during childbirth nor before puberty, dominant over other males, able to protect himself from other boys or animals, and then as he becomes a man, protect his wife/child from other men or animals. able to hunt - get/provide food.
tallness = "authority" and power, being priveledged.
good social skills = less conflict, especially in the home and community environments. able to get along better.
powerful immune system (females can determine your immune system's strength from your body odor! A University had conducted this experiment and its very real. they took a bunch of guys and asked them how often they got sick. then the guys played a basketball game and got all sweaty and smelly. their wet sweaty smelly shirts were put on a table for the females to smell. now the girls never had any contact with the guys, and they were simply asked to decide which shirt smelled the "nicest", and they all chose the same shirt, and it was the very shirt of the guy who got sick the least) = baby/child having a good immune system, protecting it from dying from disease.
females interrogate males, wanting to find out what they're like, will they be gone in the morning or will they stay and help raise the kid, are they violent and yell all the time which is unhealthy and dangerous for the kid and herself, do they care about kids or do they want nothing to do with kids, they want to know if the guy is rich or not, etc etc etc.
Also, to further their knowledge, females "chat and compare" the males' characteristics with each other, "boy/guy talk", just like with shopping, they want to get the best deal, the best male. they compare "notes" with each other on the different guys
money, as it is the means to whatever is needed, just as female gorillas like the male gorilla with the most resources/food, the female human wants the male with the most money, as that money can be used to get whatever resource she needs. this is well proven. money is a huge deal to a female, as the reason she wants a male in the first place is that he can provide for her and the baby.
Male's preferences in his female mate:
THEE NUMBER 1 PREFERENCE = the magic ratio: 7/10 (waist/hips).
the closer the girl is to 7/10 (0.7), the more the guy wants her. A university did this experiment. every single guy chose the same girl as the hawtest, the girl with the closest waist/hip ratio to 0.7, none of the guys knew what girl the other guys chose, and the experiment was repeated over and over, with different guys, moving the desired girl around, putting her on the side of the line of girls, having the other girls be a step forward and she back a step from them, having your "pin-up" girl in dead center, didn't matter, test after test, guy after guy, always chose the female with the closest to 0.7 waist/hip ratio.
I'd theorize that this has to be the perfect size for child birth'ing, as I don't know what else it could be other then this, lol. Ya, we like girl's hourglass figure, but why? so, to me, it must have to do with successful child birth'ing. As we don't want the child to die in birth, nor our lovely wives either, hehe.
the more beautiful the girl = the more she and her baby is a "fort knox". If the girl's hot, many guys will care about her and protect her, even give thier lives for her, as the last thing we guys want is to lose that hot girl as we want/hope to mate with her. whereas an ugly girl, guys would just watch her die/get killed, no big deal, no big loss, she's not a good source for keeping that baby safe or provided for or even in getting a baby possibly. So, by wanting a hot girl, she and her baby will be well-protected and provided for, ensuring the baby's safety and wel-being, as well as the hot girl's. And it's a sure thing that a hot girl is going to have a baby, lol. A hot girl is going to get guys to provide stuff and assistance for her baby, her baby will get provided for, whatever it needs, because the girl is hot, as how nor why would a guy not try to help her, when it might mean mating with her.
we can see that hot girls (and guys too) get more help and care than ugly girls (or guys).
it's a simple experiment, have an ugly girl/guy drop their stuff, and see if anyone helps them pick it up. now do the same with an ugly guy/girl.
large mammary glands = (I presume) at least our perception anyways of having more milk, "to which feed the baby(ies) with". perceived ample nurishment for the baby(ies), so they grow big and strong and healthy.
gluteous maximus = we do like it, but why... I don't know... lol
the female has her body, but doesn't have the resources, so she wants a guy with the resources, MONEY, and in exchange, she gives the male, her body, which is what he wants as that is what he doesn't have, lol.
the male has the resources, but doesn't have the female body (lol), so he wants a female with a body, a hot body, and in exchange, she can spend his money on whatever she wants.
Survival of the Fittest
I think we all understand this, and we humans are animals, and are still under the laws of nature, and that means survival of the fittest.
the more capable people are going to acquire power/wealth/social prestige, and with that wealth, they'll be able to afford "designer babies", making their children even smarter, more capable, more sexy, and etc...
just as it is with two lions, the more capable lion is going to get the meat, living for another day, whereas the other lion dies of starvation.
or take the U.S., it has done whatever it wanted in the world, because of its power and wealth, over other countries.
Survival of the Prettiest
beauty is power
more attractive people make more money
more attractive people get the jobs
more attractive people get the partner that they want
more attractive people get what tehy want
more attractive people get away with stuff (less punished)
complexion (darker skin vs lighter skin = deals with sunlight intake/relfection)
distance between eyes (closer together eyes are more attrractive, further apart eyes are less attractive)
proportionately (facial features/measurements match up to each other, for an example, a person with a huge nose or ears on a tiny face or head, as you're probably imagining, is quite ugly)
upturned nostrils/nose vs downturned nostrils/nose
ears that stick out vs ears that are flat against head
cheek bones, high or low
dimples or not
shape of head and face
size of head/skull
etc etc etc
obviously we see the importance of prettiness in animals too, with their displays of beauty, for attracting mates, just as beauty does with humans.
by getting married, the female becomes that male's property, which is for the most part respected as such by the other males, leaving the now "owned" and non-availble off-limits married female alone, pursuing other non-"owned" and available non-married females
the "Smile" = the GROWL
actually what we think and love as the "smile", is in fact a growl.
lips pulled back and up, teeth baring, lower lip/jaw jutting forward, ready to bite, yep that's exactly what our "smile" is.
so, what happened ???
how/why did the growl become perceived as our "smile" of today?
and especially when there's all the Medical Smile Science as being very curative to the human body, and all that.
how did the "bad-frightening" growl become the good-pleasant smile in our species' perception ???
about ensuring viablo offpsring:
what's more important? Quality or Quantity? How about both?
the male ensures quantity of offspring, by (unfaithfully) mating with multiple women, as one of those impregnated women will hopefully have a successful offspring who when older will have his/her own offspring. The male's body is built and his duty is to make as many babies as he can, get as many women pregnant as he can.
the female ensures quality of offpsring. She wants the BEST male, so that it's the BEST baby possible. So, the women interrogates and investigates and shops for the BEST male to mate with. So the baby has the BEST genes. Also her body is more limited in how many babies she can have, so that too contributes to her behavior of finding the BEST male to mate with.
at age 2, humans already understand the full concept and implications of deception. Yes, we are very good "Liers and Deceivers".
animals know deception too, as deception is extremely important for survival in the wild.
Last edited by HegemonKhan; June 29, 2011 at 07:53 PM.
The moment you went from biology implying behavior meant you went from real biology to fancies of anthropology.
First of all, natural selection is an observable process over generations. It is not directional. It is a cumulative effect occurring over generations, so you cannot use that to justify social behaviors occurring in a single lifetime (or social Darwinism).
Second, you seem to believe women are only designed for sex and that men do everything else. That's rather slanted.
Thirdly... I did appreciate the tidbit about wolves, that was interesting. Please say more about that, it's interesting.
these are just generalizations that do tend to be correct for generalizations of social gender roles, as obviously for both males and females there's a wide range of them, males that are very female-like and females that are very male-like. female humans are the ones that DO get pregnant, their bodies are for pregnancy and birth, and for most of our history, females tend to be domestic, staying at home dealing with the families and communities, whereas the males do their guarding/war and "foreign affair stuff". Male Gorilla's will do perimeter checks of their territories, adjusting their formations and being silent when they're approaching an invading animal into their territory, much like our own military and its tactics.
sex requires two people, male and female, the male is just as designed for sex as the female is, lol. just not pregnancy. but, while the female's body endures the pregnancy, the male's body endures hunting/providing and guarding/protecting or whatever, bringing back food and resources needed by the female and the in-coming baby, as the female is unable to go get her own food, while she is pregnant. both work together, "divide and conquering" what needs to be done, specialization is extremely ingenius and effective.
this is because, its now been discovered that nearly all the characteristics that make one "male" and "female", are actually due to testosterone and estrogen chemicals, which both males and females have, and is NOT based upon whether you have a Y chromosome or not.
if you got more testosterone than estrogen, you're have "male" characteristics, if you have more estrogen, you have "female" characteristics.
this has been displayed with artificial taking of more testosterogen (steroids and supplements), females will get whiskers and deeper voice more muscle definition and etc. And with males, a curious thing happens, it's like if the testosterogen gets too high, it resets back to a low amount, which can cause female-like breast development and testicular shrinkage in males, as can be read on their labels.
one type survives and the other type gets eaten/dies/killed, based on the current environment or circumstances. obviously the eaten type isn't able to be making offspring, and this type soon vanishes, goes extinct. Whereas, the type that doesn't get eaten, is producing offspring, populating the world with its type. that's natural selection.
but more loosely, it can be used laymen-wise for immediate changes. "If an idiot teenager moves right in front of a car, not paying attention, and gets killed, that's 'natural selection' at work too, lol"
more simply, natural selection could be thought of as the consequences based upon your characteristics and behaviors in relation to the current environment or circumstance/situation. though it's technical definition is the bolded part.
I'm not trying to human-morals justify anything as that is a human concept/concern (right/wrong, just/injust, fair/unfair, equal/unequal, deserved/undeserved, etc). I'm attempting to explain **WHY** we behave the way we do, in terms of science. behaviorialism. Sociology, Psychology, Economical, Philosophical/Idealogical, biological, sexual, competition, preferences, inequality, hatred, limited resources, and etc.
also, social gender roles can be easily switched too, as they are learned behaviors, though obviously you can't change the biological stuff, you can't get the male body to be the one that carries the pregnancy, nor change the female into the one who does the fertilization, lol.
there are some societies, albiet few, where the females behave in the male's social gender role, being the warriors, and the males as the domestic "house wives/mothers", caring for the young, while the females are away, doing their "war stuff and hunting/getting food/providing" for the "domestic caretaker house wives/mother males".
females can certainly be the "bread winners" as much as males, but one of the parents has to take care of the kids (be it the female or the male), or both work and they have another person take care of their kids. in the past usually it was the male who went to work, as the female is usually better at the rearing of children than a male, however, this is changing now, as males seem to be coming more lazy, not being bread winners (more females are going to higher learning now than males), and so the female is adapting to the changing in the males, becoming the "bread winners" who go to work everyday and bring home the pay check. Life will adjust and adapt, as we see it happening all the time.
here's some school papers I written on human behavior:
that addresses this topic and explains why "Naruto's dream of peace" is impossible in the real world
Originally Posted by HegemonKhan
Originally Posted by HegemonKhan
Originally Posted by HegemonKhan
Last edited by HegemonKhan; July 02, 2011 at 02:22 AM.
Darwin do not apply to humans since there is no more natural selection.
Also saying our life mainly aimed toward reproduction is quite restrictive. I was just hearing the medical program of France culture this morning. The subject was women and menopause. One of the first topic was completely contradictory with this hypothesis. A woman life expectancy is now 90 years old (in modern country) whereas she can make babies only while she is between 15 and 50. Which means half of her life is not aimed at the reproduction. And since our societies are aging more and more, it means they are going further and further away from this principle
some more wolf/dog stuff:Originally Posted by EarthForge
they really are amazing animals, as they can understand humans so well, read our body language, know our emotional state, understand our language somewhat through our tone of voice, as wolves/dogs language itself is distinct by many tones, there's the rally or "here I am" howl, the warning growl, the pup begging/comforting sounds, etc etc etc.
they're structure is exactly like humans:
Alpha Male and Alpha Female = the only ones who mate, as they want the best offspring for their pack = the leaders (usually extremely intelligent and wise, they got a pack to keep alive) = makes all the decisions
Beta Male (maybe can be female too) = the Enforcer/Protector/"warrior" = "2nd in command"
"Kappa" = the nervous/suspcious wolf = great for sentry, constantly on look out, distrustful and watchful, "judgeful/judging", warning the pack of danger
Omega = the peacekeeper/peacemaker/mediator = he/she keeps conflicts from esculating within the group, morale support too.
the rest of the pack members.
all wolves love their cubs, they all participate in the rearing of the cubs, males and females alike.
the wolves respect the mating alpha male and female, though an alpha can be challenged if he's a bad leader or if the young wolf thinks he/she should be alpha. none of the wolves mate except for the alphas. all the other female wolves help the alpha female with the cubs becoming her cubs' nannies.
wolf pups are taught about survival, adult wolves will find the horns of an antelop, pick it up in their mouths, and swing it swing to side, just like an antelop as the cubs try to learn to hunt it, teaching the cubs to stay away from those horns, to attack from the sides.
there's a female dog that has over 2,000 stuffed toys in its room, and she knows every single one of them by verbal-spoken name and exactly where they are in her room (I soooo need that dog to find my stuff in my messy house and room, lol). even more amazing, the scientist got a new stuffed animal toy and hid it in the dog's room. the scientist than verbal-spokenly named/described the new toy, and the dog went and found that new toy almost instantly.
obviously we have many accounts/records of dogs caring for abandoned human babies, and we know that dogs will give their lives for a totally different species, us-humans, which is embarassing as most humans won't give their lives for other humans, let alone an entirely different species.
even when there seems to be a brutal fight amongst dogs/wolves rarely are they actually injured beyond scrapes and bruises. their jaws are like their hands, they have extreme control, and they are very careful, and so they rarely actually harm each other, even though it seems so brutal to us. to what is a brutal violent fight to us, is actually a non-injurious disciplination. we often mistake this and don't understand/realize it, as when humans fight, we fight to injure/hurt others, we don't realize that the dogs/wolves are just disciplining their social standands and societal norms on each other, when they act out of line, and almost never actually hurt each other.
Also, the cuts that occur, are licked by by the dogs/wolves afterwards, as their saliva helps heal the cut faster and keeps it safe from infection.
a dog/wolf world is about smell. their nose and smell is what eyes and sight is to us. a dog/wolf gets all of its information through smell. Humans need to be mindful of this, as it's how the dogs/wolves base their decided actions upon. If you're confident and relaxed, the dog/wolf is going to respect and mind you, if you're unconfident and nervous/uneasy, the dog/wolf could care less about you, as you're a "loser" to it and so it won't mind or listen to you at all, or it may even attack you, as it doesn't any part of your mental weakness infecting its pack.
instead of murdering wolves, which we humans love to do as our solution - kill stuff, we can merely play a recording of the sound of a wolf territorial response howl, and the romaing wolves will respect it, staying out of the farmers/herders territory.
this is the really awesome show that I saw, when it was teaser'ed-aired some years back, they're making it into a multiple part series, to make more money, and it hasn't been aired since, as they want you to buy the dvd of it, which I am so going to do when it's out, or soon if it already is out now, lol.
this guy's howl was compared to a wolf's howl using a sound/frequency whatever machine, and his was perfectly aligned with a wolf's howl. among many other mazing things, this guy really knows wolf behavior. hehe.
a website on the mongols that I really like, which also includes this article about wolves and human society, which i like:
and of course there's Jack London's book, the Call of the Wild, hehe.
---------- Post added at 03:08 PM ---------- Previous post was at 02:18 PM ----------
-when "Nature Calls, Nature Calls! And we answer it! LOL" (when you have to go to the bathroom, you have to go to the bathroom, nothing can break this but one of many "Laws of Nature", hehe)
Life is about continuing life. Now as individuals, humans as well as other organisms, have their own surface-superficial-perceived interests, but underneath every action/behavior we do is about reproduction/sex, attracting the opposite gender and mating.
according to my anthropology teacher:
Human females *CAN* have babies past age 50, however, the baby is more and more likely to be majorly damaged/unhealthy/deformed/still born/dead/immaturely born/etc.
for females, age 50 is the "cut-off date" for healthy ova (eggs), as any baby-making after age 50 have a higher and higher chance of being deformed, defective, inferior/unhealthy, complications, or dead/stillborn.
males continue to make healthy spermatozoa until age 80. After age 80, there's more and more of a chance that the baby will be majorly unhealthy/damaged/deformed/still born/pre-maturely born/dead/etc
also, females do create more eggs, albiet like only 1-2 per year or every other year, after the 50 eggs are used up and beyond age 50.
everytime a human female gives birth, she breaks one of her pelvic bones, and it repairs itself back together, only to be broken again with the next birth (if there is one) of at least 9 months away, or more-longer away
the youngest human mother on record/documented is 5 years old, some 5 year old girl was holding HER baby in her arms. Her development/puberty/maturity happened soon alright, 5 years old !!!!
Human females start with like 728752948748937489274 eggs, but by the time they're a fetus/born, they are reduced to having only ~ 50 eggs.
which are released at regular monthly intervals (and the removal of old eggs and placenta, having her periods) a time during ovulation from the first period to menopause
there's two parts to continuance:
1. sex = producing offpsring
2. viable offpring = offspring has to reach maturity and have it's own offpsring
#2 requires REARING, which is certainly something that adults do, like grandparents, women over 50, so older women are still useful and needed for continuance, as they can help raise, rear, teach, guide the offspring to behave in a way that increases the chance it makes it to puberty, impresses a mate, and then mates.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Menopause, at the botton it talks about how grandmothers still have a role in the raising of children, which is about continuance, viable offspring.
females can adjust their bodies, changing their gestation (pregnancy) times and having larger or smaller "litters" (more or less babies per pregnancy)
there was a coyote problem for humans. so humans go out and kill coyotes, however once the coyote population got in the danger zone, the females coyotes body changed, they had more babies more often, and soon the coyote population not only was back to its original size again, but it actually went even beyond its original size. the humans made their coyote problem worse, as they didn't understand that life adapts and/or evolves, as it strives to survive.
also, it is possible for male humans' breast gene to "switch on", causing us male humans to lactate, though only in an extreme emergency.
the human body, and all of life itself, is truly amazing and powerful.
as said in Jurassic Park (1), "Life finds a way", hehe.
Humans ARE adapting/evolving, we're turning into aliens, huge cranians, with tiny mouths/chins. seriously take your generic picture of an alien's head and compare it to human heads, especially some female celebrities, exactly the same shape, only difference is that our human heads aren't green, lol.
this is because, intelligence is our desired trait, so our brains are being bred bigger and bigger, which means bigger craniums/heads for it. Due to our soft processed food, we have less and less need for teeth, jaws, and mouth, and so our mouth/jaw/teeth is getting smaller and smaller, until it disappears.
I myself, had/has such a small mouth, that it couldn't fit my teeth. Not only did I have to ahve my 4 wisdom teeth removed, but 4 more of my permanent teeth as well.
humans normally have:
(2-1-2-3) x 4 quadrants (upper left, upper right, lower elft, lower right) = 32 teeth
2 incisors = tearing/cutting
1 canine = piercing/puncturing
2 pre-molars = crushing
3 molars (including the wisdom tooth) = grinding
I personally have:
(2-1-1-2) x 4 = 24 teeth
2 molars (no wisdom tooth)
the fertilized egg has its own DNA, it's a new organism (a "living breathing" baby), and is not apart of the mother at all, and thus the mother's immune system sees the fertilized egg as an invading foreign body that must be killed. A female has developed three methods of dealing with her hostile immune system trying to kill her fertilized egg:
1. get the fertilized egg out of her body! our egg laying oganisms.
2. get the fertilized egg "half-way out of the body". our marsupials with their pouch like the kangaroo.
3. create a protective barrier, that shields the fertilized egg, from being known about by the mother's white blood cells (immune system). our placenta organisms, such as humans.
Last edited by HegemonKhan; June 29, 2011 at 06:12 PM.
You didn't address my points, Khan. Also, you are trying to argue physical anthropology without the traditional groundwork. Your observations come from history, which is presented with a bias. Traditionally observations come from the study of primates, like Jane Goodall's work. I don't see you referencing or using this professional style, so understand that your arguments do not come as in the style of professional anthropology.
I think humans in general are not hunters, they were gatherers. Realize that we were a relatively weak primate in contrast to African predators, e.g. the ancestors of lions. It would make more sense that we scavenged instead of hunting to begin with. Gender differences do exist, like size and weight, but they mean nothing to societal constructs.
In my opinion (and only my opinion, not stating a fact), men are beasts of burden and women are gatherers, but I don't want to rationalize it.
I would like to hear about your work in another thread, but I think you are misapplying it to anthropology.
well, I only took one anthropology class so far, and/but I really enjoyed it, was very fascinating, I'd love to take more anthrology classes (as well as philosophy too, as I really liked it as well, hehe). Also, I'm still only doing random undergraduate classes (still no idea what major I wanna pursue or what i want to do in life, sighs), so I haven't been taught nor practiced how to write professionally yet, except a bit with history. I write much better though in school thankfully, than I do here, lol. Though that's partly because I'm able to put more time into it than a quick "jot down" of my thoughts here as posts.
our ancesters were gatherers with powerful teeth eating those hard root plants/grass ~7 mya or further back in time, forgot what those hard root plants/grass were called though, argh, it's been awhile since my anthropology class...
and great apes are not the "bottom of the food chain", only we humans are. Gorrilas and baboons are just as dangerous to a lion as a lion is to them. Baboons esepecially have a lot of nasty long teeth
google: pics: baboon teeth
google: pics: lion teeth
almost identical, or maybe the baboon's teeth are actually a bit longer, hehe. both can do serious damage to each other.
also, the great apes have their social-pack intelligence too. while lions too have prides (their group name) and are social, much less so than the great apes. great apes have military tactics (male gorilla's perimeter patrols have been seen changing their formations, which shows quite some "human-like" intelligence) whereas lions don't.
here's some of my anthropology notes (I still have them, lol):
Originally Posted by HegemonKhan--------------------------------------Originally Posted by HegemonKhan
sorry about that! could you tell me which points ? as I'm not quite sure which ones you mean.Originally Posted by Earthforge
Last edited by HegemonKhan; June 29, 2011 at 06:48 PM.
There is no more natural selection in human society. There can be some natural mutation, but how the best ones can be selected when we tend to preserve all the people weak or strong. We are now even giving help to families which can not have children whereas they obviously have some gene which do not benefit human race in term of reproduction. We include in our society, homosexual, handicapped people, we even make law so that they are treated the same way of the others.
If you have 24 teeth, this superior gene have very few chance to spread further, since the 32 teeth weak gene human will continue to keep this 32 teeth holder in their herd despite all nature tentative to get rid of it.
In fact human society evolve much more nowadays through technology than with natural selection. We can not survive like your coyotes, it takes 15 years to make a mature human and woman can only do 1 baby per year. And I'm pretty sure pregnancy length will tend to increase rather than decrease.
btw I think you are wrong with your egg number. 50 makes 50/12~=4 years. But it doesn't change the fact that human have now separated sex from reproduction. in most of developed countries, we even have a reproduction rate below the 2 required . So I believe, if we only take biological facts into account, we are rather going toward decadence than alien transformation
natural selection always exists:
arctic people have light skin, equatorial people have dark skin. mountain people are shorter with more powerful lungs than sea level people. we select smarter and smarter humans, look at the society of males of today vs the society of males of the past. we select taller males, and so our population is getting taller and taller (yes, good/better health is also a huge factor in this as well, due to better knowledge, technology, medicine, etc). etc etc etc
in the past (~600 years ago and further back), it's been all about the strong and physically powerful warrior male, now it's not, our society is no more about having strong powerful males to protect their families, now it's about "intelligent scientists or businessmen and socially adept girly-feminine-men". Warriors are being naturally selected out of human society, as the only places left for warrior males is sports, law enforcement, and the military. Any violent conduct outside of these "arenas/professions" get you imprisoned, lol.
and what is interesting, as we males become more feminine, what are we now seeing?
females are becoming more male-like. fighting more and more with each other, competing over males (where its usually the males who fight with each other over females), going to work at big companies or becoming powerful lawyers - being the bread winners, etc etc etc.
life must have both social gender roles, so as/if the male becomes more feminine, than females start to adjust, becoming more masculine, taking on our roles as we start to become and take on the feminine roles.
yes I had 32 teeth like everyone else, but my jaw/mouth has gotten bred so small, it could no longer contain those 32 teeth, and so I had to have 8 of my teeth removed.
the adaptation/micro evolution, is that I have no need for my mouth/jaw/teeth anymore, and that's why after generations, my mouth/jaw is so small, unable to contain 32 teeth.
there's direct history/evidence of this:
humans mouths/jaws are disappearing, becoming smaller and smaller (as we don't need eating/chewing/crushing/cutting mechanisms due to our processed soft foods we eat), while our craniums for bigger and bigger brains is increasing, and we call this look, the alien look (or it's more likely that our illustrations of aliens have merely been a subconscious documentation of how we're changing/evolving into these "aliens")
nope, the 50 egg number is more or less correct (well, maybe its 60 eggs, lol)
50-10=40 x 12 = 480 eggs according to ovulation
(I just used 10 as it made the math easier, puberty/having first period obviously varies at what age that it occurs)
this is however wrong, as human females totally do NOT have 480 eggs once they become a fetus/born. so, 480 eggs is totally incorrect.
so, I'm not sure how to explain this, maybe eggs aren't actually released at every olulation period, and if the egg is fertilized, doesn't the ovulation stops until birth occurs ??
meh... need a girl or expert on this, lol. this female stuff isn't really interesting/important to me, anyways.. lol
actually human females can change tehir body's gestation and number of babies per pregnancy, though definately not to the extreme of the female coyote, hehe
normally you have 1-3 babies per pregnancy, but then there's some women who can have sextuplets (6? babies, a litter - meow!, lol), and maybe there's been even more than that too...
so female's body's can certainly change, just again not to the extreme of the female coyote, lol.
Societal adaptation/micro evolution:
"middle income" families:
1-2 kids, sometimes 3 but its rare comapred to 1-2 kids
poor families and non-industrialized countries:
---------- Post added at 06:09 AM ---------- Previous post was at 05:30 AM ----------
back about African predators:
lions don't mess with gorrilas too. 800 lbs of solid muscle, having such force that a gorrila's "slap" to a human's head, can physically-literally decaptate it, or they can smash their fist into a human's head and shatter it like a sledge hammer coming down on a watermellon.
and then we got the smaller, less massive chimp (about the same of a human, but much more powerful, more muscle mass, than a human), in an infamous case here in the U.S. of the woman's face being ripped apart by it (there's this DUMBFK american women who had a chimp for a pet, and she invited over a women friend of hers, the chimp theorizingly saw the women friend as a threat/competition, and so the chimp attack the women friend, as the chimp women owner watched in horror helpless and unable to do anything, as even stabbing it with a knife failed to stop it, as the chimp ripped her woman friend's face apart. It seems the chimp was a female)
google: chimp rips off women's face
this poster's (cloud's) post has much of the info on it: http://atrl.net/forums/showthread.php?p=2585954#2585954
Spoiler: WARNING! article about Oprah interviewing the women and it has a pic of her reconnstructed face, it is not pretty, so if faint of heart then do not click on link below show
so, the great apes are certainly no easy prey for a lion, but if you mean a human being, then yes, we humans are certainly easy prey for a lion (excluding our brain's ability of technology-weapons, hehe)
Last edited by HegemonKhan; June 30, 2011 at 09:00 AM.
Your natural selection examples are based on genes transformation that took place thousands of years ago. From what I know, the descendent of African slaves color has not change despite 4 centuries living out of Africa. Nowadays there is (a little) evolution, but there is no selection.
We are taller because we eat better food not because of evolution. And intelligent people are not selected. Stupid people can do has many babies as the intelligent one. I would even say they tend to do more because of lack of education.
Our behaviour change because of education, not because of natural selection. Mai 68 has changed more in terms of social behaviour in one month than thousand years of natural selection.
And I found the wikipedia article about Woman number of ovums
That makes ~180 000 eggs at puberty and ~1000 at menopause. I don't know where your 50 comes from but it is obviously false. Especially since I read that several follicles mature at the same time each month but only one reaches maturity (seems like there is still natural selection among eggs :-)
Last edited by k-dom; June 30, 2011 at 11:49 AM.
thanks for correcting me! I was wrong about the amount of eggs (my apologizes, faulty memory), you're generally right, as from a university website about it, it says:
~400,000 follicles (potential eggs) all already formed by/before when birth comes around
but, only several hundred of these (potential) eggs will actually be ovulated.
I'm not sure how much this means though, as it's ambigious. Technically, several means 3, which would ~300. But several is often used more loosely and not confined to meaning specifically 3.
to change your melanum (however its spelled) cell amount in your skin, (this what causes light skin and dark skin, the more packed together melanum blocks sunlight from entering your body, and makes your skin look dark. and vice versa), theoretically-guessingly it would take let's say ~10,000 or maybe more years. So, that's why we don't see any africans in scandanavia getting light skin, nor scandanavians in africa getting dark skin.
a quicker, display of melanum at work is with getting a tan or not, how easily you sun-burn or not.
or you can do whatever Michael Jackson did to himself, lol (unless it was actually from having the disease melanoma - in which I shouldn't be laughing, though I don't know if he had this isease or not).
could you be more detailed about this or explain what you're talking about, what you mean, as I'm not able to respond to it as it is:
----------------Originally Posted by k-dom
we are partly taller because we have more healthy lives. the other part is natural selection and whatever else is a factor.
we do select to breed/mate with taller people and smarter people, and that's why humanity has been getting taller and smarter. that's natural selection at work.
Our food is sooo NOT better !!!! processed food, all nutritional value taken out of food (example: white rice), fast food, chemical altered food, genetically engineered food, etc...
you can think that natural selection stops, but let me make it aboslutely clear, natural selection always exists and is always functioning upon all life, including us, as we are life too. this is science we're talking about. Saying and thinking natural selection doesn't effect humans, is like saying that gravity doesn't effect humans. it's absurdly incorrect.
Last edited by HegemonKhan; June 30, 2011 at 04:04 PM.
Well since this is kinda your thread I'm gonna move this stuff over, since it really became rather about terraforming then energy politics ^^
It would still take an eternity. Imagine how it began on earth, we already had water and big seas and all that stuff until bacteria could produce O2, and that takes millions of years to get anything done. And looking at the pathetic amounts of stuff we can bring to space, it will take enormous leaps in rocket science to just build a very basic base there. There are pretty easy boundaries: A lot of energy is required to transport mass up to space in a space ship, too.
Mars does probably not have CO2. There is pretty much no pressure on the surface and no atmosphere, so CO2 would definitly be a gas but cannot be hold by a planet without atmosphere.
Going to Mars is a reasonable next goal, terraforming it is not.
About the chemistry: CH4 is methane, Hydrocarbons in general consist of carbon chains and hydrogen, and the longer the chain the higher the melting/boiling points (so that around Butane, C4H10, hydrocarbons are rather liquid or even solid under normal earthly conditions). If there is a C-O-H bond on a hydrocarbon, it is an alcohol (Ethanol: H3C-CH2OH), and with two oxygens it's an carbolyxic acid.
The amount of different materials that are required for life is enormous, and many of the molecules involved are very hard to process, such as nitrogen molecules.
I would not really trust in a web source like the one you linked. The amount of people who preferr science fiction over todays' science is huge. In Germany, there was a famous scientific television show "Alpha Centauri" made by a professor of astro physics, who was able to explain such problems very well. Mainly explained facts about what is a black whole, how does it come into existence, what are neutron stars etc... but sometimes left that part to talk about the possibilities of aliens and such.
here's a decent read of evolution and natural selection, though its from a philosophical approach:
and here's my own example of how natural selection can still occur with humans:
as our pollution eats up our O3 (Ozone), and the earth receives more radiation, light-skinned people will die off, making less babies than dark skinned people. As the dark skinned people are making more babies, slowly humanity will become populated with dark skinned people, and possibly light skinned people can even disappear/go extinct.
the website was just something quickly I was able find online to post down... I hadn't really looked over it though to see how good/authentic/accurate it actually is.
this link below seems (if I understand it welll enough) to be saying that Mars does have an atmosphere and such, so terraforming should be possible (though we both agree it's not practical - it'll take way too long, though if we survive and continue generationally in domes, then this lengthy time amount wouldn't be an issue, as eventually we could get mars terraform, lol):
"What's the Martian Climate Like Today?
The current Martian climate is regulated by seasonal changes of the carbon dioxide ice caps, the movement of large amounts of dust by the atmosphere and the exchange of water vapor between the surface and the atmosphere. One of the most dynamic weather patterns on Mars is the generation of dust storms that generally occur in the southern spring and summer. These storms can grow to encompass the whole planet. Understanding how these storms develop and grow is one goal of future climatic studies." -taken from the link above
(i would ahve liked to seen that show, hehe, well the scientific part of it, not the alien part, unless they're talking scientifically about the possibility of aliens or whatever like that, lol)
(there's an awesome older computer game, a civilization-like type game by firaxis, called Alpha Centauri and its xpac, Alien Crossfire, and there's a very old school computer game somewhat like simcity, called Outpost, both games have a lot of real space science and also scientific sci-fiction or scientific "sci-fantasy", hehe)
Last edited by HegemonKhan; June 30, 2011 at 04:52 PM.
If we take the height into account. According to Insee (French statistics organization), the mean height in France has grown from 10cm over the last century. This growth is too quick to be explain by evolution. The main factor is food. You can think what you want about modern food (and I would probably agree with you for once) but at least we don't lack it, it's more diverse than centuries ago and most of us can afford to eat much more meat than our ancestors. If evolution was one of the cause, then we would see it elsewhere (hence my skin color example) but we do not.
As for intelligence it depends on your time period, if you state that we are more intelligent than australopitheques, it's evolution. If you state that we are more intelligent than people in middle age, then it's education.
For natural selection you need 2 things :
1 : an evolution factor that will make you better adapted to your environment
2 : a higher reproduction rate for this factor so that he can supplant the old one
In our modern society, humans can adapt to almost every environment rapidly thanks to technology. Hence, even if an evolution factor appears, point 2 has very few chance to happen because the weaker factors can reproduce on equal ground because they have technological way to adapt themselves. Also I have already stated that the reproduction rate has become a highly sociological issue. We don't make more babies because we are more adapted than the others.
The only way where evolution can occur again is a big catastrophe which would prevent humanity to recur on technology.
As for Mars discussion, you made me laugh when you asked yourself how many light years distance it is :-). A few minutes light are sufficient.
But it certainly has an atmosphere, after check it is even mainly CO2. Also the atmosphere pressure is only 1/10th of the one we have on Earth. Our lungs and heart would need to adapt to that.
And if you look at the rate success of the missions to Mars, terraformation has a long way to go
Last edited by k-dom; July 01, 2011 at 10:30 AM.
Oh LOL yay! We're talking about Mars, my favorite!! So, the dominant hypothesis for why water may have previously existed on Mars is that an asteroid impact severely distorted and weakened the magnetic field. In turn, this leads to erosion of the atmosphere (what I'm studying). Analysis of this may yield that life was once on Mars and that there may still be extremophiles on Mars like hypolithic cyanobacteria.
So when we go to it, I think it should definitely start as pure research since Mars is fascinating, and isn't just another dead rock, but a world on it's own that we can colonize eventually. But first comes the study.
I don't believe we have the technology to terraform yet, but hey, prove me wrong. It's interesting.
I think the assumption is that Mars is too different. I think it's worthwhile to investigate, since there may be resources that we can use there. Remember, we know very little about Mars. In fact, just recently, what was thought of as definitive proof denying the existence of life on Mars just became definitive proof supporting life on Mars because of the perchlorates in the soil.