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View Poll Results: Who wins?

Voters
163. You may not vote on this poll
  • Madara

    70 42.94%
  • Itachi

    93 57.06%
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Thread: Madara vs Itachi

  1. #166
    The Green Knight MH中毒 / MH Chuudoku / MH Addicted Gats's Avatar
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    Re: Madara vs Itachi

    Quote Originally Posted by IChallengeYou! View Post
    http://www.mangareader.net/93-41585-...apter-475.html

    I assume he means this. I would say he didn't touch him here, too. Although the panel is so small and unclear, it's hard to say.
    He touched him, his body was under his feet when he get out of the ground. Even if it was offscreen, Madara had to touch before and did after this fight, so it's clear enough.

  2. #167
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    Re: Madara vs Itachi

    Quote Originally Posted by IChallengeYou! View Post


    Yes he knew, actually. Zetsu was talking about it, remember? It was he who explained how it worked, actually. So if Zetsu knew, then obviously Madara knows as well.
    Actually Zetsu asks what is that? and They have heard about the sword and were quite suprised that Itachi had it!

    Quote Originally Posted by IChallengeYou! View Post
    And? His arsenal is limited, but that doesn't mean that he cannot beat opponents of Itachi's caliber. If that would've been the case, Itachi would kill Madara long time ago.
    I am not saying that he cannot beat Itachi! and even Madara himself did say that he was lucky to keep some secrets from Itachi, if not he had not he would already have been dead.
    And in a fight secrets do tend to become revealed.


    Quote Originally Posted by IChallengeYou! View Post
    They were equal. No one could beat anyone. It was said so in the manga. The battle at VOTE is just one big mistery yet to be solved.
    Again true, but at the end he did lose!



    Quote Originally Posted by IChallengeYou! View Post

    And where did you get that from, if I may ask?
    Easy, Naruto vs Sasuke will probably be a 50/50 match! Itachi fights Sasuke after giving Naruto some of his power and is deadly ill, and still Sasuke didn't stand a chance! But in this fight Itachi is perfectly fit to fight! so yes I would guess he would fight Naruto on pair, but thats for another fight!

    Quote Originally Posted by IChallengeYou! View Post
    That's awesome, considering we haven't seen jack about prime Madara's powers. Madara didn't retreat after Minato's fight to make a new plan on how to defeat him, Minato died already. So how is that relevant to Itachi vs Madara...No clue. And you're to say that Madara doesn't know about Itachi's powers (as laughable as that may sound), but Itachi knows about Madara's powers? I personally see no way for Itachi to escape Madara's suckering Jutsu, especially he DOESN'T use it as a last resort. So Itachi wouldn't even have time to react, let alone escape it. Minato did it because he has really fast reflexes and his own S/T jutsu, while Itachi doesn't.
    Minato did not die before after Madara retreated! It was not more relevant then I said i thought the conclusion would be pretty much the same with Itachi vs Madara.. Again I never said that Itachi did know about Madara's powers! He must have known some of them like the Suckering jutsu which seems to be his prime power at the moment! they did after all fight side by side vs rest of the uchiha!
    And honestly we haave no idea how strong Itachi actually was! He crushed Kakashi, He played with Orochimaru at his prime, and Danzou was scared of him. He must have been something special! That's why I do belive that Itachi would be strong maybe even fast and smart enough to know what to do against Madara's one trick! SUckering JUTSU!

    Madara will probably come up with more tricks up his sleeve as the manga continues! but for now, he has not impressed at all with his fighting skills. yes he did fight a weak konan and fuu and torune!
    We will have to wait and see! but for now! I say Itachi.. I cannot wait to see if Madara becomes as powerful as he should be!
    Last edited by deni2k; July 19, 2011 at 09:29 AM.

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  4. #168
    Registered User 英雄メンバー / Eiyuu Menbaa / Hero Member IChallengeYou!'s Avatar
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    Re: Madara vs Itachi

    Quote Originally Posted by Gats View Post
    He touched him, his body was under his feet when he get out of the ground.
    ...? Elaborate.

    Quote Quote:
    Even if it was offscreen, Madara had to touch before and did after this fight, so it's clear enough.
    I don't think so. It was clear enough when he suckered in the first guy, but not here.

    Quote Originally Posted by deni2k View Post
    Minato did not die before after Madara retreated! It was not more relevant then I said i thought the conclusion would be pretty much the same with Itachi vs Madara..
    I didn't say that he did die BEFORE Madara retreated. I said that your conclusion didn't make sense since it wasn't the case to begin with.

    Quote Quote:
    Again I never said that Itachi did know about Madara's powers! He must have known some of them like the Suckering jutsu which seems to be his prime power at the moment! they did after all fight side by side vs rest of the uchiha!
    Assuming he actually suckered in anyone at that fight, aren't we? Assuming that he actually took a major part in it? And why would he actually know about Madara's powers, they didn't really go on missions together in Akatsuki, did they? (even if they did, Madara would be goofing around like he did before as Tobi. That as much is clear enough.)

    Quote Quote:
    And honestly we haave no idea how strong Itachi actually was! He crushed Kakashi, He played with Orochimaru at his prime, and Danzou was scared of him. He must have been something special! That's why I do belive that Itachi would be strong maybe even fast and smart enough to know what to do against Madara's one trick! SUckering JUTSU!
    It's not just one trick. Point invalid. And we actually have a good idea of what Itachi was capable of. Heck, you even named it yourself.

    Quote Quote:
    Madara will probably come up with more tricks up his sleeve as the manga continues! but for now, he has not impressed at all with his fighting skills. yes he did fight a weak konan and fuu and torune!
    Three things.

    1) He hasn't impressed you at all with his fighting skills? Okay, but does that mean Itachi is better than him? Nope. It's your personal preference, not a manga fact.

    2) Weak Konan? So, her going all out was weak. Weak enough to actually damage Madara, something many, many ninjas (including Itachi) failed to do.

    3) Fuu and Torune weren't weak.

    Quote Quote:
    We will have to wait and see! but for now! I say Itachi.. I cannot wait to see if Madara becomes as powerful as he should be!
    That's fine and dandy, personal preferences again. However, none are manga facts, sadly.

    Quote Quote:
    Actually Zetsu asks what is that? and They have heard about the sword and were quite suprised that Itachi had it!
    And then he actually explains what are those items capable of.

    Quote Quote:
    Easy, Naruto vs Sasuke will probably be a 50/50 match! Itachi fights Sasuke after giving Naruto some of his power and is deadly ill, and still Sasuke didn't stand a chance! But in this fight Itachi is perfectly fit to fight! so yes I would guess he would fight Naruto on pair, but thats for another fight!
    Ehh, "didn't stand a chance"? Without MS, he did pretty darn well. Arm Sasuke with EMS and pit him against MS Itachi, the fight will be tipped in Sasuke's favor no doubt. Since after all, that was the entire point of the fight. So therefore, I fail to see how Itachi is better than current Naruto.
    Last edited by IChallengeYou!; July 19, 2011 at 09:46 AM.

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  6. #169
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    Re: Madara vs Itachi

    Quote Originally Posted by IChallengeYou! View Post
    ...? Elaborate.
    Madara's body get out of the ground under Fuu's -or Torune, I forgot which name it is- feet, he was lying down. You can see it by the position of Madara's head and the shadow behind his body on the ground. Since he appeared like that, he touched the Root ninja.

  7. #170
    Registered User MH中毒 / MH Chuudoku / MH Addicted xXan's Avatar
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    Re: Madara vs Itachi

    @IChallengeYou!


    It is clear enough Madara needs to make direct contact with someone to teleport this is not even up for debate. Even out of combat when the person is STANDING STILL:
    http://www.mangafox.com/manga/naruto/v52/c487/5.html

    There is not even 1 clear (not debatebele becaue Madara was not visible) instance (aside from the anime where it is irrelevant) where Madara teleports with no physical contact but we got a ton of evidence from Madara making all the effort in the word to touch a person for warping.

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  9. #171
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    Re: Madara vs Itachi

    Itachi still has shadow clones (with crows) to figure out Madara's abilities. Madara's Izanagi probably doesn't last as long as Danzo's plus he only has two eyes to spare. Can Madara even use his EMS after using Izanagi twice? Both his eyes would be completely sealed and blind by then.

    Basically, Itachi has more dependable ways to figure out Madara, and all Madara has to figure out Itachi is his intangibility.

  10. #172
    Registered User MH中毒 / MH Chuudoku / MH Addicted xXan's Avatar
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    Re: Madara vs Itachi

    Quote Originally Posted by leafです View Post
    Itachi still has shadow clones (with crows) to figure out Madara's abilities. Madara's Izanagi probably doesn't last as long as Danzo's plus he only has two eyes to spare. Can Madara even use his EMS after using Izanagi twice? Both his eyes would be completely sealed and blind by then.

    Basically, Itachi has more dependable ways to figure out Madara, and all Madara has to figure out Itachi is his intangibility.
    The crow clones is a genjutsu clone, they are not real ones. He can do shadow clones.
    Madara's Izanagi last a lot longer then Danzou's. Danzou has 1 min on it and Madara has 5 for sure and i can make a case for 10 mins of it.

  11. #173
    MangaHelper MH中毒 / MH Chuudoku / MH Addicted Rikudou King's Avatar
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    Re: Madara vs Itachi

    The crow clones is an actual clones, which also cost Itachi less then a normal shadow clone and let him set up a diversion when defeated.

  12. #174
    Registered User MH中毒 / MH Chuudoku / MH Addicted xXan's Avatar
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    Re: Madara vs Itachi

    Quote Originally Posted by Rikudou King View Post
    The crow clones is an actual clones, which also cost Itachi less then a normal shadow clone and let him set up a diversion when defeated.
    It is? I only remember him using that when his target was in genjutsu. Where has he used those clones and why do they cost less?

    Edit: i found something on a wiki but nothing more lol. Where that wiki sugest the clone was used for the first time it looks to me like Naruto was in genjutsu and that is why he was seeing the clones.
    Last edited by xXan; July 19, 2011 at 02:53 PM.

  13. #175
    Registered User 九千以上だ! / Kyuusen Ijou Da! / It's Over 9000! mattiaildivino's Avatar
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    Re: Madara vs Itachi

    Quote Originally Posted by Rikudou Sennin View Post
    Itachi was a threat, yeah. Madara/Tobi made sure Itachi didnt know some secrets of him.

    I'll give this to Madara. We dont have to argue this is a fight of friggin powerhouses nonetheless.
    I think tobi thought itachi didn't know some secrets of him because he survived to itachi's amaterasu.but I'm sure itachi's amaterasu served to make tobi think so,thus tobi doesn't suspect itachi has given naruto some powers. then itachi is the one in advantage,and it is the good chance to get rid of tobi from this tournament.

  14. #176
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    Re: Madara vs Itachi

    Quote Originally Posted by xXan View Post
    It is? I only remember him using that when his target was in genjutsu. Where has he used those clones and why do they cost less?
    Itachi used it once when he was in a genjutsu, but it's an actual technique. He used one to tell Sasuke where to come for their final fight and one to defend against Sasuke's attack and distract him. As for why it cost less chakra, that's because Itachi is forming the chakra over a bunch of crows instead of creating a whole new body from nothing.

    Spoiler: Crow Clone show

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  16. #177
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    Re: Madara vs Itachi

    Quote Originally Posted by xXan View Post
    The crow clones is a genjutsu clone, they are not real ones. He can do shadow clones.
    Madara's Izanagi last a lot longer then Danzou's. Danzou has 1 min on it and Madara has 5 for sure and i can make a case for 10 mins of it.
    I agree with on it lasting five minutes each since I remember Madara's eye closing during the final moments of Konan vs. Madara. Izanagi is still izanagi in the end though. Sasuke fought with Izanagi (Danzo) and won because Danzo wasn't able to trade blows often enough, but izanagi plus space/time teleportation will allow Madara to trade blows at anytime. Izanagi is otherwise pretty useless and harmful if you don't get hurt and have no useful jutsus to enhance.

    According to this, it is classified as ninjutsu and seems to be more efficient than regular shadow clones. It is basically a shadow clone that uses less chakra plus crows as an added effect. Sasuke's sharingan couldn't tell difference between the real Itachi and the clones; therefore, Madara's sharingan shouldn't be able to either. Madara may have more experience with the sharingan, but his sharingan (besides MS/EMS) is no different than Sasuke's. He can train his eye techniques but not the eye itself.

    Edit: I missed some of the posts up there while I was typing. >.>

    Quote Originally Posted by mattiaildivino View Post
    I think tobi thought itachi didn't know some secrets of him because he survived to itachi's amaterasu.but I'm sure itachi's amaterasu served to make tobi think so,thus tobi doesn't suspect itachi has given naruto some powers. then itachi is the one in advantage,and it is the good chance to get rid of tobi from this tournament.
    I said that before too. The way Madara talks about Itachi after he died is biased. You only hear Itachi's secret methods and ways from Madara's point of view; Madara thinks he knows what Itachi is up to, but he doesn't really the truth.

    If you compare Itachi's story about Madara and Madara's story about himself, the way Izuna's eyes were taken are different. The first was stolen; the second was offered.
    Last edited by leafです; July 19, 2011 at 03:29 PM.

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  18. #178
    MH Senpai 伝説メンバー / Densetsu / Legendary Member M3J's Avatar
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    Re: Madara vs Itachi

    Quote Originally Posted by Rikudou King View Post
    Wait, what are you talking about Itachi figuring out? Because I was speaking of Itachi figuring out how Madara's intangibility works and that he can hit Madara when he comes in to attack. Itachi should be able to figure that out before Madara attempts to warp him. While Konan knew of it ahead of time, she was able to strike while Madara was attempting to warp her, so Itachi should be able to do the same with his speed at using techniques. Fuu and Torune may have failed, but if they were able to figure out Madara's ability and come up with a counterplan, Itachi should be able to do likewise in a short time. And by using a combo of his clones and genjutsu on top of his other techniques, he should be able to come up with a pretty good plan to damage Madara.
    Itachi doesn't have the advantage that Kakashi's team, Minato, and Konan did. Konan had over a decade's worth of knowledge on Tobi and his jutsu as well as the preparation, Minato had Hiraishin to bail him out (like always), and Tobi was playing with Kakashi and Yamato. Itachi doesn't have any such benefits, so I'm actually doubting if he can injure or figure out Tobi's intangibility before it's too late. Fuu and Torune had information on Tobi beforehand, if I recall. Plus, Itachi can't really use a lot of clones otherwise it'd tire out his chakra.

    Quote Originally Posted by Plyr88 View Post
    Danzou wasn't using Shisui's Sharingan at all during the fight. It was exhausted through hypnosis of Mifune and it was covered up so he couldn't do a thing with it and it hasn't been said anywhere that he can see through the Sharingans on his arm.

    Obviously if two people are using the same tool, experience would matter which is why Itachi could pwn Kakashi and Sasuke with his Sharingan.

    Itachi died at what age 24 and he got his Sharingan around age 4? 20 years experience. Tobi is 100+ and for argument's sake, let's say he activated his Sharingan at age 20 (pretty late). That's at least 80 years experience. 4 times as much. No way he'd be trapped by a person who, IN COMPARISON, is pretty much a novice in the experience department.
    I know. I don't think he can, but he had enough experience with Izanagi to use it well, but he still got defeated by Sasuke. Experience isn't as important here, as Naruto proved against Kakuzu. If Itachi is unconventional or unorthodox, he can actually hit Tobi because Tobi's more used to ninjas that fight traditionally with regards to their life. Naruto risked his life and thus was able to outsmart Neji and Kakuzu. If Itachi fights like that, he can get Tobi off guard and hit him.

    If I recall, Itachi was like, 21-22 and awoke his SHaringan around eight. Kakashi got his SHaringan around 12, and is about 31-32 right now. But experience isn't why ITachi owned Kakashi, it was because Kakashi wasn't prepared and was caught off guard, which Itachi can do to Tobi.

    How is there no way? Danzou broke Tsukuyomi or Mangekyo genjutsu but got tricked by a simple genjutsu. Tobi can get too arrogant and be tricked by itachi like that as well.



    Quote Quote:
    Kakashi was curbstomped, plain and simple. He momentarily stunned Asura and then his reinforcements destroyed Asura. He had an opening with Raikiri that was MADE by his reinforcements. Asura jumping in the way is fine because they are still Pain, not two separate entities. Then Deva Pain defeated Kakashi AND his back-up by himself. That's a curbstomp. Even with back-up 1/6 of Pain beats you into the ground.
    Whatever, it's your opinion.

    Quote Quote:
    What does being caught up with Konan and Minato's Hirashin v2 have anything to do with him being a genius? Just because he's a genius, he's supposed to be psychic and magically know Konan set up bombs that explode for 10 minutes? He's supposed to magically know Minato can teleport to moving kunais? ¬_¬
    lolwut?

    I'm saying despite being a genius, Tobi got tricked and got hurt twice, that one time he would have died if it weren't for Izanagi. Being a genius doesn't make you immortal to death. Tobi still has a chance of dying, just less so since he's a genius. My point is, even geniuses can get hurt and lose too.

    Quote Quote:
    Tobi has power. He warps you and you're done. He can drop you where ever he wants to and you cannot touch him.
    He can warp only by touching. So far, we don't know if he can drop Itachi anywhere but his dimension.



    Quote Quote:
    If someone is coming for a direct attack from far enough, if you know his movements, you know to start ducking. Clearly, you don't know what reflexes even mean.

    How can it be REFLEXES when he KNEW the attack was coming beforehand? Think about that until you understand.
    Clearly you have no idea what reflexes mean either. If Sasuke did not have quick reflexes, he would have been owned by Killerbee's speedblitz and by Raikage's elbow. Being able to predict movements doesn't help if you can't react in time. Rock Lee vs. Sasuke proves this. Sasuke could see what Rock Lee was doing but couldn't react fast enough, thus he got owned. If Sasuke's speed was the same as it was against Rock Lee, but his Sharingan the same as it was against Killerbee, Sasuke would get speedblitzed because he wouldn't be fast enough to react.

    Because he needs to react to the attack? If Itachi has fast reflexes, which he most likely does, then he could get away from being touched by Tobi or cut off Tobi's hand before the warp thingie starts.

    Quote Quote:
    He's going to break Tobi's arm with a kunai while being warped? ¬_¬ Really? LOL..even if he does, he's still dead as Tobi can replace his arm and Itachi will be dropped into some lava pit or something.
    If Minato and Konan could react while being warped, as well as Karin, I don't see why Itachi wouldn't be able to, especially if he's fast enough. Tobi would need to go back to his hideout to replace his arm, and Itachi could be dropped into another dimension, still alive.

    Quote Quote:
    So you're saying he can warp himself anywhere but can only warp people to one specific place? LOL...pulling at strings.
    Pulling at strings? Are you ignoring Tobi warping Sasuke and Karin to that other place, where Fuu and Torune probably were warped to and from? Until it is proven otherwise, it's safe to assume he can only warp people in that place. Plus, we don't know if Tobi can warp anywhere or needs to go to that dimension first. Maybe it's the same, he or someone else gets warped into that dimension before getting warped somewhere else.

    Tobi warping into the dimension is pulling at string, but not warpin someone into the dimension. It's shown in manga. Prove otherwise if you can.

    Quote Quote:
    Torune's bugs happen to infect Tobi during the warp, it didn't seem like Torune planned it. If Tobi comes up from the ground and immediately warps, how are you going to defend? By the time Itachi turns to see him, the warp is already taking place.
    If Tobi gets the Itachi bunshin, he can be hit with the explosion. Though, it'd be hard to take Itachi by surprise, not even Sasuke was able to do it in Part I when Itachi and Kisame confronted Naruto; Itachi even managed to hit two of Naruto's bunshins without looking back at their last and final meeting.




    Quote Quote:
    Yea, break out like immediately. LOL being in a clan full of MS and EMS users, I'd think Tobi would have trained enough to break out of Tsukuyomi like nothing.

    Tobi doesn't have to touch Itachi to warp him by the way.
    And can you prove Uchiha had a lot of MS and EMS users or that Tobi even fought them? Training means nothing since Itachi's Tsukuyomi is pretty advanced. Itachi's Tsukuyomi on Kakashi was different from the one he used on Sasuke, if he uses the torture Tsukuyomi then I don't see how Tobi can break out of it. He's being mentally attacked, it'd be difficult for him to get out. While Itachi has Tobi in genjutsu, he can use a clone to attack Tobi.

    Yes he does. Almost every time we saw him warp someone, he was touching them. THere is no clear picture of him NOT touching whoever he wanted to warp. He kept trying to touch Minato to warp him away, which I doubt he'd have bothered to do if he could warp without touching.



    Quote Quote:
    I have no interest in seeing anyone's "fanboyism"
    Don't care. I just don't wanna be accused of being a fanboy, especially when I actually make an argument, list reasons, and not blindly vote (whether my argument and reasons are good or not is based on who's reading it), unlike many that voted for Jiraiya. I'm even arguing for Itachi and Tobi, and I hate Tobi and love Itachi. But not like it matters since Minato or Naruto will win anyway.

  19. #179
    Registered User 英雄メンバー / Eiyuu Menbaa / Hero Member Lelo's Avatar
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    Re: Madara vs Itachi

    Quote Originally Posted by rell250 View Post
    Excuse me but isn't Madara himself quietly a genius who seems to know everything about everyone and every jutsu. Just saying. If Itachi could kill Madara he would of done it. So just because of that reason right there im voting for Madara even tho ithink in the end it doesn't really matter. Its going to be Naruto vs Minato.
    Itachi was sick, he wasnt 100%. And he also had bigger plans for Sasuke

  20. #180
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    Re: Madara vs Itachi

    Quote Originally Posted by Lelo View Post
    Itachi was sick, he wasnt 100%. And he also had bigger plans for Sasuke
    If he could kill Madara he would have done it. Also he is sick here to :P

    1 thing is for sure. Itachi can't use MS genjutsu and kill Madara in that time as he would have done it already. If he could kill Madara after a long fight but he never tried as Madara could warp away and get peeps to help his but is another thing.

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