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Well, Jiraiya may have beaten Pain if he knew about his abilities from the start. It's safe to say from multiple accounts that Minato was more skilled than J-man. Naruto was able to beat the six bodies, at a point where was not yet entirely equal to Minato (though he may be now that he mastered the Kyubi).
Apart from that, Minato is the perfect counter for Shinra tensei, because of his insane speed. He's the fastest shinobi, period. Remember how even the weaker Shinra Tensei has a 5 second cooldown? Those 5 seconds are more like five minutes to Minato. Rasengan your face, just like Madara. That's his reaction time, movement speed, and attack speed. He'll bait a tensei, warp out of the way, and strike in the cooldowns.
Using Bansho Tenin would be suicidal. That move may be good if you see the opponent approaching so you can attack. But Minato, while he could easily warp out of it, could pretty much wait for the last moment (his reaction time his faster, period) and warp behind him (or anywhere close) and use the momentum to enhance a retaliatory blow from a blind spot.
I see too many points where Minato overcomes Nagato. If any Shinobi has the versatility to take on Minato, it's Nagato. But he's too stationary. He's too used to being overpowered. His enormous powers destroy anyone, but he's not used to a Shinobi with the finesse to slip past those powers.
wow 20 pages
I say Minato takes this. If Nagato uses shinra tensi then he has to wait 5 seconds to use it again, Naruto figured that out and Im pretty sure Minato would too. And with Minatos speed he would only need a split second to hit his target. He could start off with his summonings to give him time to read his opponent. Either way Minato will find a way to take out Nagato. We just saw him take out a man who uses space/time jutsu without the use of kunais
Last edited by Lelo; July 19, 2011 at 06:12 PM.
Deva usualy directs it downwords as to maximize the damage, the chanse of this happening to Minato is good enough, so yes he is going to be hitting that ground:
The chains where in there hands... They just got send flying backwards and keep holding the chains...
He can't react to ST as that is a invizible force that acts close to instantly and hits like a bus (if Nagato puts enough power behind it). Raikage was visible even if as a distorsion for some time. Considering Nagato does not have to put his hands up Minato would have no idea when it is coming or not.Quote:
All the tags would be blown away with Minato, Minato is going to get hit by a BUS (If Nagato puts enough force in it, he can put enough force in it to send frogs 5 stories high flying a football field in distance and brake all there bones ....) so he is not going to have anything to warp right next to Nagato (that is if he is left alive... Bones broken and out of it for sure if its the same ST that almost killed the frogs). Also he is going to "right himself"when all the other peeps in the manga got hit hard? Right...Quote:
JMan with all the info in the world would die in 5 seconds vs all 6 realms(he can't even use sage mode ...). Naruto never defeated Pein... Where do you people get this stuff? In a fair fight Naruto would have gotten demolished.
Also Naruto back then not equal with Minato? LOL what? Perhaps in speed ... But aside from that he was. Not only that but he had the entire of Konoha, info from JMan that died to get, 3 huge frogs, 2 elder frogs with insane tech and power on his side... And you are stating not equal to Minato.. LOL.
Last edited by xXan; July 19, 2011 at 06:18 PM.
Also, depending on the size of the shinra tensei, the surroundings, and Minato's distance, he could be made aware that it is coming well in advance based upon the disturbances of his surroundings.
People keep forgetting that Minato appears a slight distance from his Hiraishin seal. Say a kunai is blasted away, he can still appear within that blast radius. For example: M = Minato, K = his special kunai, S = shinrai tensei blast.
Minato throws a kunai, then Nagato Shinra Tensei's it away: M K S. If it were to get blasted away, the kunai would still be between Minato and the blast, but the moment that happens and Minato teleports, that distance from the seal is more than enough to fall behind the blast of Shinra Tensei after it repels the kunai: K S M. He doesn't teleport in direct physical contact on his seal, but a slight distance from it. Then he can close the distance with his insane base speed which is fast enough to make even Madara impressed and get Nagato. I really doubt Nagato can perform seals faster than Minato can ninja step to Nagato.
I usually place speed above most attributes when it comes to these threads. But usually when I do the ninja has offensive options that make said speed truly deadly. I'm not sure Minato has that thanks to only displaying the ability to cut you, or hit you with a Rasengan. I don't think it's enough to give him the win against someone with Nagato's repertoire.
Both ninja have summons, but one of them has what seems to be a near inexhaustible chakra reserve. One ninja can take away summoning contracts, but Nagato doesn't use summoning contracts. I think it's his access to all chakra paths that allows him to summon, and not the fact that he has a blood pact, because quite simply, it's not his blood within the corpses. The blood belongs to the corpses. I could be wrong, as we don't know the specifics behind building a realm body... but we do know they are all corpses that only have the powers they DO have thanks to the influence of the Rinnegan.
That said, I seriously don't think Minato can restrict Nagato's summons because he can't restrict the Rinnegan, which is responsible for the summons. Not his blood.
Minato has Rasengan and Taijutsu, complemented by his speed as said before, but... the Rasengan can be absorbed from any direction and the kunai can be repelled with ST. Nagato has no other realms watching his back this time so an attack from behind could work, but if he's summoned the Enma monster ghost thingy he could simply heal, having himself restored everytime he's injured (can that summon be harmed? I was of the opinion it was incorporeal like a ghost, but I could be wrong).
Minato can set up tags around the battlefield, or even on Nagato... but the ability to absorb ninjutsu likely nullifies that. And if he were to use Hiraishin to escape ST, he'd have to know to run away rather than closer (say, to Nagato's backside) or else he'd run headfirst into the other side of the wave and take himself out. Even still, if he teleports far back, but not far enough, he could still get railroaded by the shockwave.
Anyway, Nagato seems to like watching as his backup protects him, so I dont' see any reason why he would'nt spam summoning giant summons from jump street. Problem is they have zero chance of hitting Minato at all based on their size and his speed. I'm guessing a sure kill would be to activate Chibaku Tensei from the back of his giant stork for the win.
Nagato showed good speed when he saved Konan from Hanzou and company. He took damage, but his speed was enough to save him from taking fatal damage, and Konan was unharmed. I am not saying he is anywhere near Minato level, but he is not slow either.
If he were capable, Minato would've done so. Plus, Fukasaku himself said that it was only Jiraiya and Naruto who's capable of sage mode TRAINING because of the great chakra requirement associated with that mode.
I don't doubt that Minato had a large chakra pool. However, this might not be large enough to compensate for senjutsu training. Though at the very least, we could all speculate if Minato can do Sage mode, existing evidence in the manga (implied, stated, or shown) leans to the direction that Minato can't.
---------- Post added at 11:07 PM ---------- Previous post was at 11:04 PM ----------
From just that, I'd be hesistant to say he is on Sasuke/Itachi level either. It isn't really enough to put him in the speed elite, but it is enough to show he has speed talent, imo.
1. Minato throws a kunai.
2. Nagato uses S'T.
3. Minato hiraishin's to the ST-ied kunai so he is also thrown to the same direction into as that ST-ied kunai.
4. In mid-air, he throws another kunai, Nagato tries to dodge the kunai but Minato appears there.
5. Rasengan to the FACE.
Reread the fight between Kakashi and Deva Pein.
---------- Post added at 11:24 PM ---------- Previous post was at 11:22 PM ----------
For all we know, Minato knows exactly to which kunai he would appear next.
---------- Post added at 11:30 PM ---------- Previous post was at 11:24 PM ----------
six tail Kyuubi or Naruto being braced by his clones. So it wouldn't matter if Minato teleported on the opposite side of the kunai, he would still be hit by the still flowing Shinra Tensei and thrown back.
Nagato was able to react and dodge the FRS while stabbing two clones mere feet from him in a single second. There's no way he couldn't react to Minato in that same timeframe coming from a couple yards away.
Of course, every time that the window has been relevant, the other bodies have been incapacitated, so he didn't have any other abilities to fall back on...in this battle, we're assuming that Nagato has everything but Asura Path (weapon guy), right? I would think that with S/T deflecting the initial toss of kunai, he'd be able to defend with summons. Not to mention that CQC is pretty risky, since he can absorb your chakra/any ninjutsu.
And of course, once he witnesses Hiraishin once, I would think that he'd get more defensive, seeing as how he can actually fly around in the air AND can still launch attacks from a distance.
Also, is Nagato allowed to summon Gedo Mazo?
---------- Post added at 02:16 AM ---------- Previous post was at 02:13 AM ----------
Wow, while I was dallying about, Rikudou King put up a very nice rebuttal, lol