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Translations: Gintama 515 (2)
I voted for Itachi for the simple fact that Minato never showed any Genjutsu skills even tough both fighters are my only and absolute favourite characters.
Minato never faced or used Genjutsu. That doesn't make him automatically immune in this department. I can't buy the Hokage argument because shinobis like Kakashi or Orochimaru should become Hokages too and both of them had no answer to Itachis Genjutsu. I agree that Minato is stronger and faster than Kakashi and Orochimaru, but at this time I can't give him more credit than the performance shown by other top tier shinobis who even are skilled in Genjutsu and equipped with a sharingan.
Itachi on the other hand is the best Genjutsu user so far, showed impressive Ninjutsu and never got stomped with Taijutsu. The way he is executing his attacks and the professional usage of clones shouldn't be underestimated.
Overall I think both of them are on the same level. Unfortunately we never saw Minato dealing with Genjutsu. I think with his full arsenal (I assume he has more Jutsus in his repertoire) he is slightly stronger than Itachi.
But counting what the Manga showed so far, I have to give it to Itachi.
Madara put's Kyubi under a genjutsu here.
At child birth the seal was weak so Kushina had to birth outside the village incase she looses control. This opportunity gave Madara the chnce to break it. It was easy!
He then controls Kyubi to comeout since the seal was that weak.
Minato now shows up and takes her away and he still hasn't touched Kyubi.
Minato goes back to konoha and he still hasn't touched Kyubi
Yes Minato can teleport whatever he wants without tagging those things.
Minato summons bunta, He still hasn't touched Kyubi:
Minato standing on top of Bunta, He still hasn't touched Kyubi:
Kyubi gets teleported and He still hasn't touched Kyubi:
He teleported the Kyubi without tagging it, and He teleported the Biju bomb without tagging it. He can teleport Ninjutsu without tagging it. The tags are where he teleports to, if that was the case then he would have teleported Kushina to where he was since she has a tag on her.
You seem to be ignoring manga evidence. "I don't think Kabuto used up that much chakra"
Kabuto in his mind says: "Of course as a trade off, it uses up just about all my chakra".
You are saying: Kabuto chakra couldn't have been very low. Was Kabuto lying to himself and the readers?? It doesn't take alot of chakra to summon the snakes.
When something eats up about all of something, it most likely means that thing EATS UP ABOUT ALL OF WHATEVER IT'S EATING. I put it in bold red large size letters just for you incase you missed that part. And it was quoted verbatim from the manga. Mangafacts > assumptions. If the Japanese translation was different, share it.
Off topic question: How was he not able to teleport Kushina who had a tag on her but he teleported Kyubi who didn't? I dunno, Kishi may not explain this.
Last edited by Infernal Stigma; July 27, 2011 at 01:59 PM.
Itachi had plenty of time to figure out what sasuke was up to since his actions were leading up to it. Even zetsu knew.... unless u want to argue that zetsu is smarter than itachi
Point is, Minato's speed and reflexes are faster/better than itachi imo
---------- Post added at 03:09 PM ---------- Previous post was at 03:07 PM ----------
Doesn't mean he wasn't ready to use it or was prepping it.Originally Posted by RikudoKing
as for the second part. read above
After this chapter( which I won't discuss) my vote goes to itachi.The guy is kipping up with kyuiby mode for god sake!!!!
The fact that he heard about Raikage's speed means he had an inkling Raikage was almost as fast as a lighning bolt. Minato had some warning to Raikage and knowledge of him even if it was rumor, which in my opinion takes nothing away from Minato as he still reacted and didn't even know the FULL extent of Raikage's speed.
Itachi didn't have his Susano'o out until Kirin was already charging towards Itachi, no? He was also able to get Susano'o up pretty quickly despite being very blind.
Minato's speed and reflexes may be better, I think it is, but with Itachi's Sharingan, speed, and reflexes, Itachi can actually keep up with Minato. While despite Sharingan he may not match Minato move for move, he can react in time to avoid attacks and use jutsu to get Minato away from him. If it weren't for Sharingan's ability to predict, then Sasuke would have been dead against Bee. If not for Sharingan, and if Itachi's speed and reflexes aren't near Minato's level, then I can't see him having a chance.
However, if MInato gets caught in Itachi's genjutsu, I can't really see him winning as Itachi can cut his head off easily enough.
Again, I'm saying taking a single translation as absolute proof doesn't work. Translations can very depending on the person doing it. That's why there's so many different variations of translations, even on this site itself. For what Kabuto said to be true, that would mean he had to summon Manda with next to no chakra and still have enough chakra left over to not just stand around but also escape on his own. Yet every other person who get's low on chakra can barely walk, let alone walk fine. Even Naruto with the Kyuubi as aid could barely go on after his fight with Pain and had to have Kakashi carry him back. So manga pictures and multiple examples > single translations.
There's a good change that Minato did know or expect Ee's speed, thus the reason he told everyone to stand back and let him handle it while throwing out even more Hiraishin tags. Reacting at the very last minute doesn't not suggest that Minato's reflexes are better then Itachi's, especially since we have been told that his reflexes are comparable to base Ee and Sasuke had better reflexes.