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Thread: Bleach 470 Discussion

  1. #121
    Registered User 英雄メンバー / Eiyuu Menbaa / Hero Member Quantized's Avatar
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    Re: Bleach 470 Discussion / 471 Predictions

    Quote Originally Posted by noVaLue View Post
    Ya, i understand your point of view Cez, but there is only one question, Ginjo was born with Shinigami powers or he was only an ordinary man, before being assigned like Substitute Shinigami. According to the fact that only a human fullbringer-shinigami could steal/take or give/borrow full-brings, he had his own Shinigami powers and fused them with his fullbring. (http://www.mangareader.net/bleach/433/16)
    Also there is mentioned something like "our powers are the exact oposite of us". That`s at each one's mind, how to interpret...

    There is where i found out that info about stealing all shinigami powers from Ichigo. http://www.mangareader.net/bleach/460/12

    And there (http://www.mangareader.net/bleach/461/5) Ginjo believes that his fullbring strengthen Ichigo. Here i think that Ginjo doesn`t know nothing about Ichigo training into Dangai and his Final Getsuga Tensho.
    Until now Ichigo cut air 3 times with practice swing:
    http://www.mangareader.net/bleach/460/14
    http://www.mangareader.net/bleach/461/8
    http://www.mangareader.net/bleach/470/11
    and sent one Getsuga Tensho
    http://www.mangareader.net/bleach/460/17
    Now that's some very interesting details you're bringing up, I like it
    Also I completely agree, Kubo does seem to have a trend to come with indirect explanations that can be interpreted in more than one way, can be frustrating.
    Bad/different translations doesn't make it easier either xD

    I don't like that Kubo didn't give a better explanation on powers in Bleach though, fullbringers stealing powers seems to violate everything we know about or assumed about in Bleach.. Imho, such a statement can't stand alone, we need to learn more about powers in Bleach.

    So, it seems fair to assume that either it's possible to steal shinigami powers if they're merged with fullbring, or it's only possible to steal fullbring powers, but the fullbring powers were similar to his shinigami powers, it has to be one of these two options.
    Rukia stating that they only took the top layer of Ichigo's shinigami powers seems very unlikely when having Ginjou this powerful and even shared great power between all of them, yet he still "counters" Ichigo's full shikai blast... I beg your pardon, how the hell is Ginjou doing this if he only stole a little of Ichigo's shinigami powers yet alone shared it with his friends..?

    Ginjou was shocked over Ichigo's reatsu and power, yet after sharing what he had stolen he appears to be able to counter Ichigo easily. Starts to feel like an ass pull.

    Kubo better explain this soon, it's too far fetched and weird..
    But for me it seems impossible for Shinigami powers to be taken, for it to make sense to what Rukia said, it'd have to have meant that what Ginjou stole was the upper layer "copy" of his shinigami powers, and that Ichigo in fact didn't loose any of this shinigami powers.

    I'm all open ears if anyone can see through Kubo and his logic

  2. #122
    ~ Forum Fixer ~ 有名人 / Yuumeijin / Celebrity Miyagi's Avatar
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    Re: Bleach 470 Discussion / 471 Predictions

    Quote Originally Posted by Cez View Post
    Rukia stating that they only took the top layer of Ichigo's shinigami powers seems very unlikely when having Ginjou this powerful and even shared great power between all of them, yet he still "counters" Ichigo's full shikai blast... I beg your pardon, how the hell is Ginjou doing this if he only stole a little of Ichigo's shinigami powers yet alone shared it with his friends..?

    Ginjou was shocked over Ichigo's reatsu and power, yet after sharing what he had stolen he appears to be able to counter Ichigo easily. Starts to feel like an ass pull.
    Ichigo's FB was very powerful, was it not? He cut off Tsukishima's arm and overwhelmed Tsukishima at one point and Tsukishima is a guy who has captain-class power. Ginjou is probably as strong as Tsukishima and if we add Ichigo's captain-class FB to Ginjou's power, it makes sense (at least to me) that he can counter Ichigo.

  3. #123
    Registered User 上級員 / Jyoukuuin / Sr. Member noVaLue's Avatar
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    Re: Bleach 470 Discussion / 471 Predictions

    Don't take it too high, Ichigo never throw at Ginjo a Getsuga Tensho. And plus Ichigo stopped the Ginjo`s one with his shoulder...
    Quote Originally Posted by Cez
    I'm all open ears if anyone can see through Kubo and his logic
    I already managed to find that Ichigo's Hollow will fuse with Zangetsu, before Dangai trainig ... ( My cousin always says to stop cheating, and try to find out what Kubo's thinking)... You need to think illogical, if there weren't be scans. But with scans you can understand reactions of characters. And so that's the reason I'm thinking on Ichigo testing Ginjo, than in Ginjo got godlike.

    You know very well that his Shihakusho doesn't show Ichigo's reiatsu level without being in Bankai. Than it can be entirely destroyed/damaged. It wouldn't change the fact that Ichigo still has all his reiatsu.

  4. #124
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    Re: Bleach 470 Discussion / 471 Predictions

    Quote Originally Posted by Miyagi View Post
    Ichigo's FB was very powerful, was it not? He cut off Tsukishima's arm and overwhelmed Tsukishima at one point and Tsukishima is a guy who has captain-class power. Ginjou is probably as strong as Tsukishima and if we add Ichigo's captain-class FB to Ginjou's power, it makes sense (at least to me) that he can counter Ichigo.
    That certainly is a theory I can accept full heartily, it indeed makes sense if his fullbring was all that powerful and that is what Ginjou stole.
    Got to wonder just "how" powerful it is though.. doesn't seem to be exactly the same power size as his shinigami powers.. hmm..

    I may be ignorant on this subject, but I can't accept that translation / explanation that some of Ichigo's merged Shinigami powers were taken, it doesn't make sense.. well, I guess I'll have to try accept the possibility until it's better explained.

    Ginjou better not have more of Ichigo's abilities, hopefully it's only the fullbring he stole, which had copied his shinigami powers

    ---------- Post added at 01:38 AM ---------- Previous post was at 01:29 AM ----------

    Quote Originally Posted by noVaLue View Post
    Don't take it too high, Ichigo never throw at Ginjo a Getsuga Tensho. And plus Ichigo stopped the Ginjo`s one with his shoulder...

    I already managed to find that Ichigo's Hollow will fuse with Zangetsu, before Dangai trainig ... ( My cousin always says to stop cheating, and try to find out what Kubo's thinking)... You need to think illogical, if there weren't be scans. But with scans you can understand reactions of characters. And so that's the reason I'm thinking on Ichigo testing Ginjo, than in Ginjo got godlike.

    You know very well that his Shihakusho doesn't show Ichigo's reiatsu level without being in Bankai. Than it can be entirely destroyed/damaged. It wouldn't change the fact that Ichigo still has all his reiatsu.
    Very interesting point of view, and you're probably right, Ichigo might only be messing around / testing him, and it's also true that Ginjou had to block with a getsuga while Ichigo just took it head on unlike Ginjou's first hit which he himself said almost killed him.. Those are some good points you bring up, among others too.

    It's funny, Ichigo should in theory still be so powerful that none of them can feel his reatsu, unless he does like Aizen did "purposely" brings down his reatsu... I'd scream like a fan boy if he levelled his reatsu to Godmode and owned Ginjou instantly haha.
    Well, guess that's what I want to see, I used to have hopes for a bad ass guy in Ginjou, but he has lost my interest and want to move onto next arc.. So it'd be awesome if Ichigo owned him soon.

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  6. #125
    Registered User 上級員 / Jyoukuuin / Sr. Member noVaLue's Avatar
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    Re: Bleach 470 Discussion / 471 Predictions

    I'll do my best and try to explain fusion between fullbring and shinigami powers( shinigami reiatsu, because fullbring is not a reiatsu its a soul)
    If I take it for granted it's the fusion between an " experienced soul" and a reiatsu
    Why experienced soul ...?
    The object which is touched each time you finish your battle, or you use for your activity (and it works in real world too: you can see your mom moving slowly the mouse on the screen, when you have already done your job with 10 clicks, drugs and moves), have the ability in Bleach to remember last skill level ... or something near this. But isn't the object itself which stocks memories but the soul inside it.
    Last time when ichigo touched the badge was when he went in Hueco Mundo, and also when he lost all his powers (but it stopped to work before it being touched)...

    How i interpret the fusion beside a soul+reiatsu( it's more like a zampakuto + user reiatsu pulled in, but there the user need to have the level to control "the fusion"), is that the soul need a kind of reiatsu to put in practice all he knows...

    This arc is just to introduce a new world... Kubo is almost taking us for clever, and does stupid things, like that we can't understand his reasons ...

  7. #126
    Registered User 九千以上だ! / Kyuusen Ijou Da! / It's Over 9000! mattiaildivino's Avatar
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    Re: Bleach 470 Discussion

    ehm,guys, what was written in the blank cloud,where riruka speaks? http://www.mangafox.com/manga/bleach/v53/c470/ and not even in mangareader i can read that . the last page has a mistake too: look at the last picture of riruka http://www.mangareader.net/bleach/470/19

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