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Thread: Weekly Shonen Jump [2011 - 2012] - Discussion and TOC Talk

  1. #151
    SQUEE x 9000 伝説メンバー / Densetsu / Legendary Member Kaiten's Avatar
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    Re: Weekly Shonen Jump [2011] - Discussion and TOC Talk - Part 2

    Quote Originally Posted by ick View Post
    Yes and no.
    The majority of readers is split in two: 13-15 years old boys and 19-24 years old guys. It being understood that Jump will always remain a young boys magazine.
    That is not actually true. About 64% of readers are 16-30, that is taken directly from Shueisha here. Only about 33% are between 10-15, another 3% are 9. Readership is not split in two, two-thirds of readers are over the age of 16, younger readers are a clear minority. That will effect what type of manga are serialized in 2012 and will effect what series succeed.

  2. #152
    Registered User 英雄メンバー / Eiyuu Menbaa / Hero Member
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    Re: Weekly Shonen Jump [2011] - Discussion and TOC Talk - Part 2

    Quote Quote:

    Negative Syndicate wrote:

    Is it because there aren't many scanlations for other dark series, so you want Jump to have it since most of series has gotten scanlated?
    That might be the reason. A very paradoxical reason to be precise.

    I don't read new JUMP manga because they tend to get cancelled fast and especially the titles I like i.e. K.O. Sen, Double Arts, SWOT, Metallica and for me JUMP cancelled REBORN! when they turned it into a battle manga, I loved the comedy but I understand it was a change for the better (That I didn't quite like).
    All of those I liked (Yeah I have a taste for the cliched, full of tropes manga) all of those got cancelled so I decided that for me to read/buy a JUMP manga it should have an anime adaptation, that way it will at least continue a little more and likely won't get cancelled, and will get a satisfactory ending. I am not saying I would read any JUMP manga with anime adaptation as in example I haven't touched Toriko, Nurarihyon, Beelzebub or Medaka but I am planning to read Medaka soon looks full of cliches LOL

    Now, what can I do, me being ignorant of the Japanese language if a scanlation group doesn't pick up a manga? Nothing. Well, learn Japanese.
    First of all I probably wouldn't even know about the series. And when/if it gets picked up it will likely ever be if the series gets an anime adaptation. If it ever gets one.. I mean it is pretty weird when a Seinen manga gets adapted into anime.

    So by a dark manga being in JUMP and succeding then I am assured that it wll be interesting and likely have an anime.

    IMO its because of JUMP intesive and very hard system that it has managed to get these many hits, its marketing has discovered some of the best hidden gems ever.. Examples?
    What could happen if a comical artist (You know which draws characters with funny non-human proportions and all that) makes a action manga? A comedy mangaka making an action manga? In an era where most action manga had muscular super-humans.. Well Dragon Ball is the answer.
    Its also because of JUMP's marketing and poll system that Yu-Gi-Oh! turned into the franchise it is today, I'd like to think that Takahashi would have continued with the episodic nature of Yu-Gi-Oh! (Of course eventually having some plot but you get the idea).
    Not to say other magazines aren't good (I respect all of them and love manga in general) but its obvious that when you have a battle royale between authors each week (Because that's basically what TOC is) only the best of the best will come on top, the others will survive to climb to the top.
    TLR I think Jump could make the series more interesting.
    A perfect example of what I think JUMP should serialize is Akumetsu.

  3. #153
    Negative Syndicate
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    Re: Weekly Shonen Jump [2011] - Discussion and TOC Talk - Part 2

    Quote Originally Posted by perroloco View Post
    That might be the reason. A very paradoxical reason to be precise.

    I don't read new JUMP manga because they tend to get cancelled fast and especially the titles I like i.e. K.O. Sen, Double Arts, SWOT, Metallica and for me JUMP cancelled REBORN! when they turned it into a battle manga, I loved the comedy but I understand it was a change for the better (That I didn't quite like).
    All of those I liked (Yeah I have a taste for the cliched, full of tropes manga) all of those got cancelled so I decided that for me to read/buy a JUMP manga it should have an anime adaptation, that way it will at least continue a little more and likely won't get cancelled, and will get a satisfactory ending. I am not saying I would read any JUMP manga with anime adaptation as in example I haven't touched Toriko, Nurarihyon, Beelzebub or Medaka but I am planning to read Medaka soon looks full of cliches LOL

    Now, what can I do, me being ignorant of the Japanese language if a scanlation group doesn't pick up a manga? Nothing. Well, learn Japanese.
    First of all I probably wouldn't even know about the series. And when/if it gets picked up it will likely ever be if the series gets an anime adaptation. If it ever gets one.. I mean it is pretty weird when a Seinen manga gets adapted into anime.

    So by a dark manga being in JUMP and succeding then I am assured that it wll be interesting and likely have an anime.

    IMO its because of JUMP intesive and very hard system that it has managed to get these many hits, its marketing has discovered some of the best hidden gems ever.. Examples?
    What could happen if a comical artist (You know which draws characters with funny non-human proportions and all that) makes a action manga? A comedy mangaka making an action manga? In an era where most action manga had muscular super-humans.. Well Dragon Ball is the answer.
    Its also because of JUMP's marketing and poll system that Yu-Gi-Oh! turned into the franchise it is today, I'd like to think that Takahashi would have continued with the episodic nature of Yu-Gi-Oh! (Of course eventually having some plot but you get the idea).
    Not to say other magazines aren't good (I respect all of them and love manga in general) but its obvious that when you have a battle royale between authors each week (Because that's basically what TOC is) only the best of the best will come on top, the others will survive to climb to the top.
    TLR I think Jump could make the series more interesting.
    A perfect example of what I think JUMP should serialize is Akumetsu.
    All of those statement proved that my idea and your idea are completely opposite. From your examples: I like Double Arts, I didn't read K.O. Sen, I'm disappointed on SWOT, I hated Metallica, and I didn't enjoy comedy part of Reborn. Like this tell that you and me are different. Also, I read all of Jump series (except short page) and every new series (even axed series), and the only series that I've gotten sad for being axed are Double Arts and Akaboshi.

    I'm also not against that Jump to have dark series (I think Jump should have at least one dark series), but I'm diagreeing on Jump to have bloody and violent manga. For me, dark series and bloody/violent manga are different.

    In conclusion, I realized there is no point for you and me to try to persuade to change our beliefs. If I didn't agree with your idea, that's fine; if you didn't agree with my idea, that's fine too. I think we just stay what we believe.

    P.S. I couldn't understand the point you are trying to make on the last paragraph (where you talk about Dragonball and Yu-Gi-Oh).
    Last edited by Negative Syndicate; October 28, 2011 at 01:50 AM.

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  5. #154
    Registered User 英雄メンバー / Eiyuu Menbaa / Hero Member
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    Re: Weekly Shonen Jump [2011] - Discussion and TOC Talk - Part 2

    LOL so we are complete opposites

    What I meant in the last paragraph is that most times Jump (And for that matter most other magazines) would almost obligate a popular artist to make the same type of manga or change toward other type of manga because that'd be the optimal option:
    I.e. Masakazu Katsura which most popular titles are I's and Video Girl Ai first work was Wingman a super sentai, he really loves super heroes, but after Wingman JUMP almost obligated Katsura to make love/ecchi mangas (Because.. well.. just look at how well he draws.. Especially butts! Girls butts!)
    Its blatantly obvious that Katsura's forte was its beautiful illustrations, and his art-style quickly developed. Thus he was forced into making ecchi.
    In fact the most obvious example of this are all on ecchi mangas JUMP has published, i.e. Kawashita published Ichigo 100% in JUMP because her style was too shonen for a shojo magazine. A more "recent" example would be Yabuki Kentaro changing from action manga towards ecchi because he draws fan-service soooo well.

    Now, back in 1985 (Before DB) most popular action manga tend to either had big, muscular, macho looking main characters or simply characters that looked (and were) adults. I.e. Cobra, Kinnikuman, Hokuto No Ken, City Hunter and this art-style would continue for years to come examples would be Otokojuku, Rokunedashi BLUES, Jojo.
    Then Jump decided (Or maybe Akira Toriyama really wanted to make Dragon Ball) for Toriyama´s next serial to be an action gag manga.. As I have wrote they were really taking a risk here since even when Toriyama had made probably one of the most succesful JUMP mangas at the time, its art-style was as suited for a battle manga as today Hokuto No Ken would be on JUMP. We know what happened, not only Dragon Ball became the most well known anime in the world but it also changed how manga would be drawn in future generations.

    Anyway here is an extract I got from this site:

    Quote Quote:
    "But how did all this happen? What sparked such runaway popularity? According to Toriyama, "The manga wasn't too popular before the Tenka-Ichi Budokai ("World's Ultimate Martial Arts Tournament"). Torishima told me one time: 'your main character is too quiet. That's why it's not so popular.' I wanted to win readers with the story this time around, and I had even made the effort to come up with a normally dressed main character, so I was peeved, and I told him, 'I'll do some 'crowd-pleaser material, then.'

    "In the Dr Slump days, event and tournament stories like the Penguin Village Grand Prix were popular," Toriyama, continues. "So I decided to go with a simple tournament. That's how the Tenka-Ichi tournament came to be. All the characters except Goku got pulled out, Kame Sen'nin (The Turtle Hermit) came back, and the new character Krillin showed up. Immediately, popularity went up."

    This "crowd-pleaser material" became the hallmark of the second animated series
    ; the fight-fight-fight-oriented Dragon Ball Z. Toriyama took marital arts past even the most outrageous excesses of Hong Kong action films and into the far reaches of the realm of superheroes. In Dragon Ball, if you train hard enough, you can fly, firepower blasts, split into multiple bodies, teleport and even fuse two beings into one that combines the powers of both. That's if you train hard enough, mind you.

    "When you think about the character Goku, the best description of him is that he wants to get strong, so I decided that should really show." But even so, Toriyama had to work at winning his audience over to Dragon Ball's new martial arts motif — super powers or no, not even Super Saiyans have it easy. "Goku only wins for the first time in the third tournament," he says. "People around me tell me that they all know Goku is going to win. I am so contrary that if people say that, I'll go out of my way to make him not win."
    Dragon Ball had 6 weekly color pages in a row, chapter 1 through 6, to say it got REALLY special threatment is being very modest, it was PIMPed as f#ck.. It would have made Toriko´s pimping like.. child´s play or something LOL but well, it was PIMPed with good reasons, after all it needed to be, Toriyama after all had made a hit and it was necessary to promote its newest work.
    As the interview above says the rankings for Dragon Ball weren´t too hot and what I put on black is what I am trying to convey, Akira Toriyama crowd-pleasing material (AKA fan-service) as the article says became crucial in the upcoming parts of Dragon Ball and degrading the gag and humor in favor of more fights.
    Its of my opinion that Torishima (Toriyama´s editor) was very smart to leat Toriyama, but what really lead Toriyama was JUMP poll system, that´s what my last paragraph said.

    To sum it up, I think its because of how JUMP analyzes data from polls and authors make the best out fo said data that JUMP makes such hits. Also the collaboration of editors. I know this is constant in every other magazine, they work with polls and TOCs too, but we know JUMP´s "surivor of the fittest" is more savage than the other magazines which tend not to cancel every damn thing..

    The other example Yu-Gi-Oh! is basically this, Yugioh was an episodic manga of weird games and all that mumbo jumbo, then one day Takahashi made a chapter about a card game "Duel Monsters" said chapter got amazing results in the TOC and polls, Takahashi´s editor then told Takahashi that Kaiba should reapper and that "Duel Monsters" should have a higher focus on the story.. And thus Yugioh became what it is today.

    Basically if it weren´t for JUMP´s strict system is likely Yu-Gi-Oh! would have stayed as an episodic weird games manga and Dragon Ball as a gag manga (Likely very popular but not as popular as it got), similar to how Reborn! was changed from comedy to action so that it got more popular.

  6. #155
    Registered User 下級員 / Kakyuuin / Jr. Member ick's Avatar
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    Re: Weekly Shonen Jump [2011] - Discussion and TOC Talk - Part 2

    Quote Originally Posted by Kaiten View Post
    That is not actually true. About 64% of readers are 16-30, that is taken directly from Shueisha here. Only about 33% are between 10-15, another 3% are 9. Readership is not split in two, two-thirds of readers are over the age of 16, younger readers are a clear minority. That will effect what type of manga are serialized in 2012 and will effect what series succeed.
    Come on you would compare the tastes of an adolescent (16 - 17 years old) with the ones of a 25-30 years old guy?
    If you want to enlarge the categories do it conceivably:

    This is a class of reader:

    9: 2.6%
    10-12: 12.2%
    13-15: 21.3%
    16-18: 16.3%

    And this is another class:

    19-24: 23.1%
    25-29: 11.3%
    30: 13.2%

    Circa fifty fifty.
    Last edited by ick; October 28, 2011 at 07:42 AM.


    ~

  7. #156
    Registered User 上級員 / Jyoukuuin / Sr. Member
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    Re: Weekly Shonen Jump [2011] - Discussion and TOC Talk - Part 2

    Was it mentioned that Toriko is absent next week? Because at the end of the chapter it said that it does.

  8. #157
    Registered User 英雄メンバー / Eiyuu Menbaa / Hero Member Zeromcd's Avatar
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    Re: Weekly Shonen Jump [2011] - Discussion and TOC Talk - Part 2

    In commemoration of Medaka Box getting an Anime, the 4 best ranking chapters of the series were posted on the Shounen Jump website.

    The best ranking chapters are:

    4th Place: Chapter 34 - "Won't Kill Your Life"

    3rd Place: Chapter 76 - "My Older Sister Kurokami Kujira"

    2nd Place: Chapter 96 - "Because It's My Job!''

    1st Place: Chapter 70 - "I Love You"

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  10. #158
    Registered User 中級員 / Chuukyuuin / Member
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    Re: Weekly Shonen Jump [2011] - Discussion and TOC Talk - Part 2

    Quote Originally Posted by Zeromcd View Post
    In commemoration of Medaka Box getting an Anime, the 4 best ranking chapters of the series were posted on the Shounen Jump website.

    The best ranking chapters are:

    4th Place: Chapter 34 - "Won't Kill Your Life"

    3rd Place: Chapter 76 - "My Older Sister Kurokami Kujira"

    2nd Place: Chapter 96 - "Because It's My Job!''

    1st Place: Chapter 70 - "I Love You"
    wow i never knew medaka ranked first at one point...was one piece absent that week or not?

  11. #159
    Negative Syndicate
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    Re: Weekly Shonen Jump [2011] - Discussion and TOC Talk - Part 2

    Quote Originally Posted by Zeromcd View Post
    In commemoration of Medaka Box getting an Anime, the 4 best ranking chapters of the series were posted on the Shounen Jump website.

    The best ranking chapters are:

    4th Place: Chapter 34 - "Won't Kill Your Life"

    3rd Place: Chapter 76 - "My Older Sister Kurokami Kujira"

    2nd Place: Chapter 96 - "Because It's My Job!''

    1st Place: Chapter 70 - "I Love You"
    Actually, that ranking is for best battle in Medaka Box.

    Quote Originally Posted by OPN View Post
    wow i never knew medaka ranked first at one point...was one piece absent that week or not?
    That is only for within Medaka's chapters (correctly battle), not about ranking in Jump ToC.

  12. #160
    Registered User 英雄メンバー / Eiyuu Menbaa / Hero Member Zeromcd's Avatar
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    Re: Weekly Shonen Jump [2011] - Discussion and TOC Talk - Part 2

    Quote Originally Posted by OPN View Post
    wow i never knew medaka ranked first at one point...was one piece absent that week or not?
    Excuse me, i meant that it was the best ranking chapter of the series, not of the week it was published. It does not directly say how well it did against other series but when competing with itself.

    Quote Originally Posted by Negative Syndicate View Post
    Actually, that ranking is for best battle in Medaka Box.
    Thanks Negative Syndicate, wasn't paying attention >.>
    Last edited by Zeromcd; October 28, 2011 at 11:03 PM.

  13. #161
    Registered User 英雄メンバー / Eiyuu Menbaa / Hero Member Newkerzy's Avatar
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    Re: Weekly Shonen Jump [2011] - Discussion and TOC Talk - Part 2

    Heh, so ch. 70 of Medaka got 1st. I'm not surprised.

    The 7 Dragons Of Fiore

  14. #162
    Translator 英雄メンバー / Eiyuu Menbaa / Hero Member kewl0210's Avatar
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    Re: Weekly Shonen Jump [2011] - Discussion and TOC Talk - Part 2

    Yeah. In this issue of Toriko it said Toriko will be absent next week.
    It also said that the total sales of Toriko is at 10 million volumes sold now, for the first 16 volumes.
    That was revealed in chapter 163. A big difference compared to chapter 138 when they announced it was at 7.3 million.

  15. #163
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    Re: Weekly Shonen Jump [2011] - Discussion and TOC Talk - Part 2

    Quote Originally Posted by Zeromcd View Post
    4th Place: Chapter 34 - "Won't Kill Your Life"
    3rd Place: Chapter 76 - "My Older Sister Kurokami Kujira"
    2nd Place: Chapter 96 - "Because It's My Job!''
    1st Place: Chapter 70 - "I Love You"
    no surprise at all, besides that the apron vision chapter is missing...

    are there more of these infos for other series like bakuman. it's quite interesting to see what japanese people like the most.

    PS: yeah 111 posts! ;-)

  16. #164
    Intl Translator 初心者/ Shoshinsha / Beginner Reith's Avatar
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    Re: Weekly Shonen Jump [2011] - Discussion and TOC Talk - Part 2

    Chapter 70 was the result of the character popularity contest.
    And one of the greatest scenes of the manga.

    Spoiler show

  17. #165
    Negative Syndicate
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    Re: Weekly Shonen Jump [2011] - Discussion and TOC Talk - Part 2

    Quote Originally Posted by Reith View Post
    Chapter 70 was the result of the character popularity contest.
    And one of the greatest scenes of the manga.
    No, it is not result of the character popularity poll. Plus, that ranking is based on a best battle scene, not a best chapter.

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