@Shader: I see where you are coming from, played too much RPG games, didn't you?
Unfortunately you are taking this argument too far with those statistics. We don't have the exact number or even remotely a border line comparison to discuss that preciously. We can only compare by simple feats, as I did before. So make it simple or wait for Oda to release some statistics dates, otherwise this topic is not discussable.
Hodys defence is by war superior than that of a PX. But it took all Pre-SHs to take down a single PX. Lucci with his sole offensive attacks is by far weaker than the combined offence power of the SHs. So no way in hell can Lucci dream to take on on a PX all alone. Yet it took Luffy just a single light haki imbued Jet Piston to take down a PX. The same Luffy needed by far more than that to take down Hody. How on earth is Lucci going to bring up that much offensive power? He can't! thats why he can't take down Hody.
If anyone wants to prove me wrong; explain me this! xD
Last edited by BlackHair; December 03, 2011 at 01:30 PM. Reason: Deleted the part involving damane08 quote
You don't understand sarcasm do you?
I did not understand kkck's post? I was not referring to any of your posts, or did you not see that? Did you read what I said?
Lets look at EXACTLY what he said shall we?
kkck: "Lets make another comparison then. Wasn't it said that arlong was nothing compared to pre transformation hodi? Arlong is obviously nowhere near lucci's league however if we are talking about someone who in his basic form is already that much stronger than arlong then at least somewhat standing up to lucci would be plausible for a moment. Add in a transformation that enhances his physical power enough to make a weak low level attack have a mile long range and endurance to take a barrage of luffy's gear 2 and 3 attacks and you easily have someone who can take lucci's attacks. More so, lucci was indeed phased by luffy's gear second attacks while in turn hodi took significantly enhanced versions of those attacks and at large he was barely phased.... "
I did not understand that? Or did you not read it?
I'll ask my question again: When did Hodi take a barrage of Luffy's Gear 2nd and Gear 3rd attacks? Show it to me, in the manga...
If my memory serves me correctly; it was one Gear 2nd attack (Red Hawk) and one Gear 3rd attack (Elephant Gun) and those two finished him completely.
Moderator message by: UrielCALM DOWN EVERYBODY.
I don't check this forum on daily basis, so if you kill yourself and bash each other I'll simply make a warning or ban if needed to the ones involved. Stay calm and polite.
Uriel, you need to put that avatar with the creepy smiling dude, it has more effect on posters here lol
And if u did read my post, you would understand that Im since the beginning defending Hodys tank ability. Therefore since you questioned the amount of damage he tanked, I just had to butt in.
Luffys Gear 2 kick.
Anyway, you didn't vote yet. But since you are still downplaying the dmg Hodi tanked, I assume you are with Lucci. So plz bring ur arguments, I will be happy to crush them, since u went all bossy on me.
btw: I do get sarcasm, but it seems I skipped the last word of that sentence in my hurry. But my mistake, indeed.
Last edited by BlackHair; December 03, 2011 at 01:28 PM.
"Let's draw a parallel between this fight and a possible fight between Rob Lucci and Crocodile:
-A MUCH weaker Luffy beat Crocodile earlier in the story
-The Luffy that fought Rob Lucci was MUCH stronger than the Luffy that beat Crocodile
-That stronger Luffy barely beat Rob Lucci
Going by some of the arguments presented in this thread: Rob Lucci should be able to easily beat Crocodile, right?
Styles make fights man
I'm not saying that Rob Lucci could beat Hodi, but some of the arguments in favor of Hodi are kinda funny.
Take this gem by kkck for example: "Add in a transformation that enhances his physical power enough to make a weak low level attack have a mile long range and endurance to take a barrage of luffy's gear 2 and 3 attacks and you easily have someone who can take lucci's attacks."
When did Hodi take a barrage of Luffy's Gear 2nd and Gear 3rd attacks? Show it to me, in the manga...
If my memory serves me correctly; it was one Gear 2nd attack (Red Hawk) and one Gear 3rd attack (Elephant Gun) and those two finished him completely. "
I actually did quote him. I used his name and I quoted what he said so that everyone would know what and who I was talking about.
please don't close it right away... this is one of the most energetic fight threads we've had in the OP section in a while...
Back to topic:
Okay in total it took about 4 to 5 attacks to put Hody out for the count...
-2 normal gear moves (on land)
-red hawk (Underwater)
-elephant gun (in air bubble)
Damage he did to Luffy
-He Bit Him
There was a countless amount of attacks exchanged between Lucci and Luffy
Both of them went all out
Had Lucci realized he needed to dodge Gear 3rd, he wouldn't have sustained the injury to his leg, or even lost consciousness the first time...
Hody is a tank with lots of HP
Lucci is a lightning bruiser with lots of variety
but I'm far more impressed with Lucci's skill
@damane08: I already explained that you wrote to generally and since u questioned his tank ability I had to quote ur post on the way. I doesn't matter if you just argued kkck post, your post started to generally about Hodys tank ability. At least it was not clear enough for me.
Anyway, then there is no point in continuing this any further.
Last edited by BlackHair; December 05, 2011 at 12:43 PM.
Ok, the barrage part was hyperbole (as the only actual barrage luffy used was the giant elephant glattling) however that still does not change that hodi consistently took and tanked luffy's attacks.
Gear two attack which hurled hodi through a mass of rocks.
Does not appear to be a geared attack but at this point it would at least have haki in it.
Hardened kick to the head/neck (haki implied at this point)
Hardened punch. Seeing luffy's expression it is quite obvious luffy is hitting him with everything he has.
Snake shot, straight to the heart.
The shockwave of the attack went through him and apparently it kinda burned through him. Still, he is not out yet.
Now this is what finally took him out.
Seeing everything hodi took, how can we even begin to question his sheer capacity to take damage? Seeing how much luffy has grown in comparison to the first part of the manga, how can we question his offensive capacity? Its not like luffy's offense is weak at all for us to say hodi's resistance is not that great for taking those attacks. How can we possibly argue lucci from ennies lobbies would be even vaguely close to the current luffy when it comes to speed or strength, let alone the fact that haki significantly enhances the offensive power of an attack? Lucci has no haki, his punches are simply regular punches. Even if it were actually true that lucci was slightly stronger than luffy two years ago, so what? Luffy right now is incomparably and unmeasurably stronger than what he was two years ago. This is not the same luffy that was told by anyone who mattered at the war that he was plainly weak and had no business in the front lines there, this is a luffy with actual power and had he been in that war he would have been a force to be considered who to boot would not need every known pirate there to protect his ass. Luffy right now would not win against mihawk, the admirals, WB, a few of the commanders and perhaps a few of the VAs however this is a luffy who would at least give them some pain. Lucci never gave us an indication that he was at this level, none of his attacks were ever shown to reach the scale or power luffy has now so why would his punches have any more effect than those of luffy after the timeskip? Shigan and rankyaku? I don't see any particular reason for those to be game winners against hodi considering the manga has shown people stabbed throguh their guts fighting as if nothing had happened.
No one is questioning Hodi's capacity to take damage, But it seems like people are questioning Rob Lucci's ability to give it out...
Now it will obviously take longer than post time skip luffy... but yea it'll happen... show a huge string of panels of punches that Hody is throwing out Damaging attack after Damaging attack at Luffy, then I'll concede...
I'm only saying this, because you are trying to make it sound like he was even a real "credible threat" when his only real damaging attack, hit inside the water (the bite)... the single punch he landed on Luffy on Land was recoiled from his rubber abilities without Haki, so Rob Lucci's tekkai should tank it just as easily...
Luffy's Snakeshot = Lucci is a master at Shigan
Red Hawk (Luffy's Newer, But not most powerful Attack) = Rokugan (Largest Ring, Lucci's Most Powerful Attack, And bypasses his Tankness)
Rankakyu Barrage to finish him off....
Game. Set. Match.
Luffy dodging the water droplet barrage with Haki = Lucci dodging droplets with Kami-E and reflexes (as Bleuno said "There's No Art To Getting Hit")
And by the off chance he gets near enough water to throw that shark barrage, even though I doubt it's that damaging, Lucci Dodges with Geppou and Soru...
---------- Post added at 08:21 AM ---------- Previous post was at 08:20 AM ----------
I doubt Hodi, could beat a pacifista...
Reread the arc or at least the fight again damn it, you are spouting nonsense.
You're equaling a piercing attack from Luffy to Lucci's Shigan without any evidence whatsoever that they are equal in strength. There a Imo missing everywhere.
One single G2 Twin Jet Pistol caused big pain and marks on Lucci, while Hodi took a couple of haki infused hit's, was hurtled/thrown around and shrugged it off as if it's nothing, looking more annoyed than hurt, this may just be an effect of the pills, but that's irrelevant as both can use all their feats.
You mention Luffy taking his cheap shot, which his rubber body naturally neutralized, but fail to mention that Luffy used haki in his arms and legs to defend and beat Hody down in the following panels. And only this caused Bizarrohody to show real anguish and think of a different tactic, after taking hits that would have easily annihilated the older models of Pacifista.
Yes, Lucci is/was fast in the EL arc, but Luffy was able to keep up at the end, match Lucci's Madara Shigan, take on Sai Dai Rin: Rokuougan and used an early form of G2 Jet Gatling to beat down a Tekkai using Lucci. Having said that, Luffy was far to strong for Hody and Oda created circumstances to bring out the most of the second one, while creating trouble for the first one.
I wont add any picture to reinforce my arguments, everyone should have a well-founded knowledge about OP and especially those fights to take part in the discussion.
Last edited by Schabrak; December 06, 2011 at 10:45 AM.
If lucci from ennies lobby were to fight current luffy, it would clearly not be an even match. Luffy would not even have trouble (pacifista are much stronger than lucci and luffy one shots them in a sec) against the guy, it would be outright a massacre. A fight between pre time skip lucci and post time skip luffy would look a lot like the luffy vs mihawk fight. Only way to have a small chance of surviving is running the hell away and hoping to god someone with actual power saves you. Not that I think luffy is as strong as mihawk but the difference between lucci and luffy is large enough for a similar scenario to arise.
You guys take to much out of context...
Red Hawk is Definitely not Luffy's most powerful attack right now... Rokugan IS Rob Lucci's most powerful attack...
Luffy doesn't go all out to use Red Hawk, Lucci is has to catch his breath after using Rokugan...
IMO << are you happy...
And Lucci's Rokugan blast through Hodi's body, bypassing his "Tankness"
And I can easily fathom this victory for Lucci just like the other 14 people who voted for him... (Not that votes mean fact)
IMO Snake Shot isn't much different from Shigan, which Lucci seems to be a master of...
Lucci's Rankyaku Gaicho is capable of cutting steel... That's lion song sharpness (Zoro)
Why do you think luffy was not hitting hodi with all he had? I would doubt luffy would hold back his punches when he is fighting a mutant fishman underwater, that does not make a shred of sense. Heck, just look at luffy's expression when he is hitting hodi with his hardened arm, that is not the expression of a man who is holding his punches in the least honestly. Rokugan can be lucci's strongest attack but so what? How does that suggest rokugan right now would even come close to a nameless punch on luffy's punch (although technically luffy names all his punches considering more than half his named attaks are just punches lol)? I really can't see why anyone would think pre time skip lucci would be vaguely close to current luffy in terms of strength, speed or stamina, it simply does not make sense. Overall, what does it matter if lucci has attacks which are similar to luffy's if his strength, speed or stamina are but a fraction of current luffy's?