Who is stronger than Luffy?

[Dice]

I don't get how you could think that.

Alright, let's look at this from a third person perspective. Everyone was going about their duties during the timeskip. Sure, the pirates/marines may have gotten stronger, but nobody trained as hard as Luffy. He restrained himself to an island, got a PhD in all studies of haki, and now probably knows everything, literally everything about his DF. Keep in mind Luffy spent 2 full years in training. Why would he quit the training if he was not even strong enough to kill the guy who killed his brother?

The training was merely to survive in the new world which none of them would have for a long time. I don't won't to say that he is a weak or something but I'd say he is not even close to defeat the likes of Akainu he will just not die almost instantly and might very well be able to put up a fight. Especially plot wise it wouldn't make that much sense if he is able to fight one of the top dogs of the marines. Hell Akainu might be even the strongest person of the marines.
I see the training just as a tool to close the gap he experienced in the war not to surpass everybody. The last progress to be strong enough to beat them will be gained through his journey.

[Jirachier]

Characters who are still stronger than Luffy: the admirals, the emperors, the emperors's lieutenants, garp, mihawk, rayleigh, marco, kong, sengoku, dragon.

I also do not think that the other supernovas are on par with Luffy, even before the timeskip Luffy was already stronger than all of them and the only reason why Kidd
had a slightly higher bounty than him was because he was hurting civilians, and while they were splitting their time between training and exploring the new world
luffy was focusing all of his attention on training so the obvious conclusion is that luffy is stronger than the supernovas by quite a margin, not that they are weak.
The same thing is valid for Smoker, he was only beating Luffy because the later was unable to land a hit on his logia body, but now not only did he gain the ability
to hit logia users he also improved his devil fruits powers and gained haki of observation, luffy is definitely stronger than Smoker.
Lucci and Luffy were almost on par before the timeskip but now it's clear that Luffy is much stronger than him, you can't except every person that luffy has fought
in the past to have the same growth rate as he does otherwise everyone will become admiral-level by the end of the serie
Ivankov is also not stronger than luffy, we've seen his fight with Magellan and he didn't really have more luck than luffy did, they were probably on the same level back then, now luffy is stronger.
Also the emperors are do not hold that title just because they have large territories and soldiers, it's also because they are exceedinly powerful, look at Shanks, Whitebeard, Blackbeard
you can't expect the soldiers, especially pirates to follow someone who is weaker than the are, and we all know that in OP massive numbers of fighters isn't what determines
the outcome of a battle, it's the strength of the top fighters, the strawhats vs the fishermen is a good example of how 10 people defeated an entire army and it wasn't that hard for them to do so,
and the argument that in the NW the pirates are stronger than the ones in the first part of the grand line isn't valid, we've all seen these pirates fight in the war of the best, besides their captains who were
probably each on par with a vice admiral(remember that before the timeskip luffy could defeat multiple vice admirals by himself) they weren't that strong, and i know that the pirates that were present
were only a few crews of all the ones in the NW but it was explicitly said that they were veterans of the NW, they still lost consciousness to Luffy's haki even before
he gained control over it so my guess is, in the NW there is more top tiers pirates but the foot soldiers level is still not high enough to pose a threat.

[abc1233]

Characters who are still stronger than Luffy: the admirals, the emperors, the emperors's lieutenants, garp, mihawk, rayleigh, marco, kong, sengoku, dragon.

I also do not think that the other supernovas are on par with Luffy, even before the timeskip Luffy was already stronger than all of them and the only reason why Kidd
had a slightly higher bounty than him was because he was hurting civilians, and while they were splitting their time between training and exploring the new world
luffy was focusing all of his attention on training so the obvious conclusion is that luffy is stronger than the supernovas by quite a margin, not that they are weak.
The same thing is valid for Smoker, he was only beating Luffy because the later was unable to land a hit on his logia body, but now not only did he gain the ability
to hit logia users he also improved his devil fruits powers and gained haki of observation, luffy is definitely stronger than Smoker.
Lucci and Luffy were almost on par before the timeskip but now it's clear that Luffy is much stronger than him, you can't except every person that luffy has fought
in the past to have the same growth rate as he does otherwise everyone will become admiral-level by the end of the serie
Ivankov is also not stronger than luffy, we've seen his fight with Magellan and he didn't really have more luck than luffy did, they were probably on the same level back then, now luffy is stronger.
Also the emperors are do not hold that title just because they have large territories and soldiers, it's also because they are exceedinly powerful, look at Shanks, Whitebeard, Blackbeard
you can't expect the soldiers, especially pirates to follow someone who is weaker than the are, and we all know that in OP massive numbers of fighters isn't what determines
the outcome of a battle, it's the strength of the top fighters, the strawhats vs the fishermen is a good example of how 10 people defeated an entire army and it wasn't that hard for them to do so,
and the argument that in the NW the pirates are stronger than the ones in the first part of the grand line isn't valid, we've all seen these pirates fight in the war of the best, besides their captains who were
probably each on par with a vice admiral(remember that before the timeskip luffy could defeat multiple vice admirals by himself) they weren't that strong, and i know that the pirates that were present
were only a few crews of all the ones in the NW but it was explicitly said that they were veterans of the NW, they still lost consciousness to Luffy's haki even before
he gained control over it so my guess is, in the NW there is more top tiers pirates but the foot soldiers level is still not high enough to pose a threat.

It was so difficult reading your post lol

Firstly, I'd have to disagree with you on Iva. This is a person who is very highly ranked in the RA and is someone who could fight on par with a pacifista-enhanced Kuma. The more solid proof of him not being on the same level as Luffy is that he beat Sanji without breaking a sweat, can you honestly say that Luffy can do the same?

Also, when did Luffy beat multiple vice-admirals on his own? I can't remember such a thing occuring

The training was merely to survive in the new world which none of them would have for a long time. I don't won't to say that he is a weak or something but I'd say he is not even close to defeat the likes of Akainu he will just not die almost instantly and might very well be able to put up a fight. Especially plot wise it wouldn't make that much sense if he is able to fight one of the top dogs of the marines. Hell Akainu might be even the strongest person of the marines.
I see the training just as a tool to close the gap he experienced in the war not to surpass everybody. The last progress to be strong enough to beat them will be gained through his journey.

Right now you can't exactly back up that statement. We haven't seen Luffy pushed to his limits yet since the TS, nor have we seen him take on someone of Akainu's level. For all we know, he may not be that far off, he is expected to beat BM by the end of this saga anyway but who knows? It's Oda after all...

[Jirachier]

The 5 vice admirals of the Enies Lobbis arc weren't even able to capture Luffy that should be proof enough that he is already stronger than any vice admiral.
As for Iva Sanji is very strong but he's nowhere near Luffy strength and now after the timeskip both of are much stronger, I don't see Iva being stronger than they are.

[kkck]

^I don't think that is necessarily the case. The VAs at ennies lobby where there solely for the buster call. At no point they ever tried to get involved and most of them probably wouldn't have been able too. The odds of a VA actually being stronger than luffy are small IMO however I do think a few of them should be roughly even.

As for people currently stronger than luffy I would go for these guys:

- All three admirals
- Maybe a few VAs. Smoker should be close to a match to luffy and I do doubt smoker is the strongest of them considering his age.
- Marco, jozu and vista (I rate this guys at roughly the admiral level)
- Mihawk (match for shanks and the admirals IMO)
- Shanks
- garp
- the yonko. I guess there is the possibility that currently at least one of the yonko is actually at about luffy's level although the odds of that are slim
- A few of the commanders should be about as strong as luffy
- jinbe is equal to luffy
- Iva is a bit of a wildcard IMO however it wouldn't be strange to me if he was on the level or stronger than luffy. The guy actually kicked kuma's but a bit in a strictly non sexual way.
- Kuma should be stronger than luffy
- Hancock should be stronger than luffy IMO
- There should be several crews in the NW with captains as strong and perhaps stronger than luffy.

[hoeru]

Since we've been talking about mainly pre-time skip characters: I think Vergo is also stronger than Luffy - unless his powers can't bring down Luffy because "he's a rubber man". :/

[Jirachier]

I think we shouldn't speculate on Vergo's strength for now until we know for sure how he brought down Law to his knees.
Smoker is in no way close to luffy's strength, we've seen how he didn't last long against Law, and when you remember that Luffy is the strongest of the eleven supernovas.
Jinbei is pretty strong but I don't think he is stronger than Luffy, currently I think luffy is as powerful as Ace was before dying and yes we saw Ace fighting Jinbei and they were a match to each other but that was years ago, Ace was still young and he became a lot stronger than that, so no Jinbei is weaker.
Kuma isn't stronger than Luffy especially after seeing how Luffy OHKO'd a pacisifta, yes Kuma must be the strongest of the pacisifta but still.
And I don't think a single vice-admiral is stronger than Luffy, and for Vergo who's current strength is unknown you need to remember that he is a pirate who infiltrated the marines so even if he's very powerful it doesn't mean the other vice admirals are near his level.

[abc1233]

I think we shouldn't speculate on Vergo's strength for now until we know for sure how he brought down Law to his knees.
Smoker is in no way close to luffy's strength, we've seen how he didn't last long against Law, and when you remember that Luffy is the strongest of the eleven supernovas.
Jinbei is pretty strong but I don't think he is stronger than Luffy, currently I think luffy is as powerful as Ace was before dying and yes we saw Ace fighting Jinbei and they were a match to each other but that was years ago, Ace was still young and he became a lot stronger than that, so no Jinbei is weaker.
Kuma isn't stronger than Luffy especially after seeing how Luffy OHKO'd a pacisifta, yes Kuma must be the strongest of the pacisifta but still.
And I don't think a single vice-admiral is stronger than Luffy, and for Vergo who's current strength is unknown you need to remember that he is a pirate who infiltrated the marines so even if he's very powerful it doesn't mean the other vice admirals are near his level.

Kuma isn't stronger? He's probably got one of the most powerful DFs out there, he is in a completely different league to the other pacifistas so the fact that Luffy OHKO'd a pacifista isn't saying much, Kuma pretty much did that pre-TS.


How can you say that all the VAs are weaker than Luffy? We've only got a rough idea of Smoker's strength, the others are pretty much unknown. All we know is that they all have haki and most likely have much more experience with haki than Luffy.

The 5 vice admirals of the Enies Lobbis arc weren't even able to capture Luffy that should be proof enough that he is already stronger than any vice admiral.
As for Iva Sanji is very strong but he's nowhere near Luffy strength and now after the timeskip both of are much stronger, I don't see Iva being stronger than they are.

The buster call is really a poor example, they weren't exactly fighting Luffy properly and it's just ridiculous to think that pre-TS Luffy could take on 5 experienced haki users who are just below admiral level.

Sanji is obviously weaker than Luffy, but could Luffy have taken him out without breaking a sweat like Iva did? I very much doubt it.

^I don't think that is necessarily the case. The VAs at ennies lobby where there solely for the buster call. At no point they ever tried to get involved and most of them probably wouldn't have been able too. The odds of a VA actually being stronger than luffy are small IMO however I do think a few of them should be roughly even.

As for people currently stronger than luffy I would go for these guys:

- All three admirals
- Maybe a few VAs. Smoker should be close to a match to luffy and I do doubt smoker is the strongest of them considering his age.
- Marco, jozu and vista (I rate this guys at roughly the admiral level)
- Mihawk (match for shanks and the admirals IMO)
- Shanks
- garp
- the yonko. I guess there is the possibility that currently at least one of the yonko is actually at about luffy's level although the odds of that are slim
- A few of the commanders should be about as strong as luffy
- jinbe is equal to luffy
- Iva is a bit of a wildcard IMO however it wouldn't be strange to me if he was on the level or stronger than luffy. The guy actually kicked kuma's but a bit in a strictly non sexual way.
- Kuma should be stronger than luffy
- Hancock should be stronger than luffy IMO
- There should be several crews in the NW with captains as strong and perhaps stronger than luffy.

I wouldn't say that Hancock is stronger. Pre-TS she didn't do anything of note which post-TS Luffy can't do equally or better

[TitaniumOxide]

@Abc1233 Hancock pre timeskip was able to kick the hell out of a pacifista without effort And her legs didn't even go dark to show she was using any haki although Oda might have omitted that because back then he didn't put much emphasis on using CoA as much as he did now in terms of color scheme especially when Shanks's sword didn't go dark yet it saved Coby from Akainu.

Anyways off the top of my head I say...

Equals:
Law
Kidd
Jimbe
(Almost Zoro)
Magellan
Hancock
Some Vice Admirals
Smoker

Stronger:
Admirals
Some Vice Admirals
Doflamingo
Mihawk
Emperors
Marco and the rest of his commander colleagues
Sengoku
Garp

The reason why I said some VMs for both spots is because there has never been a mention of VMs having to be on the same level. Maybe the VMs during the Enies Lobby arc were fodder but perhaps others are more capable. Smoker lost to Law because it seems like he didn't know of the extent of Law's powers because Smoker isn't stupid. If he knew of Law's full power I'm sure he wouldn't have gotten in such a situation where Law can rip his heart out in that particular way. I'm not kissing his ass but I think until we see Smoker truly fight a big time antagonist/Luffy, we shouldn't underestimate him and give him a second chance after losing to Law like that.

[abc1233]

@Abc1233 Hancock pre timeskip was able to kick the hell out of a pacifista without effort And her legs didn't even go dark to show she was using any haki although Oda might have omitted that because back then he didn't put much emphasis on using CoA as much as he did now in terms of color scheme especially when Shanks's sword didn't go dark yet it saved Coby from Akainu.

Anyways off the top of my head I say...

Equals:
Law
Kidd
Jimbe
(Almost Zoro)
Magellan
Hancock
Some Vice Admirals
Smoker

Stronger:
Admirals
Some Vice Admirals
Doflamingo
Mihawk
Emperors
Marco and the rest of his commander colleagues
Sengoku
Garp

The reason why I said some VMs for both spots is because there has never been a mention of VMs having to be on the same level. Maybe the VMs during the Enies Lobby arc were fodder but perhaps others are more capable. Smoker lost to Law because it seems like he didn't know of the extent of Law's powers because Smoker isn't stupid. If he knew of Law's full power I'm sure he wouldn't have gotten in such a situation where Law can rip his heart out in that particular way. I'm not kissing his ass but I think until we see Smoker truly fight a big time antagonist/Luffy, we shouldn't underestimate him and give him a second chance after losing to Law like that.

Well as you said, Oda didn't make CoA usage that obvious before. Vista and Marco used CoA on Akainu, Shanks too but there was nothing to suggest that they had done so other than being able to touch logias/others commenting on it. So we can't say if she did or not, even if she didn't, it's still not a feat which is beyond Luffy's capabilities. Sanji pretty much achieved the same thing and we can all agree that Luffy can hit harder than Sanji.

Also, I'd have to disagree on Law/Kidd being Luffy's equals. They were equal/slightly below Luffy before the TS in which Luffy focused purely on getting stronger with the PK's first mate. I highly doubt Law/Kidd grew to the same extent as Luffy during the TS. If they had then there wouldn't have been any point in Luffy wasting 2 years training when he could have just gone into the NW and levelled up to the same extent.

[Kaiten]

All of the Kujo Pirates can use armament haki, confirmed by Rayliegh. Hancock is also a confirmed wielder of conqueror's haki.

[fcToho]

Also, I'd have to disagree on Law/Kidd being Luffy's equals. They were equal/slightly below Luffy before the TS in which Luffy focused purely on getting stronger with the PK's first mate. I highly doubt Law/Kidd grew to the same extent as Luffy during the TS. If they had then there wouldn't have been any point in Luffy wasting 2 years training when he could have just gone into the NW and levelled up to the same extent.

But I think this is exactly the case. I find it kind of stupid too, but imo Luffy, Kid, Law are supposed to be still on the same level. Heck.. I can even believe Kidd is stronger at the moment.

[Ourum]

Stronger
Akainu
Aokiji
Kizaru
Dracule Mihawk
Donquixote Doflamingo
Big Mom (Charlotte Linlin)
Kaidou
Shanks
Blackbeard
Bartholomew Kuma
Rayleigh Silvers

Equal
Eustass Kidd
Trafalgar Law
Rob Lucci (maybe)
Crocodile (maybe)
X Drake
Basil Hawkins

Weaker
Magellan (haki turns the battle right around)
Sengoku
Garp
Smoker
Coby
Mr. 1
all other important characters


Weakest
Buggy


all just my own speculation, and none of them are in order of strength

[jaymizzo]

Stronger
Akainu
Aokiji
Kizaru
Dracule Mihawk
Donquixote Doflamingo
Big Mom (Charlotte Linlin)
Kaidou
Shanks
Blackbeard
Bartholomew Kuma
Rayleigh Silvers

Equal
Eustass Kidd
Trafalgar Law
Rob Lucci (maybe)
Crocodile (maybe)
X Drake
Basil Hawkins

Weaker
Magellan (haki turns the battle right around)
Sengoku
Garp
Smoker
Coby
Mr. 1
all other important characters


Weakest
Buggy


all just my own speculation, and none of them are in order of strength

I know its your speculation and all but how can you think Garp and Sengoku are weaker than Luffy?

[FaustXIII]

Eneru, Kong, Kaidou, is stronger than Luffy