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Thread: A vs. Minato

  1. #16
    Registered User 英雄メンバー / Eiyuu Menbaa / Hero Member Lemonadez's Avatar
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    Re: A vs. Minato

    lol people using Biju tentacles as their excuse.

    3rd Raikage technique called "Jigokuzuki" was the one that Cut 8tail entire tails.
    Chidori couldn't not cut Bee.
    Kakashi Raikiri couldnt penetrate against biju form.

    Minato with his own kunai was able to cut down the 8 tails, those TAILS are called Tentacles/Limbs NOW.

    If Minato was able to cut down Hachibi limbs with just Kunai, His strength is way stronger than Sasuke kick and even his Chidori.
    http://www.mangareader.net/93-416-12...apter-411.html <- Show here Sasuke kick him at full speed.
    http://www.mangareader.net/93-416-13...apter-411.html <- Didnt even dent him. He's not even using Hachibi Chakra.

    While on other hands Strength of Minato was able to cut down Hachibi tails with just Kunai.
    http://www.mangareader.net/naruto/542/15 <- See
    http://www.mangareader.net/naruto/542/16 <- You can really clearly see the cut on Hachibi tails.

    Now look at Sasuke Chidori
    http://www.mangareader.net/93-417-14...apter-412.html <- He hit Bee with Chidori (Bee wasn't even using Hachibi Chakra).
    http://www.mangareader.net/93-417-15...apter-412.html <- After Getting hit by Chidori, He still can escape that close range attack.
    http://www.mangareader.net/93-417-16...apter-412.html <- Well if You look at that Bee wasnt even injured by Chidori. So Chidori couldn't even penetrated Bee body -.-

    Sasuke couldn't even pierce Bee Body alone with Chidori. Not even his physical attack couldn't dent Bee body.
    Sasuke Chidori was able to pierce through 4th Raikage Raiton Armor.

    So pretty much that sum it up, That even a Kunai can deal damage through Raiton Armor. Seing Sasuke chidori couldn't even penetrate Bee body :P and Bee doesnt even use Raiton armor LoL. Minato was able to damage hachibi tails with kunai alone.

    Minato physical strength is way stronger than Sasuke Chidori LoL. so even a punch can knock out A :P
    Last edited by Lemonadez; January 20, 2012 at 07:22 AM.

  2. #17
    Registered User MH中毒 / MH Chuudoku / MH Addicted ninjabot's Avatar
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    Re: A vs. Minato

    Quote Originally Posted by Uchiha_Blood
    And Ee is not that fast without Raiton Armour.
    I lol at people that say that Ee is fast while Minato is not, when they both use their jutsu to move around.
    Still, remember Kakashi Gaiden, against the Iwa ninja?
    Minato was here, and with a single Shunshin he saved Kakashi after he traveled with Raikiri killing 18 clones. People that bash Yondaime on his speed are funny

    Which means nothing considering he ALWAYS has it on. And that Iwa ninja doesn't have speed nor durability comperable to A. What you're trying to dance around is the fact that MINATO CAN'T HURT A. No one's bashing anyone's speed, we're simply forcing you to accept what makes him fast, aswell as the situations that his limited movement will place him in. He can ONLY keep himself alive via Hiraishin, and knowing where his tags are going lets you know where he is going. He has no Sharingan to predict A's movements and thus can't react to his speed WITHOUT Hiraishin as was shown in the manga already. Try as you might you are not changing what happened.


    Quote Quote:
    Yes, the speed of the thrust that was a factor only on the first time Sasuke used the jutsu. Later he used Chidori without running, and the jutsu didn't lose any power.
    Point being, you assume that the piercing powers of a Chidori are so great to pierce Raikage while the drilling powers of the Rasengan aren't so great.
    Granted, Minato would not implant his fingers in Ee's skull, but still he would damage him with enough attemps to kill him.
    If Minato wasn't a threat why Ee was saved by Bee when he attempted to stab him with the kunai? Why Ee was costantly on edge, if Raiton armour can't be touched with anything bar an S rank jutsu, while Yondaime was known for Hiraishin and Rasengan?

    I'm not assuming anything. We saw a Rasengan stronger than Minato's exponentially not be able to smash through Sandaime Raikage's armor. We also saw Minato's own Rasengan hit Tobi (a shell of his former self) without killing him. And it was a clear-cut direct strike to the back. And he got up. A was constantly on edge because Minato's reputation preceded him for taking down whole armies, aswell as his speed. Your hope that he could kill him comes from that alone: hope. When I've got two manga scans that shows Minato's power is insignificant.

    http://www.mangareader.net/93-55464-...apter-502.html
    http://www.mangareader.net/93-55672-...apter-503.html Still spry and moving at full speed, lmao. So much for that super strong Rasengan. You're hilarious.



    Quote Quote:
    Yes, he redirected a Bijuudama without breaking a sweat, and teleporting himself a few times will tire him.
    Yeah.
    And how can Ee do anything if Yondaime marks his back? He scatters a lot of kunai around when fighting, so Ee, like before, would not know where Minato will appear.
    And Minato not hurting him with the Rasengan are your assumptions, and the only thing you can cling on to make any statement even a little believable

    You forget: Minato had to send that Bijuudama away to a predetermined tag. Minato has no prepped tags here, meaning if he teleports something away, it'll only be to the place he just recently placed. Likewise he'll tire out because he has to use Hiraishin constantly just to stay alive. Every single dodge will need to be made by Hiraishin, aswell as every single counter attack as his Shunshin just isn't gonna do the job. And yes, try though you might to imply he has herculean chakra reserves, he doesn't have bijuu level chakra.

    As for why Bee tried to protect him, it's because he WANTED to. Hinata tried to protect Sage Mode Naruto from God Realm despite knowing he has the Kyuubi and has already defeated multiple bodies. That didn't stop her from trying to protect him, did it? Try as you might, you're not gonna make that tiny kunai comperable to a Chidori in potential damage.



    And I'm starting to understand why no one ever made this thread. If my arguments in favor of Minato were as pathetic as yours, I would want to save face to avoid embarrasing myself too. On that note, quit before it gets any worse.


    Quote Quote:
    I laughed. Hard. So now Bijuu's tentacles or limbs are easily cuttable, to the point that Sasuke would've cut Hachibi's tentacle with his sword.
    I DARE you to find a manga scan that states, let alone shows this. I dare you.

    Quote Quote:
    If that was so easy, why the Third bothered with his Hellbringer? Let a minor ninja do the cutting, he would've simply tanked Hachibi's attacks.
    So, in the same situation, Sasuke would easily cut cleaved the tentacle in half when his best feat with a sword was cutting a door, or exit a cave.

    Stop making up statements. It was never said he used it for cutting tails, he used it to try to defeat the 8 tails, pure and simple. It just so happened it cleaved straight through his tails as he was fighting him (just like Sasuke's Amaterasu destroyed most of Bee's tails, despite them not even behind his target).

    So, let's put your argument in perspective, pathetic though it may be:

    1:Minato will hit through Raikage's armor and hurt him because... it was strong enough to NOT break through Tobi's flesh, and Sage Mode Naruto's Rasengan wasn't strong enough to break through Raiton Armor aswell.

    2: Minato's kunai is stronger than a Chidori AND a Sage Mode Rasengan.

    3: Bee's tentacles are as strong as Raiton Armor despite his tentacles never being considered stronger than regular octopi tentacles. I actually think I know why you could say something so outrageous though: you think he was summoning tails instead of just tentacles, meaning you think he was powering up. You're wrong because if he did then his tentacles would look like pure chakra just like every other time.

    4: Minato will manage to get his tags or kunai out at the beginning of the fight, avoiding a fatal blow from the beginning of the fight.

    If anything in the numbered is what you believe, then your love for Minato'll never let you be reasonable and I'm wasting my time.

  3. #18
    MH Senpai 有名人 / Yuumeijin / Celebrity Uchiha_Blood's Avatar
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    Re: A vs. Minato

    Quote Originally Posted by ninjabot View Post
    Which means nothing considering he ALWAYS has it on. And that Iwa ninja doesn't have speed nor durability comperable to A. What you're trying to dance around is the fact that MINATO CAN'T HURT A. No one's bashing anyone's speed, we're simply forcing you to accept what makes him fast, aswell as the situations that his limited movement will place him in. He can ONLY keep himself alive via Hiraishin, and knowing where his tags are going lets you know where he is going. He has no Sharingan to predict A's movements and thus can't react to his speed WITHOUT Hiraishin as was shown in the manga already. Try as you might you are not changing what happened.
    Funny thing is, I didn't reply to you on that one, and be as it may, just like Raikage can't fight at full force without Raiton Armour, Yondaime can't fight at full force without Hiraishin.
    The thing is that ppl, when bash Yondaime, usually say that he is slow without Hiraishin, when I proved that he isn't.
    He is fast, one of the fastest without Hiraishin, and is the fastest with it, him and Naruto with his Chakra Mode. And before you go all emotional on me, the same Ee said so.
    Despute that


    Quote Quote:
    I'm not assuming anything. We saw a Rasengan stronger than Minato's exponentially not be able to smash through Sandaime Raikage's armor. We also saw Minato's own Rasengan hit Tobi (a shell of his former self) without killing him. And it was a clear-cut direct strike to the back. And he got up. A was constantly on edge because Minato's reputation preceded him for taking down whole armies, aswell as his speed. Your hope that he could kill him comes from that alone: hope. When I've got two manga scans that shows Minato's power is insignificant.

    http://www.mangareader.net/93-55464-...apter-502.html
    http://www.mangareader.net/93-55672-...apter-503.html Still spry and moving at full speed, lmao. So much for that super strong Rasengan. You're hilarious.
    Bad choice in either cases, and I'll explain you why:
    -Sandaime Raikage, in case you don't remember, has the whole strongest, resilient body etc.
    Not Ee, his father. And Naruto's Sage Mode Rasengan was used as redirecting the strike, not drilling through it. Still not that it would've made that great difference, since RasenShuriken did little to him. Still, it was thanks to the Third's strong body, not thank to Raiton Armour.
    So your point regarding Sage Naruto's Rasengan is invalid, I'm afraid. And how he redirected his arm if he didn't go through the Raiton Armour?
    The visual isn't perfect here, but you can see the Rasengan hitting the arm, without losing power and all.
    How would the Rasengan redirect the arm otherwise? Good going with this example.
    Other than that, please link me the page where it says that the Third's endurance was thanks to Raiton Armour, please
    -The Rasengan do not make the target explode. Against Kabuto, in case you remember, he devastated his stomach. With Tobi, he destroyed the part where he striked, as proven by the severed arm. And on top of that, it was used as a way to mark Tobi. If destroying one's arm, with all the effect of the earth blown and all wasn't proof of a Rasengan's strenght, then I don't know what to say to you. You do realize that is RasenShuriken that destroys the whole body of the target, and not Rasengan, yes?


    Quote Quote:
    You forget: Minato had to send that Bijuudama away to a predetermined tag. Minato has no prepped tags here, meaning if he teleports something away, it'll only be to the place he just recently placed. Likewise he'll tire out because he has to use Hiraishin constantly just to stay alive. Every single dodge will need to be made by Hiraishin, aswell as every single counter attack as his Shunshin just isn't gonna do the job. And yes, try though you might to imply he has herculean chakra reserves, he doesn't have bijuu level chakra.

    As for why Bee tried to protect him, it's because he WANTED to. Hinata tried to protect Sage Mode Naruto from God Realm despite knowing he has the Kyuubi and has already defeated multiple bodies. That didn't stop her from trying to protect him, did it? Try as you might, you're not gonna make that tiny kunai comperable to a Chidori in potential damage.
    You misunderstood me, I said that, since he was able to redirect both things that are huges, masses of chakra like a Bijuudama and the Kyuubi, that his Hiraishin usage isn't a tiring matter here, if he teleports himself.
    And why can't he? He can scatter the kunai and mark Ee. Is not like that he needs to teleport something away that isn't himself.

    The Hinata/Naruto example is really bad, Ee wasn't pinned to the ground with Minato hovering above him, he was clad in his Raiton Armour that, as you say, isn't penetrable by a kunai. The fact that Sasuke failed doesn't mean that anyone fails, I'm afraid.


    Quote Quote:
    And I'm starting to understand why no one ever made this thread. If my arguments in favor of Minato were as pathetic as yours, I would want to save face to avoid embarrasing myself too. On that note, quit before it gets any worse.
    Don't be aggressive, it only shows that you're getting upset over it.
    Usually, getting angry shows that you aren't so sure of what you're saying, so stay cool



    Quote Quote:
    I DARE you to find a manga scan that states, let alone shows this. I dare you.
    That all Sasuke cutted with his sword was a door and a stone?
    Ah no, its true, he cutted clay. My bad


    Quote Quote:
    Stop making up statements. It was never said he used it for cutting tails, he used it to try to defeat the 8 tails, pure and simple. It just so happened it cleaved straight through his tails as he was fighting him (just like Sasuke's Amaterasu destroyed most of Bee's tails, despite them not even behind his target).

    So, let's put your argument in perspective, pathetic though it may be:

    1:Minato will hit through Raikage's armor and hurt him because... it was strong enough to NOT break through Tobi's flesh, and Sage Mode Naruto's Rasengan wasn't strong enough to break through Raiton Armor aswell.

    2: Minato's kunai is stronger than a Chidori AND a Sage Mode Rasengan.

    3: Bee's tentacles are as strong as Raiton Armor despite his tentacles never being considered stronger than regular octopi tentacles. I actually think I know why you could say something so outrageous though: you think he was summoning tails instead of just tentacles, meaning you think he was powering up. You're wrong because if he did then his tentacles would look like pure chakra just like every other time.

    4: Minato will manage to get his tags or kunai out at the beginning of the fight, avoiding a fatal blow from the beginning of the fight.

    If anything in the numbered is what you believe, then your love for Minato'll never let you be reasonable and I'm wasting my time.
    Its funny how you seem pissed and all, and make statements based on what you want to believe.
    Fine, I'll play your little game

    1)When an almost severed arm count as not breaking through flesh, and when Ee's skin will be as tough as his father's, then you'll be right.
    Shame is not the case in either one

    2)Quote the part where I said that, please.
    And I'm quoting you, "I DARE you"

    3)Same as above, I used the tentacle example to show that Minato's strenght with a kunai is not laughing matter, and would be able to do damage since he cleaved in two a giant tentacle, the same feat that required a Chidori Spear and a Hellbringer to do.
    Didn't say that the Chidori spear is weaker than Minato with a kunai, I said that Minato with his kunai cleaved Bee's tentacle, thus it can likely do damage

    4)The same way he did on canon, yes. Why wouldn't he, since he already did? Please answer me.
    I'll even show you the page! And I'm afraid I'm not the one who's "love" for a character blinds him.

    So now that you so cleverly showed my points, let me show yours:

    1) Minato will lose because he can't damage him!!oneone! Why? Because Sasuke wasn't able to
    Last edited by Uchiha_Blood; January 20, 2012 at 01:16 PM.

  4. #19
    Registered User MH中毒 / MH Chuudoku / MH Addicted ninjabot's Avatar
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    Re: A vs. Minato

    Quote Originally Posted by Uchiha_Blood
    Funny thing is, I didn't reply to you on that one, and be as it may, just like Raikage can't fight at full force without Raiton Armour, Yondaime can't fight at full force without Hiraishin.
    The thing is that ppl, when bash Yondaime, usually say that he is slow without Hiraishin, when I proved that he isn't.
    He is fast, one of the fastest without Hiraishin, and is the fastest with it, him and Naruto with his Chakra Mode. And before you go all emotional on me, the same Ee said so.
    Despute that

    You didn't prove anything, and no one even said he's slow without Hiraishin. We said he can't outrun A without it, something you can't even begin to prove otherwise.

    Quote Quote:
    Bad choice in either cases, and I'll explain you why:
    -Sandaime Raikage, in case you don't remember, has the whole strongest, resilient body etc.
    Not Ee, his father. And Naruto's Sage Mode Rasengan was used as redirecting the strike, not drilling through it. Still not that it would've made that great difference, since RasenShuriken did little to him. Still, it was thanks to the Third's strong body, not thank to Raiton Armour.
    So your point regarding Sage Naruto's Rasengan is invalid, I'm afraid. And how he redirected his arm if he didn't go through the Raiton Armour?

    Sandaime Raikage's body was strong DUE to Raiton Armor, not in addition to it. Ditto for A. And you have the terribly impossible job of proving that A's physical durability isn't comperable to his father's. Good luck with that. Remember, Sandaime had a draw with the Hachibi. A outright defeated it. That's the difference in their power.


    Quote Quote:
    That all Sasuke cutted with his sword was a door and a stone?
    Ah no, its true, he cutted clay. My bad

    You said that Hachibi tentacles are hard to cut. I want proof. Show us proof that the tentacles are harder than any other giant animal's flesh or concede that you're trying your hardest to make Minato seem stronger than he actually is. I've seen Sasuke cut through Mokuton, concrete, other metal swords, and chakra constructs. No way in hell you're passing this one off without a manga scan.


    Quote Quote:
    1)When an almost severed arm count as not breaking through flesh, and when Ee's skin will be as tough as his father's, then you'll be right.
    Shame is not the case in either one
    Tobi's arm is made out of Zetsu parts and is easily snapped off like it's a prosthetic, proven when he fought Fuu and Torune and just squeezed it off like it was soft play-doh. So what's worse is that the only damage he could do to Tobi was against a fake arm, lol. He hit him in the back, yet his arm is what fell off. You consider this impressive?

    Quote Quote:
    2)Quote the part where I said that, please.
    And I'm quoting you, "I DARE you"

    You implied it was as strong as Chidori, because Sasuke "needed" (in your words) Chidori Eisou to cut through a tentacle where as Minato didn't. You also claim that it would cut through Raiton Armor, when Chidori barely could, because Bee tried to protect A from the attack (like he could sense the strength of the blade or some such excuse). Don't backpedal.

    Quote Quote:
    3)Same as above, I used the tentacle example to show that Minato's strenght with a kunai is not laughing matter, and would be able to do damage since he cleaved in two a giant tentacle, the same feat that required a Chidori Spear and a Hellbringer to do.
    Didn't say that the Chidori spear is weaker than Minato with a kunai, I said that Minato with his kunai cleaved Bee's tentacle, thus it can likely do damage

    How is it not a laughing matter when all he cut was a damn tentacle? I could understand if he'd cut through a version 2 tentacle, or atleast his first chakra shroud mode's tail, but he didn't. Just a regular old, prehencile, boneless octopus tentacle. None of that makes his kunai comperable to ANY form of dense cutting oriented chakra. Not Sasuke's Chidori Eisou (that he used for tactical purposes), or a regular Chidori, or a Raiton charged kusanagi. The Hell Stab was also not needed to cut through the tails. It was just strong enough to do so. Just because a ninja uses an attack doesn't mean that was the only option they had.

    Quote Quote:
    4)The same way he did on canon, yes. Why wouldn't he, since he already did? Please answer me.
    I'll even show you the page! And I'm afraid I'm not the one who's "love" for a character blinds him.
    Pay attention to the manga: he had kunai already set, and couldn't place a tag on Raikage without already being able to teleport out of the path of his blow, then jumping onto his back. You're deliberately avoiding the fact that he could already teleport at the beginning of the fight because of the kunai conveniently already placed into a tree behind A. He can't teleport without having kunai out already, or tags placed already. NOTHING you said is canon because he didn't do what you're claiming he did. Now I will state again: Minato, with no tags already placed and no kunai already drawn can not avoid a direct attack from A, who can activate Raiton Armor in an instant (fast enough to cut off Chakra Mode Naruto, from base mode).

    Look, if the only thing that gives you an argument is your inability to tell what actually happened in the chapter, then why are you arguing?

    Quote Quote:
    1) Minato will lose because he can't damage him!!oneone! Why? Because Sasuke wasn't able to
    There you go, that's a smart guy! Though it goes a bit deeper than that. Allow me to edit:

    Minato will lose because he can't damage anyone that can't be damaged by only a Rasengan level of attack! Why? Because Sasuke's A-rank jutsu, which is infinitely stronger than that kunai wasn't able to, and because a Sage Mode Rasengan wasn't able to break through Raiton Armor either!

    There. That's the correct logic.

  5. #20
    MH Senpai 有名人 / Yuumeijin / Celebrity Uchiha_Blood's Avatar
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    Re: A vs. Minato

    Quote Originally Posted by ninjabot View Post
    You didn't prove anything, and no one even said he's slow without Hiraishin. We said he can't outrun A without it, something you can't even begin to prove otherwise.
    Of course Yondaime can't outrun Ee clad in Raiton Armour without Hiraishin, I'm repeating time and time again that just like Ee uses his Raiton Armour, Yondaime uses Hiraishin, not that Yondaime without Hiraishin is faster than Ee.
    We are running in circles here

    Quote Quote:
    Sandaime Raikage's body was strong DUE to Raiton Armor, not in addition to it. Ditto for A. And you have the terribly impossible job of proving that A's physical durability isn't comperable to his father's. Good luck with that. Remember, Sandaime had a draw with the Hachibi. A outright defeated it. That's the difference in their power.
    Here is the first proof, Raikage unharmed and he isn't clad in Raiton Armour
    And with his tough, resilient body - Did I mark it enough?

    Now, you show me a page where it is said that the Third's armour is what makes his body ultra-resilient.
    Oh, and why you conveniently leaved out the part where I show that Naruto's Rasengan touches the Third's body in the Armour? What is your answer to that?

    Quote Quote:
    You said that Hachibi tentacles are hard to cut. I want proof. Show us proof that the tentacles are harder than any other giant animal's flesh or concede that you're trying your hardest to make Minato seem stronger than he actually is. I've seen Sasuke cut through Mokuton, concrete, other metal swords, and chakra constructs. No way in hell you're passing this one off without a manga scan.
    All of these "feats" aided by his Raiton nature, not brute strenght alone I'm afraid.
    And, just to prove that I'm wrong, how Bee grows the tentacles if they're simple flesh, while he teached Naruto to use his "Chakra limbs" ? Please, enlighten me about how Bee can create flesh tentacles

    Quote Quote:
    Tobi's arm is made out of Zetsu parts and is easily snapped off like it's a prosthetic, proven when he fought Fuu and Torune and just squeezed it off like it was soft play-doh. So what's worse is that the only damage he could do to Tobi was against a fake arm, lol. He hit him in the back, yet his arm is what fell off. You consider this impressive?
    Then why didn't he died on the spot against Konan? Why his body resisted against a good deal of paper bombs? Snap an arm that was about to fall off isn't the proof that his body is weak and soft. Weaker than a normal body yes, of course, but not that weak as you seems to believe. He hit him in the back, we didn't see where he hit, fact is that he leaved Tobi without an arm.
    It is no Rasenshuriken, but I find it acceptabling impressive


    Quote Quote:
    You implied it was as strong as Chidori, because Sasuke "needed" (in your words) Chidori Eisou to cut through a tentacle where as Minato didn't. You also claim that it would cut through Raiton Armor, when Chidori barely could, because Bee tried to protect A from the attack (like he could sense the strength of the blade or some such excuse). Don't backpedal.
    I didn't imply it, simply because, in Sasuke's case, the Spear was his best shot at it. Sasuke needed it because he hadn't any other jutsu or ability to cut that tentacle, so he used it, simple as that.
    Please don't try to bend my words to your liking


    Quote Quote:
    How is it not a laughing matter when all he cut was a damn tentacle? I could understand if he'd cut through a version 2 tentacle, or atleast his first chakra shroud mode's tail, but he didn't. Just a regular old, prehencile, boneless octopus tentacle. None of that makes his kunai comperable to ANY form of dense cutting oriented chakra. Not Sasuke's Chidori Eisou (that he used for tactical purposes), or a regular Chidori, or a Raiton charged kusanagi. The Hell Stab was also not needed to cut through the tails. It was just strong enough to do so. Just because a ninja uses an attack doesn't mean that was the only option they had.
    It will be the same answer to the question I asked you above

    Quote Quote:
    Pay attention to the manga: he had kunai already set, and couldn't place a tag on Raikage without already being able to teleport out of the path of his blow, then jumping onto his back. You're deliberately avoiding the fact that he could already teleport at the beginning of the fight because of the kunai conveniently already placed into a tree behind A. He can't teleport without having kunai out already, or tags placed already. NOTHING you said is canon because he didn't do what you're claiming he did. Now I will state again: Minato, with no tags already placed and no kunai already drawn can not avoid a direct attack from A, who can activate Raiton Armor in an instant (fast enough to cut off Chakra Mode Naruto, from base mode).

    Look, if the only thing that gives you an argument is your inability to tell what actually happened in the chapter, then why are you arguing?
    Even if that was the case, here an example for you:
    No kunai in the area, only the one he always has on hand
    Hiraishin. If you are saying that Minato can't draw even a single kunai, then you're saying that Ee is likely so fast that anyone, even with a Sharingan, can not react or he will be speed-blitzed, since he acts in an istant.
    And if that's so, then why he waited here for Yondaime?
    Why didn't he activated his Raiton Armour in an istant and attempted to punch him?


    Quote Quote:
    There you go, that's a smart guy! Though it goes a bit deeper than that. Allow me to edit:

    Minato will lose because he can't damage anyone that can't be damaged by only a Rasengan level of attack! Why? Because Sasuke's A-rank jutsu, which is infinitely stronger than that kunai wasn't able to, and because a Sage Mode Rasengan wasn't able to break through Raiton Armor either!

    There. That's the correct logic.
    I showed the manga scan where Naruto managed to pass through the Raiton Armour with his Rasengan, but lets skip that.
    Now, if what you're saying is true, in your opinion the Chidori of Sasuke in part 1 is the same Chidori of Sasuke in part 2, in both strenght and speed, yes? They're both A-rank jutsus, so they have the same power.
    Of course, its not like the power of the jutsu may be variable with the power of the ninja that uses it. Blasphemy! Its not like a Shinobi weapon's strenght depends on the user.
    My point being, if Sasuke's Chidori did that deal of damage, its not like another ninja ( in this case Yondaime ) can't do more damage with another A-rank jutsu only because Sasuke failed.
    If Madara failed, then I would agree with you. And in case you're wondering yes, I believe Minato's rasengan is stronger than Sasuke's chidori, very much like I believe that is stronger than base Naruto rasengan, and we all know that Sasuke and Naruto are equal on that departement.
    Which it isn't bashing Naruto or Sasuke, but simply stating than a Kage, a good deal older and more skilled than those two can likely use his own jutsu with more power than two kids. Simple as that


    Out of curiosity, where it is stated that Ee defeated a bijuu single-handedly ( god, did I spelt that right? Sometime english goes beyond me )? I remember the Third, but not him, I remember a flashback with both him and the Third though
    Last edited by Uchiha_Blood; January 20, 2012 at 05:41 PM.

  6. #21
    Registered User 英雄メンバー / Eiyuu Menbaa / Hero Member Naruto2011's Avatar
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    Re: A vs. Minato

    More arguments?! Honestly I could care less about logic A claimed that he thought no man could surpass the fourth. He claimed that he did and could not surpass the fourth. No argument can be disputed over this fact. And yes even if the kunai couldn't be able to pierce the armor the impact would be enough to smash A into the ground. Who says minato would use rasengan to damage him? He has space time tech, summonings, and he is knowledgable in seals. He has enough in his repertoire to take A out

    Btw minato is one of the most intelligent shinobis there was, raikage does not have the tactical mind minato has. His strategy is up there with itachis
    Last edited by Naruto2011; January 20, 2012 at 05:43 PM.


  7. #22
    Registered User 中級員 / Chuukyuuin / Member Pervy Sage's Avatar
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    Re: A vs. Minato

    Quote Originally Posted by Naruto2011 View Post
    More arguments?! Honestly I could care less about logic A claimed that he thought no man could surpass the fourth. He claimed that he did and could not surpass the fourth. No argument can be disputed over this fact. And yes even if the kunai couldn't be able to pierce the armor the impact would be enough to smash A into the ground. Who says minato would use rasengan to damage him? He has space time tech, summonings, and he is knowledgable in seals. He has enough in his repertoire to take A out

    Btw minato is one of the most intelligent shinobis there was, raikage does not have the tactical mind minato has. His strategy is up there with itachis
    Apparently, completely ignoring a compelling argument is the way to go these days^^ Everyone who supports A as the winner has chosen to overlook the fact that he himself stated that he is inferior. I guess it's easier to win a discussion that way.

  8. #23
    Registered User 英雄メンバー / Eiyuu Menbaa / Hero Member Naruto2011's Avatar
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    Re: A vs. Minato

    Quote Originally Posted by Pervy Sage View Post
    Apparently, completely ignoring a compelling argument is the way to go these days^^ Everyone who supports A as the winner has chosen to overlook the fact that he himself stated that he is inferior. I guess it's easier to win a discussion that way.
    That's exactly what I don't understand why this was made, I mean before A stated that we could debate and what not, but he hisself admitted that he seemingly was a man that he thought couldn't be surprassed, bam argument settled. Yes A is great and all but all he does is his nintaujutsu, minatos arsenal is beyond that plus his incredible tactical mind. Minato has too much support from the manga that he is one of the best there was. He had a flee on sight rep, anko wished that the fourth was still alive cuz orochimaru wouldn't had a chance of invading(or whatever she said), he made killer bee tremble, and kakashi had stated that naruto is the only one capable of surpassing the fourth, meaning no one had yet


  9. #24
    Registered User MH中毒 / MH Chuudoku / MH Addicted ninjabot's Avatar
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    Re: A vs. Minato

    Quote Originally Posted by Pervy Sage
    Apparently, completely ignoring a compelling argument is the way to go these days^^ Everyone who supports A as the winner has chosen to overlook the fact that he himself stated that he is inferior. I guess it's easier to win a discussion that way.
    I prefer logic as opposed to statements when we have feats to rely on instead. Itachi stated that he and Kisame would either die defeating Jiraiya or outright lose. You can't possibly take that as manga fact just because Itachi said it, can you? Especially after seeing what both ninja could do on their own? Same thing here. We saw enough to know that Raikage would kill Minato in a fight where he isn't prepared beforehand.


    Quote Originally Posted by Uchiha_Blood
    Of course Yondaime can't outrun Ee clad in Raiton Armour without Hiraishin, I'm repeating time and time again that just like Ee uses his Raiton Armour, Yondaime uses Hiraishin, not that Yondaime without Hiraishin is faster than Ee.
    We are running in circles here

    Then stop putting words in my mouth. You said I said he was slow. I corrected myself. You're not winning anything by both making up manga facts or making up claims that I never claimed.

    Quote Quote:
    Here is the first proof, Raikage unharmed and he isn't clad in Raiton Armour
    And with his tough, resilient body - Did I mark it enough?

    There you go making stuff up again. First of all, you clearly see his body recovering from injury so no, he was NOT unharmed. It's your own manga scan and you neglected pay attention to the huge gash in his chest and shoulder that's closing back up thanks to Edo Tensei. For your second scan it says he has a reselient body. So what? It never, every claims that his body is resilient sans ninjutsu. Not once. Anywhere. Ever.

    All of these "feats" aided by his Raiton nature, not brute strenght alone I'm afraid.

    Who the hell implied otherwise!? I don't even- whatever.

    Quote Quote:
    And, just to prove that I'm wrong, how Bee grows the tentacles if they're simple flesh, while he teached Naruto to use his "Chakra limbs" ? Please, enlighten me about how Bee can create flesh tentacles

    The same way that Yugito grows cat claws: it's a physical representation of their tailed beast that they use via partial transformation. Just like how Bee can spit ink out of his mouth without turning into an octopus. They can use a partial form of the beast without transforming fully into another form. It's made using chakra, yes, but it's not made OF chakra like their tails when they access their boosted mode. The difference is as easy as looking at the pictures. As he taps into more and more tails he has a bubbly chakra shroud just like Naruto. His body's strength and speed grows. If he's just creating a tentacle for the sake of an extra limb, then that limb isn't gonna have herculean strength the likes of which it would if he had powered up to Version two.

    Just like the big octopus hand he used to block Itachi's flaming shuriken. They pierced right into his hand and burned him aswell. Were he to power up to Version 2 the would've bounced off of the hand harmlessly. As for why Naruto can't do so, it's for the exact same reason he can't turn into a fox: because he wasn't in a partnership with Kyuubi. Remember, he tried to become the kyuubi and he became an SD friendly looking cartoon fox instead. Everytime we see Bee use his tentacles without them actually looking like condensed chakra it's JUST flesh from the Hachibi (evidenced by the fact that he is the one that squeals in pain, not Killerbee). It was his body. His flesh. His limbs.



    Quote Quote:
    Then why didn't he died on the spot against Konan? Why his body resisted against a good deal of paper bombs? Snap an arm that was about to fall off isn't the proof that his body is weak and soft. Weaker than a normal body yes, of course, but not that weak as you seems to believe. He hit him in the back, we didn't see where he hit, fact is that he leaved Tobi without an arm.
    It is no Rasenshuriken, but I find it acceptabling impressive

    Because he used the combination of intangibility, absorbing most of the bombs, and then Izanagi to survive having his body blown to pieces. Again, failure to pay attention on your behalf. He turned intangible to avoid 5 minutes worth, but only after absorbing some of them and getting blown almost to bits (and what do you know! He lost his fake arm. Again). He didn't tank anything. He was just fast enough to alter reality before he was completely dead.

    Quote Quote:
    Even if that was the case, here an example for you:
    No kunai in the area, only the one he always has on hand
    Hiraishin. If you are saying that Minato can't draw even a single kunai, then you're saying that Ee is likely so fast that anyone, even with a Sharingan, can not react or he will be speed-blitzed, since he acts in an istant.
    And if that's so, then why he waited here for Yondaime?
    Why didn't he activated his Raiton Armour in an istant and attempted to punch him?
    No, not at all. Raikage was a centimeter from decapitating Minato, but because he didn't have to take the time to pull his kunai out of his back and then throw it, he could use Hiraishin to reach the tree behind him (as it takes no handseals to use it, just a thought). If that kunai was not already at the tree, Minato would have had to:

    Reach into his bag.
    Pull out one or more kunai.
    Throw it/them.
    Then teleport.

    All of this in the time that Raikage's knuckles were in Minato's face, a hair away from turning his face into an inny? This is what we call a speedblitz. You can't believe this without giving up any credibility whatsoever. Also, he waited for Minato because at this point he didn't know how his power works. He wanted to play it safe and watch his first move before going on the offensive. It's the one time in the manga where playing it safe was the worst possible choice. He should've just rushed his ass the instant he saw him, as that would've literally ended Minato and thus, the tail of Uzumaki Naruto.


    Quote Quote:
    I showed the manga scan where Naruto managed to pass through the Raiton Armour with his Rasengan, but lets skip that.
    Now, if what you're saying is true, in your opinion the Chidori of Sasuke in part 1 is the same Chidori of Sasuke in part 2, in both strenght and speed, yes? They're both A-rank jutsus, so they have the same power.
    Of course, its not like the power of the jutsu may be variable with the power of the ninja that uses it. Blasphemy! Its not like a Shinobi weapon's strenght depends on the user.

    No you didn't. Dear god. It didn't go through, you can look at the picture and see he clearly has armor on his arm (look at the close up on the bottom right. To the far right you see the armor). Not to mention if he'd knocked the chakra armor off then the Jigoku Nikute would've fizzled out, since the Raiton on it would've disappeared. As for the rest, I haven't the foggiest idea where you get the idea that a Genin Chidori from Sasuke is as strong as his current Chidori. We're comparing basic ninja weaponry to high rank ninjutsu, aswell as a practically fully developed Chidori from a Raiton expert against a Rasengan from the creator of the jutsu. I've no reason to believe Sasuke's Chidori wouldn't do the same thing to Minato's Rasengan that it does to Naruto's. None.


    Quote Quote:
    My point being, if Sasuke's Chidori did that deal of damage, its not like another ninja ( in this case Yondaime ) can't do more damage with another A-rank jutsu only because Sasuke failed.

    Take both of the ninja out of the equation and just look at the attacks themselves. As far as power goes it's Sage Mode Rasengan>Rasengan>Chidori>>>>kunai. We've seen that the Sage Mode Rasengan can't pierce through Raiton Armor. So, by proxy, everything beneath it is incapable of breaking through aswell.

    You know what? All that's besides the fact when you consider the damn Chidori didn't even do significant damage. Even if he could do equal damage with his basic kunai, or his Rasengan, that damage is still damage that won't stop him. I mean the Rasengan could potentially do more damage if it wasn't for how the attack works. It doesn't get boosted piercing damage by picking up speed or anything the way Chidori does, so the neglegable strength increase from a Rasengan actually wouldn't do better.

    Quote Quote:
    Out of curiosity, where it is stated that Ee defeated a bijuu single-handedly ( god, did I spelt that right? Sometime english goes beyond me )? I remember the Third, but not him, I remember a flashback with both him and the Third though
    I think Motoi explains it. When he tells us that A is the one that broke off his horn with his karate chop. I'll find the scan.


    http://www.mangafox.com/manga/naruto/v53/c494/1.html Here we learn that Sandaime had help each time (A is even there aiding him). Also, way back when Bee fought Sasuke he stated the only one to ever block his "Number 8" was Sasuke, and A. Not Sandaime. Also notice that Sandaime already has his Jigoku Nukite scar. Then...http://www.mangafox.com/manga/naruto/v53/c494/2.html He karate chops his horn off. Okay, so he didn't finish him on his own, but niether did Sandaime. So at the very least it proves what I was trying to say beforehand: that he's atleast as tough as his father.
    Last edited by ninjabot; January 20, 2012 at 10:37 PM.

  10. #25
    Registered User 英雄メンバー / Eiyuu Menbaa / Hero Member Lemonadez's Avatar
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    Re: A vs. Minato

    Look @ Ninjabot, "A" Himself stated that HE FOUGHT MINATO MANY TIMES, HE SAID EXACTLY "THERE IS NO MAN THAT CAN EVER SURPASS HIM"

    Why you think "A" can win over Minato. If he's Raiton Armor were so GODLY. Bee wont even bother sneaking attack against Minato. Even "A" Apologize to Bee. So it clearly Minato can damage "A" even with Kunai.

    If "A" stated it himself that Minato is the fastest shinobi, why are you still trying to avoid the fact "A" lose this battle? As he stated he fought him MANY TIMES and couldn't defeat Minato LOL.

    "A" Cut the horn back when he was on his PRIME. When Shinobi get older they become weaker.. As Bee Stated "Ever since "A" became a hokage he failed to notice his own strength". What Raiton Armor + Lariat vs Bee Normal mode Lariat = pwned the crap out of "A". Seriously.

    And EDO Character by Kabuto were given power up, As he said there his EDO Character is even beyond of Tobirama and Orochimaru.

  11. #26
    Registered User 有名人 / Yuumeijin / Celebrity Shaunlim's Avatar
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    Registered User 英雄メンバー / Eiyuu Menbaa / Hero Member Naruto2011's Avatar
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    Re: A vs. Minato

    I find it funny that no one wants to rogue with none of my statements
    I don't feel like typing much but I'll just reiterate the point, A stated that he thought no on could surpass minato
    Sorry bro there are too many statements in the manga and feats to prove that minato is superior, I just don't feel like looking for the pages.
    That flashback showed twice that minato had the upper hand and he had no prep, yes killer bee had his knife ready to kill as well but as we saw minato stopped his attack, minato is too versatile, he has rasengan, hiraishin and other space time tech, summonings and he is knowledgeable of seals, also he is one of the most intelligent ninja in the manga, A has shown nintaijutsu and raiton cloak.... I'm not posting here again cuz honestly this fight is something the manga has already proved who would be the victor


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    Registered User 有名人 / Yuumeijin / Celebrity KiSwordsman's Avatar
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    Re: A vs. Minato

    Quote Originally Posted by Naruto2011 View Post
    I find it funny that no one wants to rogue with none of my statements
    I don't feel like typing much but I'll just reiterate the point, A stated that he thought no on could surpass minato
    Sorry bro there are too many statements in the manga and feats to prove that minato is superior, I just don't feel like looking for the pages.
    That flashback showed twice that minato had the upper hand and he had no prep, yes killer bee had his knife ready to kill as well but as we saw minato stopped his attack, minato is too versatile, he has rasengan, hiraishin and other space time tech, summonings and he is knowledgeable of seals, also he is one of the most intelligent ninja in the manga, A has shown nintaijutsu and raiton cloak.... I'm not posting here again cuz honestly this fight is something the manga has already proved who would be the victor
    http://www.mangafox.com/manga/naruto/v57/c542/14.html

    That looks like a buttload of prep to me. The scene even started so that Minato would have the advantage with the kunai in the tree. Kishimoto has given Ei such speed that minato had to have a kunai placed somewhere or else we wouldn't have a story. All the versatility and knowledge in the world won't do a thing if you not only can't see your opponent until he is inches away from your face, but can't do a thing to dodge or block it.

    If manga statements are what you wanna cite then that's cool too, but that just starts to sound like Itachi and Kisame vs Jiraiya after a while.

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    Registered User 英雄メンバー / Eiyuu Menbaa / Hero Member Lemonadez's Avatar
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    Re: A vs. Minato

    Quote Originally Posted by KiSwordsman View Post
    http://www.mangafox.com/manga/naruto/v57/c542/14.html

    That looks like a buttload of prep to me. The scene even started so that Minato would have the advantage with the kunai in the tree. Kishimoto has given Ei such speed that minato had to have a kunai placed somewhere or else we wouldn't have a story. All the versatility and knowledge in the world won't do a thing if you not only can't see your opponent until he is inches away from your face, but can't do a thing to dodge or block it.

    If manga statements are what you wanna cite then that's cool too, but that just starts to sound like Itachi and Kisame vs Jiraiya after a while.
    Look clearly at Minato kunai he's holding.
    http://www.mangafox.com/manga/naruto/v57/c542/15.html
    http://www.mangafox.com/manga/naruto/v57/c542/16.html

    Similar to this -> Unprepared LOL
    http://www.mangafox.com/manga/naruto/v53/c502/14.html
    http://www.mangafox.com/manga/naruto/v53/c502/16.html

    No matter how u look at it Minato always have his own kunai in his hand :P

    ALso Minato is fast without Flying thunder god technique even faster than Sasuke.
    http://www.mangareader.net/93-245-2/...apter-240.html <- From this Spot
    http://www.mangareader.net/93-245-8/...apter-240.html <- Sunshin Jutsu.
    http://www.mangareader.net/93-245-9/...apter-240.html <- Back to Spot again. No Marking what so ever.
    http://www.mangareader.net/93-245-10...apter-240.html <- Here he used Flying Thunder God technique.

    So Here another one
    http://www.mangareader.net/93-54942-...apter-500.html <- Minato Struggling Trying to supress the seal.
    http://www.mangareader.net/93-54942-...apter-500.html <- You can even see it in his expression.
    http://www.mangareader.net/93-54942-...apter-500.html <- Here Even after all that work, No Seal was mark to naruto.
    http://www.mangareader.net/93-55203-...apter-501.html <- Tobi was about to Stab Naruto.
    http://www.mangareader.net/93-55203-...apter-501.html <- There he teleport LOL No Marking what so ever.
    http://www.mangareader.net/93-55203-...apter-501.html <- Here were Minato use Flying thunder god technique.

    http://www.mangareader.net/93-55203-...apter-501.html <- Here he saved Kushina, Kushina doesnt even have the mark.
    http://www.mangareader.net/93-55203-...apter-501.html <- Talk about his normal speed without flying thunder god.
    http://www.mangareader.net/93-55672-...apter-503.html <- Even Tobi bleed from Minato Rasengan - You cant deny that Minato is too strong for A. Even Naruto with kyuubi chakra couldn't hurt Tobi LoL.
    http://www.mangareader.net/93-55672-...apter-503.html <- Not at least Tobi admitted it :P

    So its clearly that even Minato reflexes and speed are beyond A with no lightning cloak armor.

    A Lightning CLoak Armor = Minato normal speed. They can hit each other.
    Flying thunder god > Lightning Cloak armor. :P Pretty much show there on Manga that flying thunder god was too hard for A.
    Last edited by Lemonadez; January 21, 2012 at 12:16 AM.

  16. #30
    Registered User 英雄メンバー / Eiyuu Menbaa / Hero Member Naruto2011's Avatar
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    Re: A vs. Minato

    Quote Originally Posted by KiSwordsman View Post
    http://www.mangafox.com/manga/naruto/v57/c542/14.html

    That looks like a buttload of prep to me. The scene even started so that Minato would have the advantage with the kunai in the tree. Kishimoto has given Ei such speed that minato had to have a kunai placed somewhere or else we wouldn't have a story. All the versatility and knowledge in the world won't do a thing if you not only can't see your opponent until he is inches away from your face, but can't do a thing to dodge or block it.

    If manga statements are what you wanna cite then that's cool too, but that just starts to sound like Itachi and Kisame vs Jiraiya after a while.
    What do u consider prep?
    The battle has started when they met, prep is what shikamary does before the fight even starts for example with hidan


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