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Thread: One Piece 655 Discussion

  1. #376
    Registered User MH中毒 / MH Chuudoku / MH Addicted zerocooldx's Avatar
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    Re: One Piece 655 Discussion / 656 Prediction-The winners for One Piece awards were decided! Be sure to ceck the results!

    Quote Originally Posted by Ero-Sanji View Post
    OMG!

    I'm sick and tired of all this "Luffy trained regularly therefore he's stronger than Smoker, who have just been fighting pirates...!". If we follow that logic then then we can no longer see Killer, Law, Hawkins, Drake and Kidd as potential and lethal enemies of the SH. Since all they have been doing is fighting "fodder marines" and other "fodder pirates". Luffy is now waaay stronger than shichibukais like Crocodile, Moria and Jinbei since all they have been doing is sitting on their lazy asses and if unlucky have faced some "fodder marines" and "fodder pirates".

    Just because you're out at sea does not imply that you can't grow stronger, are you telling me that Orange town Zoro is just as strong as pre metal cutting Zoro? Give me a break, those out at sea has meet dangerous opponents, trained like hell as well. It's not only the SH that can train their bodies off screen or do you mean that Luffy suddenly woke up and learned Gear 2 and 3?

    The SH's have improved immensely, yes, but they are not ready to conquer the world yet!
    This is about as logical of a post that can be written concerning this particular matter. Oda created a lot of characters to specifically challenge the SH's across their journey. They weren't created so that after the time skip the SH's would face-roll them all. I don't know why some people expect these insane things to happen right off of the bat. Its like they didn't even read Part I of the manga. The two years of isolated training was meant to be similar to being in the NW for two years. It wasn't meant to be the equal of the hyperbolic time chamber. This is Part II of the manga, things are most likely going to progress like they did in Part I. Otherwise we mind as well have the SH's just get to Raftel next chapter and challenge BB or whomever. Because everything else that takes place would be a waste of time due to the SH's being so much stronger then everyone else other then Yonko or Admiral type opponents. This "argument" makes no sense on a million different levels, yet its so prevalent thats its scary.

    "Upon the back of his body not a wound of retreat scars it."
    One Piece is a series created by a genius, it's a masterpiece, it's like a fine wine, it only gets better with time.

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  3. #377
    Registered User 初心者/ Shoshinsha / Beginner z3bola's Avatar
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    Re: One Piece 655 Discussion / 656 Prediction-The winners for One Piece awards were decided! Be sure to check the results!

    smoker and tashig will still be a rivels for luffy and zoro , same for coby and helmbo , mr.1 and mr.0 , lutcy and kaku
    means that is this is not the last fight for them ,
    i think , the winners will be tashig and smoker
    tashig the natural enemy for zoro , the only one in the world that zoro cant face
    smoker lets see , he invent a new technique to beat any 1 , he is a smoke then if he go inside luffy from his nose to his lung make him Suffocated < cool cheez

  4. #378
    Intl Translator 有名人 / Yuumeijin / Celebrity Black Lagoon's Avatar
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    Re: One Piece 655 Discussion / 656 Prediction

    Quote Originally Posted by zerocooldx View Post
    So what you are basically saying is that you are one of those people who somehow believes that in a nutshell Part II of OP for the most part is going to be the SH's travelting from island to island absolutely face-rolling everyone and everything that isn't comparable to an Admiral or Yonko because Luffy and Zoro are now essentially Mihawk Jr. and Rayleigh Jr. right? Yeah...that sounds like an amazing story to read. Man i sure hope that dragon has some wings to fly away with.
    Sorry but I have to answer to this, because if I would have answered to your previous post I'd have said the same thing, well not in that manner but according to my style, the thing is my answer wouldn't have been different.

    I dont know why you say so
    All he did is he replied to what you wrote in your previous post, you said that Rayleigh only taught Luffy the basics of Haki and added that unless people think that Luffy learned all he could in 1 1/2 year, now why is that? Don't you remember how much they suffered here? if his training was just about haki's basics then don't you think that 2 years are a bit too much, even a year and a half that as you say Rayleigh spent with him teaching him the basics and then left isn't a bit too much too?

    I think either you got his post wrong or I'm the one who got it wrong, anyways, I don't think he meant that the SHs will be travelting from island to island absolutely pwning everyone except from the Admirals and Yonkous (I know it was a metaphor), as Lord Rayleigh and yourself said, the New World is like a Paradise's experience but with a much bigger growth rate, to put it simple the New World would be like "The Room of Spirit and Time" in Dragon Ball, sure the Supernovas have got much stronger and I don't think there is a much bigger difference between them and Luffy except for Haki, sure training with Rayleigh has its advantages but if they all had the same ability then there won't be any room for any doubts that Luffy would be way too stronger, but fortunately they don't, they all developed/are developing their abilities one way or another in the New World.

    Now for Luffy and Smoker, Smoker was way too strong for him the beginning, however IMO Luffy improved more than Smoker in those 2 years of timeskip and I think they are now kinda equal with one win one loss depending on the circumstances.

    Now for Zorro, dude how could Tashigi be equal to Zorro?
    At most and if she improved a loooooooooooooot their battles would be like Mihawk vs Vista, in the end the best wins, you said that Zorro won't accept anything beyond Some Haki basics from Mihawk, seriously??? , let me remind you something, Zorro asked literally Mihawk to show him the WAY OF THE SWORD, after I hear/read Zorro begging Mihawk I think he could accept something beyond some Haki basics, I see your statement only valid now ... in the time being, not when he learned that his captain friend/Nakama just lost his brother.

    Of course if I didn't say it too much already, it's still My Humble Opinion.

    Sig Credit : Shinsatsu
    Quote Originally Posted by zerocooldx View Post
    In terms of pure intelligence and mental capacity the title belongs to Itachi. The guy could make a cat bark if he wanted to, and do so without his Sharingan.

  5. #379
    Registered User MH中毒 / MH Chuudoku / MH Addicted zerocooldx's Avatar
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    Re: One Piece 655 Discussion / 656 Prediction-The winners for One Piece awards were decided! Be sure to check the results!

    Haki isn't something that is learned just like that. If Rayleigh wanted to teach Luffy everything then he would have stayed with him the whole two years. Yet he left Luffy to train on his own. Thats a pretty good indication that after Luffy grasped the basics of Haki and could now improve it his own that Rayleigh left him to do just that. Unless you think that 1 1/2 years was enough time for Rayleigh to teach Luffy just about everything he could about Haki to the point where Luffy was almost a master at it or whatever. Also it doesn't make any sense whatsoever for Hawkeyes to teach Zoro anything that would allow Zoro to beat Hawkeyes, nor could i ever see Zoro accepting training like that. "The way of the sword" in this instance probably means teaching a swordsman how to use Haki with his swords instead of his body like other fighters.

    Again i don't see anything good coming from Luffy and Zoro becoming Rayleigh Jr. and Hawkeyes Jr. essentially after these two years. Not only because it eliminates all of the other "rookies" as their challengers. Which was the reason for their manga existence to being with, but it also takes the mystery and excitement out of the SH's island adventures. How many islands in the NW are going to have opponents strong enough to challenge the SH's when Rayleigh Jr. and Hawkeyes Jr. are there? At least 90% of them won't. So what kind of a manga would this devolve into at that point? Every adventure would be terrible boring and predictable with the same outcome unless one of the world powers was there to challenge the SH's. The two years of training wasn't a hyperbolic time chamber, it was a substitution for not being in the NW.

    "Upon the back of his body not a wound of retreat scars it."
    One Piece is a series created by a genius, it's a masterpiece, it's like a fine wine, it only gets better with time.

  6. #380
    Intl Translator 有名人 / Yuumeijin / Celebrity Black Lagoon's Avatar
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    Re: One Piece 655 Discussion / 656 Prediction-The winners for One Piece awards were decided! Be sure to check the results!

    Quote Originally Posted by zerocooldx View Post
    Haki isn't something that is learned just like that. If Rayleigh wanted to teach Luffy everything then he would have stayed with him the whole two years. Yet he left Luffy to train on his own. Thats a pretty good indication that after Luffy grasped the basics of Haki and could now improve it his own that Rayleigh left him to do just that. Unless you think that 1 1/2 years was enough time for Rayleigh to teach Luffy just about everything he could about Haki to the point where Luffy was almost a master at it or whatever. Also it doesn't make any sense whatsoever for Hawkeyes to teach Zoro anything that would allow Zoro to beat Hawkeyes, nor could i ever see Zoro accepting training like that. "The way of the sword" in this instance probably means teaching a swordsman how to use Haki with his swords instead of his body like other fighters.

    Again i don't see anything good coming from Luffy and Zoro becoming Rayleigh Jr. and Hawkeyes Jr. essentially after these two years. Not only because it eliminates all of the other "rookies" as their challengers. Which was the reason for their manga existence to being with, but it also takes the mystery and excitement out of the SH's island adventures. How many islands in the NW are going to have opponents strong enough to challenge the SH's when Rayleigh Jr. and Hawkeyes Jr. are there? At least 90% of them won't. So what kind of a manga would this devolve into at that point? Every adventure would be terrible boring and predictable with the same outcome unless one of the world powers was there to challenge the SH's. The two years of training wasn't a hyperbolic time chamber, it was a substitution for not being in the NW.
    I agree with most of what you said (You know except from the Zorro Part :P) and got what you mean, I did mention that Luffy isn't certainly going to own everyone, as you say the special training was a substitution for not being in the New World, and like I said earlier, the others developed their abilities in one way or another, but the StrawHats needed that special training specially Luffy (Because of his ability), he is now according to the last SBS half the way to Master Haki like Shanks do, but if his training was only focused on Haki (again 2 years are too much, he probably learned how to combine haki with some of attack and defense techniques and that would explain the long period) he would be now the opposite of what some expect him to be (THe Stronger) with only haki.
    Sure they will now just do fine in the New World, From the stories we have been told, the NW isnt a place to play around, the others have certainly worked their asses to survive till starting to mess some Yonkou's ships. And Same goes for Smoker put another way.

    A possible scenario
    Logia guy : Hey, you know how to use Haki ... Well, you can stop me but I know other techniques.
    Luffy : WHAAAAT??? Rayleigh You Bastard.
    Logia Guy : hahahaahah
    Luffy : Well ... Gear 2. AAAAAAAHHHH!!!!!
    Logia Guy : that's all you have got?? give me a break ... hahaahahah

    Now here comes the importance of the Bold part.

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    Quote Originally Posted by zerocooldx View Post
    In terms of pure intelligence and mental capacity the title belongs to Itachi. The guy could make a cat bark if he wanted to, and do so without his Sharingan.

  7. #381
    Intl Translator 英雄メンバー / Eiyuu Menbaa / Hero Member Lord Rayleigh's Avatar
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    Re: One Piece 655 Discussion

    The argument of 2 years training making them part of the high tiers does not make any sense. It's not because they were trained by Rayleigh and Mihawk that they reached their level and experience or can sail serenely in the New World. It is just that they were taught by the adequate people the New World's basis of fighting in a few time in order to get a chance to conquer their dreams. Without that, they would not have any chance to shine in New World.

    It's easy to understand that to become the "new Roger Pirates" the Straw Hats needed an appropriate knowledge of fighting. They've been growing a lot thanks to meeting opponents but that was not enough to pretend being the strongest pirates. They were about to enter a new sea in which the fighters' level is quite different. The gap would have been too important and they would have easily been crushed by these people as the Sabaody's experience proved it. So the timeskip happened so that they could have a change to succeed in New World.

    That doesn't make them boss for New World yet. Don't forget that Mihawks has been very clear on the fact that training without experience was futile so thinking these 2 years are enough for them to fight against most of New World's fighters is ridiculous. What lacks the Straw Hats right now is experience and that is going to be the whole point of these New World arcs. They are going to grow a lot like they did in Paradise but they have prepared for New World like they did for becoming pirates.

    So Straw Hats went to training to get the appropriate level for the New World challenge like they did in the past for Paradise. If you think about it, Luffy and Zoro spent all their childhood training in order to set sail as independent pirates, still their growth rate was better in this one year traveling than in their whole decade of training. Yet, they did it. It's because their training was necessary for them to be successful on their own in their East Blue and Grand Line travels as Pirate King candidates. If they had sailed before with their dreams in mind they would have died or stopped being pirates. Their fast growth rate and shining in Paradise would have been impossible.

    Remember what happened to Don Krieg. He was completely defeated in Grand Line. So the 2 years training is simply the training which will enable them to be independant pirates in the New World and still survive with their dreams in mind. The other supernovae must have become stronger too but we don't know how much. It depends on what they did in New World. If they had a Roger like behavior, they probably got a massive power up. Kid is expected to have become a strong pirate and a frightening opponent for Luffy since he seemed he took many risks, challenged Yonko and still survived. The others may have just ended up allies and had a lower growth rate.

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