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Thread: Hunter x Hunter Chapter 341 Spoiler Discussion (& One Shot)

  1. #211
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    Re: Hunter x Hunter Chapter 341 Spoiler Discussion (& One Shot)

    Sounds rather plausible. Yes, it is a stretch, but he could go with it.
    It doesn't seem very Togashi-like, though.

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    Registered User 中級員 / Chuukyuuin / Member Kazna's Avatar
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    Re: Hunter x Hunter Chapter 341 Spoiler Discussion (& One Shot)

    Quote Originally Posted by Uriel View Post
    It's too much forced, actually.
    Yeah that's it. Btw Uriel, where's the hangout thread? it's missing? When I'm back to the mangahelpers forums I notice some threads've been missing!



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    Re: Hunter x Hunter Chapter 341 Spoiler Discussion (& One Shot)

    Quote Originally Posted by Kazna View Post
    Yeah that's it. Btw Uriel, where's the hangout thread? it's missing? When I'm back to the mangahelpers forums I notice some threads've been missing!
    There are some issues and some threads are missing. xi0 is working on it as we speak. Do not fear (?) And let me know if there is another thread missing.
    The Sky is pouring
    The wind is blowing
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    a surging sea of flames
    looks like the entrance to hell
    'Perfect', the captain said.

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    Re: Hunter x Hunter Chapter 341 Spoiler Discussion (& One Shot)

    I forgot what the exact name is but there's this concept that you don't build up a character with possible foreshadowing and then don't do anything with it because that's considered very bad writing, so Pairo HAS to be Shalunark by necessity because it doesn't make sense to develop this character and then say "oh yeah he died and never get to do anything he hinted he's going to do". Though since this is HXH where people often reveal foreshadow worthy plans and then immediately get killed, it's not as easy to apply this same concepot. As to whether this would make any sense, of course it does not but that's not really that important.

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    Re: Hunter x Hunter Chapter 341 Spoiler Discussion (& One Shot)

    ^I kind of see get what you are talking phan (I also don't know if there's a proper name for this kind of storytelling concept; though i have to add that I personaly call it's inverse personagens discartáveis [disposable characters], a thing I learned from a friend when talking about Gantz...), but do remember that even if it remains true, it doesn't necessarily mean that Pairo has to be Shalnark. Maybe he'll appear later in the storyline (at least the movie one; hopefully the manga too ^^).

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    Re: Hunter x Hunter Chapter 341 Spoiler Discussion (& One Shot)

    Well for example way back Silva says Killua will return one day because he is his son. And Killua eventually did return. If Killua never returned there would literally be no point to this section unless the point was that Silva is a babbling fool who didn't even understand what his son. Now the 'return' itself can be open to discussion. Killua didn't really return in the sense of 'I wanted to be an Assassin' but he did return.

    Likewise it seems almost necessary that Kurapika has to answer the question: "Are you happy?" and this necessarily means Pairo has to be alive and given what's happened this means Pairo has to be Shalunark, unless the underlying message is: "And I never even get to answer that question before Pairo got brutally murdered".

    I'm pretty sure there's a literary term for this kind of stuff. It makes most fiction rather easy to predict, but if you veer off from this, usually whatever story you make literally does not make sense. Again, if Killua never went back home and HXH ended, everyone's going to be asking: "What the heck is the point of Silva saying Killua will return one day?" In Kurapika's case, it's hard for me to see anyone else asking that question, since nobody even knows about this promise way back to begin with. He's very aloof to even his friends so I don't see any of them just suddenly walk up to him and say something like: "Now that all the Spiders are dead, are you happy?" because it really doesn't make much sense.

    This is one of those 'plot twist by necessity', like if we hear about the legendary Super Saiyan it is necessary that the legendary Super Saiyan exists, otherwise there would be no reason for this legend to exist in the first place. While it's true there's a good deal of 'and soandso died without ever accomplishing anything important' kind of ending in HXH, even those are generally limited to fairly unimportant characters. For example we know Kuroro says way back, all they wanted is... (unknown). Therefore there has to be *something* that the Spiders really wanted that we have to know at some point. The only exception is if HXH was forced to end in 2 volumes and there turns out to be insufficient time to wrap things up. Otherwise you can't just leave major foreshadowing events unanswered. The answer itself can be rather arbitrary, but it must be answered.

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  9. #217
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    Re: Hunter x Hunter Chapter 341 Spoiler Discussion (& One Shot)

    Quote Originally Posted by Phantron View Post
    Well for example way back Silva says Killua will return one day because he is his son. And Killua eventually did return. If Killua never returned there would literally be no point to this section unless the point was that Silva is a babbling fool who didn't even understand what his son. Now the 'return' itself can be open to discussion. Killua didn't really return in the sense of 'I wanted to be an Assassin' but he did return.

    Likewise it seems almost necessary that Kurapika has to answer the question: "Are you happy?" and this necessarily means Pairo has to be alive and given what's happened this means Pairo has to be Shalunark, unless the underlying message is: "And I never even get to answer that question before Pairo got brutally murdered".

    I'm pretty sure there's a literary term for this kind of stuff. It makes most fiction rather easy to predict, but if you veer off from this, usually whatever story you make literally does not make sense. Again, if Killua never went back home and HXH ended, everyone's going to be asking: "What the heck is the point of Silva saying Killua will return one day?" In Kurapika's case, it's hard for me to see anyone else asking that question, since nobody even knows about this promise way back to begin with. He's very aloof to even his friends so I don't see any of them just suddenly walk up to him and say something like: "Now that all the Spiders are dead, are you happy?" because it really doesn't make much sense.

    This is one of those 'plot twist by necessity', like if we hear about the legendary Super Saiyan it is necessary that the legendary Super Saiyan exists, otherwise there would be no reason for this legend to exist in the first place. While it's true there's a good deal of 'and soandso died without ever accomplishing anything important' kind of ending in HXH, even those are generally limited to fairly unimportant characters. For example we know Kuroro says way back, all they wanted is... (unknown). Therefore there has to be *something* that the Spiders really wanted that we have to know at some point. The only exception is if HXH was forced to end in 2 volumes and there turns out to be insufficient time to wrap things up. Otherwise you can't just leave major foreshadowing events unanswered. The answer itself can be rather arbitrary, but it must be answered.
    Another possibility is that Togashi just forgets about it. That wouldn't really be bad writing in the way you described it. Just keep in mind that even if there was a plan at the beginning, it doesn't necessarily mean it's going to be executed in the future.

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    Re: Hunter x Hunter Chapter 341 Spoiler Discussion (& One Shot)

    Quote Originally Posted by Googlez_kun View Post
    Another possibility is that Togashi just forgets about it. That wouldn't really be bad writing in the way you described it. Just keep in mind that even if there was a plan at the beginning, it doesn't necessarily mean it's going to be executed in the future.
    I really don't think Togashi forgot it.Killua could really change in the future.I think he could become an antagonist later.

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    Re: Hunter x Hunter Chapter 341 Spoiler Discussion (& One Shot)

    Quote Originally Posted by Demonspeed View Post
    I really don't think Togashi forgot it.Killua could really change in the future.I think he could become an antagonist later.
    Not talking about anything specific, just in general.

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    Re: Hunter x Hunter Chapter 341 Spoiler Discussion (& One Shot)

    Quote Originally Posted by Phantron View Post
    Well for example way back Silva says Killua will return one day because he is his son. And Killua eventually did return. If Killua never returned there would literally be no point to this section unless the point was that Silva is a babbling fool who didn't even understand what his son. Now the 'return' itself can be open to discussion. Killua didn't really return in the sense of 'I wanted to be an Assassin' but he did return.

    Likewise it seems almost necessary that Kurapika has to answer the question: "Are you happy?" and this necessarily means Pairo has to be alive and given what's happened this means Pairo has to be Shalunark, unless the underlying message is: "And I never even get to answer that question before Pairo got brutally murdered".

    I'm pretty sure there's a literary term for this kind of stuff. It makes most fiction rather easy to predict, but if you veer off from this, usually whatever story you make literally does not make sense. Again, if Killua never went back home and HXH ended, everyone's going to be asking: "What the heck is the point of Silva saying Killua will return one day?" In Kurapika's case, it's hard for me to see anyone else asking that question, since nobody even knows about this promise way back to begin with. He's very aloof to even his friends so I don't see any of them just suddenly walk up to him and say something like: "Now that all the Spiders are dead, are you happy?" because it really doesn't make much sense.

    This is one of those 'plot twist by necessity', like if we hear about the legendary Super Saiyan it is necessary that the legendary Super Saiyan exists, otherwise there would be no reason for this legend to exist in the first place. While it's true there's a good deal of 'and soandso died without ever accomplishing anything important' kind of ending in HXH, even those are generally limited to fairly unimportant characters. For example we know Kuroro says way back, all they wanted is... (unknown). Therefore there has to be *something* that the Spiders really wanted that we have to know at some point. The only exception is if HXH was forced to end in 2 volumes and there turns out to be insufficient time to wrap things up. Otherwise you can't just leave major foreshadowing events unanswered. The answer itself can be rather arbitrary, but it must be answered.
    I think Killua returning was in connection to the fact that he had been implanted with something on his forehead all the way up to the ant arc where he finally had it removed. He was given this forceful fear that was telling him not to risk his life if I"m not mistaken because the way of an assassin is safety and attacking from the shadows, but being with Gon made Killua more of an upfront fighter but it went against what he was brainwashed to do by his family. But with all that removed what Silva said should now be moot because he pretty much got rid of anything that would allow his parents to control him.

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    Re: Hunter x Hunter Chapter 341 Spoiler Discussion (& One Shot)

    Quote Originally Posted by TheWanderer View Post
    I think Killua returning was in connection to the fact that he had been implanted with something on his forehead all the way up to the ant arc where he finally had it removed. He was given this forceful fear that was telling him not to risk his life if I"m not mistaken because the way of an assassin is safety and attacking from the shadows, but being with Gon made Killua more of an upfront fighter but it went against what he was brainwashed to do by his family. But with all that removed what Silva said should now be moot because he pretty much got rid of anything that would allow his parents to control him.
    Silva's 'he'll be back, he's my son' is clearly meant to be like 'my son is definitely still going to be an Assassin', not "I got Ilumi with some awesome manipulation tech that will kick in later".

    Of course that didn't turn out to be the way he planned, but Killua did come back (for Alluka). In HXH, foreshadowing is usually misleading. The event foreshadowed will almost certainly happen but not in the way you'd expect. For example we see way back in the Hunter exam it's foreshadowed that one day, Kurapika, Gon, and Leorio will go separate ways (Killua wasn't part of the group at that time). Well, that's already happened but mostly because Kurapika decides to work for the Mafia and Leorio needs to study to become a doctor while Gon is out fighting super powerful alien invaders. At the original point you'd think the separation means a collapse of their friendship, but no, it's more like each of them simply got different jobs that had nothing to do with each other so they each went their way. That said I kind of like this style, because the normal way this is done would be like:

    XYZ: "Gon, Killua is going to try to kill you one day. REMEMBER!"
    (sometime way later)
    Killua: "Gon, Togashi called and says I have to kill you now."
    Gon: "But I thought we're friends???"
    Killua: "The will of Togashi is absolute my friend!"
    (pointless epic battle ensues)
    XYZ: "See I told you so way back in volume 1!"

    As we see Killua eventually returned home, and the original trio eventually went separate ways, but it wasn't because the will of Togashi said so.
    Last edited by Phantron; December 29, 2012 at 04:33 AM.

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  15. #222
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    Re: Hunter x Hunter Chapter 341 Spoiler Discussion (& One Shot)

    There's also the one early on in the Hunter Exam arc where Gon, Kurapika, and Leorio was asked what they would do if they can only save one person out of two that were in danger. You can interpret this however you want: Kurapika choosing to save Gon and Killua instead of going after the Spiders, Killua choosing to journey with Alluka instead of Gon, Gon choosing to avenge Kite recklessly instead of listening to reason, etc. Togashi didn't play the foreshadowing straight, but he did play it such that he was still able to retain the essence of the question: what would you do when you're faced with two difficult choices?

    Quote Originally Posted by Phantron View Post
    XYZ: "Gon, Killua is going to try to kill you one day. REMEMBER!"
    (sometime way later)
    Killua: "Gon, Togashi called and says I have to kill you now."
    Gon: "But I thought we're friends???"
    Killua: "The will of Togashi is absolute my friend!"
    (pointless epic battle ensues)
    XYZ: "See I told you so way back in volume 1!"
    This had me laughing because that's how some stories sadly do play out. XD

  16. #223
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    Re: Hunter x Hunter Chapter 341 Spoiler Discussion (& One Shot)

    Screw you guys bumping this thread making me think the manga is back!!

    "If you want to understand someone, find out what makes them angry."

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  18. #224
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    Re: Hunter x Hunter Chapter 341 Spoiler Discussion (& One Shot)

    ^ Yeah, I was fooled too.

    Though I think someone would make a separate thread about the hiatus being over or something instead.

    Overall, I agree with what everyone's said. Killua returning was out of his free will (not because of the needle), and the foreshadowing did come true from earlier chapters. This is one of many examples stated. I think sometimes Togashi leaves some things up in the air and lets the readers piece them together, or you have to pay very close attention to get closure on some things (i.e. Abegane meeting Kuroro). Either case, the way Togashi handles foreshadowing is creative and really is an indication of how well of a story writer he is.

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  20. #225
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    Re: Hunter x Hunter Chapter 341 Spoiler Discussion (& One Shot)

    Well think of it this way, in real life sometimes you will see something or something will happen that you could say 'foreshadows' something that happens later, but more often than not what happens happens differently to what would be expected of the foreshadowing of events.

    Togashi takes this real life unpredicatability and utilises it, instead of playing things straight things occur differently but also close enough that it connects back to that prior event.

    "If you want to understand someone, find out what makes them angry."

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