Bleach 492 Discussion

[mattiaildivino]

Did Kirge use Ransōtengai technique to continue fighting? From appearances alone he is gravely injured, his bones are broken and his body is full of injuries, even he admits that such power is too much for him. I guess he'll use one final technique to kill Ayon but his injuries will prove too much for him and Ichigo will defeat him without releasing bankai. Kirge implied that other quincies have the same technique, it seems they'll be very dangerous adversaries with such powerful techniques, a very tough battle is awaiting us in SS.

nice,I was wondering that as well. but I doubt that,since his body seems to be as tough as nnoitra's and he has some other tricks to absorb or nullify opponents' attacks (such as the getsuga tenshou)

[SaitoSpike]

i really wonder if Kirge isnt just stalling...per his orders...i mean he took that beating from Ayon but imo if you can take that sort of beating and get up than it should be a testament to your power..so the question being, is it Ayon's power or is it Kirge's stalling?

i still dont believe Ayon could ever defeat any of the captains (for reasons not solely based on power)...despite having what seems like Captain Class power, the gap between VC and Captain is just too wide imo...to further that point...we can look at VCs with Bankai even still that gap between them and a Captain still seems wide

Yama-ji is strong enough to take on 2 Senior Captains at once so he's not a good comparison to anyone short of ichigo

that 'beating' Ayon gave kirge.....i dont really buy it, alot of flash, no real damage

its hard to find a measuring stick for Ayon's power because we dont really know what level Kirge's at and Ichigo's power fluctuates so much that doesnt help either, its also very hard because Ayon fought a bunch o VCs then followed it with the strongest Shinigami there is (was), was Ayong stronger than Tosen? I mean Hisagi proceeded to get his ass handed to him by Ayon, but then had enough strength to kill a transformed Tosen....(sneak attack or not)

sometimes i wish the bleach power levels were as simple and straight to the point as DBZ power levels lol, but it certainly makes things interesting

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the levels of power have been confusing since the Aizen saga ended, technically Kubo put the shinigami of the G13 in a sort of box, which results in having to limit the bad guys powers as well if you really think about it the shinigami in the G13 cant really get much stronger unless he has a damn good explanation as to why they're all suddenly much stronger in these 17 months, as compared to the normal growth of a shinigami which seems to be over 50-100 years

there are some exceptions i guess since some of these shinigami are prodigies and are young enough thats its realistic that they make crazy leaps, examples would be toshiro and maybe Byakuya, otherwise they've all been pretty limited because Aizen brought out their max...except of course for the senior captains who managed to get through the Aizen thing without bankais

there's really only one explanation (excuse) Kubo could use to explain what we are very likely about to see soon when they start the war, when we suddenly see a spike in all their powers....ICHIGO we've already seen his effect on just his school friends in terms of developing spiritual power so maybe the same can be applied to the shinigami in the G13

kubo could choose to ignore it and not explain why these ppl are suddenly all stronger within 17 months which would be lame as well....but if there is no obvious spike in their powers than it leads us back to the fact that these enemies can't really be as strong as we all thought...right? there's always the exception of the main bad guy in this case the 'king' he has no limit to what his power can be at because its likely Ichigo who has to beat him, a guy who also has no limit, but everyone else (who has shown their full power) based on 'normal' shinigami growth shouldnt really be that much stronger...which means the star knights and Kirge can't really be that strong....which also furthers the point that there's no way Kirge can beat Ichigo

meh

i think that what makes this arc interesting tho is that Quincy abilities seem to be tricky so maybe being stronger is no longer the deciding factor, so he may not need to really 'beat' ichigo

[unusualangel]

I think Ichigo's strength is closely related to length of Tensa Zangetsu's chain. Before dangai training it was short. After dangai training, it was so long that it was wrapped around his arm. After he got his powers back, the chain was still long but not as long as his post-dangai self. So I agree with those who say his power is somewhere between pre-dangai and post-dangai form, I believe he's close to senior captain level now.

good point there. so i guess the longer the chain and the more attached it is to ichigo the more he becomes one with zangetsu therefore increasing his power?

[Bromamura]

It's odd but I'm growing quite fond of Ayon. I'll be sad when he eventually gets schooled by Kirge. Let's hope it's not too nasty.

[capricorn]

I doupt anything kirge does to Ayon will result in Ayon dying. I think the secret to ending Ayon is killing the bestias themselves. Remember the Fake Karakura town arc where Ayon got cut clean in half and was barbequed by Captain commander, that's not something you just regenerate from.

[crimsonlink310]

Kirge's real name is actually Quilge Opie as stated on Shonen Jump Alpha.... Click on the Bleach picture Man I can't believe we have all been using the wrong name the whole time. Makes me wonder what else was mistranslated now that we have a reliable translation from Alpha.

Anyways I predict a Cero from Ayon at one point that will blow off one of Quilge's body parts and then both end up killing each other or a focus on the battle in SS for next weeks chapter.

[Darjaille]

>_>;;

Well, translating from katakana to latin alphabet is actually impossible in case of names like these, you know I don't see any problem, whether it's Barragan or Baraggan, Allon or Ayon, Ulq Shiffer or Cifer... it's all about pronunciation, and in japanese, you can pronounce it Quilge (Q=K, R=L in japanese).

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Ichigo will probably fight in bankai (I've no problems with that) although it may be only because he'll have to fight Ayon as well. Or, you know, maybe Chad, Hime and Urahara will actually do something?

[Quantized]

Got to ponder whether Mugetsu really is fully developed yet, knowing Kubo it probably isn't, he enjoys to build upon old artwork/techniques.
As a shinigami technique it' probably reached its peak of power, but what happens if you throw fully developed Hollow and Fullbring powers into the mix.
Seems to me that Mugetsu will be something much greater/different when mixed with other powers, and possibly we'll see Ichigo with Mugetsu+'something else' at the end of Bleach <3
Not being able to use it due to loosing his powers, likely means it's deemed to be used once more, and if at the end, he could loose his powers or learn to use Mugetsu permanently.

anyway on-topic!
Predicting that Ichigo won't go bankai for once, it screams to much cliché and repeating, at least to me.
Also that Urahara and his friends are nearby, in addition that he has already used bankai earlier, it would be too repeatable if he already used it now once more this few chapters afterwards. Also we haven't seen Ichigo pwn hard in shikai yet, it's time he learns to, imho.
If not now, then at least attempt to learn strategic fighting and other skills he lacks.

Predicting that Urahara is not only with Ichigo to support him, not only with him for strategic war reasons, he's not only with him to make sure he survives because this time it's a serious threat, I doubt any of these reasons are the real reasons, albeit partly reasons.
Think the real reason Urahara is with Ichigo is to teach him, while Ichigo has almost abundant power levels and in large has learned to control a lot of his powers, he still seem to hide a lot of hidden potential.
All his Bankai / hand to hand potential aside, Ichigo is pretty weak in other areas, such as kiddo and strategic fighting.
Not to forget his extremely underdeveloped hollow and fullbring abilities, he didn't exactly get these powers for fun sake, there is a purpose.
Remember what Ginjou said, when a Fullbringer dies, all his/her fullbring powers are "reset", thus, Ichigo probably got his Fullbring powers back, albeit not using them.

All that aside, Ichigo also has to learn strategic warfare if he should have any hopes becoming a leader of a kind one day, which I think is likely to happen.

So, for what reason is Urahara really with him? The absolute main reason, if you look aside from the bonus reasons, such as cause harm on VR internally or similar.
Think that Urahara really can make Ichigo a mind blowing treath if he learned to fight differently, instead of being so direct, raw young and naive, charging directly with raw power, Ichigo is still lacking strategic thinking imho, and who better to teach him strategic and intelligent thinking than Urahara himself?

[Miyagi]

I would like to see Chad fight, he must have gotten quite strong during the timeskip. Urahara didn't have a decent fight too, he toyed with Yammy twice and he fought Aizen in a teamwork when Aizen was indestructible. I also noticed something interesting about Urahara, he realized that Kirge Quilge released his complete holy form but Orihime said she didn't feel any reiatsu from him, how did Urahara know it then? Quilge implied that Ichigo could feel his reiatsu in the same page, I wonder if it was because Urahara and Ichigo were much powerful than Orihime.

Ayon should be able to fight even if Quilge opens a hole in his chest, I'm curious about how Quilge will defeat him. Perhaps he will aim at his head or try to kill Mila Rose and Sung-Sun to dispel the technique, assuming incapacitating Apacci isn't already enough. He was absorbing spiritual energy in the last panel, we know from Uryū's final form how powerful such an attack with high amounts of absorbed reishi could be. I expect to see a new technique from Quilge though, his previous attempt of Biskiel failed, I doubt he is planning to use the same technique over and over to kill them all.

[Jorge D. Dragon]

I don't really think that Quilge or Kirge (the last sounds more like German, but strangely means church) is using Ransōtengai or at least it isn't the only reason why he can continue his fight after being fisically trashed by Allon. His neck was actually broken, so I don't believe any normal human can survive this beating, so it means that he is somehow modified.

Hope Ichi will dominate the guy in this chapter or in the upcoming one. And I hope he won't use his Bankai as it would be strange for him to use it unless Kirge is one of the two or three top dogs of VanderReich.

P.S. About the names... I believe the names should be spelled and pronounced as they are in their original language. For example Barragan is a spanish surname, so it should be spelled and pronounced like this or Stark is a german surname and should be spelled like this.

[Quantized]

I don't really think that Quilge or Kirge (the last sounds more like German, but strangely means church) is using Ransōtengai or at least it isn't the only reason why he can continue his fight after being fisically trashed by Allon. His neck was actually broken, so I don't believe any normal human can survive this beating, so it means that he is somehow modified.

Hope Ichi will dominate the guy in this chapter or in the upcoming one. And I hope he won't use his Bankai as it would be strange for him to use it unless Kirge is one of the two or three top dogs of VanderReich.

P.S. About the names... I believe the names should be spelled and pronounced as they are in their original language. For example Barragan is a spanish surname, so it should be spelled and pronounced like this or Stark is a german surname and should be spelled like this.

I can't say much about the Japanese translation, but Kirge doesn't mean Church if you translate in roman letters
Kirge means nothing on German, and if you translate Church in German you get "Kirche".
It's very different in pronunciation, albeit similar.
You put your tounge on the "che" sound, it's different from the "ge" sound when you speak these two words on German, the "kir" sound is the same though.
But I agree that it's too similar, and the fact he looks like an angel with the wings and all makes it almost certain that the name is on purpose, but it doesn't literally mean church
Unless it really meant Church in Japanese and it was a bad English translation? O.o
Using the original names? I completely agree... I never got over my self from the German translation name on Luffy, called Ruffy... such a weird thing to do, I never forgave that translation team..

But other than the German word difference, I completely agree with your whole post, especially didn't realize the neck part.. it indeed seems he aint human anymore.
Maybe the Quincy ripped out their own Souls and moved to a dimension they had created?
Would love to know more of this matter, maybe Kirge will spill some more in his gloating next chapter.. typical villain thing to do