Naruto 589 Discussion

[M3J]

To give Sasuke a showing like Naruto has had against Tobi and the Jinchuuriki Paths. I don't think the Kages will look any worst, given that several times it's been made clear that Madara was merely toying with them. If anything, them actually beating Madara would be weird with such a difference in power and them already being pushed to their limits.

Can't believe that, they'd really have to OP Sasuke since Madara has Sharingan, EMS, knowledge of EMS and Uchiha, Rin'negan, and Sharingan's greatest weakness, Mokuton. Kishi would have to introduce more asspulls for Sasuke like he did for Naruto for him to stand any chance. I could see Naruto and Sasuke vs. Madara, but not either teen alone against Madara.

If the gokage, even Oonoki and Gaara with a Naruto clone, are doing horribly, Sasuke would do just as bad, give or take.

I don't think that he'll resist it, just counter it. Lets not forget that he has the rinnegan and that comes with the power to revive people. What if he choses to revive himself? That was originally the plan they had in store for Nagato.

Difference is, Nagato was meant to revive someone else. Which is weird considering his statement of "it's not too late," yet it looks like it was years after Madara's death.

I know he has Rin'negan, I was thinking about Rin'negan and forgot about Izanagi. The problem is, Madara is dead. He can't revive himself, and Izanagi shouldn't work since Madara's not being killed or anything.

[Rikudou King]

Can't believe that, they'd really have to OP Sasuke since Madara has Sharingan, EMS, knowledge of EMS and Uchiha, Rin'negan, and Sharingan's greatest weakness, Mokuton. Kishi would have to introduce more asspulls for Sasuke like he did for Naruto for him to stand any chance. I could see Naruto and Sasuke vs. Madara, but not either teen alone against Madara.

If the gokage, even Oonoki and Gaara with a Naruto clone, are doing horribly, Sasuke would do just as bad, give or take.

Well it'll have to happen either now or later if Sasuke's expected to fight Naruto's new mode, unless Naruto really does end up getting the Kyuubi removed to drop the needed powerlevel. And done the right way, Sasuke wouldn't need a major power boost if he returns to using tactics full time. If Madara is brought back to life, then that could open the opportunity needed to physically take him down.

[M3J]

Will tactics help against an experienced powerhouse who has shown quite an intelligence or awareness? It'll be hard for Sasuke to fight Mokuton when it can appear anywhere, and Rin'negan that lets Madara use any jutsu he wants. Madara has shown extremely difficult to take down as an Edo Tensei, and we don't even know what his chakra pool is.

[Rikudou King]

Tactics should, as Madara so far has been pretty straight forward in his actions. And it would be the prefect chance to show what his Enton ability can really do. Seeing as Mokuton doesn't appear to have any properties to prevent it from burning, Amaterasu should be useful and manipulating it around the field just like Madara does with wood would be interesting. The Rinnegan would be an issue, but Madara doesn't actually appear to make use of it's more dangerous abilities, so the chance is that he could be taken out before he realizes he needs too, especially if he's underestimating Sasuke during their fight as he has a habit of doing.

[gnut]

Tactics should, as Madara so far has been pretty straight forward in his actions. And it would be the prefect chance to show what his Enton ability can really do. Seeing as Mokuton doesn't appear to have any properties to prevent it from burning, Amaterasu should be useful and manipulating it around the field just like Madara does with wood would be interesting. The Rinnegan would be an issue, but Madara doesn't actually appear to make use of it's more dangerous abilities, so the chance is that he could be taken out before he realizes he needs too, especially if he's underestimating Sasuke during their fight as he has a habit of doing.

i'm interested in the ultimate tsukyomi...now i know this guy has got to have gas...reguardless of being ET'd or not.
just a thought...since we haven't seen anyone fighting madara but the kages since naruto left.what if they are all in a big genjutsu(hence how"weak"it looked on raikage)...meaning i guess that they are already in one...know what i'm getting at...
i think this is why he is so cocky/arrogant...they are already under his control...

[M3J]

Tactics should, as Madara so far has been pretty straight forward in his actions. And it would be the prefect chance to show what his Enton ability can really do. Seeing as Mokuton doesn't appear to have any properties to prevent it from burning, Amaterasu should be useful and manipulating it around the field just like Madara does with wood would be interesting. The Rinnegan would be an issue, but Madara doesn't actually appear to make use of it's more dangerous abilities, so the chance is that he could be taken out before he realizes he needs too, especially if he's underestimating Sasuke during their fight as he has a habit of doing.

I don't think he'll underestimate Sasuke if Sasuke shows Susano'o. Madara might not have any respect for non Uchiha apart from Hashirama, and maybe even the same with Uchiha. Madara would get a chance to use Rin'negan though, if he realizes he has to. Sasuke would have to get in in a way that his chakra absorption won't work otherwise Madara will resort to Rin'negan.

[Rikudou King]

That's where I think his Enton could help, given even a missed shot could be manipulated into an advantage. Presuming Madara doesn't know about Enton, he wouldn't have any reason to worry about it missing him. In addition, there was that whole thing with Nagato where he choose to use Shinra Tensei instead of chakra absorption against Amaterasu, so that could be leading somewhere.

[M3J]

Nagato was under Kabuto's control though, so who knows. Why wouldn't Madara expect enton? Looks like the ability to manipulate Amaterasu is a given, but the degree of control is based on the person itself. He may not expect Sasuke's good or precise control of enton, but I don't see why he wouldn't see enton.

Of course, that is assuming he has Amaterasu or knows about it. Which he might not. It's all speculation.

Though, if he does know about Amaterasu, it'll be harder to hit him as he can move in time, like what Sasuke did against Itachi to trap him.

[DooMinator]

forgot about Izanagi. The problem is, Madara is dead. He can't revive himself, and Izanagi shouldn't work since Madara's not being killed or anything.

I don't think being dead is needed for casting Izanagi. It's a jutsu to change reality, not to cancel death (though I agree, it was used for only that so far...). Madara simply could change a reality where he was ET into one where he's still alive. Rinnegan-Izanagi might be one hell of a jutsu :/

[mattiaildivino]

what the??? I didn't notice this in the first time: kishi has made one of his biggest mistakes in this chapter!!! http://www.mangareader.net/naruto/589/7 Sasuke tells itachi about "tobi",but itachi shouldn't know that tobi was madara! In fact,in volume 42 he just told sasuke that madara was behind akatsuki,but itachi NEVER showed (in his thoughts)tobi talking about madara. I think tobi's behaviour,that is the childish tobi we knew, was due to deceive itachi. maybe sasuke said so because the last time naruto mentioned tobi: http://www.mangareader.net/93-47870-...apter-485.html ,yet,this is a mistake: itachi didn't know that tobi was madara. I hope kishi will correct that or,better, itachi has to asy soemthing like :"tobi?so he was madara..."

[syx]

Why shouldn't Itachi know that Tobi is "Madara"? When Itachi first encountered "Madara", he was already wearing a mask with only one hole (if we believe this part of Tobis story of course). In chapter 354 Itachi saw Tobi, who was wearing a mask with one hole. It's not a mistake I think. Itachi can put 1 and 1 together.

[mattiaildivino]

Why shouldn't Itachi know that Tobi is "Madara"? When Itachi first encountered "Madara", he was already wearing a mask with only one hole (if we believe this part of Tobis story of course). In chapter 354 Itachi saw Tobi, who was wearing a mask with one hole. It's not a mistake I think. Itachi can put 1 and 1 together.

itachi might have had some doubts(according to his intelligence), but in this page http://www.mangareader.net/93-391-11...apter-386.html ,he doesn't show tobi,actually itachi regards madara as if he were unknown and in its shadow. I really want itachi to make some comments about tobi/madara next chapter,otehrwise I will consider the biggest mistake commited by kishi. you don't know for how may years I've been thinking about tobi being unknown by itachi...

[syx]

Tobi isn't shown, because Itachi was talking about the Madara from the past. Read chapter 386 again and keep in mind the timeline whenever Madara was shown. Itachi begins with the two brothers awakening the Sharingan until Madara defeat against Hashirama. Fact is that Madara never wore a mask in this time frame.

Itachi never talks about the Madara(Tobi) he met. That's why we never saw Tobi (Madara), when Itachi was talking about him.

[abyozuu]

I don't think being dead is needed for casting Izanagi. It's a jutsu to change reality, not to cancel death (though I agree, it was used for only that so far...). Madara simply could change a reality where he was ET into one where he's still alive. Rinnegan-Izanagi might be one hell of a jutsu :/

what good may it be if madara returns alive with one eye lost? he will not have perfect susanoo

[mattiaildivino]

what good may it be if madara returns alive with one eye lost? he will not have perfect susanoo

he couldn't use susanoo at all,nor can itachi now. without a sharingan,madara would be much weaker. he can turn alive through using the gedo rinne tensei,his or tobi's one. not to mention that tobi knows how to use the ET now...