Naruto 590 Discussion

[Curtarc]

Good chapter, I liked the bits when Itachi had to kill his parents, it was the first time that we saw Itachi cry(I think?) and it was also the first time the manga showed that he hesitated before killing his parents. I think that was a good thing Kishi did, it just made Itachi's character grow in complexity(as if it wasn't complex enough ) and it proved once again what a hard decision he had to make: save his brother and his village but in return loose all the other members of his clan(including his parents) or join the fight with the Uchiha but see the downfall of the village and eventually the people closest to him. It was also the goodbye that we waited for and the closure Sasuke needed.

I just didn't understand something, what was that picture right after Madara said :"Did something happen to the jutsu?"? Did Madara vanish from the Edo Tensei release or was that picture just a transition from the place where Madara was to the place Itachi and Sasuke were?

[THM Nindo]

luckily madara is finished too,so the kages can rest,and next time he will be summoned by tobi. ehy,this means tobi won't die either ! uhm,but that's quite obvious...

Until we actually see him disappear, I wouldn't say that.
I wouldn't be surprised if he found a way to remaing alive...

Although, I that happens, the Kages are really f*cked!

[insid3rkill3r]

When i first read this chapter, i thought it was a good chapter but i wasnt that moved, it was alright.

But reading it over and over again really hit my heart strings real hard.... seriously.


Most people here seems to have loved the last page more than anything else,,,, and while it was a good scene, i must say the talk between Fugaku and Itachi was what hit me hard.

Even tho they didnt agree with each other, even with all the issues they've had prior to this event, you can see that Fugaku has much more than just pride for his son, he truly loves and admires him.


Even when facing imminent death, Fugaku is concerned about his son's life and future more than anything else, to the point he tries to reassure Itachi that he doesnt have to fear for them as they both won't suffer from this, but that he should rather take care of himself because it's him who will have to face it all.


And we knew Itachi had it hard, we all knew it but Itachi kept that facade up all his life and this prevented us to truly feel what he felt all these years. So seeing that scene with him shaking and crying truly speaks to us. No matter how skilled Itachi was at keeping his calm, this shows us that this was just too much for him, nothing could have prepared him for such strong emotions. There was just much for a 13 years old child to handle.

And honestly, fuck Danzo, fuck him real hard.

I must say i had a bit of sympathy for the guy when he died, but now i truly don,t feel it anymore.

It's almost as he really wanted the Uchiha clan to be dead. Stealing Shisui's eye right before he attempted to use Koto Amatsukami in order to stop the coup?

And while Itachi made his own descision, Tobi did say Danzo manipulated Itachi into doing the mission and i must say that i to some extent agree with this statement.

Danzo pushed Itachi in a corner where only two options were available, and this likely highly influenced Itachi's descision as they were heavily revolving arround Sasuke dying or not dying.

Itachi made his descision himself, but i honestly strongly believes now that Danzo played a good part at toying with his emotions.






So here we are, flashbacks end and Sasuke got what he wanted, the truth about what happened on that night.

There wasn't any developpement in this chapter, however, there was a clarification when it comes to Itachi's point of view.



Itachi really sees himself as a failure.

He believes that had he told the truth to Sasuke back then, maybe the younger brother could have changed the Uchiha's heart. Whats better than an innocent child to put some sense into some avengeful heads?

So what hits me hard about the last page is how much Itachi thinks he has failed. Looking at everything that has happened, he who is perhaps the most intelligent person in the manga, believes that he made the wrong choice back then. He strongly feels like he has failed his brother and parents by not choosing the alternative where Sasuke knows the truth and tries to convince the clan.


So he even goes to say that he doesnt need to be forgiven as he feels he doesnt deserve it, and it's exactly because of all this that he wants to leave it to somebody else as he who failed this much shouldnt have the benefit of having an other chance.

Seriously, im clearly an Itachi fanboy, but never did i think i could me that amazed by a manga character, Kishi sure created one of the greatest character all around in the manga history.

[ninjabot]

I said it was imply, I never said its fact.

Never said you did. But it's obvious you think it's fact because literally every chapter Sasuke appears in you manage to start a "No, the Uchiha weren't there during the Kyuubi attack, Kishi's implying something!" argument in the discussion threads.

But evidence is strong that they have something to do with the kuuybi incident cause I doubt tobi can keep the whole clan away from the village during the attack, and even if tobi was hiding in konoha, he would have hide around the uchiha place so he should not have been aware of kushina going into labor without someone hinting it, it's not like he spy when minato actually release inside kushina and when kushina go to her doctor and shit and I seriously he can do all that spying so near her with minato or anyone noticing

First off, you're trying too hard. We didn't see every ninja in Konoha during the attack. Did they have their hands in the assault too? What about the Inazuka clan, whom none of which were shown? Should we blame them? Ofcourse not. And secondly, at the bolded, EW.

Are you aware it takes 9 months usually from conception to delivery? Are you also aware that Tobi has been planning an assault against Konoha for an untold amount of time/years? Are you telling me that, while Kushina was growing fatter and fatter over the course of 9 months Tobi, who was, as atested to by Itachi, gradually moving through Konoha unnoticed, in preperation for "something", would never, ever hear a ninja or civilian walking around and say something about the beloved 4th Hokage having a child soon? Especially considering she's the 9 tails jinchuuriki? You're telling me the literal only way he could know is if the Uchiha snitched? Do you know how much of a horrid ninja Tobi would be if he could only glean information from people telling him first hand?

No, none of that makes sense.

but the point is that kishi have imply that uchiha was involved and that is what I basing my opinion on, while you are basing it on your wishful thinking in trying to justufy them as good guy, you should present some hint or evidence to back up your argument/ thinking.

I'm basing it on the fact that you haven't a sliver of proof to negate my claims. Hell, I never even said my claims were factual, I said they were possible. It is possible that the only reason you didn't see Uchiha defending against the Kyuubi because Kishimoto wants people to think they were in on it, inorder to throw them for a loop.

It's possibe Danzo wanted them to take the blame for the attack and thus, intercepted whatever message was sent to the police force to prevent them from joining in (the same way he did with the toad he killed during the Pain attack).

It's possible that the Uchiha were willing to help, but were ordered by Fugaku and Mikoto not to aid the village or else they'd excommunicate them/kill them off.

And it's also possible that they were ALL in on it and deliberately chose not to help because it was part of the plan (your favorite scenario).

Or it's possible that Tobi warned the Uchiha that he was going to attack Konoha with the Kyuubi so they'd flee, only for him to sell them out to Danzo to frame them (since they wouldn't be there to answer for it, it would seem like Tobi was telling the truth) thus, planting a seed of hatred that would grow and result in the Uchiha Genocide as we know it today.

Who knows? All I'm saying is you can't prove otherwise. All you can do is hold onto the sliver of hope that the Uchiha are as evil as you want them to be. Whatever the case is, we'll know eventually.

[Silvers Rayleigh]

people need to realize that Itachi didn't pick the village side in all of this he made the choice to be on SASUKE side.
by killing is clan he created a better future for is brother a future where is brother would be alive.

for itachi : sasuke> village, innocent kids, parents, family
for sasuke: itachi> village, innocent kids

they both would do the most evil things for each other am sure if danzou had killed sasuke
itachi would be the one trying to destroy the village right now

[gnut]

page 11...itachi calls tobi...tobi.now,why wouldn't he call him madara?
danzou and tobi told you the truth...sounds pretty blatant to me(tobi is someone...not something).

[Rikudou King]

We don't need to know every uchiha member to know that they don't have any because it they really was a guy in the past that was better than minato or sarutobi then I am damn sure his name would have come up by now. Also what uchiha would have better reputation than a guy who is call the god of shinobi or the guy that ended a war? They pretty much have no one that have any chance to actually be voted for, yes at the hokage appointment relationship was a factor but reputation was also a big factor so if the uchiha really did have someone with more reputation then one of the previous hokage then I pretty sure the fire lord or one of his council would have bring it up unless they were all brain dead.

Faulty reasoning. This entire war just went through introducing a bunch of never before mentioned powerful characters in the form of Edo Tensei. Heck, this war turn Gaara's father from some no named ninja that got taken down by Orochimaru to a no nae guy who could take on a Bijuu along and made Shisui from an unknown to a world famous Uchiha in a single chapter. So just because we haven't had a reference to another powerful person doesn't mean they didn't exist.

Reputation was only a factor if they could get put forth and it hardly needs to be some major feat accomplished. Kakashi and Danzo sure didn't have anything like that. Again, we saw how it went down. Unless someone on that council chose to speak out, an Uchiha wouldn't have had a chance to even be considered. Also, I'm quite sure Minato was never stated to have ended a war.

It was imply by kishi that they were not there, Uchiha is a big focus of the story if one of them were there kishi would have focus on a close up on their eyes to show it, but we saw nothing. And again the event with Mito and tobi knowing the exact day kushina going into labor is to supicious, unless tobi is an expert in female body and he can tell when they are due by simply looking at a how big the stomach is then I would think someone hinted to him. Itachi and sasuke were show right before the kuuybi attack but don't forget kishi purposely didn't show us that place they were at as the kuuybi was attacking so for all we know they were really far away from the attack. Also I find it really hard that there would discriminate against someone if that person were there risking they live fighting together against an common enemy.

Kishi didn't imply anything. You overstating their focus in the series, as if every single event has to do with them. We had plenty of arcs that didn't involved a single Uchiha. The flashback was Naruto's flashback showing his family tragedy.

And no, it's not suspicious. This chapter cleared showed they loved their children, so it would make no sense to help Tobi and leave their children in the village were they could be killed if the Kyuubi launched a single Bijuu Blast. It was clearly shown that Tobi had been spying on the village, thus his knowledge of Minato's abilities, which was barely known within Konoha. The fact that he had Zetsu, who was shown being capable of spying from afar, is more then enough. And as Tobi mentioned, it was the higher-ups that was doing the discrimination. By that same token, the entire clan being gone during the attack would have at the very least been a sign of cowardice and at most actual evidence of them being connected. The fact that the Uchiha's were still respected pretty much implies no one doubted their courage.

[ecoX]

Going back to thinking Tobi is Madara's brother. He might hae called himself Madara because without his eyes Madara would be blind. He also took alot of the Uchiha eyes after the massacre. Plus we found out this chapter that he prettty much is an Uchiha. Who else would we ever care it to be

[Kaiten]

Maybe Tobi could have taken the name of a ninja famous throughout the land, a name that inspires fear and admiration in all who hear it. Being an Uchiha himself, Madara decided he may as well pretend to be the most famous Uchiha ever. Or it could have had something to do with Madara being blind if he didn't take his brothers eyes. That sounds like a plausible plot twist too.

If you listen real closely while reading this chapter you can hear the sound of a billion fangirls squealing at the same time.

[llamapie]

page 11...itachi calls tobi...tobi.now,why wouldn't he call him madara?
danzou and tobi told you the truth...sounds pretty blatant to me(tobi is someone...not something).

Trolly situation man. I still think Tobi is Madara in the sense of he is a mass of uchiha DNA formed by a last ditch attempt by Madara as he died, hence how Tobi had Madara's rinnegan (which Madara gave to Nagato). There is a huge flash back due to explain all of that. I think Tobi is perhaps Madara's attempt at cheating death.

---------- Post added at 04:59 AM ---------- Previous post was at 04:56 AM ----------

Maybe Tobi could have taken the name of a ninja famous throughout the land, a name that inspires fear and admiration in all who hear it. Being an Uchiha himself, Madara decided he may as well pretend to be the most famous Uchiha ever. Or it could have had something to do with Madara being blind if he didn't take his brothers eyes. That sounds like a plausible plot twist too.

If you listen real closely while reading this chapter you can hear the sound of a billion fangirls squealing at the same time.

The whole fact that Tobi claimed to have given Nagato the rinnegan then Madara knowing Nagato, it tells me there is a direct link there somewhere. Unfortunately nothing will be explained until Kishi is done trolling. I like to think there is more to it than him just taking the name to inspire fear. It was enough to convince people like Minato and Itachi. And Minato came to the conclusion before Tobi started going by Madara. At the very least that is confirmation of a direct connection. The whole bit of Madara unlocking rinnegan right before he died, and the fact that nagato received the rinnegan when he was probably a baby... Something is missing in there.

[Wind_NiN]

Wow, what an epic chapter this was. It's still hard for me to process that Itachi was a good guy all along. Now... Let's see if Sasuke will become a good guy after knowing the truth.

[lamenguy]

it's the torture for sasuke to go on kiling konoha clan, maybe if itachi tell him not to take revenge and it remind me of the taiwan drama the lee's family reunion.

[M3J]

Very plausible that Madara was alive and actually talked to Itachi, looking at the hair. Or he cut his hair and let it regrow for some odd reason, maybe so Itachi can discover who he was and/or for Kisame.

We don't know when Madara died, nor do we know whether Nagato did get Madara's Rin'negan or whether Rin'negan was his, but Tobi did something. Plus, Tobi could have been lying to mindfuck with Konan like he tried with kage/Oonoki. This whole situation is murky in my opinion as it can go many ways. Either Tobi was lying or he was vague, or he really did give Nagato Rin'negan.


And thanks to Tobi saying he's no one, I actually wanna know more about him. Considering he's likely an Uchiha (if Madara didn't tell him about the statue or shrine or whatever), I wanna know what happened to him.

[Murdock]

I can only think of this way:

Shisui had a rough plan to stop the coup d'etat. He probably wanted to use Koto Amatsukami on Fugaku. However just using KA on Fugaku is definitely not enough to stop the coup d'etat. Everyone would know that there is something strange if Fugaku suddenly wants to stop the coup d'etat. Shisuis probably needed some time to come up with a perfect plan. The plan itself would also require a good amount of time, because the process (convincing the Uchihas to stop the coup d'etat via KA on Fugaku, without them noticing) would be long termed.
But considering the pressure of time he had and knowing what kind of a person/shinobi Danzou is, Shisui went to Danzou to inform him about his plan in order to convince Danzou not making any rash actions. Unfortunately Danzou didn't trust Shisui, because he knew that the Uchiha gave him the order to keep an eye on Itachi.

Danzou couldn't let Shisui walk away, so he attacked him and took one of Shisuis eyes. He wanted to take the other eye and kill him, but Shisui escaped.

The problem Shisui had after he escaped Danzou is that he was missing an eye. He couldn't go back to the village/Uchiha base. The Uchihas would realize/think that "Konoha" already made their moves against them. This would immediately lead to the civil war.

So what happened next after Shisuis incident with Danzou is what Itachi showed us in his flashback in this chapter. After their talk Itachi helped Shisui to pretend a suicide. This would buy some time, because we all know that the Uchiha police force investigated Shisuis death. They wanted confirmation whether Shisui really committed suicide or was killed. They (Itachi & Shisui) succeeded in delaying a civil war.

What happened afterwards was already explained/shown.

Still how could Danzou possibly steal an eye from Shisui ... that is BS in my book there was a discussion that it must have been an army to do that but not a single person ... I mean people have hard time to land a hit let alone steal the eye ... It's written such badly that I have hard time dealing with it but that is nothing new with Kishi ... he's been bad storyteller since the beginning so this is just another thing that adds up

[ecoX]

The other thing also is someone put the shrine there. Doubt it was Madara. Seems like if Tobi was Madara or a clone he would still be boosting about his power the whole manga. Also want to see the fan in Madara's hand now.