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Madara knew that Nagato had the rinnegan (he said it after was revived) and nagato was about same age with Itachi so it is possible Madara lived long enough to notice Nagato having Rinnegan and he could have met/train/helped Itachi.... But Tobi said that he was the one who gave nagato the rinnegan so my theory may crack here...Madara on his death ordered Tobi to plant rinnegan to the young Uzumaki ( Nagato was Uzumaki coz of red hair....).
Also about ET Madara I want him to survive coz I wanna some of the good guys die e.t.c. If he is released it would be kinda disappointing for me just like Tobi not being real Madara...BUT if Madara survives the release then it means that he will lose against someone...like Naruto Sasuke Kages Kakashi guy e.t.c...That would be worst scenario.The almighty unstoppable guy lose to waklings.....Yeah all of them together are not weak but they are already exhausted. So I hope Kishi releases Madara....
The chapter was not so good guys....Tobi/Madara could have also explained the Uchiha Massacre close to the end (since he helped Itachi) but no Kishi will have another flashback during that battle..Propably what Madara did between Hashirama battle and his original death + Tobi actions after Madara's death...Or how Madara met Tobi e.t.c.... Flashbacks FTW!!!!..best way to gain time...
P.S Shisui used his sharingan and then Danzo stole it? WTF?!?!?!?!?!?!? Did Danzo have the hashi sells? I mean these bandages :P
http://mangastream.com/read/naruto/26323743/20 epic! in the end,fugaku was still proud of him. but wouldn't it have been easier if the parents had said "okay,rather than dying and being killed by our sons,we choose peace,as hiruzen proposed... and then,all of us against danzo!!!"
Firstly, there was no vote; it was not a democracy. The Hokage instructed Danzou to hold himself back and he disobeyed him.
Secondly, Sarutobi wasn't the ruler. He's a Hokage. The Fire Daimyo is the ruler and picks to Hokage's. If you got a problem with the choice of leadership he's the one you should be talking about.
Thirdly, the Uchiha had the same measure of power as the other clans(which granted is not much). They wanted more (THAT'S inequality). So Konoha tried to placate them with the shinobi police force thing. Which didn't work out (and the not showing up when the Kyuubi attack thing probably didn't make them very popular). Things continued to decline on both sides and the clan was on the cusp of not leaving the village but rather attacking it in an attempt to take control (as Itachi said). That's the situation.
Fourthly, if someone is planning to do something to bring harm to you and those you are charged to protect. Stopping them is the priority. Sometimes you don't have the luxury of ending a threat like that with a hug. If you can great! If not you do what you have to. Even Danzou wasn't trying to harm the Uchihas because they were Uchihas, he did it because of what they were about to do. Honestly, if somebody needs to be blamed there it's Sasuke's dad for getting this ball rollin'.
Last edited by Jammin; June 20, 2012 at 10:27 AM.
That just shows how the Uchiha lost their standing to the Senju, while Konoha built thanks to the agreement between Uchiha/Senju to begin with, it's as Tobi said. I won't say Uchiha are saints, but they clearly are victims of hatred/doubts about them, how Senju were doubting them, how Senju completely seized political power in Konoha, how they were put outside the leadership of Konoha. It was only right for them to reclaim it if you ask me.
Anyway, 2 things still bothering : Why Uchiha disappeared during that night, and also, why did Tobi went to check that stone back at that time... He seems to know a lot about Madara/RS, we know he isn't Madara, but I thought he was a clone/Izuna maybe, but the fact that he needed to check that stone at THAT TIME, is quite troubling...
luckily madara is finished too,so the kages can rest,and next time he will be summoned by tobi. ehy,this means tobi won't die either ! uhm,but that's quite obvious...
The elders talk about how sacrifices need to be made in order to protect the village, but have you ever notice that all they do is sacrifice other people? There's a damn good reason why they managed to live until so old - they never sacrifice themselves and their power when it comes to 'protecting the village'.
If you compare Fugaku's final moment with Danzou's final moment, you would realise who was in it for the power. Fugaku was like, ok so you see things differently, but I still love you for who you are. Danzou was like, nuuuuuuuu!!! the village needed me! you cannot kill me here!!! I was so close to becoming Hokage!!!
I'm sorry, but what the hell the other clans have to do here ? I don't remember Konoha being built by an agreement between Senju, Uchiha and Yamanaka or Akimichi... But Senju and Uchiha only, and whatsmore, the Hokages were completely either Senju or disciples of Senju's, and whatsmore, Uchiha were put in a corner of the village...Quote:
Of course Hiruzen did nothing to Danzou afterward... The Uchiha massacre must not be discovered as a plot from the higher up. People would find it suspicious that suddendly Hiruzen sentences Danzou to death or something. Besides, even if they talked about it, the Hokage couldn't prove it. Even more, if Itachi, the one who accepted such a painful task asked Hiruzen to play along after the massacre, he couldn't refuse to respect his wish.
Besides Dansou is no fool, he certainly had many precious things Konoha needed at the time (spies, intel, efficient group...), you must appear useful enough to not die or to not be in jail even if you did something on the back of the leader.
It doesn't mean that Hiruzen approved it in the end. Danzou was also one of his oldest camarade, and we know that Hiruzen had big trouble to deal with his close people (Orochimaru...). He didn't approved Orochimaru, yet he couldn't deal with him when the time had come.
It was more of a miscalculation on the Uchihas' part not waiting for Itachi and Shisui, since, with Yondaime out of the picture, they were the best Konoha had to offer. Itachi at least, even though he wouldn't be a puppet, and would always favor Konoha over the Uchihas
From being one of the founders of Konoha to being nothing but some clan in the corner of the village with zero power, that's way too much.
Then why are you playing so fast and loose with your interpretation? The “plan”, according to Sarutobi’s own words (he was the Hokage after all) was to negotiate a peace. He was willing to go right down to the wire and wait for the Uchiha to start their uprising before doing anything. There WAS NO PLAN TO KILL EVERYONE except on Danzo’s part.Quote:
This is just where you (and others) have got it all wrong and there’s no nice way to say it. Let's say that you are in a board room meeting with all your fellow board members and you are discussing a new advertising campaign. All of a sudden some guy jumps up and says, "Hey - I think we should kill all of our competitors!" The CEO looks at the guy and says, "Uh - no - I'll come up with a less STUPID strategy..." and drops the topic. Now this guys thinks that killing the competition is the best approach, so he goes off to the head of corporate security and tells him to kill all thier competitors. The guy does what the board member says. It takes a fantastically illogical brain to believe that the CEO (A) approved of the "killing" plan or (B) that the "killing plan" was ever up for serious consideration by anybody except the crazy guy. And yet that's exactly what you guys are saying is going on here. Just because Danzo throws out genocide as an idea doesn't imply Sarutobi ever had any intention to go for it.
Yes he did. He said, “Don’t jump to conclusions. I want to use WORDS, not power against them. I’ll think of a strategy.” He SHOT. IT. DOWN. Period. Full stop. End of story. You could not be more factually incorrect when you say that Sarutobi didn’t shoot down the massacre idea. Just because he didn’t jump out of his seat, frothing at the mouth, and screaming at Danzo doesn’t mean that he accepted the idea of attacking the Uchiha either overtly or implicitly. To say so is a complete mischaracterization of what we have now (finally) seen in the actual manga of what really happened.Quote:
What surprised me the most was the Fugaku and Mikoto seemingly accepted their deaths so easily. I guess they could not harm their son or had no wish to fight him. Or...maybe they realized it would be futile to resist as we know Itachi was already one of top Uchiha fighters around this time, if not the best.
tobirama was a good guy,he promoted the uchiha to avoid someone like madara came again. the uchiha were put in a corner only after the fox's attack,that is after minato's death and under hiruzen's kingdom