One Piece 671 Discussion

[Resgia]

Just one question

for all the guys who support the "heart"-theory. I don't quite understand why the new guy should have Law's heart. For him to have Law's heart, Law should have cut it out himself and give it to the new guy, but for what reason?

[BlackHair]

Law and the mystery guy seem to know each other for a long time. We don't have any information on their past, for instance the guy could have been a mentor of Laws, whom he trusted at one point. There are two obvious scenarios: Law could have given his heart on his own free will, or the guy could have taken his heart by force. Either way, Im going with the heart theory, as it seems the most logical to me. Considering how Law grabbed his heart and went down coughing blood.

Though I didn't write it out yet, I have a (hidden) second thought of him having a blood fruit. Some may remember this from the past Akainu thread, before he was introduced as the magma man. Back then I supported the magma idea (it turned out to be right xD) and was against the blood prediction, as I thought a blood theme would be to dark for OP. But since then Oda cut a giant leg, burned WBs face and put a whole through Ace. So basically the manga can be dark if the situation requires it, as such a blood fruit isn't unthinkable anymore.

Anyway, If I may address a different matter, we have two different opponents for Law, one being Joker (WG conspiracy) and the other being the Yonko in question, whom Law wants to defeat. They might have a connection, but at this point I tend to think there are two different individual issues.

[minimz]

Just one question

for all the guys who support the "heart"-theory. I don't quite understand why the new guy should have Law's heart. For him to have Law's heart, Law should have cut it out himself and give it to the new guy, but for what reason?

I quote myself

Perhaps it's something along the lines of Kuma i.e. PX-0 REFLECTING his "MEZ" attack towards himself, thus cutting his own heart out, before he could do anything about it (perhaps fainting afterwards like Smoker) this mysterious man collected it. In my opinion, Law does not seem the type to offer his own heart, as a pirate, to anyone, particularly if it were the marines.

Another point, if Law didn't know this mysterious guy was here, was he just bluffing Luffy to get his attention so that Luffy will help Law somehow get his heart back?

Blood logia is possible, I mean, it wouldn't be the most overpowered devil fruit out there... For other logias, you'd still die just as fast without haki. An easy way to survive the blood logia would be to jump into seawater where his powers might not work right? :P

Also, in relation to a previous discussion, I don't know whether or not Law was using Luffy's heart but that's not why he fainted because he was holding his neck like he was choking before he fell, not his heart.

[BlackHair]

Since u mentioned Luffy, it seems some ppl are sure that Luffy went down on CCs poison gas, with a delayed effect. I don't think that is true. Luffy didn't even react in any way to his toxis gases, so I don't think that was the case. Since the fight with Magellan, I expect Luffy to be immune against "light" toxic material. After all CCs fruit is gas, not poison. Magellan on the other hand was a poison expert, as such his poison were much more deadlier.

I think right after Luffy grabbed him, CC released sleeping gas to put him asleep. Could have been also KPG drunk gas, which the Yeti used on Zoro, Sanji and Brook. Regardless, could have been any kind of gas which causes unconsciousness or sleep, but poison gas. As I believe Luffy is immune to CCs toxic gas.

[hoeru]

Blood logia is possible, I mean, it wouldn't be the most overpowered devil fruit out there... For other logias, you'd still die just as fast without haki. An easy way to survive the blood logia would be to jump into seawater where his powers might not work right? :P

As you describe the "blood logia" it's contradicting how Oda made up the rules for logia powers: First, it's not part of the natural system which is cause of any desaster people could die from. Gas, Magma, Fire, Gravity, Freezing, Swamp, even Light are. But blood? No.

Secondly, Logia users are able to create and turn their own body into a specific substance and put anything based on that into different shades. They are not able to control the (the anime was wrong with Ace controlling the flames on Banaro to return to his body, as he simply stands within those flames in the manga.) Controlling blood would be a paramecia power - restricted only in controlling blood, and nothing else.

So a "Blood Logia" itself is impossible.

[ukimix]

Since u mentioned Luffy, it seems some ppl are sure that Luffy went down on CCs poison gas, with a delayed effect. I don't think that is true. Luffy didn't even react in any way to his toxis gases, so I don't think that was the case. Since the fight with Magellan, I expect Luffy to be immune against "light" toxic material. After all CCs fruit is gas, not poison. Magellan on the other hand was a poison expert, as such his poison were much more deadlier.

I think right after Luffy grabbed him, CC released sleeping gas to put him asleep. Could have been also KPG drunk gas, which the Yeti used on Zoro, Sanji and Brook. Regardless, could have been any kind of gas which causes unconsciousness or sleep, but poison gas. As I believe Luffy is immune to CCs toxic gas.

I also think that Luffy didnt faint because of some poison gas. I didnt see CC as a dangerous guy, but just a puppet, I tried to think that it was ths new guy with some kind of attack who hit Luffy and cause his faint. So I tried to support those theories about some kind of devise or artifact implanted on Luffy's body by Law, but also implanted on Law's body by someone else (Vegapunk?). So I was thinking on some kind of pulse activated by this new guy and attacking Law and Luffy simultaneously.

But this doesnt seem to be the case since:

• apparently Luffy and Law have different reactions to their respective attacks.
  
• this being the main reason, the title of this chapter is "The gas-gas fruit". Oda wouldnt put that title if that gas-gas fruit doesnt deserve it at all. Some credit must be paid to that fruit. (If it would be a pulse or some other attack coming from this new guy, the chapter wouldn't have that title at all).

So I support your theory: It should be some kind of gas managed by CC (sleeping, co2, ??) that knocked out Luffy.

[jamarTheDem]

What If Simpliy C.C Just Has His Gas In The Buildin As A Defensive System, That Could Be Why Law Collapsed And Also The Gas Was Meant To Kill; Explainin Why He's Bleedin Internally Because Over Time It traveled To His Organs Or Blood. The Man Standin Over Him, And Bird Lady (Name I Forgotten) Took Drugs So It Doesn't Effected Them.
(Just A Guess ^.^)

[mattiaildivino]

I wonder whether oda will show soon the yeti bros and maybe the children too. it'd be cool if they help against that man and CC,imo.

[Schabrak]

If even Trafalgar falls so easily to that man, I somehow doubt those two could have a chance of disturbing the situation. Would rather like to see Monet in action.

[Kaiten]

Just one question

for all the guys who support the "heart"-theory. I don't quite understand why the new guy should have Law's heart. For him to have Law's heart, Law should have cut it out himself and give it to the new guy, but for what reason?

It's not you, the theory is crack. It seems to me to be based on an over literal reading of what was probably meant as a visual clue, intended to demonstrate Law's physical struggle to avoid collapse. Grasping his chest would be a fine indication that Law was losing a battle of wills, trying to find the heart to remain on his feet. It would also save Oda the redundancy of making Law say "I must fight, I must stay on my feet, I must be strong", cliche lines better demonstrated visually.

The theory that Law has lost his heart seems to me to arise from readers hoping for an explanation of two very ambiguous lines Law said earlier in the arc. First, that he and Luffy both "...have things they need to get back", and that he can not defeat CC without the Strawhats help. Based on stealing Smoker's heart earlier in the arc, and clutching his own in chapter 671, some fans are jumping to the conclusion that Law lost his heart and until he gets it back has some weakness that will prevent him from fighting CC himself. Thus the presumption that this mystery character stole his heart, and that Law's collapse is a matter of his heart being manipulated.

[BlackHair]

Kaiten
Certainly Laws gesture could be considered as a metaphor for those cliché lines. However that gestures (grabbing one's heart) only fit a weak character. Law is by no means a weak character. A strong character as him would draw a serious/struggling face, clench a fist or any other gestures fitting a strong character, but not a overdramatic gesture such as grabbing one's heart. Those dramatic gestures only fit the weak, such as supporting character introduced in a arc like Shirahoshi, Caimi, Lola .. etc.

Regardless, there is at this point no better theory than the heart one. Since the man as a whole is still a mystery.

[Kaiten]

Grabbing ones heart could fit any character, it is not a sign of weakness, it's a sign of physical strain. Law was left laying on the ground immobilized, of course grabbing his heart as he fell was an appropriate visual clue, and certainly none to extreme. Why must Law's power level even be of issue anyway? The implication I took away from this meeting was that his attacker was someone of incomparable power, capable of easily felling a character of Law's caliber.

Luffy was also knocked out last week, after clutching his head. Maybe CC stole his brain. Or maybe Law stole it after Marineford, then he gave it to CC off screen after learning Luffy had arrived on Punk Hazard. That would explain why Luffy can be so dumb, he was actually without a brain this entire time

No, the stolen heart theory wreaks of crack to me. I can not imagine Law stealing Smoker's heart only for it to be revealed that the exact same thing happened to him in his youth, and that the thief should conveniently turn up at Punk Hazard. To obtuse a plot twist for One Piece, that does not seem like Oda's writing style. That would also require a different character to have the same power as Law, or a different power capable of producing the same results. Again, that is something Oda has never done before.

I still think the most likely answer is that this character is a very high level haki wielder, using conqueror's haki against Law. All we need is a character with haki strong enough to knock Law to the ground. They do not even need to be strong enough to knock him unconscious, just to immobilize him. Right or wrong it makes a lot more sense than making Law a victim of his own power, and the same attack used against Law not ten chapters ago.

I do not expect that Law's reaction to this attack will explain what he wants to get back or why he can not fight Caesar.

[Curtarc]

I don't have a formed opinion on this heart theory yet, but I suppose it's plausible...a bit weird, but plausible. I mean, we have already seen crazier things in the manga already, this wouldn't suprise me that much but I'll wait and see. This crazy/absurd feel in One Piece is also part of what made me get so hooked on it.

[ukimix]

Kaiten: Bad reasoning. Imagine this scene:

New guy to Law: Now dear Law, use your ope ope no mi power on your self and give your heart. I will keep it safe, only to be sure that you will do what I told you to do

In this plot, the new guy has a different power than Law’s one, but the results of their past fight are very similar than what we have if a SuperLaw would attacked Law.

Now, to my standards it would be a very nice plot: the story of a character that was forced to use his power on himself (…for loyalty, for love… ????)

Regardless, there is at this point no better theory than the heart one. Since the man as a whole is still a mystery.

Don’t forget that there is a third theory about how this new guy defeated Law, different than (i) the guy has an extraordinary haki, and (ii) the guy has Law’s heart on his hands:

(iii) The new guy has an extraordinary DF power

[Kaiten]

Did you really just call my reasoning bad

By your logic this character threatened Law as a child, forced him to use his devil fruit power to remove his own heart, and then let's him leave, not seeing him again for years. Despite having total control of Law, he never used it, allowing him to come and go as he please with no consequences.