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Thread: The 5 War Potentials

  1. #331
    Registered User 英雄メンバー / Eiyuu Menbaa / Hero Member devstauk's Avatar
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    Re: The 5 War Potentials

    Quote Originally Posted by kkck View Post
    The hax ability you mention is aizen's ability though, aizen can be as strong as the ability allows him to. And even then, even without the ability the guy has crushed with reiatsu alone captain level techniques and captain class enemies alike. Did he use his ability to win rather easily over the captains? True, but that is 100% his strength. Did he used psycological tactics? true, but that is also his strength. If anything its the captains who are at fault considering that after the momo bit the guy did not even use his ability to attack from the back but rather simply shunpoed in from the front and take them down.

    I would think that if ichigo had seen anything weird he would have acted or said something earlier overall. Why act just when momo gets attack? Whatever ichigo was seeing earlier was simply not suspicious enough for ichigo to interfere, its that simple. At leasts its a better and simpler explanation than ichigo being struck with grief (which makes no sense at that point). Aizen foderized the G13 captains overall, whether you believe he did so legitimately or not is a different matter altogether.

    Dude your a mod you should know better this is getting off topic and needs to stop.

    But i will put this to you everyone in that fight was using shikai, not one of the captains was on equal footings with Aizen in terms of exhaustion, not one of the captains kept their composure, Aizen on the other hand stated that he was using his Ks from the beginning (100 years prior i might add). But if anyone actually knows about how fights are won and lost they would be agreeing with me, fact is it doesn't matter if Aizen used his KS or not he was not fighting any one of the captains on equal footings. Aizen showed no great feat in beating any of the captains that were not mind full of what was going on but was engaging him with pure rage. The only thing that can win with pure rage is the hulk.

    Quote Quote:
    would think that if ichigo had seen anything weird he would have acted or said something earlier overall. Why act just when momo gets attack? Whatever ichigo was seeing earlier was simply not suspicious enough for ichigo to interfere, its that simple. At leasts its a better and simpler explanation than ichigo being struck with grief (which makes no sense at that point). Aizen foderized the G13 captains overall, whether you believe he did so legitimately or not is a different matter altogether.
    Right so okay we know 100% Ichigo was not under the KS ablility, so that would mean that he saw the reality of what was happening from start to finish, how that wouldn't make him struck with grief is beyond me, for a start Ichigo was only told by Unohana about what Aizen's ability could do just moments before this happened (take that into consideration before judging what i said) now think about seeing it in action for the very 1st time and how it would make you feel seeing all these captains bombarding someone like momo you'd be mortified dumb founded and quite literally speechless, then we take a look at the final stabbing just as ichigo says something he didnt say 'Thats not aizen' he said, 'what the hell, are you guys doing' now that alone makes me think okay he's seeing everything but can not figure out why they are attacking someone else until it is too late. So how that makes no sense is beyond me and your logic on that is a flawed one
    Spoiler show

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  3. #332
    Registered User 有名人 / Yuumeijin / Celebrity jaymizzo's Avatar
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    Re: The 5 War Potentials

    Quote Originally Posted by Zehahaha View Post
    He did fodderize G13 minus Yamamoto using only his Shikai... He did fodderize Komamura/Lisa/Love/Rose easily too, Kubo pretty much showed us the superiority of Aizen, the only man who could be able to defeat him would be Yamamoto, period.
    He did not fodderize the G13 by raw strength. He had to trick them years and years before that. Its not like he just woke up one day from Hueco mundo and destroyed the G13.

    I very much doubt Aizen would be able to accomplish the same feat ever had he started with a fresh Shikai i.e. Not having the whole Gotei under KS. So again, No, he did not fodderize the G13.

    ---------- Post added at 07:29 AM ---------- Previous post was at 07:24 AM ----------

    Quote Originally Posted by kkck View Post
    The hax ability you mention is aizen's ability though, aizen can be as strong as the ability allows him to.
    That is true but at the same time you need to realize that Aizen did not engage anyone and show them his Shikai, he had to trick them years and years before that. Basically, any Shinigami who did not have such raw power would not have been able to fight against Aizen, regardless of how powerful they actually are.

    Fodderizing is not at all a word to use, he tricked them but in no way did he fodderize them. He did not go at them fresh and use his abilities, he already had them fooled and could have changed theyre perception at any point, which is a bit unfair concidering his ability was never released during combat.
    "Man hands misery onto man" - Philip Larkin

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  5. #333
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    Re: The 5 War Potentials

    Wonderfully said devstauk & jaymizzo. There is one thing I have been saying for sometime now & that is that victory in battle isn't determine by whom is necessarily the strongest, rather victory is established through timing & chance. Aizen is a predominant example of this thing I'm talking about. Throughout he had utilised timing & chance to proceed with his plans.

    It's because of timing & chance Shunshi took down his foe, Starrk.

    It's because of timing & chance Gin embarrassed Aizen regardless of the gap in power & would have permanently killed Aizen if not for his immortality status.

    .Aizen wasn't the fastest gotei 13 member, Soifon has him beat.
    .He wasn't the physically strongest gotei 13 member, Yamamoto has him beat.
    .He wasn't the best at Kido, Tessei & Hachigen has him beat
    .He wasn't the best in hand to hand, Yoruichi & Soifon has him beat

    BUT he is a well rounded intellectually skilled planner who in the end defeated many of the individuals above.

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  7. #334
    Registered User 英雄メンバー / Eiyuu Menbaa / Hero Member Quantized's Avatar
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    Re: The 5 War Potentials

    1. Ichigo
    2. Uryuu
    3. Aizen
    4. Zaraki (The only confirmed of the 5 war potentials).
    5. Unknown (Too many possibilities left).

    In that order. Ichigo is obvious, Uryuu too I think, due that he seems like a trumph card.
    Also Ichigo vs. Uryuu would be pretty darn epic, espcially considering Uryuu most likely is a 100% good guy, for whatever reason he is with the Wandenreich.

    Aizen, still really nasty, all he needs to do is release his sword infront of the enemy, and he's powerful enough to last long enough against most of the strongest fighters.
    Would have to be far stronger and faster than Aizen to be able to win against him in my opinion, and few are cable of that.
    Also Ichigo wacked Aizen's kiddou, he would likely also wack Aizen's zanpaktou ability, similar to how Soi Fon wasn't able to use her ability against Aizen, because of his sheer reatsu difference.
    Telling a captain she can't kill him because of reatsu difference seems legit, a captain would know if it's true or not, so it wasn't just an illusion trick.
    Whether Aizen had reatsu enough as a pure Shinigami to negate Soi Fon's abilities is questionable, however, there is a big BUT, it doesn't change what Aizen said to likely be true.

    Zaraki because he's pretty much confimed as one of the 5 war potentials, also we simply dont know just how powerful he'll become with a zanpaktou teamwork.

    Zaraki confirmed to be on the list.
    Aizen and Ichigo are almost dead certain to be on it.
    Uryuu the hardest to prove, but I'd be pretty surprised if Uryuu does not make it on the list, it screams of foreshadowing that he'll be a insanely powerful Quincy.

  8. #335
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    Re: The 5 War Potentials

    Quantized
    Well, Ichigo was first to be confirmed as a War Potential. Only after him it was confirmed that Ken-chan was the one as well.

    To everyone
    About Aizen... Well, I don't think he was using KS all the time during his fight against Captains in FKT. Actually most of the time he didn't use it. It was only confirmed, when he changed himself with Hinamori, since it was the only time Ichigo was surprised on what Captains were doing. All the other time, it seems that Aizen was actually using just his basic skills to take down Captains.

  9. #336
    Registered User 英雄メンバー / Eiyuu Menbaa / Hero Member SoulAuron's Avatar
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    Re: The 5 War Potentials

    Quote Originally Posted by Jorge D. Dragon View Post
    Quantized
    Well, Ichigo was first to be confirmed as a War Potential. Only after him it was confirmed that Ken-chan was the one as well.

    To everyone
    About Aizen... Well, I don't think he was using KS all the time during his fight against Captains in FKT. Actually most of the time he didn't use it. It was only confirmed, when he changed himself with Hinamori, since it was the only time Ichigo was surprised on what Captains were doing. All the other time, it seems that Aizen was actually using just his basic skills to take down Captains.
    exept that aizen said himself that he had been using it all along, one of the most badass quotes in bleach is him saying it.
    heres what i think is the explanation to BB having multiple DF:
    http://mangahelpers.com/forum/showth...t=#post3373390

  10. #337
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    Re: The 5 War Potentials

    Quote Originally Posted by SoulAuron View Post
    exept that aizen said himself that he had been using it all along, one of the most badass quotes in bleach is him saying it.
    He was using it all along, but he took advantage of it just in that moment, when he switched with Hinamori. And yes, this quote is the most badass quote from Bleach, except for Ichigo's speech at the end of Deicide arc. ;d

  11. #338
    MangaHelper 伝説メンバー / Densetsu / Legendary Member kkck's Avatar
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    Re: The 5 War Potentials

    I think there is some ambiguity in regards as to when aizen can or cannot use his sword overall. As far as we know his illusion is activated basically at all times. I get the impression that hirako and co expected aizen to actually release his sword of give some sort of indication that he was about to use an illusion but in turn what we saw was that aizen used the illusion without so much of a hint they could notice. Aizen did not need to activate the illusion, he could use it freely at all times. In the end most of what we saw should be pretty real considering the damage the shinigami took was real. I don't think the illusion would actually overpower consecutive captains on its own, aizen had to deal that damage himself.

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  13. #339
    Registered User 英雄メンバー / Eiyuu Menbaa / Hero Member devstauk's Avatar
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    Re: The 5 War Potentials




    ____________________________________________________

    Could the Aizen talk, remain in the Aizen thread...... Thank you
    Spoiler show

  14. #340
    Registered User 英雄メンバー / Eiyuu Menbaa / Hero Member SoulAuron's Avatar
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    Re: The 5 War Potentials

    Quote Originally Posted by kkck View Post
    I think there is some ambiguity in regards as to when aizen can or cannot use his sword overall. As far as we know his illusion is activated basically at all times. I get the impression that hirako and co expected aizen to actually release his sword of give some sort of indication that he was about to use an illusion but in turn what we saw was that aizen used the illusion without so much of a hint they could notice. Aizen did not need to activate the illusion, he could use it freely at all times. In the end most of what we saw should be pretty real considering the damage the shinigami took was real. I don't think the illusion would actually overpower consecutive captains on its own, aizen had to deal that damage himself.
    that is easyly understood by going back to when aizen explained his ability, he said he needed to activate it, but he never said there was a time limit, so it is reasonable to think that he had activated it before the battle even began and used it since then, as for the damage part, yes, you are probably right, but if we think of how his ability works he could very well trick the captains into KOing each other, that is almost the whole pourpouse of his zan alright.

    ---------- Post added at 10:57 AM ---------- Previous post was at 10:54 AM ----------

    Quote Originally Posted by Duniak View Post
    He was using it all along, but he took advantage of it just in that moment, when he switched with Hinamori. And yes, this quote is the most badass quote from Bleach, except for Ichigo's speech at the end of Deicide arc. ;d
    that was probably the turning point, but we dont know wether he only took advantage at that moment, he probably manipulated peoples senses so that they didnt notice important things that allowed him to do as he pleased, any way he was using the ilusion and ichigo never said what did he see, so what was real and what was not is something we cant say for sure yet.
    heres what i think is the explanation to BB having multiple DF:
    http://mangahelpers.com/forum/showth...t=#post3373390

  15. #341
    MangaHelper 伝説メンバー / Densetsu / Legendary Member Hakuteiken's Avatar
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    Re: The 5 War Potentials

    At the moment, I don't think sheer strength is the determining aspect of a war potential. I'd assume Bach is after people who might be on his side at the end of the day in some way. I consider his speech to Captain-Commander as nothing but trash talk, since no matter how weakened he was, Captain-Commander was far beyond what Kenpachi could be in terms of strength.

    Still, it's interesting that Kenpachi's enormous potential was a known fact. I thought only Central 46 and few of the fellow captains knew about this. Maybe one of them has assisted Bach or another Quincy to provide that data. The innate power of his is much more difficult to simply report compared to a Bankai power.

    Quote Originally Posted by devstauk View Post
    Could the Aizen talk remain in the Aizen thread...... Thank you
    Well, indeed, Aizen talk might be going over the border here and there.
    At least KS talk might warrant a different thread to be kept going, since the OP sets a different perspective about the war potentials in general, not detailed for each person.
    So, please be more considerate of this fact while moving the discussion forward.

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  17. #342
    Registered User 英雄メンバー / Eiyuu Menbaa / Hero Member NoOneInParticular's Avatar
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    Re: The 5 War Potentials

    Since Uryu hasn't actually been referred to as a SWP, I'm assuming he isn't one. In that case, the one thing the known SWPs have in common is that they aren't Quincy. That doesn't really narrow it down much, except to strike Ryuken off the list. But so far we have 3 Shinigami who are above Captain-class or at least have the potential to be. The only others I can think of who belong on such a list are the Royal Guard, but there are 5 of them and I'm of the opinion that Yhwach intends to crush them, possibly using his 5 SWPs once he's gathered them.

    There might be Isshin, but I don't think there's any evidence to suggest he's much stronger than any other Captain - his performance against Aizen gets too much credit imo. Harribel might have been one, though I don't really believe that. It depends on what Yhwach is actually doing with her right now. He must have some reason for not outright killing her. If she is one, Grimmjow might well be one too. Although again, I don't believe that to be true.

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    Re: The 5 War Potentials

    What about Yuruichi? We never saw what she can do with a sword (except flashbacks where she had one). And do not forget she was fighting Aizen without even Shikai ! Urahara is a wild card too.

  19. #344
    Registered User 初心者/ Shoshinsha / Beginner lyght's Avatar
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    Re: The 5 War Potentials

    Quote Originally Posted by NoOneInParticular View Post
    Since Uryu hasn't actually been referred to as a SWP, I'm assuming he isn't one. In that case, the one thing the known SWPs have in common is that they aren't Quincy. That doesn't really narrow it down much, except to strike Ryuken off the list. But so far we have 3 Shinigami who are above Captain-class or at least have the potential to be. The only others I can think of who belong on such a list are the Royal Guard, but there are 5 of them and I'm of the opinion that Yhwach intends to crush them, possibly using his 5 SWPs once he's gathered them.

    There might be Isshin, but I don't think there's any evidence to suggest he's much stronger than any other Captain - his performance against Aizen gets too much credit imo. Harribel might have been one, though I don't really believe that. It depends on what Yhwach is actually doing with her right now. He must have some reason for not outright killing her. If she is one, Grimmjow might well be one too. Although again, I don't believe that to be true.
    ichigo is a quincy and aizen isnt a shinigami any more so...
    i think uuryu can be one and the other might be urahara

  20. #345
    Registered User 中級員 / Chuukyuuin / Member Tempest Phoenix's Avatar
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    Re: The 5 War Potentials

    Before I start, I'm just going to say I've not read the entirety of this thread and I really just skimmed what I did.

    Frst thing I want to say is I don't think Orihime or Urahara are SWPs at all, purely because they weren't mentioned along with Ichigo when Yhwach was informed of the situation in Hueco Mundo. You'd think they would have been mentioned as well if they were graced with this "title" and the Quincy would have had a field day knowing more than half of their SWPs are distracted at the same time. This is more focused on Orihime, though, since iirc Urahara hid himself for a greater part of the battle but even then Opie went to attack him and didn't give any indication that he was special to the Vandenreich.

    I'm going to go with the idea that any normal Shinigami is out of the question when it comes to being a SWP. Ichigo can't have his Bankai stolen and Zaraki's strength compensates for all of his shortcomings, and with every other captain being vulnerable to having their greatest weapon taken I doubt the Vandenreich would think much of them. I only have 2 candidates who I think could be SWPs and a few of them are a little out there but it's merely speculation:

    1. Shukuro Tsukishima - Just think about how deadly his ability is. If he hadn't been so overconfident he would have been able to defeat Byakuya without getting so much as a scratch, but the fact that he was under the impression that his ability makes him untouchable caused him to lose at a crucial moment. As we have no reason to assume he lost this ability in death, and the Vandenreich most likely being aware that he would be sent to Soul Society after death, he seems like a worthy candidate to me. The Quincy are loyal to Yhwach to the point where the jumped into to attack an enemy they knew to be the most powerful captain in the Gotei 13 without hesitation. If Tsukishima could manipulate their memories so they think he is their king he could kill pretty much any of the Quincy without effort since they wouldn't be likely to attack their leader.

    2. - Kukaku Shiba - As well as her intelligence, she also lacks the weakness of having Bankai as her greatest asset as is already strong with her proficiency is Kido and physical strength. Although my reasoning goes a bit deeper than that. If the theory that Yhwach wants to bring the 5 SWPs together to attack the Royal Guard/Soul King then she would be a key factor in this. If that is his goal then he would need to have some way to get there and the Tenchuran would be the best choice. But if attacking the Soul King isn't part of Yhwach's plan, although I don't see why it wouldn't be since he will have to do that at some point, then I doubt she'd be considered special by him.

    As for the last, or maybe more, I think it'll be a character we haven't seen yet since I doubt we'll be familiar with all the SWPs.

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