Battle of the Logias

[Ero-Sanji]

Wait a minute is this a battle between the actual logias or the people wielding them?
If so, then BB is more than enough, he has two fruits for gods sake and they might be the strongest of their respective domain. Among the admirals it was pretty clear that Akainu was the strongest of the three, not only was he in the middle in the introduction, he also faced the strongest of the invaders, WB, while Aokiji and Kizaru initially had problems against Jozu and Marco. On top of that Marco and Vista(?) couldn't even stop the tank that is Akainu. Aokiji was also on par with Ace, fruit-wise, we don't know how that fight would have ended though, but Akainu finished him with ease.

There's also this hierarchy of the logias that we have to take notice of, while Ace and Aokiji's fruits were portrayed as equal, Akainu's smashed them both. Which further puts him at the top. We still don't know how the light and darkness fruit will react against each other, but it still wouldn't be a fair fight since BB has two fruits and his strange body.

Also, the reason why I haven't even mentioned the rest is because it's pretty clear, Enel has potential but he's to weak overall against the others, he's been living in thoughts that he's a god of course he doesn't evolve, strength wise. CC should however be the strongest of the rest which are Ace, Smoker, Caribou and the Croc. I mean he's in control over everything that is in gas form, meaning that Ace and Smoker are both in great danger when facing him. I do think that Aokiji's fruit is above his since cold makes gas liquid meaning that he might be able to negate his powers. Anyway, it's unfair and rather confusing writing down Ace and Smoker when it's actually Fire and Gas, that's why I don't really get the topic...

[Impossibility]

One thing I have been wondering about for a bit is how a smoker vs ceasar fight would turn out. Smoker is a smoke logia which makes him a gas. In turn ceasar seems to be able to control gas through his fruit. Would this mean ceasar would have an advantage over smoker? Or perhaps smoker being solely smoker would have superior control over that? It seems like it could go either way.

It would depend. Smoke is not just gas, it is an aerosol; essentially a mixture of airborne solids and liquids in gas. The solid and liquid to gas ratio is variable, the composition of smoke depends on the source burning and the conditions of the combustion. So it would come down to the extent of CC's control over the gas. Would the concentration or composition of particulates suspended in the gas affect his ability to alter it? If it does, Smoker would likely be able to exert more control over his own form without much problem. Or it may simply be the fact that Smoker's control over the entire suspension is absolute. I've never thought much about Smoker's ability, but now I wonder to what extent the Smoke DF allows for control over the composition of the smoke formed by Smoker. Is it reliant upon his surroundings, or is he able to make any type of smoke regardless of its composition? If it is the latter, Smoker would essentially be capable of control, manipulation, and transformation of gases, solids, and liquids, at least within his own smoke. That would provide versatility on a level that would even exceed CC's. Or there is also the possibility that the smoke has the same composition every single time Smoker changes. So I guess any match-up between CC and Smoker would depend on the extent of Smoker's ability. And now that I've bothered to think about him, I'm not sure.

[jamarTheDem]

I too think CC is overrated here... i mean, come on... The admirals would crush him in a few seconds. With or without df-powers. Even without oxygen, or poisoned, a few seconds would be enough.
Despite that, they are smart enough and probably knowledgeable enough, to not toy around with a gasgas user, so they wont end up like luffy did. (And we all know, that in the end...CC will be defeated in this arc)

Even though it was stated by oda, that enel would have had a VERY high bounty (cant recall correctly... it was something far above 300mio i guess) if WG knew about him, i dont think that he would stand a chance.
Yet, to some extend, we shouldnt let ourselfs fool us, just because pretimeskip luffy beat him. Theres no linear growth in power, just because of the bounty´s back then. Crodocile has been proven far stronger than everyone imagined, since luffy beat him back then.
Luffy beat both of those, because he could benefit from their elemental weaknesses.
lightning vs rubber and sand vs water. In case of enel... the arguments are still legit, he lacks the haki and physical prowess.

To sum up, imho, it would come down to the Admirals vs Blackbeard.

(If oda REALLY wants to get more into the "elemental-weakness"debate of warfare, than i´d say that aokij is stronger than akainu... We´ve seen strong guys taken out easily, just because of that elemental weakness, yet the fight between those two lasted several days)

we can't go by bounties cause Ace bounty was 550 beri and lots of people still saying he's not one of the 3 strongest

[kkck]

I dont think ace's bounty has ever been revealed lol.

[hoeru]

Ace's bounty has been revealed in the One Piece Exhibit as 550,000,000 ฿ and was confirmed in the current Jump that contained the special booklet "Dive to Grand World" for more than a million legal readers. The bounty comes directly from Oda who said, he wanted to bring it up in the manga first, but then decided to give the exhibit something special.

I think the battles would be decided on the intent to kill anyways. And Akainu as the representative of thorough justice (as interpretation of the Absolute Justice policy of the Marine) carries the largest intent to kill everyone standing in his way.

[Mr. Arashi]

Cheering Mr. Sakazuki -Akainu-!

Enel has the most adapting fruit in the manga, and Aokiji has the broken ability ever. But certainly Magu its made to wound everyone and spreading heat itself to melt the surroundings. It allow go underground, making meteorites, throwing magma punches and sweat lava. Distance is nothing to Akainu when is time to justice. More over, Busoshoku Haki to repel and attack users.

It doesn't has natural enemies this ferocious dog.

[kkck]

Well, I would argue that the one with the most convenient fruit is kizaru here. His fruit is simply light therefore it has limited negative and possitive interactions with other fruits here. Potentially he can take advantage of aokiji's ice though to use as if they were mirrors though. In considering what we have seen of the lasers he should be hotter than either ace or akainu. And even on his own he has the advantage of being able to move at the speed of light. rangewise I would argue kizaru has an advantage too. Even if kizaru is not the strongest of the admirals he has the advantage that akainu would have an advantage against ice while at the same time aokiji would limit the heat from akainu's attacks. Taking this into consideration it is entirely possible that kizaru having a fruit which is in the end not affected by anyone here would be key to his victory.

[Zehahaha]

Well, I would argue that the one with the most convenient fruit is kizaru here. His fruit is simply light therefore it has limited negative and possitive interactions with other fruits here. Potentially he can take advantage of aokiji's ice though to use as if they were mirrors though. In considering what we have seen of the lasers he should be hotter than either ace or akainu. And even on his own he has the advantage of being able to move at the speed of light. rangewise I would argue kizaru has an advantage too. Even if kizaru is not the strongest of the admirals he has the advantage that akainu would have an advantage against ice while at the same time aokiji would limit the heat from akainu's attacks. Taking this into consideration it is entirely possible that kizaru having a fruit which is in the end not affected by anyone here would be key to his victory.

Don't forget Magma > Fire thing, that was one helluva asspull and still doesn't make sense, so to say that he has limited negative interaction with other fruits is farfetched... Oda can say " Ice is superior to Light " or " Rubber superior to light ", you get what I'm saying

[BlackHair]

Don't forget Magma > Fire thing, that was one helluva asspull and still doesn't make sense [..]

Actually I think it does. At that time a few translations stated "Magma is hotter than fire", which was wrong. The correct translation should be "magma consumes fire". Which on the other hand, does make somewhat sense. After all fire is gaseous element, while magma is melted rock. Now without any specific knowledge in this matter, I could imagine magma absorbing fire and making it its own.

Back in the day, I assumed it was Akainu's haki which overpowered Ace's fire, since the given "magma is hotter" explanation didn't make sense. But now the consume part does. I don't know how the real world physics work on this matter, but it does make sense to me.

[kkck]

Not sure I get how the consume part would make more sense. I mean, how would magma make fire its own? It's not like magma necessarily has fire on it...

My original ideas on the matter were two. First is that haki allowed physical contact with ace's body which in turn allowed akainu to burn it since he was hotter. Haki does not make you stop being your element so ace would still be fire even if haki came into play. Still, since haki would allow contact with ace's body then if it is hotter than it then it should be able to burn it. Kinda confusing but that is the gist of what the manga has shown. My other idea was that since magma is pretty hot it consumes air faster than fire (it also should give off a number of other stuff) hence why ace would be forced solid(fire needs air to burn) and burned by magma.

---------- Post added at 01:48 PM ---------- Previous post was at 01:41 PM ----------

Don't forget Magma > Fire thing, that was one helluva asspull and still doesn't make sense, so to say that he has limited negative interaction with other fruits is farfetched... Oda can say " Ice is superior to Light " or " Rubber superior to light ", you get what I'm saying

Well, even if there is an asspull to some extent (I do kinda maintain that at some point the manga will elaborate more into what happened there) however I would argue to us readers a relation between the fruits would seem evident. Right now there is no particular reason for us to think light would be particularly limited here right? At least ace and akainu had a temperature thing going on, there was an affinity to begin with (they both burn you). In turn it does not seem like there is any affinity between kizaru and anyone else. well, I have thought of a few scenarios but none of them are exceptionally bad for kizaru. One would be kizaru using the ice to reflect himself around. This would even be an advantage for him. I guess aokiji could also use this to avoid attacks from kizaru to some degree but even then it would not be overwhelmingly bad if every attack aokiji uses results in kizaru gaining mobility. Not sure if kizaru would have a weakness for things which block light though. If this is the case then kizaru would have some trouble although it would hardly help considering smoker is not overwhelmingly strong in this particular fight.

[BlackHair]

Well both are heat elements. Lava with its liquid mass can suck up fire's heat and make it it's own. Which would lead to fire dissolving, after all it is just gaseous. At least that is the image I had as I read cnet's translation, and it made click in my head. Just to be clear again, I have no proper knowledge in this matter.

[kkck]

Well, for lava to take up energy given off as heat from fire it would have to necessarily be colder than fire. Well, I can't say I am all to familiar with OP thermodynamics but as far as the real world in concerned you can't low amounts of energy moving towards higher amounts of energy. In principle you always have heat moving towards where there is less of it.

[Impossibility]

Well both are heat elements. Lava with its liquid mass can suck up fire's heat and make it it's own. Which would lead to fire dissolving, after all it is just gaseous. At least that is the image I had as I read cnet's translation, and it made click in my head. Just to be clear again, I have no proper knowledge in this matter.

Lava being 'superior' to fire has no real world basis. Fire is just a chemical process with heat and light being some of what is released. The only ways to counter fire are to remove the fuel source, use some sort of retardant, smother it, or remove the heat from the fire faster than it is being produced. Lava doesn't do any of these things; it's just molten rock.

[GomuGomu_Getsuga]

Enel could defeat a good bit of these guys if he land any blows. Don't forget he knows the Observation Haki and his power is a one shot kill as far as I've seen. I see BlackBeard taking it all.


Edit
1st- BlackBeard
2nd - Akainu
3rd - Aokiji/Kizaru
4th - Crocodile(Haki)
5th - Smoker
6th - Ceasar Clown
7th - Ace
8th - Enel
9th - That swamp dude...why is he in the list?

I didn't realize Ceasar didn't have Haki. Since he doesn't then that means he should be lower. The same goes for Enel. I have a hard time placing Smoker above Croc. I'll say he'd win a fight, if and only if he has haki. Without haki I would have him tie with Enel.

[kkck]

Because so far it seems caribou is a logia. I do believe you are underestimating smoker. Enel only has observation haki meaning that any form of physical attack he tries will be largely ineffective. More so, he has no haki of his own to defend from the attacks of the haki users here. I don't think observation haki alone would do the trick here. Ceasar is in an even worst situation, he has no haki whatsoever. I would place smoker after kizaru/aokiji in that list. Crocodile as we last saw him has no business fighting smoker for that matter. I do think ceasar would have an edge over crocodile. Neither could harm each other but as long as ceasar can control air there is always that option. Actually, I don't think ceasar would have such an easy time with smoker's tornadoes so perhaps there is that. Although if he does control air then perhaps he would be able to stop them to some degree.