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View Poll Results: Who wins?

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  • Team JMan

    8 88.89%
  • Team Orochimaru

    1 11.11%
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Thread: Team JMan vs Team Orochimaru

  1. #31
    MH Senpai 有名人 / Yuumeijin / Celebrity Uchiha_Blood's Avatar
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    Re: Team JMan vs Team Orochimaru

    Quote Originally Posted by Silvers Rayleigh View Post
    Sorry, team oro is been reduced to all most nothing

    Uchiha_Blood, bro am not taking any side's in you guy's discussion but DAMN
    at least read what the dude is trying to tell you. Looks like your just ignoring every facts he brings up, funny is that is right on this one. why you cant see that i don't know

    now please entertain me guys!!!!
    If he contradicts manga logic I will call him on that, I'm afraid.

    Quote Originally Posted by chilibun View Post
    Er... except this is exactly what Silvers Rayleigh is talking about. xXan NEVER said that Sasuke is equal to Raikage's speed. He said he could keep up with his speed as in react and defend/counter accordingly. You don't need to have equal speeds to do those things. Just enough of it, which Sasuke clearly showed he had. Raikage is also referring to Minato's ability to cross distances with Hiraishin, and clearly he is faster at that. Nobody is disputing that, but Raikage will crush Minato's physical speed with ease. Minato has done nothing impressive with his conventional speed.
    I'll quote a part of one of my previous posts

    Quote Originally Posted by Uchiha_Blood View Post
    No, no they haven't.
    We saw with Deidara Sasuke's speed, he traveled with a shunshin for, like, 5 meters? And still was dodged.
    With a shunshin, in a second, Yondaime traveled from here to there, as showed here.

    So no, Sasuke doesn't have Yondaime's speed.
    Not even close
    I'll try to make it short xXan, you made a post of epic proportions lol

    Quote Originally Posted by xXan View Post
    @Uchiha_Blood

    I don't need to present any scans of anything. The only way any of the links you presented would be instant is if Minato teleports with the kunai or whatever other attack already inside the target, like materialize the kunai, rasengan and whatever else inside the target enemy.
    Now considering that does not happen LIKE in any panel we have with him Minato teleporting even with his kunai on the enemy chest would still imply that Minato needs to trust it inside the target's flesh. Minato DOES NOT teleport other object inside other objects like merging them. He NEVER displayed that ability.
    This is what Minato does, it is broken down into panels here:
    http://www.narutobase.net/manga/Naruto/542/15
    Pops next to the target (the range of the Kunai or whatever to his target is not always the same obviously, he can teleport closer to the target) and then he SWINGS. Seriously he can cut that tentacle in half but with your Tobi example NOTHING happen to him... Not even blood showing.

    I can see the above is to hard for you to understand but if you can't... Show me Minato teleporting an object inside another as that is the only way he does not need to swing or trust or whatever else to pierce his target... That would be the only way the attack is instant.

    We saw with Deidara Sasuke's speed, he traveled with a shunshin for, like, 5 meters? And still was dodged.

    Is this what you where refering to?
    http://www.narutobase.net/manga/Naruto/357/8

    Well he did NOT whant to kill him lol. He was there to take him ALIVE. He missed him on purpuse. Sasuke himself states how he wants to ask him questions:
    http://www.narutobase.net/manga/Naruto/357/9
    You don't kill him and then ask questions lol (yes cutting him in half would kill him...).
    So let's see, to fast:
    http://www.narutobase.net/manga/Naruto/357/8
    http://www.narutobase.net/manga/Naruto/357/10
    (yes Tobi was exagerating but still)
    http://www.narutobase.net/manga/Naruto/357/15

    Sasuke poping behind him:
    http://www.narutobase.net/manga/Naruto/357/13
    Then as i provided the link above he states Sasuke is to fast:
    http://www.narutobase.net/manga/Naruto/357/15
    Then Deidara whent for the sky.
    You don't, yet I have to? Double standards much?
    Also that example you made is fine and all, but it has a single, fundamental flaw:
    when Yondaime teleported to Raikage, he teleported in mid-air, since the kunai was in mid-air, meaning it wasn't on Raikage's body or anything, meaning that, if Raikage was marked, Yondaime would've just do what he did to Tobi.
    If he teleports in the same way to and fro, then why oh why he always have a different position when he uses Hiraishin? How, if it isn't instantaneous, can he pass from being squatted without doing a thing to swinging his kunai?

    Also lol at Sasuke and Deidara example, so apparently Sasuke is fast why?
    Because Deidara said so, despite dodging every attack?
    And yet Yondaime isn't faster despite doing a faster shunshin for, like, thrice the distance and having the fastest guy in the world say that he was slower than him.
    Cute

    Quote Quote:
    Never said he has the same speed, like in moving from a to b. That is something you aparently can't grasp and i told you that a LOT of times. Sasuke has comparable speed... He is not that far from Minato from EVRYTHING we got to see from him... Now if you add to the equation his sharingan (ability to predict the future) he will have 0 problems keeping up with Minato's speed (outside of ST behin him or some other crep).

    You do understand that Sasuke whent from close to a statue vs Naruto in part 1 (just some kyuubi chakra) to dodging Naruto 100% of the time... And that was just the diference from 2 tomoe to 3 tomoe.

    In essence Sasuke does not need Minato's running speed to keep up with him in a fight.
    You missed the lesson, again, when the Sharingan user needs to have at least comparable speed to keep up.
    Sasuke could see Rock Lee's movements, yet he couldn't dodge because he was a turtle compared to him.
    He could see Gaara's movements and dodge, because, despite being slower, he had comparable speed.

    Quote Quote:
    You whant to count the number of links i provided in the post i make (in reply to you) and the number you did? Go right ahead...

    He see? that proves nothing. Where exacly does it state there that only target's that move in a line can be tracked like that eh? Sasuke just states Bee's charinging in a line and that is a peace of cake to dodge...
    This is what the sharingan does, does not matter how one attacks:
    http://www.narutobase.net/manga/Naruto/230/6
    http://www.narutobase.net/manga/Naruto/230/7

    Close combat:
    http://www.narutobase.net/manga/Naruto/230/8
    Read what Naruto states:
    http://www.narutobase.net/manga/Naruto/230/12

    From behind, point blank range:
    http://www.narutobase.net/manga/Naruto/231/5

    Look here:
    http://www.narutobase.net/manga/Naruto/463

    Both of them charging at one another. Sasuke using CHIDORI. We all know YOU MUST have a sharingan to use it or you are completly oppen. Dodging Raikage at that speed in a linear attack (chidori) is very impresive.
    About the Chidori:
    http://www.narutobase.net/manga/Naruto/240/14
    The way he dodged that attack is more impresive then if he would stand still or something.

    You making up things like the sharingan needs linear attacks to keep up... Is just that.. Making up things.
    How is making something up when I showed Sasuke himself saying this?
    He said "he moves in a straight line, so his attacks are easy to read", Raikage attacked too in a straight line, so what does it tell us?
    Also yes, is impressive to lower your head 20 cm, a normal human would never dodge a punch using such refined tactics

    Quote Quote:
    Sasuke can do it very fast, take the spear and how he cut that tentacle from Bee fast enough to save Karin or how he was able to cut Deidara bird. As for his Chidori curent... Well he got Yamato(the wood thing), Naruto and Sai if i remember right... Its close to instant.

    Look here:
    http://www.narutobase.net/manga/Naruto/308/3
    http://www.narutobase.net/manga/Naruto/308/4
    No nothing, handseals or visible Raiton to the point they where hit. Why would Minato not get hit? Its very possible.
    After that they where DOWN for a good time, enough for Sasuke to finish them off.
    I'll put this in an easy way so you can understand:
    manga fact, in attack speed A with V1 > Sasuke, A with V2 >>>> Sasuke, Yondaime > A with V2.
    Manga facts, Sasuke couldn't follow Raikage with V2 while Yondaime, as showed, could follow even a blitz and react accordingly.
    How in the world Yondaime wouldn't dodge something Itachi dodged without a problem, despite being blind, sick and everything?

    Quote Quote:
    Not when i have diferent event from the manga. Clearly nowhere in the manga a jutsu is less powerfull because a clone was using it. if you would have anything support this calim it would be one thing but like this?

    You think that if Naruto would do a Chidori or Raikiri it would be 1000 times (with Kyuubi chakra) more effective then Sasuke or Kakashi's? You just need enough chakra to produce that jutsu, a clone of Naruto would have enough. You don't need insane amounths of charka to create said jutsu. As long as you create it... well its that as the originals.
    You can be my gues and find me 1 line or panel or whatever in this manga that would provide any evidence to support your point. It has ALLWAYS been shown that a rasengan is arasengan even if a clone of Naruto does it or the original.
    So, basing on your reasonement, 12 years old Naruto's Rasengan has the same strenght of his 16 years old self


    Quote Quote:
    The clones are using with your own cells that are transformed using chakra. Then you can even absorbed the provided cells back into your own body. Its like a clone in real life only made with chakra.

    Spoiler show


    Any clone replicate the taget or nobody would belive those are the real ones, take shadow clones, they replicate Naruto down to his chakra system, of course Naruto's clones go poof.

    Its the same as you as you are providing your own cells as a blueprint to grow yourself. Compared to other clones the user provides his own biomass in a sense to make them. Its not just solid chakra construct.

    You do understand that if the clone did not have the same exact DNA as Yamato it could not use wood element right? This is not just something shaped as you, this is you as you give your own cells to create it. In essence you use your cells to create the clone with the same DNA as you, what does that tell you?

    Hell look at Madara's wood clone, it even replicated his ET mode. He whent into ashes just like any other ET zombie.
    Good catch, yet it isn't true the whole DNA thing, a clone can use Gekkei Kenkais of the original even without being a Mokuton, see Kakashi and his Kage Bushins or Itachi and his Crow Bushins

    Quote Quote:
    Its irrelevant if it can kill to. Lots of crep can kill but that does not mean they have the same power. Rasengan (normal one) can kill and so can Kirin but oviously 1 is more powerfulll.

    Now asure had a SM rasengan, normal compact mode but it was done so with senjutsu chakra. Not stating a normal one would not take it down but still.
    Deva himself was not showed to have ANY increased durability then a normal body would have. Yes Deva was powerfull but his durability... Well it was normal.
    Now again i presented a LOT of feats. Even if you use the ones blasting Susano up and ignoring the Madara clone bit and you still have her above even OOdama rasengan. They hit the same blasted version but 1 of the mcracked it and the other did nothing.

    I fail to see how you can keep arguing this when i showed you both of them hitting the same target and 1 doing more damage.

    Now Rasengan does blunt damage. Sasuke's sword can slice trough creap, its a big diference. His sword is a Chidori put on his sword, it cuts. Oro showed the ability to tank blunt damage. Piercing attacks showed to cut him in half (naruto with his claws).
    So now Orochimaru is weak to cutting attacks but is the strongest against blunt damage.
    You are really creating a whole new level of double standards

    Quote Quote:
    No you don't need similar speed to keep up. I explained it above. A sharingan can close the gap even if you don't have enough speed. Dodging that arm was clearly showed to be done because of his sharingan. Its on panel.
    Now he did, in the manga, keep up with Raikage even hitting the man 2 times. What more do you whant?
    2 times.
    Oh good lord

    Quote Quote:
    It was not 1 linear, simple attack. They where close to 1 another. He was also able to land a sword hit on Raikage, it did crep but who cares.

    I love when Minato fans ignore why Raikage stated that Minato was faster then him... Its only because of ST... As long as Minato does not have ST to get the drop on Raikage he is WAY, WAY slower then Raikage going at full speed to the point he is a statue or close to.

    Minato fighting Sasuke would mean using his normal speed to the point he can tag him... Just like vs Tobi.
    An elbow is not a simple, linear attack?
    Really?

    Quote Quote:
    I said nothing about lvl 2. Minato himself only noticed Raikage after Raikage run some 10-15 meters to him. Again i said he could keep up with Raikage at casual speed.

    Not only was Bee able to counter to some degree but also Minato DID NOT attack Raikage.
    What you are going to tell me Sasuke is going to care if Minato teleports to some tree and put his dagger to kill that tree? Again it does not apply here. Raikage was fighting him like Sasuke would be fighting him here. Minato did not display any feats of getting around Raikage information about his jutsus in that event. He just changed targets... If anything this showes he could not do shit to Raikage as he run to attack the other guy.

    You clearly ignored the order to retreat, right?
    Of course you have.
    And who says that Yondaime needs to attack Sasuke? He can mark him, wait for him to use Kirin, teleport behind him to dodge the attack and he obtained the maximum result with the minimal effort.
    If Tobi couldn't see nor sense an Hiraishin tag being placed upon him, neither will Sasuke

    Quote Quote:
    You can see him pulling the sword out casualy, it was nothign done in a rush. Sai even had time to run all the way there... Before the man that popped before them like he just teleported. You argued that Sasuke count not counter that, i told you he did not have his sharingan on at that point, its a big diference from countering Sai with or with no Sharingan bub. Seriously Sasuke oculd have jumped down and hit Naruto but he just jumped down and put his hand on his shoulder or whatever. Yes that was not a serious attack... Naruto would have probably got it as he was just standing there but that is another thing.



    First off you don't need to move faster then Raikage to tag Minato, Tobi did himself (some 2 times even grabing him in chains ffs).
    The raiton attack just pops in the area, it has no handseals or any visible signs before it goes off. Seriously Minato still needs to notice the attack and take action. He could very well be hit.
    I'm sure.
    Of course if Tobi can do it everyone can, after all Tobi's intangibility is such a weak, non haxed jutsu, right?

    Quote Quote:
    If he can vs Casual speed raikage and Bee then he can here just fine. Just stay away from tags and you are fine.
    Of course, stay away from the tags.
    And then maybe stay away from Yondaime. And then stay away from combat in general. After which Yondaime would double-team Orochimaru and Kabuto and then we would have a 3 vs 1.
    But he is Sasuke, he will blast Kakashi away with Gokyakuu, he will pierce Jiraiya with Chidori Senbon and will destroy Yondaime with Shishi Rendan

    Quote Quote:
    Letr's brake it down. First off i provided posible counters. I never said Minato has no way to dodge or whatever. Also i said that Minato getting close would mean he could get hit by multiple crep. Nothing is 100% sure but i have a lot of counters for Minato going in to hit Sasuke with a rasengan. Also i never said he can't kill him but he would need to do it at least some 2 times. I never actualy said he can't avoid Kirin but yes he can't. If Sasuke trows that down Minato is dead as it effects a huge area, big enough to hit all his Kunai, he would have nowhere to go to.

    Now I even addresed what Sasuke can do IF he get's tagged... He can spit himself out and leave the tag behind... Seriously i gave posibilities on how Sasuke can counter.
    So you basically confirmed that you believe Hebi Sasuke to be superior to Yondaime.
    Oh well, as you well said your opinion

    Quote Quote:
    Actualy there is. There is no reason Sasuke can't keep up with Minato aside of Minato's teleporting behind him or some other crep. Show me Minato overpowering anybody (that is not fodder) with his casual speed aside from getting the drop on him with ST. Yeah sure he has a fast shunshin no jutsu but that it does not mean Sasuke with his sunshin + sharingan can't keep up with that. Sasuke has a sharingan to compensate.
    Same Sasuke being overwhelmed by every opponent in the speed department sans Danzou and Deidara, which were on his level.
    A long ranged fighter and a 80 years old.
    Manga facts right there

  2. #32
    Registered User 英雄メンバー / Eiyuu Menbaa / Hero Member chilibun's Avatar
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    Re: Team JMan vs Team Orochimaru

    Quote Originally Posted by Uchiha_Blood View Post
    I'll quote a part of one of my previous posts
    "Conventional" speed meaning actually moving from one place to another, and not disappearing and reappearing with Hiraishin. All the links you posted are of Minato using Hiraishin. He did not shunshin in any of those instances. If you think it is because of Rin, then you are wrong because its pretty obvious that he had used hiraishin in each of those cases and that Rin is just a huge noob.

  3. #33
    MH Senpai 有名人 / Yuumeijin / Celebrity Uchiha_Blood's Avatar
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    Re: Team JMan vs Team Orochimaru

    Quote Originally Posted by chilibun View Post
    "Conventional" speed meaning actually moving from one place to another, and not disappearing and reappearing with Hiraishin. All the links you posted are of Minato using Hiraishin. He did not shunshin in any of those instances. If you think it is because of Rin, then you are wrong because its pretty obvious that he had used hiraishin in each of those cases and that Rin is just a huge noob.
    The part I quoted you was a bona fide shunshin.
    Why?
    Kakashi wasn't marked, nor the guy was marked ( well, he marked him when he touched him ) and there were no kunai involved.
    When Yondaime Hiraishins, Kishi always shows the kunai, or the mark

  4. #34
    Registered User 英雄メンバー / Eiyuu Menbaa / Hero Member chilibun's Avatar
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    Re: Team JMan vs Team Orochimaru

    Quote Originally Posted by Uchiha_Blood View Post
    The part I quoted you was a bona fide shunshin.
    Why?
    Kakashi wasn't marked, nor the guy was marked ( well, he marked him when he touched him ) and there were no kunai involved.
    When Yondaime Hiraishins, Kishi always shows the kunai, or the mark
    Minato gave Kakashi a marked Kunai before the mission. He then hiraishined to that dudes marked foot. So yea, no shunshin involved.

  5. #35
    MH Senpai 有名人 / Yuumeijin / Celebrity Uchiha_Blood's Avatar
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    Re: Team JMan vs Team Orochimaru

    Quote Originally Posted by chilibun View Post
    Minato gave Kakashi a marked Kunai before the mission. He then hiraishined to that dudes marked foot. So yea, no shunshin involved.
    You know what?
    I completely forgot about that, great catch.
    It could've been, but we see next page that he effortlessy shunshins back

  6. #36
    Registered User 英雄メンバー / Eiyuu Menbaa / Hero Member chilibun's Avatar
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    Re: Team JMan vs Team Orochimaru

    Quote Originally Posted by Uchiha_Blood View Post
    You know what?
    I completely forgot about that, great catch.
    It could've been, but we see next page that he effortlessy shunshins back
    More likely he just left a tag behind. Judging by the aesthetics of that move, it looks like its hiraishin with the puffy circular smoke. Shunshins are typically always drawn with dashing lines to indicate actual movement. Plus, it makes no sense for him to shunshin through trees and stuff, and even Ee wouldn't be able to travel those distances at an instant. And please tell me you think he is faster than Ee with conventional speeds...

  7. #37
    Registered User MH中毒 / MH Chuudoku / MH Addicted xXan's Avatar
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    Re: Team JMan vs Team Orochimaru

    @Uchiha_Blood


    Quote Quote:
    You don't, yet I have to? Double standards much?
    Also that example you made is fine and all, but it has a single, fundamental flaw:
    when Yondaime teleported to Raikage, he teleported in mid-air, since the kunai was in mid-air, meaning it wasn't on Raikage's body or anything, meaning that, if Raikage was marked, Yondaime would've just do what he did to Tobi.
    If he teleports in the same way to and fro, then why oh why he always have a different position when he uses Hiraishin? How, if it isn't instantaneous, can he pass from being squatted without doing a thing to swinging his kunai?
    I used that example to show you how he needs to swing as it is broken down (to show Bee intercepting the move.
    Asuming its like vs Tobi and Minato pops with his Kunai NEXT TO HIS KIN (Tobi's) from that point he still needs to trust his hands forword to implant the kunai in Tobi's flesh.
    Seriously are you telling me Minato is going to pop with his kunai INSIDE Tobi's flesh? Like teleport 1 object inside another? He never displayed the ability to do so.
    So compared to the examble with Bee Minato is just going to have a smaller space where he needs to trust the kunai to effect his target, but the trust is still there.

    Quote Quote:
    Also lol at Sasuke and Deidara example, so apparently Sasuke is fast why?
    Because Deidara said so, despite dodging every attack?
    And yet Yondaime isn't faster despite doing a faster shunshin for, like, thrice the distance and having the fastest guy in the world say that he was slower than him.
    Cute
    You where the one who used that example to show me something and i posted in response to that. Deidara never acutaly dodge an attack that was meant for him. First time Sasuke allowed it and second when he was up in the tree deidara used a bomb to get away. Its not like ce actualy DODGED Sasuke.
    Now Sasuke never needed to display that range of shunshin... Not to say he can do it but as i said before he does not need the same speed to keep up with Minato in a fight as he has his sharingan to compensate for the speed gap.
    Now Minato is faster then Raikage (for God knows how many time) because he can teleport. A shunshin Minato can't even compare to full speed Raikage.

    Quote Quote:
    You missed the lesson, again, when the Sharingan user needs to have at least comparable speed to keep up.
    Sasuke could see Rock Lee's movements, yet he couldn't dodge because he was a turtle compared to him.
    He could see Gaara's movements and dodge, because, despite being slower, he had comparable speed.
    Sasuke has more then enough base speed to keep up with Minato lol. He can do that with Bee and casual speed Raikage. Minato is defenetly not above casual speed Raikage...

    Quote Quote:
    How is making something up when I showed Sasuke himself saying this?
    He said "he moves in a straight line, so his attacks are easy to read", Raikage attacked too in a straight line, so what does it tell us?
    Also yes, is impressive to lower your head 20 cm, a normal human would never dodge a punch using such refined tactics
    Again read what you post lol. He said that because of that tactic he can read his attacks easy. It has nothing to do with the fact that he can keep up with Bee ONLY BECAUSE OF THAT. He said that is easy to track because of that.
    And stop tring to nerf Sasuke feat in dodging Raikage and landing a blow, considering the huge speed they where traveling that is a insane feat. I exampled to you why even coming from Minato's own words in my last post.

    Also that was not a linear attack exacly, it was a CLOSE RANGE attack with the elbow.
    The way they charge:
    http://www.narutobase.net/manga/Naruto/462/16
    Then Raikage tries to swipe Sasuke away with his hand:
    http://www.narutobase.net/manga/Naruto/463
    its not a frontal linear charge like Bee does, its running in and tries to hit him with your hand.
    Now yes its impresive as that proves Sasuke is more then able to keep up, avoid and land hits on Raikage that is easy on or above Minato (no st). Sasuke is not as fast but his sharingan is more then able to provide for the speed diference.

    Quote Quote:
    I'll put this in an easy way so you can understand:
    manga fact, in attack speed A with V1 > Sasuke, A with V2 >>>> Sasuke, Yondaime > A with V2.
    Manga facts, Sasuke couldn't follow Raikage with V2 while Yondaime, as showed, could follow even a blitz and react accordingly.
    How in the world Yondaime wouldn't dodge something Itachi dodged without a problem, despite being blind, sick and everything?
    And i will use the manga.
    Because Sasuke dodged and hit Raikage in v1. Sasuke>Raika in v1 (sharingan included of course). A with v2>>>> Sasuke yes. Yondaime>a in v2 ONLY because he can teleport instantly out of the way. That is NOT going to help Minato here to get a hit on Sasuke aside from some freak accident. Now its like this NO St Minato <<<<< Raikage in lvl 2 exacly as Sasuke is.
    Sasuke could follow the attack just as good, he put Amaterasu on his Susano... You do understand that Minato noticed Raikage after some 10 to 15 meters dash lol?
    Now Minato for instance does not have the tools Itachi has. Also Itachi himself got hit by that big shuriken look thing (yes he was sick and half blind but you used him). Also a lot of that fight was insane of genjutsu more then real life. Now don't get me wrong i am not stating Minato is going to get hit for sure... But the posibility exists and Minato needs to RUN IN to do damage... He is going to expose himself to a posible attack and the best he could do is teleport away if its get ugly.

    Quote Quote:
    So, basing on your reasonement, 12 years old Naruto's Rasengan has the same strenght of his 16 years old self
    Yes probably, same for Raikiri. There is no reason to belive they could not do the jutsu at that age at full power. Do you got anything that would put it at more power now then before? N
    Then you can be my gues and tell me why did you change the point with the above? You could not find anything of what you stated and then you tried to avoid the subject?
    How does the above have anything to do with Naruto creating a rasengan just as powerfull as his clone and the other way around? Even asuming kid Naruto could not do a rasengan as powerfull as now and it would not apply here in any way as Naruto could have improved it over the years.
    Again i am open to a hypothesis if you can find anything in the manga to support you claims.

    Quote Quote:
    Good catch, yet it isn't true the whole DNA thing, a clone can use Gekkei Kenkais of the original even without being a Mokuton, see Kakashi and his Kage Bushins or Itachi and his Crow Bushins
    Well those things are complete replicas of the originals but they just go poof when they are hit (or grow's fly away)... Now don't ask me why they go poof, its magic. The diference is that wood clones are not going poof and they are basicaly the original growing himself into a double.

    Quote Quote:
    So now Orochimaru is weak to cutting attacks but is the strongest against blunt damage.
    You are really creating a whole new level of double standards
    Am i? The manga showed Oro taking punches to the face that can do more damage then Oodama rasengan and then the manga showed Oro getting sliced in more then 1 ocasion with no real problem. Even Itachi with a kunai cutting his hand off.
    Not my fault the manga showed it that way.

    Quote Quote:
    2 times.
    Oh good lord
    The only times they got into close combat... Sasuke clearly showed to dodge him and hit him.
    You don't see me arguing how Minato can't hit Tobi because he did it only once or that he can't keep up with Tobi as he got tagged 2 times.

    Quote Quote:
    An elbow is not a simple, linear attack?
    Really?
    Its more like a hand slap. And no its not exacly linear. Well not more then running close to a guy and tring to punch him in the face. What Sasuke refered to Bee's linear attacks where those charged from left to right like a bull, even jumping in the air.
    You do understand even Bee was Oo as Sasuke dodged something that only Raikage could?

    Quote Quote:
    You clearly ignored the order to retreat, right?
    Of course you have.
    What does this have to do with anything? Elaborate.

    Quote Quote:
    And who says that Yondaime needs to attack Sasuke? He can mark him, wait for him to use Kirin, teleport behind him to dodge the attack and he obtained the maximum result with the minimal effort.
    If Tobi couldn't see nor sense an Hiraishin tag being placed upon him, neither will Sasuke
    Seriously tagging him would be an feat in itself... Now if this is a 1vs1 i personaly don't belive Sasuke can get the Kirin off. So its irrelevant anyway. I used the Kirin only when you said Minato vs the 3 of them at the same time.

    Tobi did not see it as he was blated by the bloody Rasengan at close the exact same time and he had his bloody face down ... He could not see the hand placed on him. Some extremly weird turn of events would be needed to replicate this.

    Quote Quote:
    I'm sure.
    Of course if Tobi can do it everyone can, after all Tobi's intangibility is such a weak, non haxed jutsu, right?
    It is very hax, i just gave you an exaple of not needing comparable speed to do it. Some jutsus can get around that.

    Quote Quote:
    Of course, stay away from the tags.
    And then maybe stay away from Yondaime. And then stay away from combat in general. After which Yondaime would double-team Orochimaru and Kabuto and then we would have a 3 vs 1.
    But he is Sasuke, he will blast Kakashi away with Gokyakuu, he will pierce Jiraiya with Chidori Senbon and will destroy Yondaime with Shishi Rendan
    Even Raikage could keep track of all the tags on the battlefield. And Sasuke keeping his range from the tags ... Well its logical to do so. Minato would need to move away to attack or its a draw. If Minato would move to another dude he would move off to assist to and still keep range from the tags.

    So its a draw or Oro and Sasuke vs JMan and Minato and we get to the exact problem but here Oro can send huge snakes to cover the tags or just go himself in as he can tank the attacks... He can summon a Tsunamy of snakes with kusenagi and so on.

    And again you have to exagerate and make fun of diferent things...

    Quote Quote:
    So you basically confirmed that you believe Hebi Sasuke to be superior to Yondaime.
    Oh well, as you well said your opinion
    Superior... Not sure but he can defenetly win this same as Minato. Its defently not a stomp as you keep tring to demonstrate... And defenetly Minato can'tt solo the 3 of them.
    I do give him good ods at taking Minato down expecialy considering Sasuke knows what ST does, has the ability to get out of at least 2 deaths and removed tags from his body (by jumping out of his body). Then he has aoe close range attacks that would be extremly hard to dodge even for Yondaime (chidori curent). Sasuke can also summon snakes to provide cover or defened himself. Then he can increase his durability by a lot with CS. His wing could take a huge explosion.

    Sasuke DEFENETLY has ways of winning this.

    Quote Quote:
    Same Sasuke being overwhelmed by every opponent in the speed department sans Danzou and Deidara, which were on his level.
    A long ranged fighter and a 80 years old.
    Manga facts right there
    Who exacly? Let's see.
    Bee. He could keep up, yes Bee was charing bla bla bla but he could. Bee only got him when he suprised him with his raiton blades and with his weird sword skills.
    Bee was charging at full speed that only Raikage could dodge but he was able to keep up just fine.
    Raikage, only when his max speed was used did it happen but he was able to counter with his Susano+Amaterasu. Minato himself needed a jutsu to get around this speed. This is the same level of feat for Minato and Sasuke.

    I am sorry but he showed more then you give him credit for.
    Last edited by xXan; July 25, 2012 at 05:37 AM.

  8. #38
    MH Senpai 有名人 / Yuumeijin / Celebrity Uchiha_Blood's Avatar
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    Re: Team JMan vs Team Orochimaru

    Quote Originally Posted by chilibun View Post
    More likely he just left a tag behind. Judging by the aesthetics of that move, it looks like its hiraishin with the puffy circular smoke. Shunshins are typically always drawn with dashing lines to indicate actual movement. Plus, it makes no sense for him to shunshin through trees and stuff, and even Ee wouldn't be able to travel those distances at an instant. And please tell me you think he is faster than Ee with conventional speeds...
    It actually depends on Kishi's mood on the moment, for Gaara he usually drawed circular movements and smoke, with Kakashi and general shunshins he uses smoke, or smoke and lines.
    Same thing with Hiraishin, he usually make it smoke-less, but one or two times it showed Hiraishin using smoke, its mostly a drawing expedient.

    As for Yondaime's speed, of course I don't think he is as fast or faster than Raikage without Hiraishin, but I still think he's way faster than Sasuke

  9. #39
    Registered User 有名人 / Yuumeijin / Celebrity jaymizzo's Avatar
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    Re: Team JMan vs Team Orochimaru

    Quote Originally Posted by Uchiha_Blood View Post
    It actually depends on Kishi's mood on the moment, for Gaara he usually drawed circular movements and smoke, with Kakashi and general shunshins he uses smoke, or smoke and lines.
    Same thing with Hiraishin, he usually make it smoke-less, but one or two times it showed Hiraishin using smoke, its mostly a drawing expedient.

    As for Yondaime's speed, of course I don't think he is as fast or faster than Raikage without Hiraishin, but I still think he's way faster than Sasuke
    Actually that was Hiraishin. Sadly.

    I still do not understand why people do not understand that the only reason Sasuke reacted to 1 or 2 of Bee and Raikages movements was because they were in linear motion and using straight forward attacks.
    "Man hands misery onto man" - Philip Larkin

  10. #40
    Registered User 英雄メンバー / Eiyuu Menbaa / Hero Member chilibun's Avatar
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    Re: Team JMan vs Team Orochimaru

    Quote Originally Posted by Uchiha_Blood View Post
    As for Yondaime's speed, of course I don't think he is as fast or faster than Raikage without Hiraishin, but I still think he's way faster than Sasuke
    Well, again. I don't remember Minato having any conventional speed feats, so sorry if can't just take your word for it. I haven't seen him do anything, that can't be duplicated with Sasuke's speed.

    Quote Originally Posted by jaymizzo View Post
    I still do not understand why people do not understand that the only reason Sasuke reacted to 1 or 2 of Bee and Raikages movements was because they were in linear motion and using straight forward attacks.
    I'm not denying that Sasuke is capable of reacting to those speeds because they are linear. However, part of the reason why they are so fast is because it is a charging linear attack. They will not be moving as fast if they are zig-zagging all over the place.
    Last edited by chilibun; July 25, 2012 at 05:55 AM.

  11. #41
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    Re: Team JMan vs Team Orochimaru

    Quote Originally Posted by xXan View Post
    @Uchiha_Blood

    I used that example to show you how he needs to swing as it is broken down (to show Bee intercepting the move.
    Asuming its like vs Tobi and Minato pops with his Kunai NEXT TO HIS KIN (Tobi's) from that point he still needs to trust his hands forword to implant the kunai in Tobi's flesh.
    Seriously are you telling me Minato is going to pop with his kunai INSIDE Tobi's flesh? Like teleport 1 object inside another? He never displayed the ability to do so.
    So compared to the examble with Bee Minato is just going to have a smaller space where he needs to trust the kunai to effect his target, but the trust is still there.
    He needed to swing because he appeared in mid-air, meaning he had to fill the distance separating him and Raikage.
    With Bee he appeared with a kunai over his face, if he wanted to he could've done the same thing he did to Tobi.
    He didn't because they had to retreat, meaning he couldn't risk an all-out war against A and Kumo, he only had to threaten A so he could retreat safely, remember that A didn't want Yondaime to retreat?

    Quote Quote:
    You where the one who used that example to show me something and i posted in response to that. Deidara never acutaly dodge an attack that was meant for him. First time Sasuke allowed it and second when he was up in the tree deidara used a bomb to get away. Its not like ce actualy DODGED Sasuke.
    Now Sasuke never needed to display that range of shunshin... Not to say he can do it but as i said before he does not need the same speed to keep up with Minato in a fight as he has his sharingan to compensate for the speed gap.
    Now Minato is faster then Raikage (for God knows how many time) because he can teleport. A shunshin Minato can't even compare to full speed Raikage.
    Sasuke can still be hit despite his Sharingan by faster opponents.
    Proof?
    grabbed, grabbed, hit, hit, hit, hit, grabbed, hit.

    See? Sasuke isn't invincible in taijutsu, far from it

    Quote Quote:
    Sasuke has more then enough base speed to keep up with Minato lol. He can do that with Bee and casual speed Raikage. Minato is defenetly not above casual speed Raikage...
    Yet everyone landed more than an hit on him, while Raikage is too fast for almost anyone to follow.
    Does it mean that maybe, just maybe, Sasuke isn't as fast as you believe he is?

    Quote Quote:
    And i will use the manga.
    Because Sasuke dodged and hit Raikage in v1. Sasuke>Raika in v1 (sharingan included of course). A with v2>>>> Sasuke yes. Yondaime>a in v2 ONLY because he can teleport instantly out of the way. That is NOT going to help Minato here to get a hit on Sasuke aside from some freak accident. Now its like this NO St Minato <<<<< Raikage in lvl 2 exacly as Sasuke is.
    Sasuke could follow the attack just as good, he put Amaterasu on his Susano... You do understand that Minato noticed Raikage after some 10 to 15 meters dash lol?
    Now Minato for instance does not have the tools Itachi has. Also Itachi himself got hit by that big shuriken look thing (yes he was sick and half blind but you used him). Also a lot of that fight was insane of genjutsu more then real life. Now don't get me wrong i am not stating Minato is going to get hit for sure... But the posibility exists and Minato needs to RUN IN to do damage... He is going to expose himself to a posible attack and the best he could do is teleport away if its get ugly.
    So if Yondaime doesn't attack they will simply stand there?

    Quote Quote:
    Yes probably, same for Raikiri. There is no reason to belive they could not do the jutsu at that age at full power. Do you got anything that would put it at more power now then before? N
    Then you can be my gues and tell me why did you change the point with the above? You could not find anything of what you stated and then you tried to avoid the subject?
    How does the above have anything to do with Naruto creating a rasengan just as powerfull as his clone and the other way around? Even asuming kid Naruto could not do a rasengan as powerfull as now and it would not apply here in any way as Naruto could have improved it over the years.
    Again i am open to a hypothesis if you can find anything in the manga to support you claims.
    Read what you wrote, think about it, think carefully about what you wrote, then post again.
    Saying that Naruto at 12 had the same power he had at 16 is negating all the improvements he made all over the years, it is again logic that a 12 years old is way inferior to an 16 years old expecially if he trains, or what, a punch of your 12 year old self will be as strong as a punch of your 16 years old self?
    Are you aware that the body grows and is strenghten through both growth and training, right?

    Then why Sasuke's Gokyakuu trumphed Itachi's if the jutsu is the same?
    They expended the same chakra, so the effects must be the same

    Quote Quote:
    The only times they got into close combat... Sasuke clearly showed to dodge him and hit him.
    You don't see me arguing how Minato can't hit Tobi because he did it only once or that he can't keep up with Tobi as he got tagged 2 times.
    Yeah, infact Tobi won, not Yondaime, Tobi sucked Yondaime in his dimension when he "tagged" him.
    Oh wait...

    Quote Quote:
    It is very hax, i just gave you an exaple of not needing comparable speed to do it. Some jutsus can get around that.
    Instant teleportation can go around that, something Sasuke hasn't and can't follow

    Quote Quote:
    Who exacly? Let's see.
    Bee. He could keep up, yes Bee was charing bla bla bla but he could. Bee only got him when he suprised him with his raiton blades and with his weird sword skills.
    Bee was charging at full speed that only Raikage could dodge but he was able to keep up just fine.
    Raikage, only when his max speed was used did it happen but he was able to counter with his Susano+Amaterasu. Minato himself needed a jutsu to get around this speed. This is the same level of feat for Minato and Sasuke.

    I am sorry but he showed more then you give him credit for.
    I guess I have a different meaning of "keeping up".
    Keeping up, for me, is avoiding being hit by the opponent, taking some scratches and everything, but ultimately being a match against him.
    Sasuke wasn't a match for Bee in speed, since he needed a phoenix down twice.
    Sasuke wasn't a match for Raikage since he couldn't follow him, and used Susano'o, the antithesis of speed.
    Sasuke was a match for Deidara, a long ranged fighter.
    Sasuke was a match for Danzou, a 80 years old guy way past his prime, and still needed a phoenix down.
    Sasuke was a match for a blind, sick, holding back Itachi, that still would've won if he wanted to.

    So its not me not giving him credit, its you overestimating him wayyyyyyyyyyy too much.
    Yondaime is shown time and time again to be in a complete different class from Hebi Sasuke, on the levels of Itachi and just below Nagato.

  12. #42
    Registered User MH中毒 / MH Chuudoku / MH Addicted xXan's Avatar
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    Re: Team JMan vs Team Orochimaru

    @Uchiha_Blood

    Quote Quote:
    He needed to swing because he appeared in mid-air, meaning he had to fill the distance separating him and Raikage.
    With Bee he appeared with a kunai over his face, if he wanted to he could've done the same thing he did to Tobi.
    He didn't because they had to retreat, meaning he couldn't risk an all-out war against A and Kumo, he only had to threaten A so he could retreat safely, remember that A didn't want Yondaime to retreat?
    Yes but in nothing you said here addresses the fact that Minato needs to trust or swing his arm to cut after his ST that is unless you belive Minato can teleport his Kunai or Rasengan direcly in the target and that he never displayed as able to do.
    Quote Quote:
    Sasuke can still be hit despite his Sharingan by faster opponents.
    Proof?
    grabbed, grabbed, hit, hit, hit, hit, grabbed, hit.

    See? Sasuke isn't invincible in taijutsu, far from it
    Let's not forget that what you used there is:

    1-Itachi keeping up with RM Naruto and Bee at the same bloody time.
    Second link has Sasuke himself grabing Itachi as he was grabed so its something of a draw.
    Then you show Bee who we know how fast he is and that is a sword fight where be had a big advantage as he could use 8 of them (because of his skill true but its about speed here) and he is VERY fast. Then you show me Bee striking him down when he left himself oppened as he had no bloody idea Bee can block with Raiton (bad tactics and what not but again its not exacly because he could not keep up, he could to some level but obviously yes Bee was better).
    Then you show me Bee hitting him when he had his back TURNED TO HIM belive Bee is out cold. This mean Sasuke is stupid, has bad tactics or anything you whant but not a fail in Sasuke's speed or ractions times. Don't ignore WHY that happened... He showed to be able to dodge things like that, he got hit there because his stupidity and not because of his inability to dodge those.
    Then grabbed by Danzou... Well he did not give a shit as he was aiming to cut his hand off and he did.
    Then again him going OK with a double hit on himself and Danzou. He knew that would happen but he knew he would not die as the blade would not go in ANY vital area and that Karin was there.

    But you missed the point. I never said he is invincible in melee combat lol. I said he can keep up in one with Minato. Big diference. I never said he will be immune in a melee fight with Minato.
    Quote Quote:
    Yet everyone landed more than an hit on him, while Raikage is too fast for almost anyone to follow.
    Does it mean that maybe, just maybe, Sasuke isn't as fast as you believe he is?
    As i said above. He is fast enough.

    Quote Quote:
    So if Yondaime doesn't attack they will simply stand there?
    '

    Probably as Sasuke is not stupid enough to go into those seals or at least try to get him from range with something. Think about it Sasuke would be the one having no problems to w8... Minato on the other hand is going to do his best to finish this fast... Sasuke does not give a SHIT about his team, never has. Minato on the other hand... His master and his "padawan" are there.

    Quote Quote:
    Read what you wrote, think about it, think carefully about what you wrote, then post again.
    Saying that Naruto at 12 had the same power he had at 16 is negating all the improvements he made all over the years, it is again logic that a 12 years old is way inferior to an 16 years old expecially if he trains, or what, a punch of your 12 year old self will be as strong as a punch of your 16 years old self?
    Are you aware that the body grows and is strenghten through both growth and training, right?
    Don't compare body function to jutsu potency. Or at least Rasengan. Let me put it this way. Do you have ANY evidence from the manga that Naruto's curent Rasengan is > his old 1?
    Seriously Naruto improbed in other areas and developed other bigger version of Rasengan but the standard one should be the same. Take after the time skip he developed Oodama rasengan. But his old version of Rasengan was showed just as powerfull as his curent one.
    Again don't acuse me of diferent things, try supporting your point with manga evidence of what you belive. Also and again don't compare chakra levels, body capabilities, skill, speed, reaction times and other things like that to RASENGAN. You said Rasengan and i addresed that. Seriously i noticed NO change in power from part 1? Did you? Where?

    Quote Quote:
    Then why Sasuke's Gokyakuu trumphed Itachi's if the jutsu is the same?
    They expended the same chakra, so the effects must be the same
    I never said diferent people can't use a jutsu more powerfull then others. Take ST from Minato, he can do it himself and on the other hand we have 3 others doing it. Naruto aparently perfected Rasengan from part 1. Again you belive he has more power in it since part 1 show me where and why.
    But to address this that was not just shoot and forget. It was chaneled as they kept shooting it, Sasuke just had more chakra as Itachi was close to death and pain like hell.

    Now stop changing the subject. You said Rasengan from part 1 to part 2 FOR NARUTO then you whent with body abiltiies and other crep then comparing the jutsu from 2 diferent people. Make up your mind already what you whant to compare.

    But the discussion was about a clone and the original using a jutsu. How does the above applies to that in any way? Seriously.

    Quote Quote:
    Yeah, infact Tobi won, not Yondaime, Tobi sucked Yondaime in his dimension when he "tagged" him.
    Oh wait...
    And i said anything about winning or losing where? I said about the ability to tag Minato...

    Quote Quote:
    Instant teleportation can go around that, something Sasuke hasn't and can't follow
    As long as he keeps away from seals he does not need to.

    Quote Quote:
    I guess I have a different meaning of "keeping up".
    Keeping up, for me, is avoiding being hit by the opponent, taking some scratches and everything, but ultimately being a match against him.
    Keeping up in speed means you can do that, keep up with your opponent in speed(sharingan compensation and what not included).

    Quote Quote:
    Sasuke wasn't a match for Bee in speed, since he needed a phoenix down twice.
    Why do you ignore why it happened? First time as he left himself oppen like a moron and second time because he turned his back to him like a moron. In none of this casses does it mean he can't keep up with Bee... Only that he is a moron. Your evidence is flawed.

    Quote Quote:
    Sasuke wasn't a match for Raikage since he couldn't follow him, and used Susano'o, the antithesis of speed.
    And Minato used ST so Minato can't keep up with Raikage to.. Minato used a jutsu and so did Sasuke... But for Minato it does not matter as he is Minato.
    Not that it matters as i stated some 20 times now casual speed but let's ignore that.

    Quote Quote:
    Sasuke was a match for Danzou, a 80 years old guy way past his prime, and still needed a phoenix down.
    80 years old man with INSANE Speed able to move back from a Susano poping in his damn blasted face when we know you can summon that faster then a lighting bolt hits the ground and who had Senju DNA in his ass.

    Quote Quote:
    Sasuke was a match for a blind, sick, holding back Itachi, that still would've won if he wanted to.
    Because Itachi is Itachi and he would shit all over Minato just as well.

    Quote Quote:
    So its not me not giving him credit, its you overestimating him wayyyyyyyyyyy too much.
    Yondaime is shown time and time again to be in a complete different class from Hebi Sasuke, on the levels of Itachi and just below Nagato.

    Neah.. its just you ignoring how said "hits" where achived.
    Last edited by xXan; July 25, 2012 at 07:43 AM.

  13. #43
    MH Senpai 有名人 / Yuumeijin / Celebrity Uchiha_Blood's Avatar
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    Re: Team JMan vs Team Orochimaru

    Quote Originally Posted by jaymizzo View Post
    Actually that was Hiraishin. Sadly.

    I still do not understand why people do not understand that the only reason Sasuke reacted to 1 or 2 of Bee and Raikages movements was because they were in linear motion and using straight forward attacks.
    The first probably, the second doesn't have a seal nor a kunai in the vicinity, unless nothing visible

    Quote Originally Posted by chilibun View Post
    Well, again. I don't remember Minato having any conventional speed feats, so sorry if can't just take your word for it. I haven't seen him do anything, that can't be duplicated with Sasuke's speed.

    I'm not denying that Sasuke is capable of reacting to those speeds because they are linear. However, part of the reason why they are so fast is because it is a charging linear attack. They will not be moving as fast if they are zig-zagging all over the place.
    Don't be, I'll be the first to admit that Yondaime's feats are few since he really fought a single fight, so it is basically a matter of personal opinion:
    what I can see at impressive, in both hype and feats, you can see as average.

    As for charging attacks, A actually moves around when using shunshin, since against both Madara and Sasuke he went for the blind spot when dealing a decisive attack.
    And in both cases A was way faster than his opponents, Sasuke completely lost him and Madara commented on his superior speed.


    Quote Originally Posted by xXan View Post
    @Uchiha_Blood
    Yes but in nothing you said here addresses the fact that Minato needs to trust or swing his arm to cut after his ST that is unless you belive Minato can teleport his Kunai or Rasengan direcly in the target and that he never displayed as able to do.
    He did so against Tobi and the Iwa fodder, you just refuse to see it


    Quote Quote:
    Let's not forget that what you used there is:

    1-Itachi keeping up with RM Naruto and Bee at the same bloody time.
    Second link has Sasuke himself grabing Itachi as he was grabed so its something of a draw.
    Then you show Bee who we know how fast he is and that is a sword fight where be had a big advantage as he could use 8 of them (because of his skill true but its about speed here) and he is VERY fast. Then you show me Bee striking him down when he left himself oppened as he had no bloody idea Bee can block with Raiton (bad tactics and what not but again its not exacly because he could not keep up, he could to some level but obviously yes Bee was better).
    Then you show me Bee hitting him when he had his back TURNED TO HIM belive Bee is out cold. This mean Sasuke is stupid, has bad tactics or anything you whant but not a fail in Sasuke's speed or ractions times. Don't ignore WHY that happened... He showed to be able to dodge things like that, he got hit there because his stupidity and not because of his inability to dodge those.
    Then grabbed by Danzou... Well he did not give a shit as he was aiming to cut his hand off and he did.
    Then again him going OK with a double hit on himself and Danzou. He knew that would happen but he knew he would not die as the blade would not go in ANY vital area and that Karin was there.

    But you missed the point. I never said he is invincible in melee combat lol. I said he can keep up in one with Minato. Big diference. I never said he will be immune in a melee fight with Minato.
    So he will not dodge everything.
    So he will be tagged.
    So he will lose.
    And yet you say that Yondaime can't touch Sasuke.

    Quote Quote:
    Probably as Sasuke is not stupid enough to go into those seals or at least try to get him from range with something. Think about it Sasuke would be the one having no problems to w8... Minato on the other hand is going to do his best to finish this fast... Sasuke does not give a SHIT about his team, never has. Minato on the other hand... His master and his "padawan" are there.
    Good strategy, Yondaime ends Kabuto and Oro with his team's help then they all gang up on Sasuke.
    I love how usually wanking Sasuke results in Uchiha fans making him look like a retard when he is really the opposite, and Kishi doesn't make him as overpowered as many seems to think.

    Quote Quote:
    Don't compare body function to jutsu potency. Or at least Rasengan. Let me put it this way. Do you have ANY evidence from the manga that Naruto's curent Rasengan is > his old 1?
    Seriously Naruto improbed in other areas and developed other bigger version of Rasengan but the standard one should be the same. Take after the time skip he developed Oodama rasengan. But his old version of Rasengan was showed just as powerfull as his curent one.
    Again don't acuse me of diferent things, try supporting your point with manga evidence of what you belive. Also and again don't compare chakra levels, body capabilities, skill, speed, reaction times and other things like that to RASENGAN. You said Rasengan and i addresed that. Seriously i noticed NO change in power from part 1? Did you? Where?

    I never said diferent people can't use a jutsu more powerfull then others. Take ST from Minato, he can do it himself and on the other hand we have 3 others doing it. Naruto aparently perfected Rasengan from part 1. Again you belive he has more power in it since part 1 show me where and why.
    But to address this that was not just shoot and forget. It was chaneled as they kept shooting it, Sasuke just had more chakra as Itachi was close to death and pain like hell.
    And how they can, if body doesn't matter, only chakra usage?
    The same jutsu consumes the same chakra, then why Sasuke's was superior? Since the body doesn't affect the jutsu, pain and sickness shouldn't be relevant, right?

    Quote Quote:
    And i said anything about winning or losing where? I said about the ability to tag Minato...
    How he "tagged" Yondaime if tagging him would mean Tobi sucking him into his eye?

    Quote Quote:
    Why do you ignore why it happened? First time as he left himself oppen like a moron and second time because he turned his back to him like a moron. In none of this casses does it mean he can't keep up with Bee... Only that he is a moron. Your evidence is flawed.
    So Sasuke is a moron.
    But he is smarter than Yondaime.

    Quote Quote:
    80 years old man with INSANE Speed able to move back from a Susano poping in his damn blasted face when we know you can summon that faster then a lighting bolt hits the ground and who had Senju DNA in his ass.
    Danzou has insane speed?
    You are grasping at straws here

    Quote Quote:
    And Minato used ST so Minato can't keep up with Raikage to.. Minato used a jutsu and so did Sasuke... But for Minato it does not matter as he is Minato.
    Not that it matters as i stated some 20 times now casual speed but let's ignore that.

    Because Itachi is Itachi and he would shit all over Minato just as well.

    Neah.. its just you ignoring how said "hits" where achived.
    You lack hatred

  14. #44
    Registered User MH中毒 / MH Chuudoku / MH Addicted xXan's Avatar
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    Re: Team JMan vs Team Orochimaru

    @Uchiha_Blood

    Quote Quote:
    He did so against Tobi and the Iwa fodder, you just refuse to see it

    Vs Tobi he had his back to us but you have no evidence in the world to prove Minato can teleport with his Kunai inside a dude.
    Vs the fodder his kunai was obviously on the outisde and on the guy's neck.. if you noticed him with the Kunai teleported inside that dude's flesh you are defenetly reading some other manga then me.


    Quote Quote:
    So he will not dodge everything.
    So he will be tagged.
    So he will lose.
    And yet you say that Yondaime can't touch Sasuke.
    So you get to irrelevant posts not addresing anything just posting nonsense.
    You provided AGAIN no arguments and just acused me of doing whatever.

    Quote Quote:
    Good strategy, Yondaime ends Kabuto and Oro with his team's help then they all gang up on Sasuke.
    I love how usually wanking Sasuke results in Uchiha fans making him look like a retard when he is really the opposite, and Kishi doesn't make him as overpowered as many seems to think.
    If Minato moves to assist some other man ignoring Sasuke then what would stop Sasuke to move after him or give his assistence to some other guy? Seriously do you even read or think about the things you post? What is keeping Sasuke there looking at the fight..

    Quote Quote:
    And how they can, if body doesn't matter, only chakra usage?
    The same jutsu consumes the same chakra, then why Sasuke's was superior? Since the body doesn't affect the jutsu, pain and sickness shouldn't be relevant, right?
    Getting bored with you now. Going to put it simple. Show me evidence of:

    1-Clones doing jutsus worse then the original.
    2-Rasengan from part 2 doing more damage then Rasengan in part 1.

    I love the fact that now you whant to the sikness crep. Again provide evidence of the 2 above things.

    Quote Quote:
    How he "tagged" Yondaime if tagging him would mean Tobi sucking him into his eye?
    Trolling some more aparently as if you are telling me you don't know that Minato teleported before Tobi could warp him or teleported out of his chains i don't belive it.

    Quote Quote:
    So Sasuke is a moron.
    But he is smarter than Yondaime.
    Derailing the conversation again:
    a-That was about speed feats and reactions times.
    b-Nobody states Sasuke is smarter then Minato.

    Straw man arguments again ignoring what we are discussion and making up crep.

    Quote Quote:
    Danzou has insane speed?
    You are grasping at straws here
    He has feats. Dodging Susano (even if he got hit a little). Susano pops in your face faster then a lighting bolt hits the ground. This is not me grasping at straws, are events that happened in the manga.

    Quote Quote:
    You lack hatred
    And more nosense. Aparently when you run out of arguments you start posting nonsense. Well gratz.
    Last edited by xXan; July 25, 2012 at 08:48 AM.

  15. #45
    MH Senpai 伝説メンバー / Densetsu / Legendary Member M3J's Avatar
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    Re: Team JMan vs Team Orochimaru

    Quote Originally Posted by jaymizzo View Post
    Actually that was Hiraishin. Sadly.

    I still do not understand why people do not understand that the only reason Sasuke reacted to 1 or 2 of Bee and Raikages movements was because they were in linear motion and using straight forward attacks.
    Wasn't Rock Lee moving in linear motion and using straightforward attacks as well? I forgot, but Sasuke still failed to dodge even though his eyes kept up. Sasuke's ability to keep up even to some degree and react in time does show he has enough speed and reflexes, otherwise Killerbee and Raikage would have just speedblitzed him. Sharingan alone won't help if you can't react fast enough.


    But I don't see anyone being able to take out Orochimaru. I doubt he'll let people continuously hit his body over and over and make him waste chakra. Even without his arms, he was able to be on par with Jiraiya, although Jiraiya did have messed up chakra control. And even against Naruto, Orochimaru was fightin with a body that was failing on him.


    And no, no comparing how Jiraiya did against Four-Tailed Kyuubi to how Orochimaru did. That's stupid, unless Jiraiya was also fighting the Kyuubi Naruto. FOr all we know, he got blindsided and since Naruto is his pupil and godson, Jiraiya wasn't trying to hurt Naruto.

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