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View Poll Results: Who wins?

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  • Team "Rasengan"

    9 69.23%
  • Team "Immortal"

    4 30.77%
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Thread: Team "Rasengan" vs Team "Immortals"

  1. #1
    MangaHelper MH中毒 / MH Chuudoku / MH Addicted Rikudou King's Avatar
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    Team "Rasengan" vs Team "Immortals"

    Combatants
    - Team "Rasengan": Minato, Jiraiya, Kakashi, and Naruto
    - Team "Immortal": Kakuzu, Hidan, Sasori, and Tobi.

    Battlefield
    - Destroyed Uchiha Compound, 10m apart.

    Conditions
    - Team with the last survivor wins.
    - Both sides only have basic knowledge of the other, but no previous knowledge from any canon fights.
    - Both teams have had time to come up with a basic plan and are willing to help their teammates gather blood or stall for time.
    - Minato has 15 tags with him, but no tags upon the field at the start.
    - Naruto can use Sage Mode and draw on the Kyuubi's chakra, but he can't transform into any cloak form.
    - Tobi only has the Sharingan and can not leave the battlefield to grab another Sharingan or stay away for more then five minutes at a time.
    - Obviously no Rinnegan or Kyuubi summoning for Tobi.
    - All characters have any tools or weapons and can use any techniques they have shown, except what previously disallowed.
    - All characters start in their respective "base modes" and are fighting to win.
    Last edited by Rikudou King; July 26, 2012 at 09:53 PM.

  2. #2
    MH Senpai 伝説メンバー / Densetsu / Legendary Member M3J's Avatar
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    Re: Team "Rasengan" vs Team "Immortals"

    Team Immortal.

  3. #3
    Registered User MH中毒 / MH Chuudoku / MH Addicted xXan's Avatar
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    Re: Team "Rasengan" vs Team "Immortals"

    Hidan: This dude is irrelevant. He get's 1 shoot with Kamui. No idea how Tobi stoped Kamui in the manga and if he can do that again here. To the point i know that Tobi can disable Kamui under the conditions we have in this fight i am going to asume Kakashi can do this.

    Sasori: Kakashi finds his hearth with sharingan, Kamui = dead. This dude would be a horible problem as he has a lot of aoe but Kakashi can kill him like this.

    Tobi can't make the both of them intangible and he can't just stay close to them constantly to protect them.

    Then just buy time till JMan get's to SM. Naruto having some 50 SM clones to run around would work wonders.

    Then Tobi is the only real big problem here but the team should be able to take him down even if they have to w8 for the frog song.

    EDIT: I read something wrong in the OP, considering they only have basic info about one another i have to go with team immortals...

    Also Rikudou King what did you meant by no Kyuubi summoning for Tobi?

    Quote Originally Posted by M3J View Post
    Team Immortal.
    Try to elaborate on your oppinion. It always helps. No point just stating X wins, you can just use the poll for that.
    Last edited by xXan; July 27, 2012 at 04:54 AM.

  4. #4
    MH Senpai 有名人 / Yuumeijin / Celebrity Uchiha_Blood's Avatar
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    Re: Team "Rasengan" vs Team "Immortals"

    Quote Originally Posted by xXan View Post
    Also Rikudou King what did you meant by no Kyuubi summoning for Tobi?
    It means that Tobi can't use/summon Kyuubi like he did in the Kushina flashback.


    Mmh... I was gonna say team Rasengan on first impact, but I have to reconsider since Sasori, the true Sasori, not the Fodderized ET is a beast on team fights.
    Gonna elaborate on it later

  5. #5
    MH Senpai 伝説メンバー / Densetsu / Legendary Member M3J's Avatar
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    Re: Team "Rasengan" vs Team "Immortals"

    Hidan and Kakuzu together are deadly. Kamui will work only if Kakashi takes out HIdan's head otherwise if it falls near them like Deidara's arm did, I think, Kakuzu will be able to reattach it. Kakashi can't use Kamui instantly anyway, he'll leave himself open. He usually concentrates so he doesn't waste chakra.

    not to mention, HIdan's immortality makes him a great bait, especially for Kakuzu, who can use any attack. Tobi and Sasori can get blood somehow for HIdan to use. Shikamaru didn't even realize what Hidan was doing until after Asuma got injured. Hidan will probably go for killing move here instead of sparing any of the team Rasengan whose blood he has.

  6. #6
    MH Senpai 有名人 / Yuumeijin / Celebrity Uchiha_Blood's Avatar
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    Re: Team "Rasengan" vs Team "Immortals"

    Quote Originally Posted by xXan View Post
    Perhaps i am slow but i still don't get it. Summon it from inside Naruto and make it brake lose or how?
    This is a battle arena, meaning that if the creator of the thread so wants he can make Tobi summon Kyuubi at will, it was simply a condition, an obvious condition as he himself said.

    This is how the fight would went down imho:
    as usual, Tobi would transport Yondaime away from the battlefield, since he is the worst threat possible for both Kakuzu and Hidan ( they get marked, they get pwned ), so it would went down to a 3 vs 3 fight.
    Basic knowledge would mean that they would know not to get too physical with Hidan at the risk of drawing blood, so Naruto would be the ideal man for the job:
    he can go into Sage Mode with ease, and has both superior speed and sensing abilities, plus he would be able to hit Hidan without actually touching him.
    He doesn't even need to behead him, an Oodama Rasengan to the gut and Hidan is history, he is immortal, but he doesn't regenerate, meaning if he has a broken body he can't likely move.
    Or simply Naruto would catch the schyte and break it to pieces.

    Meanwhile it would be Kakuzu and Sasori vs Jiraiya and Kakashi.
    Jiraiya would summon a strong summon to being, as to have another element to deal with Kakuzu on top of his own, or simply using it to buy time to enter Sage Mode.
    He still needs to support though since Sasori can't lose against Kakashi ( Hiruko can protect him from a first Kamui, and him summoning 100 puppets would protect him from any other Kamui ), expecially in a team battle.
    Still Sasori can't spam his iron sand since it would put out of combat Kakuzu and his hearts too, meaning he has to be cautious about it.
    If team Rasengan can stall, Naruto would enter the fray, and team Sasori/Kakuzu would be overwhelmed, seriously Tajuu KB + Oodama Rasengan is too much of an attack for almost anybody to withstand, it blasted away freakin' Kyuubi for god sake, and I doubt Sasori or Kakuzu are even comparable to Kyuubi's resilience or power.
    After this it would be a tired Naruto, Jiraiya in SM and Kakashi ( if survives ) waiting for the result of the Tobi vs Yondaime battle, which, again, is 50/50:
    while having the fan really doesn't matter ( hell, if he block a rasengan with it Yondaime can mark it and appear anywhere Tobi is ) as Yondaime said it was only a matter of timing.
    Still not knowing about V2 should allow the win for Yondaime yet again, and so it would spell a win for team Rasengan.

    If Tobi wins, I really don't know how it would went down, since Jiraiya with Ma and Pa is way better at support than Gai and Kakashi combined, yet Naruto wouldn't have Chakra Mode, so he would be slower.
    With KB spam though he should be able to be effective against Tobi, and Kakashi can do whatever he is doing now.
    Hell use Kamui to make Tobi tangible while he blocks it, so Jiraiya and Naruto can rush him and deal a killing blow.

    80/20 for Team Rasengan

  7. #7
    Registered User MH中毒 / MH Chuudoku / MH Addicted xXan's Avatar
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    Re: Team "Rasengan" vs Team "Immortals"

    @Uchiha_Blood

    Dude i am not arguing with the OP, i am asking what it means as i don't get it.

    _________


    Deleated a post i made to M3J as aparently i need glasses i read the "the no information from cannon fights to" information from cannon fights" for some reason.

  8. #8
    MangaHelper MH中毒 / MH Chuudoku / MH Addicted Rikudou King's Avatar
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    Re: Team "Rasengan" vs Team "Immortals"

    I remembered at least two battle threads where Tobi was given the ability to summon the Kyuubi despite it being sealed away, so I simply thought I should clarify that that's one technique he can't preform here. Perhaps I could have worded it better.

    Anyway, while Sasori is the most vulnerable on his team, don't forget that he's capable of covering the field in poisonous smoke and if he gave his teammates some of his poison to use, that would make taking down their opponents easier.

  9. #9
    MangaHelper 有名人 / Yuumeijin / Celebrity Impossibility's Avatar
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    Re: Team "Rasengan" vs Team "Immortals"

    This is tough. But, I think I'm leaning toward Team Immortals. As Rikudou King points out, Sasori utilises poisons. A single scratch, or mistaken breath, would be disastrous for any member of Team Rasengan. With as many puppets as Sasori has access to, he is likely to score some hits. Add the use of the Iron Sand for defense, and Sasori is particularly useful for team battles. Hidan isn't too much of a threat for any of Team Rasengan in one-on-ones, but if he scores a hit amidst the chaos of the battle he is obviously immensely problematic. Tobi is his regular talented self. Kakuzu is monstrous, as long as he doesn't decide to become an amateur and take shots. Minato is obviously problematic, but I think if Tobi receives support from one of his teammates he becomes heavily favoured for victory. Naruto & Jiraiya have great offensive capabilities, but neither are capable of handling Tobi, or capable of handling Sasori's army of puppets without sustaining injury. Kakashi is completely outclassed by the members of Team Immortals, with the possible exception of Hidan, who has the advantage with the whole 'immortal' thing. Team Immortals has the advantage of being immensely difficult to kill, obviously, but also has great offensive options. For me, Team Immortal is the likelier winner.

  10. #10
    Registered User 英雄メンバー / Eiyuu Menbaa / Hero Member chilibun's Avatar
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    Re: Team "Rasengan" vs Team "Immortals"

    Quote Originally Posted by xXan View Post
    Hidan: This dude is irrelevant. He get's 1 shoot with Kamui. No idea how Tobi stoped Kamui in the manga and if he can do that again here. To the point i know that Tobi can disable Kamui under the conditions we have in this fight i am going to asume Kakashi can do this.

    Sasori: Kakashi finds his hearth with sharingan, Kamui = dead. This dude would be a horible problem as he has a lot of aoe but Kakashi can kill him like this.

    Tobi can't make the both of them intangible and he can't just stay close to them constantly to protect them.

    Then just buy time till JMan get's to SM. Naruto having some 50 SM clones to run around would work wonders.

    Then Tobi is the only real big problem here but the team should be able to take him down even if they have to w8 for the frog song.
    Tobi can negate Kamui. Don't really know how its done, but its pretty clear that he could. If Sasori is not taken out quickly, he can use the Kazekage puppet's Iron needle sphere attack to kill like the whole team depending on their positioning. The AOE on that thing is pretty huge and all it takes is a stratch because of the poison. And whoever actually manages to completely dodge all the needles (which is unlikely) is essentially trapped, and Tobi can just phase in and warp them.

    Hidan isn't much of a factor in terms of actual combat abilities, but nobody knows about his abilities. If any members of team rasengan even gets injured, Hidan can just get the blood from his teammates or even from the ground for an easy kill.
    Last edited by chilibun; July 27, 2012 at 11:17 PM.

  11. #11
    Registered User 有名人 / Yuumeijin / Celebrity jaymizzo's Avatar
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    Re: Team "Rasengan" vs Team "Immortals"

    Quote Originally Posted by chilibun View Post
    Tobi can negate Kamui. Don't really know how its done, but its pretty clear that he could.
    You always say people make things up, yet you come up with something like this. Tobi has not shown the ability to negate Kamui. Until he does so without words then the assumption that he can/could is wrong.
    "Man hands misery onto man" - Philip Larkin

  12. #12
    Registered User 英雄メンバー / Eiyuu Menbaa / Hero Member chilibun's Avatar
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    Re: Team "Rasengan" vs Team "Immortals"

    Quote Originally Posted by jaymizzo View Post
    You always say people make things up, yet you come up with something like this. Tobi has not shown the ability to negate Kamui. Until he does so without words then the assumption that he can/could is wrong.
    Uh... did you not read the latest chapter? It looked to me like Tobi did something to block Kakashi's Kamui on Gedo. I could be wrong since its quite unclear on exactly what happened, but yea it did look to me like he did something. Tobi notices Naruto's attack, then Kakashi's Kamui, and instead of becoming intangible like he almost always does, he uses his fan to pull himself away from Naruto's attack. Since Tobi can only use one of his s/t at a time and he almost always just becomes intangible instead of actually dodging attacks, it does appear that he needed to stay solid to pull off some jutsu to block Kamui. Kakashi was also quite surprised at why Kamui failed. I would assume he would know if he simply didn't have the power to rip apart Gedo, but he was clearly surprised like he had no idea what happened to his Kamui. Add that to Tobi's past comment about how Kamui is useless on him, and it does appear he can do something to negate it.
    Last edited by chilibun; July 28, 2012 at 02:12 PM.

  13. #13
    MH Senpai 伝説メンバー / Densetsu / Legendary Member M3J's Avatar
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    Re: Team "Rasengan" vs Team "Immortals"

    We don't know what Tobi did. For all we know, Kamui failed on Gedo Mazou because of what it is.


    In any case, although I voted for Jiraiya in the tournament, it was a pure fanboy vote. I think Kakuzu would be able to beat Jiraiya, at least the normal Jiraiya as long as Kakuzu could use five elements. Some of JIraiya's strongest or most useful attacks are negated by Kakuzu, like his Swamp of the Underworld, since it's weak to raiton. Not sure how water would do against fire and oil, but if it's strong enough, Kakuzu should be good there.

    Not only that, but Kakuzu's pretty fast and can attack from any range. He can surprise attack Minato, Kakashi, and Naruto as well. Hidan can be used as bait too, since he's immortal and can withstand any attack. Sasori's nearly indestructible as well, and just one touch of his claw or whatever will poison.

    The only one I see not being hit with Hidan's weapon at all is Minato because of Hiraishin. I also assume that because of the Kyuubi, Naruto should be able to withstand poison, or at least, he'll be able to react accordingly as he was poisoned before, on his first mission.

    Tobi can go against Minato. So far, Minato was not able to injure him to the point that Tobi couldn't fight. Tobi withstood a rasengan and a stab but retreated because he lost the Kyuubi. He also showed no signs that he was in pain when Konan blew up her origami, or when Tobi crushed off his arm. Minato's basically their only shot at taking out Tobi.


    Kakashi is not going to use Kamui right off the bat. This has nothing to do with his fighting style, but more with him being careful. Kakashi won't waste chakra unless he knows Kamui will work, because that leaves him open. Not only that, but he has to concentrate to use precise chakra before using Kamui, which also leaves him open. We won't be seeing Kakashi open with Kamui unless clones of Naruto and Jiraiya hold down the enemies, or Swamp of Underworld can do that job.


    Not using Tobi's ability to make Kamui useless because we have no idea how he does it, the limitation, or if he needs to prepare. I don't even know if Tobi negated Kamui or if Gedo mazou had something to do with it.

  14. #14
    Registered User 有名人 / Yuumeijin / Celebrity ashher's Avatar
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    Re: Team "Rasengan" vs Team "Immortals"

    I personally have no doubt in my mind that tobi can negate kamui, in fact i made a thread on it long time ago when he first said that kamui doesn't work on him. And as usual i find that this fight once again boils down to 'information'. Does kakashi know that tobi can negate kamui? If he doesn't know then how many times can he do kamui before he burns out? Aside from the kamui factor, another important factor will be the general battle strategy, specially at the onset. In team rasengan, its pretty obvious that naruto and jiraya would provide the raw power, covering for minato and kakashi to do their sneaky business. On team immortal kakuzu and sasori would be the ones with ranges attacks, while hidan and tobi would be the ones looking to get close. While sasori's attacks can be great, specially with so many puppets, i think naruto with his mass kage bunshin would be able to hold him off. Jiraya in sage mode with his summonings are more than a match for kakuzu's hearts. Kakashi's earth travelling tech would be nicely countered by the phasing of tobi. Seeing that minato would move over to back up kakashi. He might already have finished slitting hidan's throat by that time. Even if he does not, kakashi should have no trouble with hidan. Naruto may have trouble against sasori, but even if he is cut, his will power probably would keep him going till he lands a rasengan on sasori. Even if he fails, he should be able to hold off sasori long enough for jiraya to finish off kakuzu and move over to sasori. Most likely situation is that the fight will end up 3 vs 1 with jiraya, minato and kakashi against tobi. Or at worst for team rasengan, jiraya and naruto both may fall with sasori and kakuzu. In that case it will be 2 vs 1. Minato and kakashi should be able to finish of tobi, after his one izanagi and kakashi's one wasted kamui.

  15. #15
    Registered User 英雄メンバー / Eiyuu Menbaa / Hero Member Kazu-Sama's Avatar
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    Re: Team "Rasengan" vs Team "Immortals"

    I say Team Immortal - While Kakuzu and Sasori can spam using AoE attacks, and survive the first couple of blows thanks to hearts/puppets, then Tobi can drag Hidan underground and appear in surprise attacks, gaining blood and then retreating to kill from range. Kakuzu might die, but with Sasori's puppets proving a massive (and potentially fatal) distraction, Jiraya (who has to stay stationary to go into sage mode) is at a huge risk. Minato can dodge around the puppets, and potentially avoid poisonous gas if he knows it's coming, but team Immortal wins precisely because of their name - they're dangerous, and so hard to kill that they up winning in a war of attrition

    Epic Brofist!

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