Manga News: Check out this week's new manga (10/13/14 - 10/19/14).
Forum News: The nomination phase of the Community Awards 2014 is live! Visit new sections for Nisekoi and Kingdom!
Translations: Gintama 515 by kewl0210
@Airgrimes, since the thread seem to already close.
Ochi and Mouri were mention as "double specialist". I don't see any mention on that about no 7 and 8. So I'll assume 9 and 10 to have better coordination, actually. So, according to you, no 9-10 have better overall skill. AND from this, I'll assume they also have better coordination. That sounds like they should be rank higher to me. Of course, they are not rank higher. So one of these have to be wrong. So unless you have something that shows 7-8 coordination is better, I'll go with what the manga say. Thanks. So, because of that, I'll assume no 7-8 to have a better skill. Your turn to prove something?
If Kimijima negotiated his way up to here, no 8-20 and all HS 2nd stringer are simply stupid. He deserved that status then. I don't think he did.
On Tachibana and Chitose. They do not count as a pair in the national that year. They are not in the same team. Unless you want to suggest to me Oishi/Kikumaru can beat Sanada/Atobe or something. My point is that Chitose and Tachibana are both high tier characters. And they got beat. And Oishi beat someone who stomp the team that beat them. I really don't see how you fail to give him some credits for that. 3rd Court Pair can syncho. I also think it's not unreasonable to assume they are stronger than the golden pair at the start of Shin.
So, next month, Kite will aim for Tohno?
I don't know why is this happening, why Kite is following Kimijima's orders, why he negotiates with him. The only reason might be facing a higher rank.
Marui's ability to dodge balls from behind is impressive also, but he can't do anything right now as Tohno and Kite are aiming for him, I just think Kite will go for Tohno next month and they'll make a comeback, or the negotiation goes on and they lose.
But HOW does this prove either Tohno or Kimijima are better than Ochi?
Individually, Konomi hasn't shown whether or not No. 8 is better than No.9.
It's like Taira/Hara pair and Mutsu/Mutsu. Can we guarantee Taira would lose to either of the Mutsu's in Singles??
The manga doesn't say that individually Tohno and Kimijima are better than Ochi so...
Golden Pair VS Sanada/Atobe?? Both Sanada and Atobe would kill Tachibana and Chitose lol.
Sanada/Atobe would kick the ass of a lot of pairs right now. Maybe every pair.
Chitose has Kamikakushi, a more than returnable shot when in Doubles. Abare Dama, will be returnable after a while especially if the opponents have shared vision in Synchro.
We can count Tachibana/Chitose as an MS pair though. And even if they were in the Nationals, you telling me they could have beaten Golden Pair with Synchro?
Golden Pair are the only MS pair who can compete with Doubles opponents who in Singles would kick their ass.
Whether they are a Nationals pair or not, Tachibana/Chitose are not better than Oishi/Kikumaru.
Also, Washio/Suzuki only won 7-6 against them, so we knew that they couldn't necessarily be amazing.
I don't know how you feel Golden Pair, Washio/Suzuki and Wings of Kyushu are all one level.
No Acrobatic Play, No Seal Step, No Special techniques at all, No Oishi Territory, I don't know man, I never once thought that Washio/Suzuki would bt Golden Pair after I saw their match.
I think that Kimijima is negotiating with Kite a spot in the top 10, cause he does not like the Tohno style, so, Kite need to aim Tohno to had his spot, and Marui is just a leftover part.., sorry for my bad english...
Isn't Kite supposed to be called the "Killer" rather than the "Hitman" ? Someone correct me if I'm wrong please.
Nvm, killer and hitman pretty much means the same anyways.
This is the PoT universe and all, but shouldn't the referee say something about Kite going against Marui? Shouldn't they atleast warn him or something.
And why would Kimijima want Tohno to be beaten, he's getting something out of it.
Last edited by Ryonix; September 05, 2012 at 04:06 PM.
Konomi is running out of ideas hardcore.
This is getting ridiculous, I don't want to think what kind of players are the rest of the G10 are. Kimijima and Tohno are a joke, they don't seem that strong, Atobe/Niou would have destroyed them with Synchro. I hope Konomi isn't showing their true power yet, if not they're lame characters.
I find the idea FuRinKaZan mentioned to be one of the more plausible ones for this situation. Even though we had lots of people getting beat up on the court, there was still a distinction between that and attacking people outside of matches.
We've seen Tohno do the latter multiple times already, so it's not too farfetched to say that it reflects poorly on the team (and those are the guys that represent Japan at international events no less) and Kimijima might want him removed because of that (or maybe because Kimijima has the most public exposure of the G10 and Tohno is kinda nuts).
The deal would be something along the lines of both Marui and Tohno getting KO'd (or permanently damaged in Tohno's case) with Kimijima keeping No. 7 and Kite taking No. 8. Of course it's possible that this is just one of Kimijima's tricks.
The example itself doesn't imply either GP > WoK or the other way around though, or at least that's how I interpreted it.
It's also not like we have any proof that GP would do better against the twins that Washio/Suzuki did. Oishi/Niou were losing in a Synchro battle and it was only because of Niou's ability to disrupt the Mutsus' Synchro that they won.
Lastly we've never seen anyone use any special techniques or movements while in Synchro (from what I recall at least), so none of them are necessarily relevant.
Personally I feel like WoK is above GP but won't get the spots because plot. They most definitely had better bases when the camp started, had equal improvement rates to Kikumaru (although Oishi's was probably a bit higher) and got Synchro as well, maybe a better version at that.
You think Golden Pair would be equal to WoK without Tachibana and Chitose without using any special shot? Oishi Territory and Seal Step and Acrobatic Play are top combinations.
WoK were equal with Washio/Suzuki before they had used a shot.
I think GP would comfortably defeat Tachibana/Chitose if you take away Kamikakushi and Abare Dama from them.
Since Marui and Jackal froze in fear when they saw Synchro and despite being individually better didn't stand a chance.
So Tachibana and Chitose likely had higher stats than Washio and Suzuki.
Do you really think Shiraishi, Kirihara, WoK individually had weaker stats than them?
Outside of Synchro they were 3-2 up against Tachibana/Chitose who were at Game Point and they hadn't even used Abare Dama or Kamikakushi yet.
I kept thinking hold on, these doubles specialists were toe-to-toe against WoK without any special shots? That's not a good look.
I'm sorry but there is no proof Washio or Suzuki are better Singles Players than Kikumaru at all. Kikumaru no longer sucks. His stamina is solid and he has Seal Step. He is a good Singles player.
So yeah The Synchro with the higher abilities win, but nothing suggests Washio/Suzuki have necessarily higher abilities.
They probably climbed their way to 3rd Court since they could use Synchro.
Looks like Kikumaru is using Acrobatic Play here. So you should probably change the theory.
Marui/Jackal >> Kikumaru/Oishi pair in terms of stats. Synchro changes that. Completely.
Last edited by Airgrimes; September 06, 2012 at 04:50 PM.
That means GP loses the Synchro battle. If only Washio/Suzuki use Synchro, they win as well (I hope this is obvious).
A better example to combat my point is Atobe using AK, although in that case I would argue that it's a result of his Insight and not a technique in the traditional sense of the word. We haven't seen any of the traditional synchro pairs use any special shots or steps so far.
AK is a technique outside of their base skills however.
To see Kikumaru in that completely sideways position in the air and not say it was down to Acrobatic Play seems a bit off.
Inui/Kaidoh individually destroy Shishido/Ootori however Shishido and Ootori comfortably beat them.
So it's wrong it say it implies roughly equal bases.
Nothing suggests that Tachibana and Chitose individually had lower/equal bases than 3rd Court.
I mean think about it.
They weren't really a level above the MSers. Only Irie and Yamato in terms of skill were above.
Nakagauchi, Miyako, Matsudaira looking back at them, what about them says that Tachibana or Chitose would struggle against them individually?
Shiraishi and Akutsu, other MSers from the 5th Court who individually I couldn't see them having trouble with old 3rd Court during the Team Shuffle.
And Oishi doesn't have Acrobatic Play.
Akutsu, Tachibana, Chitose, Kite, Ishida even Kirihara don't seem like they would really be below Washio or Suzuki in terms of stats.
Just be honest, if you see the guys I mentioned having trouble with Washio or Suzuki.
Secondly, Shishido by himself was able to shut down Kaidou completely on his own and I don't think it's farfetched to say he would have won in a singles match (not saying he would have definitely won or anything, but saying he'd have outright lost just doesn't sound right).
Lastly, if Inui and Kaidou hadn't been dumb about it, the match would have been a lot closer.
As opposed to
While this doesn't prove that their bases were lower/equal, it certainly suggests it.
On the flipside, there's also nothing to suggest that Tachibana or Chitose would defeat them as easily as you seem to believe.
although it is only Akutsu's opinion). I'll give you Akutsu, but it was already implied by Oni that he was above most of the other MSers at the time.
That being said, I don't think Kirihara or Gin would comfortably beat them.