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Translations: Gintama 515 (2)
Ok, I don't know if opening a thread about this topic is the right thing to do or not (I'll leave to Alpha the decision), but considering that many people (and me) are wondering how Ithnan and the others could betray Solomon, I decided to do this.
So now I will tell you what, in my opinion, has been the catalyst for their betrayal.
Solomon being an high-ranking member of the Church seems to be the main reason. In fact as many people pointed out, Arba refers to him as young master, which means that in the past he must have belonged to a very important family which had some connections with the Church. For some reason I think that this fact led Ithnan and the others to betray Solomon. Why is that? Let me explain: Solomon is looking for the divine staves, which are currently in the Church's hands and are said to be really powerful. Now, what do you think would happen if Ithnan and the others would discover that Solomon, an ex-high-ranking member of the Church, gathered all the staves that they thought he would have disposed of and used them to bring forth the Utopia that he desired for Alma Toran? They would obviously feel betrayed, hurt, used and so on. But if it's really like that, then why didn't Solomon tell them anything? The reason in my opinion can be explained through Solomon's behaviour and way of thinking. He thought that Ithnan and the others would understand what his true aim was, because he really trusted them and he didn't have an hidden agenda with the gathering of staves to begin with, other than bringing peace to Alma Toran. Unfortunately things didn't go as he hoped and as a result, the world that he had created, was destroyed....
So, what do you think? Let's share all of our thoughts.
Last edited by Zasz; March 18, 2014 at 10:30 AM.
Gyokuen who we can assume is Sheba says that Solomon is arrogant. I think it comes from the fact that he became really powerful, so powerful that he did some things that could be viewed as a sacrilege against Ill Illa. Whether it's because he decided to create a new wold, or he used the staves to create an utopia, we don't know yet, but I'm pretty sure it's something along those lines. But I pretty much agree with what you said.
Another thing, Falan seems to hate the Djinns and the creatures that Solomon created in general(from Sinbad no bouken).So I think Solomon ended up giving the staves to the other species, when they're not supposed to hold them according to the Church. I think the staves allowed them to becomes Djinns.
Aladdin is obviously solomon, and i agree sheeba is gyokuen
Gyokuen would not know aladdin is the reincarnation of solomon if she were not aware of what went downdown on alma toran
what we are seeing now is the foundation for her bitterness, and the beginning of how she came to despise and eventually betray solomon
great thread idea by the way
the element the peaks my curiosity is why did ithnan betray solomon as well
he must have been jealous of solomon, or his ideals differed enough to allow him to be tempted by the black god
What you purpose makes a lot of sense, but in the last chapter (218) it was confirmed that all of them where once members of the church, so I don't know if they would suddenly start thinking that Solomon would betray them or have a secret agenda out of the blue.
I think that even though they were members of the church they still believed in the utopia that humans tried to built and failed until Solomon came in.Maybe in their eyes Solomon betrayed that purpose and those ideals by doing something that is yet to be revealed.Or maybe they didn't believe that the world should have one king.
But I think that they don't know that he was an high-ranking member of the Church.
Besides, I think that what ladyola and I just said (Solomon using the staves to bring forth the Utopia he envisioned), might have led Ithnan and the others to think that he wasn't any different from the Church.
Using something powerful and dangerous to create something good, which seems to be the main focus of the manga right now.
P.S: I'm glad to have started this discussion.
Last edited by Zasz; March 19, 2014 at 03:33 AM.
The last two chapters revealed a lot.
Solomon is the son of the head of the Church, David. All his allies know this, so I'm not sure that will cause their betrayal. Solomon gave the staves to the other species, giving them magic and is using it to build a utopia together. Again, his allies know this and seem to support him. Next chapter is a time-skip, so let's see if that changes anything.
In the scene where Alma Toran is being destroyed and the medium is descending, Solomon says, "So you didn't allow it in the end." I wonder what exactly Gyouken/Al thamen didn't allow.
Last edited by cos7; March 31, 2014 at 12:58 AM.