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Translations: Gintama 515 (2)
There isn't enough time to show 30 or so improvements and there can be improvements outside of special moves (even significant ones). That being said, he doesn't need a significant improvement because...
Adding to that, Hiyoshi is prepared much better for this than Shiraishi or Kirihara were. Remember the court on the cliff where every shot had an irregular bounce? Any serve that's as fast as Flower requires the same reaction speed there, and we got to know that everyone was able to return that stuff by the end.
I don't think Hiyoshi would have too much problems to return Flower as Tannahuser is an even harder serve to return.
Matsudaira only has excellent speed, but if Hiyoshi returns Flower, I think he can win the match, he should have improved quite a bit and should be able to defeat a 3rd court guy. Hiyoshi wins 6/3 or 6-4.
Do you think Hiyoshi is stronger than National! Shiraishi? I don't think so. And National! Shiraishi got dominated by flower.
I ask this before in Tachibana/Chitose thread. Are we counting possible improvement+plot power? To quote the exact word, "So, improvement and plot seem to be a legit assumption for everyone? I know whos winning when it's Ryoma vs anyone then. "
At least three people repeated what you said and it was annoying repeating myself.
The point still stands that they ''improved'' in the Mountains, and you're a liar if you can tell me specifcally how Hiyoshi improved. Since we haven't been told a thing in detail where he improved. All we know is he can hit irregular bounds, so we're talking about a slight boost in Technique.
Therefore, if he doesn't get a significant boost, he shouldn't really do well against Matsudaira.
So he returned THS that he has seen nearly everyday from after Regionals right through til the Camp invitation.
Nationals!Shiraishi who broke down the counters of Fuji had to remove a weight to return it. Nationals!Shiraishi > Hiyoshi right now.
Don't see Hiyoshi beating Nationals!Fuji (No CE/6th Counter included).
We don't need to see 30 improvements to judge on other BJB members improvement.
Tooyama, Momoshiro, Kawamura, Niou, Kabaji clearly improved.
Oishi and Kenya also improved. But you can't prove they improved by much.
Going by that, only the Higher level players showed good improvement.
Don't see why we should suggest Hiyoshi improved much. We just know he improved, and he wasn't that good to begin with.
Hiyoshi does have potential, but he isnt beating Matsudaira.
If Matsudaira was taking games from Nationals!Shiraishi with just a serve, although I don't think in Singles he would beat Nationals!Shiraishi, I know it has to trouble Hiyoshi.
Since when did returning a shot you know so well mean you can return every other serve?
Flower Serve and THS have completely different concepts.
Flower Serve is more along the lines of Twist Serve, Knuckle Serve and Kick Serve while Tannhauser Serve lands like Tsubame Gaeshi.
Hiyoshi shows no reason to be at that level.
I don't see him beating Marui or Hirakoba for starters.
---------- Post added at 10:28 AM ---------- Previous post was at 10:22 AM ----------
We don't know if its the same time.
I doubt we should really be assuming everybody from the Mountain training is suddenly immune to sudden-movement-style serves like Knuckle Serve and Flower Serve.
Since your now implying Richard Sakata can now handle Flower Serve after Mountain training. Since Hiyoshi partnered up with Sakata during that scene.
BM!Kirihara is better than Hiyoshi lol. Since Ryoma didn't use Muga no Kyouchi against Hiyoshi but he used Muga against Kirihara.
BM!Kirihara > Hiyoshi on that note.
Since Ryoma wasn't even in Muga against Hiyoshi as he hadn't mastered it yet.
We can discuss about the winner here, but I don't think Hiyoshi will struggle against Flower throughout the whole match.
Either way Kaoz, returning the irregular bounds in the mountains means he can return Flower after a game or two sure, but Matsudaira is likely more than Flower.
Hiyoshi shouldn't have reached able to defeat old 3rd Court yet.
Honestly I just don't think its right to assume that Hiyoshi could have improved that much.
Only a few from the Mountains made significant improvement.
In fact, not many MSers in general have made significant noticeable improvement. Don't see why we should assume Hiyoshi should have.
Hiyoshi VS Matsudaira, Although most people have come here and written Hiyoshi off as losing this, they aren't wrong.
Can't see why we should assume Hiyoshi has made a massive jump.
This is a definete Matsudaira win.
Hiyoshi Wakashi: 1 vote
Matsudaira Chikahiko: 11 votes
Winner: Matsudaira Chikahiko