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Thread: Weekly Shonen Jump [2012-2013] - Discussion and TOC Talk - Part 4

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    Re: Weekly Shonen Jump [2012-2013] - Discussion and TOC Talk - Part 4

    The biggest pimpimg for Toriko would be airing together with One Piece in a movie and it's anime shedule. Color pages and so on were given to bleach and kuroko as much.

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    Registered User MH中毒 / MH Chuudoku / MH Addicted k-dom's Avatar
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    Re: Weekly Shonen Jump [2012-2013] - Discussion and TOC Talk - Part 4

    I agree with kewl0210, there is nothing shocking in giving more exposure to an established author. So the "pimping" of Toriko was quite logical in term of "business". And if it was indeed done, was it wrong ? Now a lot of us are happy that this serie has become appreciated. The Toriko forum has only good feedback from the readers, that's far from being the same everywhere...

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    Re: Weekly Shonen Jump [2012-2013] - Discussion and TOC Talk - Part 4

    we are not arguing about whether it's a bad or a good thing,someone said that "The only series that was noticeably "pimped" in the last 4 years was Kuroko no Basket " so we are just mentioning that toriko was heavily pimped
    a story that can reach the hearts of people all around the world no matter what their culture or background is and be their favorite is truly and definitely a masterpiece . i hope you last a bit more Naruto. thanks Kishi for the most epic manga

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    Re: Weekly Shonen Jump [2012-2013] - Discussion and TOC Talk - Part 4

    It's good to remember that in the early chapters of Dragon Ball, it had almost the same treatment as Toriko. It had a lot of first and second positions in the first 8 chapters.
    (Source: http://www.biwa.ne.jp/~starman/index.htm )

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    Re: Weekly Shonen Jump [2012-2013] - Discussion and TOC Talk - Part 4

    Ah I wasn't closed to specific enough. I was using pimped for series that weren't doing well being pushed like they were i.e. Kuroko ranking in the bottom 5 but still getting a bunch of color pages. I'm sure there are more cases, I just don't recall at the moment.


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    Re: Weekly Shonen Jump [2012-2013] - Discussion and TOC Talk - Part 4

    Quote Originally Posted by perroloco View Post

    TORIKO in the other hand had lots of exposure, heck one of its first Color pages had an aroma on it IIRC, this has never been done before (At least that I remember) in the history of WSJ (Dunno about other manga magazines though).

    but you can't deny it was heavily pimped to be the next big thing *As in Bleach-Naruto level* sadly the last thing that could have gone to those levels was D-Gray man but it really lost its stride with the mangakas schedule and changing to SQ.
    Well it's a nice gimmick, which makes sense with a cooking manga, which don't come "that" often, what's wrong with giving the readers a treat? The mangaka is using the readers ideas, so it's nice to get something back. And well, I've had smelling magazines twenty years ago already, with Micky Mouse or some random stickers. It's not that new or special.

    You could hardly promote something in terms of Naruto/OP/Bleach if it's a complete different genre as in AssClass or Kuroko no Basket. It makes sense for them to promote it as such, readers will automatically associate it with some hits, which can't go wrong unless it's a whole different series as introduced.

    WSJ promotes a lot of new series, some more, some less, but it's doing so nearly constantly.

    Quote Originally Posted by Asgaroth View Post
    Whats good about turning the black to red? it feels unnatural and is kinda heart to read, at least in scanlations of mangas. I don't understand its appeal.
    It worked fucking well with a series as Slam Dunk, which has it's main colors in red, black, white.
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    Re: Weekly Shonen Jump [2012-2013] - Discussion and TOC Talk - Part 4

    Quote Originally Posted by perroloco View Post
    HAHAHAHAAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA

    No.. is this post for real? You are joking, right?

    JUMP pimped TORIKO soooooooooooooo much, probably because they either wanted to erase from people minds the fact that the mangaka is a sex offender or because they really were longing for an action manga and lets face it TORIKO didn't live up to what WSJ wanted it to be, Assclass did waaay better with not nearly as much marketing involved and so did Bakuman.
    Kuroko too.

    TORIKO in the other hand had lots of exposure, heck one of its first Color pages had an aroma on it IIRC, this has never been done before (At least that I remember) in the history of WSJ (Dunno about other manga magazines though).


    BTW I am not saying its good or bad, I wouldn't know since I never read it, but you can't deny it was heavily pimped to be the next big thing *As in Bleach-Naruto level* sadly the last thing that could have gone to those levels was D-Gray man but it really lost its stride with the mangakas schedule and changing to SQ.

    Also PIMPing doesn''t mean its a bad manga.. It (from what I understand PIMPing is, since I am not a native english-speaker) is to receive way more exposure or be priviliged than other series. Toriko certainly had more exposure while other hits from the same time like Bakuman didn't had as much.
    I feel that if Psyren got more pimping and an anime adaption it could have been the next HUGE series.

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    Re: Weekly Shonen Jump [2012-2013] - Discussion and TOC Talk - Part 4

    IIRC the bichrome being in red was also one of the reasons for Goku's Cloths changing from blue to red.

    But not everything is turn into red.. I.e say Piccolo, he was drawn using greyish, same with Yuusuke's green clothes which Togashi used greyish in bichrome.. Though IIRC other mangakas didnt care that much, i.e. I got an old issue and it haa bichromes of Hokuto no ken and Kenshiro is.. All in red while a greyish tone would have suited his blueish clothing.

    BTW which was the last bichrome manga in JUMP? I know ONE PIECE got at least 2 of them, one bunch in chapter 1 the other in like chapter 17 or something.. HXH had for its initial chapter but Shaman King didn't.

    So think about it, Kenshin wears pinkish-red tones, Dragon ball's main cast have orangeish tones, Slam Dunk cast is all red too, all of JUMP biggest hits in the 90s were very bichrome friendly, except for Togashi, he must love green.. Gon, Yuusuke.. (Ey green ftw! Its my fav color :-) )

    Heck, even today's JUMP hits, One Piece Luffy wears red, Naruto orange and Bleach is all black but Ichigo's hair is orange so it fits, same with Toriko.
    Last edited by perroloco; February 01, 2013 at 01:49 AM.

  11. #1149
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    Re: Weekly Shonen Jump [2012-2013] - Discussion and TOC Talk - Part 4

    Quote Originally Posted by k-dom View Post
    Are you a member of jump to know if they have done this or that ? We have learned from a credible source that Hungry joker rank was higher than it's real poll. That was the editor decision and it's their own right to eventually balance the poll results if they feel it's better this way. They did it for 2 weeks what is the big deal. Where is the conspiracy against the manga reader ? We know nothing about the poll results so how can you know they didn't do the same for other series in the past. Didn't they decide to keep cross manage and cancel kurogane when this one was doing better according to the last tocs ? How do you explain that assassination classroom beat 15 year old series like naruto and one piece. Isn't it reasonable to think that one vote for a new serie weight more than old series ones.
    Jump readers know that the popularity will affect greatly the future of the serie, that's enough for them to send poll because if they like a serie they need to make it known. After the editor still have their word to say and we can't feel betray or anything of something we don't know.
    That's not the same as placing a series higher than it actually polled to give the illusion that it's first chapters were well-received. Keeping one basement-dweller over another is an editorial choice. So is placing a series higher than it actually polled, but it isn't disingenuous.

    All that being said, I don't see a series being placed higher than it ranked as being that damaging, as long as it doesn't become a habit. It sort of became a moot point though, as Kaiten said.

    Quote Originally Posted by Drmke View Post
    Ah I wasn't closed to specific enough. I was using pimped for series that weren't doing well being pushed like they were i.e. Kuroko ranking in the bottom 5 but still getting a bunch of color pages. I'm sure there are more cases, I just don't recall at the moment.
    Exactly. If you guys can't see the difference between Kuroko being pushed and Toriko being pushed, then I don't know what to say. Two completely different situations there. After the switch for PoT to Jump SQ and ES21 ending, WSJ clearly wanted to keep a sports series in their magazine. It isn't all that different from what they've done with RomCom/Ecchi series in the past. That doesn't mean they didn't see promise in Kuroko or the author, but it's obvious it received special treatment and they're within their right as a publication to do so.
    Last edited by xi0; February 01, 2013 at 05:38 AM.

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    Re: Weekly Shonen Jump [2012-2013] - Discussion and TOC Talk - Part 4

    As for bichrome adding anything to the manga, well all I can say is SOME of the bichrome pages I have seen look amazing, I remember seeing a particular one of Dr. Slump which should be bichrome since its all in the typical bicromish style of using greys and reds but Toriyama was to intelligent, to this day I still have my doubts if its a true Color page or bichrome.

    Also at least red and black is better than other magazines bichromes like green and ..
    Red is the color of blood so battle scenes benefit from it IMO, and you can also emulate some skin tones with red, unless you are drawing Piccolo that won't help with green and black.

  14. #1151
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    Re: Weekly Shonen Jump [2012-2013] - Discussion and TOC Talk - Part 4

    Quote Originally Posted by perroloco View Post
    As for bichrome adding anything to the manga, well all I can say is SOME of the bichrome pages I have seen look amazing, I remember seeing a particular one of Dr. Slump which should be bichrome since its all in the typical bicromish style of using greys and reds but Toriyama was to intelligent, to this day I still have my doubts if its a true Color page or bichrome.

    Also at least red and black is better than other magazines bichromes like green and ..
    Red is the color of blood so battle scenes benefit from it IMO, and you can also emulate some skin tones with red, unless you are drawing Piccolo that won't help with green and black.
    I think those pages done in Green, Blue, or Red are just the back of some of the single pages of color. Most scanlation groups don't even keep the color and just grayscale it. I identify bichrome as specifically Red and Black, thought that might be completely wrong... It does give sort of a nostalgic feel, probably because you don't see it as often anymore. I've seen more advertisements use it in the magazine than actual manga.

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    Registered User 上級員 / Jyoukuuin / Sr. Member Estranho's Avatar
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    Re: Weekly Shonen Jump [2012-2013] - Discussion and TOC Talk - Part 4

    Quote Originally Posted by xi0 View Post
    All that being said, I don't see a series being placed higher than it ranked as being that damaging, as long as it doesn't become a habit. It sort of became a moot point though, as Kaiten said.
    Maybe it's already a habit and we don't know. How could we know for sure?
    Only in the last 2 pages of this topic, there's at least 3 another examples of editorial "changes" (even if for different reasons) in the ToC: Toriko, Dragon Ball and Kuroko no Basket. So, I don't understand all this comotion.

    Shonen Jump is bussiness, and it's silly to believe the editorial department only sit back and let untouched the readers' choises.

  17. #1153
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    Re: Weekly Shonen Jump [2012-2013] - Discussion and TOC Talk - Part 4

    Quote Originally Posted by Estranho View Post
    Maybe it's already a habit and we don't know. How could we know for sure?
    Only in the last 2 pages of this topic, there's at least 3 another examples of editorial "changes" (even if for different reasons) in the ToC: Toriko, Dragon Ball and Kuroko no Basket. So, I don't understand all this comotion.

    Shonen Jump is bussiness, and it's silly to believe the editorial department only sit back and let untouched the readers' choises.
    Well yeah, I think there's a lot of assumption at work whenever we talk about how the editorial staff operates. We do know that they place a higher importance on the questionnaires than any other magazine, but there's a lot of gray areas after that. We can say some inside information comes from a credible source and some not, but a lot of what is seen is inferred in my opinion.

    That being said, I wouldn't say there were editorial "changes" going on with Toriko or Kuroko (nothing as explicit as a fake ranking), but choices being made. Ones that you don't normally see. Like a series being hyped undeservedly, or receiving more color pages than a reader thinks they deserve. It all comes down to the perception of the reader here. I doubt a fan of Kuroko thought it received undue attention during that time. However, if you think every series is treated equally because of a system that looks as democratic as the polling system, then you're just being naive.

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    Re: Weekly Shonen Jump [2012-2013] - Discussion and TOC Talk - Part 4

    Also don't forget that japanese have a different culture and principles then western folks, as it is the case for all countries and people. Judging the ranking only based on logic could be as silly as thinking it 100% represent fair counting for reader votes. A Mangaka may is the best friend, is more favored because he doesn't lack in time. Other gets dumped down as a punishment for being late. Who knows how objective the ranking really is and in what time manner it works. It could be 9 weeks or 10 and the 2 higher HJ spots were unranked, with now its real rankings visible?

    It actually gets quite boring talking any longer about this matter without new insight infos.

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    Re: Weekly Shonen Jump [2012-2013] - Discussion and TOC Talk - Part 4

    Quote Originally Posted by xi0 View Post
    I think those pages done in Green, Blue, or Red are just the back of some of the single pages of color. Most scanlation groups don't even keep the color and just grayscale it. I identify bichrome as specifically Red and Black, thought that might be completely wrong... It does give sort of a nostalgic feel, probably because you don't see it as often anymore. I've seen more advertisements use it in the magazine than actual manga.
    Yeah, some of the advertisements use bichrome.
    And you are right, JUMP uses red but I have seen old magazines using green and blue if I my memory isnt playing tricks.. I guess the RGB colors?
    Anyway Its too unconvinient to posts those old pics of blue/green bichrome pages since I am using a tablet and my laptop is death x.x, I will post ASAP.

    Also IIRC Jaguar's ending was all color page, I assume it meant bichrome?



    EDIT. I am seeing you guys are talking about fairness in the poll..

    Didnt bakuman basically confirmed the editorial department takes the votes differently?
    I.e To love ru got less votes because kids where ashamed to vote for an ecchi manga but editors knew that.

    Final edit..
    @xio:
    About those blue/green/red "color pages" after the real color pages, no I am not talking about those, I don't consider those CP, but they stand out anyway (different paper, blue/red/green instead of worst-than-newspaper ink) so they do the same as aregular CP, make the series stand out from the other series.
    Last edited by perroloco; February 01, 2013 at 11:38 AM.

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