Weekly Shonen Jump [2012-2013] - Discussion and TOC Talk - Part 4

[k-dom]

No the artificial discussion comes from the fact that its first chapter ranked last in the polls (cf one of zerocomd earlier post) and it didn't appear in its first ranks which were rather in the middle

[cearon]

No, I just don't really follow the TOC and was confused by all the talk of the editors pimping Hungry Joker. It ranked in the middle of the magazine, 11th place in issue 8 and 9th in issue 9. While that's a respectable start for a new series, it's nothing spectacular, certainly nothing worth posting that the series was artificially high. There was talk that they were trying to protect it because it was an action series, even though it was only ranked in the middle.

you confused me man, why would editors want to protect a serie that doesnt seem to get any attention? the feeling i get from WSJ is; they wont bother with a serie if it is not doing well unless sales figures goes of the charts or dont have any viable options . Also i would assume battle manga would be the one category that gets the most submissions. it is not a niche category so there will be a better choice.

I was suprised actually when HJ went up the 2. week in ToC.

[Kaiten]

Read the last few pages, before the issue #10 TOC came out. There was a lot of talk that HJ was being protected. I don't get it either.

[Divinenega]

I'm not too sure if that'd be a good thing. The only series WSJ USA picks up just as they are released in Japan are ones that end up getting cancelled soon. Bulge and Takamagahara were cancelled less than 20 chapters in and Cross Manage isn't looking very well. Then again, maybe I'm speaking too soon. And maybe it's just a coincidence that all the more popular series WSJ USA avoid releasing happen to be too mature for Western audiences.

I also hope I'm wrong when I predict that WSJ USA may be choosing its series based on how likely they are to fail just so they can reach a quota for short stories on the magazine, the quota being there for marketing purposes or something.

Sounds a bit too crazy of a conspiracy theory even for me. At the end of the day Viz is a business and if their picking up anything, it's being done with the belief/hope that it will do well. Also in a podcast they did last week on Anime News Network they did say they want to keep trying with new series since iit generally makes it easier for readers to get invested in them than in chapter 900 of One Piece or something which makes enough sense even with the way JUMP works. Hopefully they'll just be a bit more cautious about what to take a gamble on. I do think Barrage was a logical choice at the time they picked it up since it seemed like it could be successful enough but Tamagahara on the other hand was a really bad choice.

[Pirulito]

Read the last few pages, before the issue #10 TOC came out. There was a lot of talk that HJ was being protected. I don't get it either.

It is because of that, at the end of the post: http://mangahelpers.com/forum/showth...=1#post3263217

[Kaiten]

You believe everything they say on 2CH? If so, I have a bridge for sale you might like.

[k-dom]

Why would the guy lie about hungry joker and not about the serie cancelled ? Hungry joker chapter 2 was probably last in the poll for real but it was not seen in the Toc because it's a new serie. That's just proove once more than the 8 chapters rule shall not be taken seriously but just as a tendancy, which in the case of hungry jocker is rather bad.

[cearon]

I read the post @k-dom said and @Pirulito posted. 2ch not a favourite of mine. I still dont get it. Maybe it is afterwork and my brains mushed? I also want to know how the questionairre works.

Read the last few pages, before the issue #10 TOC came out. There was a lot of talk that HJ was being protected. I don't get it either.

Good to know i am not alone at least.

[k-dom]

It's quite simple. HJ poll= last place, HJ rank ~= last place => editors decided to put HJ higher for whatever reasons

[Pirulito]

I'm just saying where it started for people who are confused.
If it is true or not, it doesnt really matter to me.

[Kaiten]

I trust Zero's information. He does a great job parsing the news, as good as anyone who's ever posted to this thread. That does not mean I'm going to indulge in conspiracy theories because one little bit of news did not come true. Hungry Joker debuted in the middle of the magazine. Nothing that special there. If it had debuted in the top five, or near, I might have been a little suspicious. Two chapters near the middle is not enough for me to think a series is being pimped, no matter what early news has been posted. And now it really has fallen to the bottom, all the conspiracies are a moot point anyway.

I take the eight chapter rule as a guideline, not an ironclad law. For my purposes, I need a cutoff, when rankings begin for a series. If rankings are not immediate, from the second chapter on, it has to start somewhere. The best available information says rankings begin at chapter eight, so for my purposes that is good enough. We may never know definitively, so why not just use the best available information?

[k-dom]

Hmm, so according to the JUMP insider the first chapter from Hungry Joker had bombed. Still the editors decided to place it outside the bottom 5. Seeing how it somehow manages to still keep afloat for the moment (this is the third not-so-shabby ranking) I can't help but wonder if its results for later chapters picked up a little or if this is still only just the editorial department protecting/pushing it...

Personally, I also thought the first few chapters were kinda meh but ever since chapter 5 it's been actually kinda enjoyable. Nothing exceptional but your regular Shounen Action series.

Wait so Hungry Joker placed last on the questionnaires, but ranked out the bottom 5 in the ToC? Is that Jump just trying to promote it?

Don't really mind seeing Kurogane go. It's a shame we never got Date-senpai translated. What i wonder now is if we're gonna get these new series translated, the World Trigger one looks somewhat interesting.

Where is the conspiration theory in these posts ? It's me who must have missed something this time...

[xi0]

I'm not exactly sure why it's hard to believe that the editors would place a series where they want and for their own reasons. Slap whatever label you want on it, pimping, whatever. But I think it's way too early in the series' run to already suggest they're doing that. There has to be a noticeable trend here. A series CAN yoyo. I'm not even sure if color pages is a good measurement of that either, considering people are paid more for a color page and some authors are just more willing to work in color on top of their already busy schedules. Meaning, some are just more adept at it than others.

[Kaiten]

Where is the conspiration theory in these posts ? It's me who must have missed something this time...

Hungry Joker polled in last place but the editors conspired to place it higher anyway. Dictionary definition of a conspiracy.

I'm not exactly sure why it's hard to believe that the editors would place a series where they want and for their own reasons. Slap whatever label you want on it, pimping, whatever. But I think it's way too early in the series' run to already suggest they're doing that. There has to be a noticeable trend here. A series CAN yoyo. I'm not even sure if color pages is a good measurement of that either, considering people are paid more for a color page and some authors are just more willing to work in color on top of their already busy schedules. Meaning, some are just more adept at it than others.

Jump's policy is to cancel series based on fan polls. There has to be some level of consistency in this. If fans were to believe the editors tinker with the votes, canceling some low ranking series, but not others, than trust would be lost between the magazine and readers. Fewer readers would bother filling in the questionnaire, and series could be canceled based on a statistically less significant portion of the population. Fans have to trust, or at least have the illusion of trust, that the rankings mean something. If Hungry Joker really did place last, yet was ranked in the middle, and continued to rank in the middle despite poor polls, it could rankle fans. The fact is that it's already fallen to the bottom, so any accusations of pimping can be thrown out.

[xi0]

I don't think the trust, or illusion of trust is broken over what could potentially be misinformation. I'm not exactly sure why they would place Hungry Joker higher than it actually polled, but if it's true it only happened once so far. The pimping of series in the past is still speculation. We can have theories and educated guesses as to why it happens, but it's still speculation most of the time. I remember there were some rumors with Maison du Penguin and the author being friends with the chief editor or something. I'm not sure if that was reality, or simply the majority of the online readership of WSJ disliking Gag series and even more so when a fledgling series they like getting axed and a Gag series sticking around in its stead. Usually this happens with a rare sports series, or maybe romance. I think it might depend on the landscape of Jump on the whole at a particular time. But I really can't see Hungry Joker getting this treatment just because it's a Battle series and some of the juggernauts of the magazine heading towards the end. Like someone said before, I have no doubt there's no shortage of Battle series in the hopper.

What's more likely is the editorial staff sees a lot of promise in the author. But that's assuming the ranking isn't legit in the first place. Even if it is legit and Hungry Joker has already tanked, it isn't necessarily a death sentence YET. Many series have managed to pull themselves back up from the bottom here and there to last a decent length.